Corked or otherwise bad wine

[jeniac42]

OK, so the other day I bought a bottle of Georges DuBoeuf Beaujolais-Villages (I think it's a 2001 but don't quote me on that). Opened it up, poured a glass, and sat down to drink it. I noticed a smell that I haven't encountered before on a wine, but I don't know much (as stated many times). So I drank some, and I mostly like the flavor, but there's this weird almost latex-like smell that kind of ruins the taste for me.

So I'm not sure if I got a bad bottle here, or if that's just a characteristic of the wine, or what. I know it's hard to diagnose this kind of thing online, but just generally: How do you know if a wine's gone off (not just that you don't like the taste/smell)?

[Ron Johnson]

Corked wine has a mouldy, mildewy, wet basement, wet cardboard type smell. It is caused by TCA contamination.

Wine that is damaged by heat is different, imparting a cooked or madeira-ized effect.

I have had beaujolais that smelled strongly of bananas or bubble gum, maybe that is what you are smelling?

[jeniac42]

So basically, it would be really, blindingly obvious that it was bad?

I don't know about bananas or bubble gum. It was more like rubber or motor vehicle emission. Maybe it's just mineral-y somehow?

Stupidity revealed below:

I think Moulin-A-Vent is a Beaujolais too, right? If not, this is (I think) the first Beaujolais I've had, so it could be something that's meant to be there. This is just the first wine I've encountered since I started drinking wine more seriously that was really off-putting in a way. But I really, really like the underlying flavor, so maybe I'll buy another bottle from a different shop and compare.

[Ron Johnson]

Is it like tar or asphalt? I have never had that in a beaujolais, but if it was to be found in one it would be Moulin a Vent, which is the most complex of all the crus.

If that is the smell then it is not a fault. I actually the love that tar or creosote smell in my wine.

[KatieLoeb]

Corked wine has a mouldy, mildewy, wet basement, wet cardboard type smell.  It is caused by TCA contamination.

Best quote ever, from a waiter with no wine knowledge whatsoever. We'd opened a bottled of corked wine during service so I figured this was big chance to show the pretty inexperienced staff what "corked" actually meant. Saved it for after service and served it side by side with a newly opened fresh bottle. Upon smelling the corked wine, one waiter piped up with:

"Eeeewwwww! It smells like a dirty hot tub!"

Brilliant! Slightly chlorine-like, slightly "sweaty" smelling, slightly moldy smelling, wet towel smells, all wrapped up in one spot on comment.

Wine that is damaged by heat is different, imparting a cooked or madeira-ized effect.

Think of it as the smell of "cooked fruit" like a compote with sherry or madiera, versus the smell of fresh fruit or grape juice. The oxidized smell is also what you get when you leave a bottle open too long. It just doesn't smell "fresh" anymore. Another dead giveaway that your wine is cooked is if the cork is bulging or there are drips down the sides of the bottle emanating from the area of the cork, or the foil is glommed on to the bottle from these "leakages". Definite heat damage there.

I have had beaujolais that smelled strongly of bananas or bubble gum, maybe that is what you are smelling?

Beaujolais often smells like grape bubble gum, or as I prefer to say, smells like the color purple, rather than like anything ever resembling a fruit. Like grape soda and lollipops smell "purple", not grape like, if you follow what I'm saying here. I've had Cotes du Rhone that had a faint smell of Band-Aids as well. Sometimes these odd smells in wine kind of "blow off" after a few minutes in the glass and some vigorous swirling, so be certain that it's not something transient before you judge an entire bottle.

edited for spelling and clarity.

Edited March 6, 2003 by KatieLoeb (log)

[jeniac42]

Actually, Band-Aids might be the best word to describe the scent. I've got half the bottle left at home so maybe I'll give it another go tonight and swirl it around more this time. Will report back later; anticipate Smell-O-Vision transmission at approximately 9pm EST.

[Craig Camp]

Corked wine has a mouldy, mildewy, wet basement, wet cardboard type smell.  It is caused by TCA contamination.

Wine that is damaged by heat is different, imparting a cooked or madeira-ized effect. 

I have had beaujolais that smelled strongly of bananas or bubble gum, maybe that is what you are smelling?

DuBoeuf Beaujolais has had a distinct banana aroma in the past because of the yeast they used for fermentation. I believe they have changed the yeast strain they are using.

The Band-aid smell tends to come from brett.

Corked wine has a mouldy, mildewy, wet basement, wet cardboard type smell.

A perfect description of corky smells.

[tommy]

is it me, or do alsatians seems to have a higher corkage rate, or, at the very least, can exhibit more of a "musty" nose more often.

i know, of course, it's just me.

[carpet bagger]

Tommy its not you Your alsation has a doggy smell. Your corkie has musty nose. Drink wine don't pet dogs.

[Robin Meredith]

Tommy, there were some interesting comments along those lines in the Wine Advocate's coverage of the 2001 vintage in Germany. Rovani reported that up to 15% of the bottles he sampled suffered from cork taint to some degree, way beyond the usual average. He attributes this to the relative delicacy and transparency of German wine, which allows low levels of cork taint that might be concealed by more robust wines to rise to the surface.

If this is true (and it seems reasonable to me), it's quite possible that the same sort of thing might happen in Alsace.

[dlc]

Tommy, there were some interesting comments along those lines in the Wine Advocate's coverage of the 2001 vintage in Germany.  Rovani reported that up to 15% of the bottles he sampled suffered from cork taint to some degree, way beyond the usual average. 

In a tasting a couple of weeks ago with Fritz Hasselbach of Gunderloch, he was bemoaning the same fact as regards cork. This is why he is going to screw top bottles which he thinks is superior to plastic corks. Apparently he was impressed with the research and data coming out of Australia and New Zealand on screw tops

[bugsy]

had lunch monday past with the omners of Plumpjack Winery who put their premiem cabernet sauvignon in screw cap bottles beginning with

the '97 vintage. they are working with UC Davis to moniter the aging over

a 5 and 10 year period. so far,in subjective tests,they taste the same.

some critics beleive that the natural cork "breathes" and that improves

the taste of the wine......stay tuned

[tommy]

Welcome.

[Al_Dente]

Actually, Band-Aids might be the best word to describe the scent.  I've got half the bottle left at home so maybe I'll give it another go tonight and swirl it around more this time.  Will report back later; anticipate Smell-O-Vision™ transmission at approximately 9pm EST. 

Band Aids. Whew, am I glad to see that someone else has experienced this. I ordered a red at dinner with friends (I don't recall what) and I immediately detected the band aids. Everyone at the table thought I was crazy and went ahead and drank it. I couldn't stomach it. I thought I was going crazy-- seemed odd to recognize such a specific and distinct odor.

[SFJoe]

some critics beleive that the natural cork "breathes" and that improves

the taste of the wine......stay tuned

I think that is mostly the Neanderthal element. Most of the industry thinks oxygen is the enemy, and that it must be excluded. Good corks do this, lesser corks don't.

[tissue]

I sent back wine (chianti) once that tasted and smelled sort of like soy sauce.

Is this heat damage?

[Craig Camp]

I sent back wine (chianti) once that tasted and smelled sort of like soy sauce.

Is this heat damage?

We can only hope.

[Ron Johnson]

is it me, or do alsatians seems to have a higher corkage rate, or, at the very least, can exhibit more of a "musty" nose more often.

Tommy, I do find that many Alsatians often have a stinky nose when first opened, especially when they are young. This merde smell usually blows off after a few hours of being open or some aggresive swirling.

I do not think that these wines have a higher rate of TCA taint but I could be persuaded to change my mind in the face of some overwhelming statistical data to the contrary.

[jeniac42]

Here is another question about possibly bad wine: Should a 1999 Syrah/Grenache (I can't remember the name... it has the word Maris in it though) have sediment at the bottom of the bottle? I haven't encountered a wine with stuff in it yet. It tasted OK to me, but I'm, um, clueless. The cork was kind of crufty on the bottom, too.

[Craig Camp]

Here is another question about possibly bad wine: Should a 1999 Syrah/Grenache (I can't remember the name... it has the word Maris in it though) have sediment at the bottom of the bottle?  I haven't encountered a wine with stuff in it yet.  It tasted OK to me, but I'm, um, clueless.  The cork was kind of crufty on the bottom, too.

The presence of sediment is most often a sign that the wine was un-fined (adding egg whites or bentonite to clarify the wine in barrel or tank) and unfiltered before bottling. This is most often seen as a sign of quality as the wine was manipulated less during winemaking. The sediment is powdery when you feel it. The 'crufty' stuff on the cork was probably tartaric acid crystals which are another sign the wine was minimally treated - in this case not 'cold stabilized’ by chilling before bottling. These feel like grains of sand.

Both the sediment or the crystals offer no problem except that you have to let the bottle sit quietly for a while before carefully opening and then pouring into a decanter leaving the sediment and tartrate crystals in the bottle. You can accomplish this for red wines by using a flashlight (or a candle for those traditionalists out there) shining through the neck of the bottle as your pour so that you can see when the sediment starts to pour into the decanter. White wines do not normally throw significant sediment but can have large chunks of tartaric acid crystals from being over chilled.

Un-fined and unfiltered wine is not a guarantee of quality, but shows that the winemaker is at least trying. Often red wines benefit from judicious fining which can mellow tannins. Most of the great red wines of the world are fined. Filtration is a totally different matter. Many feel that filtration strips a wine of many important flavor components and that cold stabilization changes the acid balance of the wine . I agree.

Edited March 14, 2003 by Craig Camp (log)

[dlc]

White wines do not normally throw significant sediment but can have large chunks of tartaric acid crystals

My wife has always called these the pearls of wisdom. Especially when they are in her glass from the last of a bottle of an old botrytis reisling.