Per Se

[rdailey]

I thought everyone would like to see the menu from a recent meal at Per Se.  It was the Chef's Tasting (do not call it 2x2) with wine pairings.  It was more extraordinary than I could possible express in words. I hope nobody at Per Se gets upset that i'm posting this.....

Ah, the mysteries of Per Se! Can you clarify what you ordered, and what it cost? You've listed two different fifteen-course tasting menus. My impression is that the "regular" menu offers a single nine-course tasting menu every day. However, if you ask for it, you can pay more for what's variously been described as a 1x1, a 2x2, or a VIP menu. What did you do?

It was recently referred to by our captain at FL, as the "extended Chef's Tasting Menu" with wine pairings.

[Cpalms]

Some notes on my menus above (I had #1, But had a generous friend along)....lets just say it was expensive, very very expensive, the parameters that I set for the wine were that I wanted to spend about $100 each (for what selections we had, this was a bargain) and I prefered European wine (particularly italy) rather than domestic wines. Every bottle was presented to us and most opened for us. Beautiful stemware both Riedel and Spieglau ...in terms of the food all I said was no Foie Gras, we prefer fish that swim in the ocean as opposed to steams and ponds, and I wanted the creamsicle dessert (I'm a creamsicle junkie) other than that, cook for us, guns blazin'...I terms of the 2x2 or whatever its been called here, they just called it the chefs special tasting menu and didn't much care for the term 2x2. Our waiter asked the kitchen before they agreed to it. Our ressie was for 6:30, and i suspect they don't like starting the special menu much later seeing our meal was 5 hours long (and i think they turned our table) I would suggest to anyone, do not get a late reservation unless you want to be there all night....some other thoughts, the best tables are the first row of the upper deck, then first row of the lower, then second row of the first.....We did the kitchen tour, In great detail we were brought through what looked like a martian operation room,we have a nice pic with jonathan benno, Soo cool...If I were to go again I would do the five course menu (the 9 course was a traditional tasting menu) and be able to select my own dishes, unless, of course,someone else was paying....and thanks to Lyndon at per se for emailing and snail mailing me the menu's

Particular highlights

CHILLED SWEET CORN SOUP

HAND CUT TAGLIATELLE

SWEET CORN "AGNOLOTTI

PAN ROASTED MAINE SCALLOP

NOVA SCOTIA LOBSTER "CUIT SOUS VIDE

SNAKE RIVER FARMS "CALOTTE DE BOEUF GRILLÉE

BELLWETHER FARMS’ PECORINO AND RICOTTA RAVIOLI

CREAMSICLE

[jsfein]

I unfortunately must cancel a reservation I have at Per Se on Saturday, Aug. 21 at 9 p.m. for 2. With all of the amazing reviews (and especially those just posted), needless to say I'm extremely disappointed. If anyone is interested in trying to grab my reservation, send me a message and perhaps we can coordinate phone calls to the restaurant.

[sladeums]

There's some nice Per Se coverage in the July/August Food Arts.

- The 'Kitchen Spy' feature takes an in-depth look at the Per Se kitchen.

- Corey Lee and Jonathan Beno demo cutting a "beef cap" from a boneless four-bone chuck end beef rib.

- Two recipes:

Fillet of New Zealand John Dory Cuit Sous-Vide, Fricassee a la Printaniere & Louisiana Crayfish with Sauce Nantua

- and -

Calotte de Boeuf Grille: Snake River Farms Beef Cap, Green Asparagus, Morel Mushrooms, Rissolee of Marble Potatoes, Crispy Bone Marrow & Bearnaise Mousseline

[Dryden]

Can you shed some light on how the crispy bone marrow is done? It was amazing when we were there - we'd never seen anything like it.

[sladeums]

Can you shed some light on how the crispy bone marrow is done?  It was amazing when we were there - we'd never seen anything like it.

It reads fairly simply.

Ingredients: center-cut veal shin bones soaked overnight, oil, S&P and flour.

Method: remove the marrow, heat oil over high heat, season marrow and dust with flour, saute until crispy, remove and drain on paper towels.

The recipe in it's entirety looks very do-able for the home cook with access to quality ingredients.

[bloviatrix]

Paul at Per Se faxed me a copy of Wednesday's menu as well as the wines we had paired.

Tasting of Vegetables

Amuse - Coronet with Tomato "Caponata"

Toasted Bulgar Wheat

Marinated English Cucumbers, Red Onions and Port Wine Syrup

Chilled Sweet Corn Soup

Celery Branch and Leaves with Brown Butter "Emulsion"

Salad of Toybox Tomatoes

Basil Sorbet and Parmesean Vinaigrette

Grilled King Trumpet Mushrooms

Caramelized Fennel Bulb and Aged Sherry "Mignonette"

Baked Young Italian Eggplant

Fava Beans, Pickled Peppers and Nicoise Olives

"Fricasse" fo Russet Potato "Gnocchi"

Roasted Romaine Lettuce, Shaved Summer Truffles and Braised Red Radish

"Welsh Rarebit"

Ribbledale Goat Cheese, Onion Bread "Crouton" and Watercress Salad

Old Chatham Sheep's Milk Yogurt Sorbet

Beet Esssence "Genoise" and Candied Beets

"Cube Magique au Chocolat"

Valrhona White Chocolate and Yogurt "Cremeux" "Sirop au Caramel et au Chocolat Amer" and Chocolate Sorbet

Mignardises

Wine Accompaniment

We started with a 375 of champagne. I can't remember the house and it wasn't on the fax

Huet "Le Haut Lieu," Sec, Vouvray 2002

Chelia Romano, Fiano di Avellino, "Colli di Lapio" 2002

Prager, "Klaus," Smaragd, Wachau 2001

Dipoli Sauvignon Blan, "Volgar" 2001

Fourrier, "Clos Solon," Morey St.-Denis, Burgundy 2001

Emilio Moro, "Malleolus,"Ribera del Duero 1999

Mt Horrocks, Riesling, "cordon Cut," Clare Valley 2002

Chanbers-Rosewood, Muscat, Rutherglen

I have the entire menu that was offered on Wed. night. If anyone is interested let me know.

[asundstrom]

So one can get a regular + vegetarian tasting menu for $250, but a regular + a different regular is $500? Is there a good reason not to opt for the former?

[bilrus]

So one can get a regular + vegetarian tasting menu for $250, but a regular + a different regular is $500? Is there a good reason not to opt for the former?

My wife and I did the 1 veg and 1 regular option and on about half of the courses we liked the veg option as much or more than the regular dish. You can read about my meal somewhere upthread.

[oakapple]

So one can get a regular + vegetarian tasting menu for $250, but a regular + a different regular is $500? Is there a good reason not to opt for the former?

If you order the regular tasting menu and your partner orders the veggie tasting menu, the combined price for two is $275 (before tax, tip, and beverages).

If you and your partner both order the regular tasting, but you ask them to make liberal substitutions — so that the table has as many different dishes as possible — this seems to be what they call a 1x1. The premium for this has been variously quoted, but I think it's around $25. It is nothing like $500 for two, unless you also count wine pairings.

Lastly, there is the extended tasting menu, which is something like 15 courses, and for which the premium is something like $100 pp (before tax, tip, and beverages).

All of the above is what I have understood from the various postings. I hope it is an accurate summary.

[adegiulio]

If you and your partner both order the regular tasting, but you ask them to make liberal substitutions — so that the table has as many different dishes as possible — this seems to be what they call a 1x1. The premium for this has been variously quoted, but I think it's around $25. It is nothing like $500 for two, unless you also count wine pairings.

We ordered the 2x2 pairing when we were there. It was $250 per person, plus $100 per person for the wine pairing. It was 16 courses, so we did get more food for the money (at per se that means about 2 1/2 ounces ). Total bill, with tax, tip, water, and adding in our insobriety, was $2000 for four people. It's not so bad though, I just need to park my car in a different spot every night so the repo man can't find it..

[juuceman]

If you and your partner both order the regular tasting, but you ask them to make liberal substitutions — so that the table has as many different dishes as possible — this seems to be what they call a 1x1. The premium for this has been variously quoted, but I think it's around $25. It is nothing like $500 for two, unless you also count wine pairings.

Lastly, there is the extended tasting menu, which is something like 15 courses, and for which the premium is something like $100 pp (before tax, tip, and beverages).

All of the above is what I have understood from the various postings. I hope it is an accurate summary.

i believe you're incorrect.. there is no liberal substitution policy.. if you're not interested in eating one or two courses, they'll happily swap them out.. if you're interesting in being served different dishes than your dining partner, you're looking at, alternatively named, a 1x1, 2x2, etc. or allowing the kitchento cook for you.. someone reported early on that there was a $25 surcharge, as well as varying amounts up to $100.. the charge is currently $100 p/p on top of the tasting menu and includes 7-8 additional courses of food.

[oakapple]

i believe you're incorrect.. there is no liberal substitution policy.. if you're not interested in eating one or two courses, they'll happily swap them out.. if you're interesting in being served different dishes than your dining partner, you're looking at, alternatively named, a 1x1, 2x2, etc.

"Liberal substitution" is just my made-up term for 1x1. I meant exactly the thing you described.

[asundstrom]

So $500 buys you and a partner 30 different courses, as opposed to 18 for $275? I'd rather just do the latter, I guess, being on a student budget and all...

[juuceman]

"Liberal substitution" is just my made-up term for 1x1. I meant exactly the thing you described.

just to be absolutely clear, a 1x1 carries a surcharge of $100 on top of the price fixe..

[Dryden]

So $500 buys you and a partner 30 different courses, as opposed to 18 for $275? I'd rather just do the latter, I guess, being on a student budget and all...

This is pretty much correct. The courses for the 1x1 also tend to be more varied (not being restricted to vegetables will tend to do that) and involve some more luxe ingredients, as well.

[oakapple]

"Liberal substitution" is just my made-up term for 1x1. I meant exactly the thing you described.

just to be absolutely clear, a 1x1 carries a surcharge of $100 on top of the price fixe..

I'm not so sure that this is absolutely clear, given the wide variety of prices people have been quoted (anywhere from a $25 to a $100 premium). It seems a certain amount of mystery surrounds this option.

Another affectation reported by many, is that the server first says that he has to check with the kitchen...but nobody has said that the answer is ever anything but "yes."

[adegiulio]

Another affectation reported by many, is that the server first says that he has to check with the kitchen...but nobody has said that the answer is ever anything but "yes."

This is pretty funny stuff. I would expect it at some local NJ joint, but not at per-se. We were told the same thing, I thought it was just us.

I think one issue with the pricing discrepencies is that the 1x1 or 2x2 typically include 6-8 extra courses, which costs 100 dollars more. The mass substitution of course between diners, while maintaining the number at nine, seems to result in a 25 dollar charge...

[juuceman]

<never mind, this is a pointless debate.. go eat there if you'd like.. find out for yourself what menu options they offer..>

Edited August 12, 2004 by juuceman (log)

[JDPenach]

Had lunch yesterday (Sunday) at per se. Spectacular. Haven't been to Ducasse since Delouvrier took over the kitchen, but have been to Daniel, JG, Le Bernardin, ADNY, Bouley, etc. IMHO, per se is in another league, clearly superior to any other "luxury" dining experience in NYC right now.

FYI, we were told that Bruni's review will appear this Wednesday and that he dined there on 5 separate occasions (and also at the French Laundry) in preparation for the review.

I did find it interesting that, with a party of 4 at lunch, when we probed the way we could best explore what the kitchen had to offer, we weren't offered the "2x2" (forgive me if I'm not using the right numbers to describe it.) (We ended up having 3 chef's tastings and 1 vegetable tasting, with no "extras".) When explaining the various options, at one point our waiter seemed about to offer it then stopped himsef. (I didn't push him, as we were happy to stay with the "standard" menu.) With a 1 pm reservation and incoming diners at 5 pm or so, perhaps this was due to timing constraints? Or does getting this option require asking for it?

[oakapple]

<never mind, this is a pointless debate.. go eat there if you'd like.. find out for yourself what menu options they offer..>

Given that this restaurant requires an investment that, in some towns, would equal a monthly rent payment, I think it would be beneficial if these options were spelled out, so that diners wouldn't need to make an instant decision the night of their visit.

[adegiulio]

Oakapple, I agree with you on this point, it would be nice if they offered some details of the pricing beforehand. However, it is per se, and if you are spending $1000 on rent, you probably aren't going to eat there anyway. That's not an excuse though...

[asundstrom]

JDPenach, I think my girlfriend and I were sitting next to your party yesterday (based on the tray of 3 salmon / 1 tomato cornets I noticed them delivering you). We just had the chef's and the vegetable tasting; I asked about the extended tasting and was told it would be 18 courses each, but rather than completely different courses we would each get a variation on the same basic foodstuff.

Anyway, not to clutter up this thread with any more superlatives about the place, but, yeah, probably the best restaurant meal I've ever had. Toque! in Montreal was as good, but nothing else has been.

I did think the chef's tasting was better than the tasting of vegetables. The vegetarian menu was the only one with a dud (a terrible, astringent baked eggplant dish) and I disliked a few elements of the other dishes - the bland fried tomato and overly sweet basil sorbet in the toybox tomato salad and the boring gnocchi in the otherwise spectacular seared romaine/radish/truffle dish. Everything else we tasted was perfection. My favorites were the hen of the woods mushroom (I'd love to know how they managed to cook every little stalk so well, with that great olive oil/pepper mixture), the pate w/ peach marmalade and pickled peaches, the rabbit terrine with tangerine coulis, the veal, the lobster... but having to just use vegetables is a pretty limiting constraint I guess.

[oakapple]

FYI, we were told that Bruni's review will appear this Wednesday and that he dined there on 5 separate occasions (and also at the French Laundry) in preparation for the review.

Nope. This week's review is on the website, and it's not Per Se. The vigil continues.

[JDPenach]

Yes, I saw. A bit surprising, as the staff at per se told us on Sunday afternoon that the Times review was running today (Wednesday). This, of course, begs the question of how they would know this (although someone mentioned something about a photo request from the Times) and how they would know that Bruni had been on 5 separate occasions (and to the French Laundry once). Makes you wonder how much anonymity an important critic can have at a place so small and so difficult to get into.