Why measure in ounces?

[TAPrice]

Why is it that cocktail recipes almost exclusively use ounces? When I see a recipe written with teaspoons and tablespoons, I can guess that it came from a cook and not a mixologist.

I understand that it's easier to see ratios between ingredients when everything uses the same measurement. Is this the reason?

What got me thinking about this was the insistence of using 1/4 oz measures in recipes. At first, I struggled to measure 1/4 ounce. I squinted at little shot glasses measures. I bought one of the silly OXO sloping measures (am I the only person who doesn't like that measuring cup?). Finally, though, I realized that 1/4 oz is also 1/2 a tablespoon (I know, I 'm slow). Now it's easy to measure 1/4 oz, because measuring spoons are good at portioning out such small amounts.

Do the English have different size jiggers, because a UK ounce is not the same as a US ounce? Do you make adjustments when using a UK drink recipe?

Are there metric jiggers in the rest of the world?

[MSRadell]

I actually think you already stated the answer in your post. By having all the measurements in the same units you can easily scale the volume you're making up and down very easily. You could replace ounces with milliliters or gallons (US gallons or imperial gallons) and still make this thing drink.

[thirtyoneknots]

Why is it that cocktail recipes almost exclusively use ounces? When I see a recipe written with teaspoons and tablespoons, I can guess that it came from a cook and not a mixologist.

I understand that it's easier to see ratios between ingredients when everything uses the same measurement. Is this the reason?

What got me thinking about this was the insistence of using 1/4 oz measures in recipes. At first, I struggled to measure 1/4 ounce. I squinted at little shot glasses measures. I bought one of the silly OXO sloping measures (am I the only person who doesn't like that measuring cup?). Finally, though, I realized that 1/4 oz is also 1/2 a tablespoon (I know, I 'm slow). Now it's easy to measure 1/4 oz, because measuring spoons are good at portioning out such small amounts.

Do the English have different size jiggers, because a UK ounce is not the same as a US ounce? Do you make adjustments when using a UK drink recipe?

Are there metric jiggers in the rest of the world?

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I use teaspoon measures all the time in recipes (most barspoons hold about 1 tsp). The standard UK shot is 25 ml, or 5/6 oz, stemming from being it being 1/6 of an Imperial Gill (5 oz) if I'm not mistaken. British types will often give recipes in fractions of a "shot" with the idea that this will work no matter what your standard shot size is. Me, I like ounces, barspoons, and dashes in my recipes. If you want to use jiggers and ponies instead of ounces, a la The Gentleman's Companion I'm ok with that too, it sounds so old-fashioned.

[eje]

[...]

What got me thinking about this was the insistence of using 1/4 oz measures in recipes. At first, I struggled to measure 1/4 ounce. I squinted at little shot glasses measures. I bought one of the silly OXO sloping measures (am I the only person who doesn't like that measuring cup?).

[...]

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I know those oxo measures have their fans, but I also cannot stand them.

First off I dislike using plastic for measuring anything remotely reactive or really using it for much of anything in the kitchen. (I know they also make a stainless version.) Second, they are hard to read. You really have to pay attention, making them slow to use. I also imagine after a few trips through the dishwasher, the writing will be gone. Third, along with them being hard to read, it seems like there is a huge potential for over pouring.

Eventually, I just gave up on houseware and kitchen stores and bought a set of stainless, conical, double sided jiggers from barsupplies.com. 1/2 and 1 oz, 3/4 and 1 1/2, 1 oz and 2 oz. You don't even really need the 1oz/2oz jigger, but they are so cheap, I figured what the heck.

I am much happier now.

I will note this doesn't solve the 1/4 oz issue. As it is conical, a quarter ounce is actually somewhere around 3/4 of the way up the side of the 1/2 oz jigger. You get used to it.

[eje]

Oh yeah, in my experience, to generalize wildly, American cocktails tend to be written in ounces, English in shots or jiggers, European and Australian in Millilitres.

So don't throw away that Oxo jigger, you'll need it sooner or later...

The two measures which give me the biggest headaches are those written in 10ths and those, like Embury, who write recipes in "parts".

[jsmeeker]

I like my Oxo jigger. Yeah, it's plastic. Maybe not the "classiest" thing, but when I'm making cocktails, it's usually at home with no one watching. Plus, I've seen them in use at the Velvet Tango Room. So, if THEY can use 'em, so can I.

[thirtyoneknots]

The two measures which give me the biggest headaches are those written in 10ths and those, like Embury, who write recipes in "parts".

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I have been guilty of the parts thing.

It works well for me, but clearly not for everyone so I do try to avoid it.

[jsmeeker]

The two measures which give me the biggest headaches are those written in 10ths and those, like Embury, who write recipes in "parts".

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I have been guilty of the parts thing.

It works well for me, but clearly not for everyone so I do try to avoid it.

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ratios certainly can have their place, especially if ALL ingredients are listed in parts.

[MSRadell]

The two measures which give me the biggest headaches are those written in 10ths and those, like Embury, who write recipes in "parts".

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Actually I think recipes written in "parts" are the easiest to interpret because I just pick what a part is (an ounce, a milliliter, a cup or whatever) and make the recipe. I don't ever have to worry about converting a recipe that is written in a unit of measure that I don't have.

[slkinsey]

The problem with listing a drink in parts is that it becomes very complicated unless you have fairly simple ratios. For example, how are you going to list a drink that has 2 ounces of spirit, 3/4 ounce of liqueur and 3/4 ounce of citrus? 8 parts spirit, 3 parts liqueur, 3 parts citrus? That starts to become cumbersome. It would be challenging to free pour this drink with any real accuracy, and you end up having to do math to scale the recipe into actual amounts.

The other benefit to listing a drink's formula in actual volumes (and given the American provenance of the cocktail, I think ounces make perfect sense) is that it also specifies the actual volume of the drink -- which is important, in my view.

[thirtyoneknots]

The problem with listing a drink in parts is that it becomes very complicated unless you have fairly simple ratios.  For example, how are you going to list a drink that has 2 ounces of spirit, 3/4 ounce of liqueur and 3/4 ounce of citrus?  8 parts spirit, 3 parts liqueur, 3 parts citrus?  That starts to become cumbersome.  It would be challenging to free pour this drink with any real accuracy, and you end up having to do math to scale the recipe into actual amounts.

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In that case I would actually call it 3:1:1, it's a rare cocktail indeed where an extra 1/4 oz of base spirit is going to throw it off.

[slkinsey]

But then how are you going to translate 3:1:1 easily into a drink that is not either a 5 ounce drink or a 2.5 ounce drink? I can easily say to someone, "this drink is three-quarters, three-quarters, two -- lime, MB orange curaçao and Tanqueray, plus a dash each of orange and Angostura bitters" and they can bang out the drink with the right proportions and in the right size without using a calculator.

Using actual amounts is even more important as formulae become more complicated (I would not want to figure out the Tantris Sidecar from a "parts formula"), and for drinks that involve a top or lengthening of any kind (Fizzes, Daisys, etc.).

[jsmeeker]

But then how are you going to translate 3:1:1 easily into a drink that is not either a 5 ounce drink or a 2.5 ounce drink?  I can easily say to someone, "this drink is three-quarters, three-quarters, two -- lime, MB orange curaçao and Tanqueray, plus a dash each of orange and Angostura bitters" and they can bang out the drink with the right proportions and in the right size without using a calculator.

Using actual amounts is even more important as formulae become more complicated (I would not want to figure out the Tantris Sidecar from a "parts formula"), and for drinks that involve a top or lengthening of any kind (Fizzes, Daisys, etc.).

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I'm not so concerned about the total volume of the finished drink. And not everyone wants the same sized drink or uses the same sized glassed. I can tell people to make a margarita 3:2:1 and they will get a drink just like I make. It may be bigger or smaller, but it will taste the same. (assuming they use the same tequila and triple sec). And to me, getting it to taste "right" matters more than finished volume.

[TAPrice]

Along the same subject, why do cookbooks always insist on writing cocktail recipes for four. It's alarming to run a across a recipe that measures the spirit in cups (even if it's a fraction).

I see this a lot in restaurant cookbooks. Is it just a quirk of cookbook writing that all portions must be for at least four people?

[TAPrice]

I like my Oxo jigger.  Yeah, it's plastic.  Maybe not the "classiest" thing, but when I'm making cocktails, it's usually at home with no one watching.  Plus, I've seen them in use  at the Velvet Tango Room.  So, if THEY can use 'em, so can I.

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It's not that I object to the cheapness---well, actually I do. I love to work with jiggers and have a set of three. They're physically satisfying to hold and I love the ritual of tipping them into the shaker.

I'm clearly not all about practicality in my home bar, because--although I love my measuring spoon for 1/4 ounce measure--it bothers me that the spoon is blue plastic and not metal.

But seriously, my problem with the OXO measure is that it's hard to read (we're talking about the miniature measuring cup with the sloping side that so that you can read it from above, right?). Try measuring a 1/4 oz of clear liquid and tell me it's easy.

The problem with listing a drink in parts is that it becomes very complicated unless you have fairly simple ratios.  For example, how are you going to list a drink that has 2 ounces of spirit, 3/4 ounce of liqueur and 3/4 ounce of citrus?  8 parts spirit, 3 parts liqueur, 3 parts citrus?  That starts to become cumbersome.  It would be challenging to free pour this drink with any real accuracy, and you end up having to do math to scale the recipe into actual amounts.

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I agree that anything beyond a simple drink can become a complicated mess of ratios.

I wonder, though, if maybe we shouldn't think of two kinds of recipes. There are recipes designed for basic consumers who want to create the drink (or anything, really) straight from the text. For this group, it seems to make more sense to use common measurements and replace 1/4 oz with 1/2 tablespoon (or even 1.5 teaspoons), etc. For a more sophisticated audience, perhaps ratios work better but with the author suggesting his or her preferred size for the base ratio (e.g. "where 1=1 ounce"). You might need to actually translate the ratios to make the drink.

Edit: I'm not much of a baker, but I understand that there is a similar breakdown between baking recipes for home cook (writing in absolute measures) and recipes for professionals (written in ration or percentages, not sure).

[slkinsey]

I'm not so concerned about the total volume of the finished drink.  And not everyone wants the same sized drink or uses the same sized glassed.  I can tell people to make a margarita 3:2:1 and they will get a drink just like I make. It may be bigger or smaller, but it will taste the same. (assuming they use the same tequila and triple sec). And to me, getting it to taste "right" matters more than finished volume.

You may not be concerned about the total volume of a drink, but I certainly am! I'd just as soon pass on that 6 ounce Pegu Club, thank you very much.

I'd also dispute that a 3:2:1 Margarita will be "just like you make it" or will "taste the same" at any size. A Margarita made with 1.5 ounces of tequila, 1 ounce of Cointreau and a half-ounce of lime juice will be bracing, cold and refreshing at three ounces. A Margarita made with 3 ounces of tequila, 2 ounces of Cointreau and one ounce of lime juice -- even assuming that your shaker was twice the size of the one you used for the 3 ounce drink, and that you were able to chill/dilute the drink to the same degree (neither of which is likely to be true) won't be the same at six ounces. For one, by the time you get to the bottom of the three ounce drink, it's likely to still be cold and you're likely to be ready for another. By the time you get to the bottom of the six ounce drink, it's going to be warm and cloyingly sweet.

I agree that anything beyond a simple drink can become a complicated mess of ratios.

I wonder, though, if maybe we shouldn't think of two kinds of recipes. There are recipes designed for basic consumers who want to create the drink (or anything, really) straight from the text. For this group, it seems to make more sense to use common measurements and replace 1/4 oz with 1/2 tablespoon (or even 1.5 teaspoons), etc. For a more sophisticated audience, perhaps ratios work better but with the author suggesting his or her preferred size for the base ratio (e.g. "where 1=1 ounce"). You might need to actually translate the ratios to make the drink.

I agree that there are different sorts of recipes. A simple drink like a Martini, that has wide variation in formula all the way from 1:1 to 20:1 is usefully discussed in ratios. But still, if I were going to give someone a recipe for my Martini formula, I'd size the drink to 3-4 ounces. For most other drinks, I think it makes the most sense to offer the drink the same way the vast majority of drink formulae have been given going all the way back to Jerry Thomas: in the actual volumes in which the author or mixologist expects the drink to be made. When I'm filpping through cocktail books, I automatically skip over books that specify recipes by parts. It's just too much trouble and, not for nothing is my experience that "parts" recipes don't tend to be very good ones.

I'm not sure I follow your idea about substituting a half-tablespoon for a quarter-ounce. Is a half-tablespoon measure a common kitchen measure? I've got probably three or four sets of measuring spoons around, and I'm not sure any one of them has a "half tablespoon" measure. You can either use something like the OXO graduated measure (which I find perfectly fine for home use, especially when I can't use a speed-pourer) or all you need is two jiggers: a 2 : 1 jigger and a 1 : 1/2 jigger. If you like, you can precisely measure 1/4 and 3/4 ounces into the two sides of the 1: 1/2 jigger and make a scratch mark on the inside. Another good thing to have for <1/2 ounce amounts is this adjustable tablespoon measure from KitchenArt.

[TAPrice]

I'm not sure I follow your idea about substituting a half-tablespoon for a quarter-ounce.  Is a half-tablespoon measure a common kitchen measure?  I've got probably three or four sets of measuring spoons around, and I'm not sure any one of them has a "half tablespoon" measure.

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Hmm..maybe the 1/2 tablespoon measure is a rarity. I've never surveyed measuring spoons. I've got two sets at home. One has a 1/2 tablespoon measure on the other doesn't.

Although I understand the argument that scaling up an individual drink would change it, do you think scaling up a recipe to make multiple drinks at once changes the taste of the individual cocktail? I guess if we agreed on that (and I've got no opinion on the matter at the moment), then there would be even less of argument for using ratios as a standard for recipes.

[the queneau]

A few points here.

There may be some confusion over the idea of there being a UK ounce and a US ounce. In the UK, ounces are only ever used as a measurement of weight, not volume. So yes, whilst our nations have different ounces, it's because they have completely different referends. For clarity, we do have fluid ounces in the UK, but these will always be specified in recipes as "fluid ounces" (i.e., separate from the "other" ounces). However, the last time I saw fluid ounces mentioned were in recipe books from the 70's, and never in relation to bartending.

Secondly, the standard UK shot is not 25ml. This is the standard English shot and, I think, Welsh. Here in Northern Ireland, we serve 35ml as a standard measure, always served from a Government-approved measure (whether jigger or optic). It's a legal requirement to do so, unless in a mixed drink with 3 or more ingredients (this is where the law gets complicated, so I won't go into it too much).

As for how UK tenders give recipes, I've only ever given them in metric form and have only ever received them in metric form. It avoids the confusion that might arise from the belief that there is such a thing as "a standard shot".

We do generally have different size jiggers in our bars - 25ml, 35ml and 50ml. I normally keep a set of "keys" on me as well, which allows me to measure 5ml, 10ml, 12.5ml etc. It just means that I know exactly how much I'm pouring, which is critical to the formula of a drink, as well as allowing tabs to be kept on booze control (important in a bar context, rather than at home).

Personally, I believe that everything, everywhere should be measured metrically, but that's mainly because I prefer decimal points to fractions, aesthetically as well as functionally.

Edited for clarity.

Edited April 21, 2008 by the queneau (log)

[slkinsey]

Although I understand the argument that scaling up an individual drink would change it, do you think scaling up a recipe to make multiple drinks at once changes the taste of the individual cocktail?

Yes, I do think it makes a difference, unless you happen to have an oversized shaker you can use for making 2-3 drinks at once (and even this usually will not result in a drink that is exactly like an individually made drink). This depends somewhat on the drink. If you can get a large enough mixing vessel with a large enough amount of ice, stirred drinks seem to come out more or less the same. For shaken drinks, however, it is generally the case that two individually-shaken drinks will come out better than if they were shaken together. Think about it: Unless you have a shaker that is twice the size of your usual shaker, there is no way you can get the same ratio of ice to liquid (which will change the thermal transfer quite a lot) and there is not likely to be as much air space (which affects aeration, etc.). Even with a shaker that is twice the size of your usual shaker, it's not going to be quite the same. But don't take my word for it... try it yourself. It's pretty obvious, IMO.

There may be some confusion over the idea of there being a UK ounce and a US ounce. In the UK, ounces are only ever used as a measurement of weight, not volume. So yes, whilst our nations have different ounces, it's because they have completely different referends.

Whether or not the UK liquid ounce is actually used in practice, there does in fact exist a "British Imperial" liquid ounce, which comes out at 1/20th of an Imperial Pint (making it somewhat less than an American liquid ounce).

Secondly, the standard UK shot is not 25ml. This is the standard English shot and, I think, Welsh. Here in Northern Ireland, we serve 35ml as a standard measure, always served from a Government-approved measure (whether jigger or optic). It's a legal requirement to do so, unless in a mixed drink with 3 or more ingredients (this is where the law gets complicated, so I won't go into it too much).

What's interesting is that these standard measures are right around the same as an American fluid ounce, which comes in at 29.57 ml.

What is the standard shot in Scotland?

As for how UK tenders give recipes, I've only ever given them in metric form and have only ever received them in metric form. It avoids the confusion that might arise from the belief that there is such a thing as "a standard shot". . . . It just means that I know exactly how much I'm pouring, which is critical to the formula of a drink, as well as allowing tabs to be kept on booze control. . .

This accords with what I know of most bartenders: they give recipes in actual amounts. As you suggest, this probably has much to do with costing drinks, booze control, government regulations, etc.

[thirtyoneknots]

But then how are you going to translate 3:1:1 easily into a drink that is not either a 5 ounce drink or a 2.5 ounce drink?  I can easily say to someone, "this drink is three-quarters, three-quarters, two -- lime, MB orange curaçao and Tanqueray, plus a dash each of orange and Angostura bitters" and they can bang out the drink with the right proportions and in the right size without using a calculator.

Using actual amounts is even more important as formulae become more complicated (I would not want to figure out the Tantris Sidecar from a "parts formula"), and for drinks that involve a top or lengthening of any kind (Fizzes, Daisys, etc.).

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Well your original example makes a 3.5 oz drink, so it's not that hard. To clarify, these types of ratios are how I remember things, and occasionally to discuss recipes with my colleagues. They are not necessarily for public consumption. Clearly a ratio isn't appropriate for every drink, I wouldn't talk about a Mai Tai, for example, in ratios, nor probably any drink with more than about 3 ingredients (exclusive of bitters and the like). I know that fractions and ratios are frustrating or don't make sense for some folks, but they do for me, and furthermore allow more flexibility in scaling recipes up or down. At home I rarely make a drink with more than about 2.5 oz going into the shaker. At work rarely one with less than 3 oz going in. Remembering recipes as ratios instead of amounts helps me rapidly scale them for different size glasses, or to make batches for large groups when entertaining.

[slkinsey]

Well, I certainly do think that, when one is discussing the different formulae for, say, a Sidecar or a Margarita, then ratios make a good basis for discussion. But when it comes down to codifying a formula, that's when I think it makes the most sense to go to actual amounts.

[Nathan]

I use ratios or parts on occasion...makes it easier to scale the drink. most of the time I'm making a 2.5-4 ounce cocktail but sometimes you have to save time when mixing for a bunch of people...

if the ratio is measured correctly, the drink will taste the same at all sizes...other than the temperature issue as you get through a large cocktail.

but, for example, I recently discovered that one jigger I was using which I had thought was a 1oz/2oz jigger was actually a .75oz/1.5oz jigger. Oops. which explains how some drinks were off when using more than one jigger...but for drinks where I only used that jigger...it makes no difference that it wasn't the size I thought it was. they were just coming out slightly smaller.

[brinza]

I use one of those mini-measure shot glasses. It's a one-ounce glass with four different scales printed up the sides: ounces, milliliters, teaspoons, and tablespoons. I can use the same measuring glass regardless of what units the recipe is written in. Admittedly, it's not that easy to read--actually I read it backwards, looking at the opposite side of the glass for the scale I want. I find it easier to see the scale that way while pouring than trying to look at foreground. I also have a 1 : 1.5 jigger, but I'm thinking of just getting several more of those in the various sizes. As long as you pull the correct jigger, there is no need to worry about actually measuring, just fill it and dump it.

The only thing that bothers me about recipes written in parts is when there are dashes involved. If I'm to use one dash of, say Yellow Chartreuse or Absinthe, then the other ingredients must have a specific volume measurement, otherwise, how is the drink going to work properly?

[eje]

Thanks for the info queneau.

I blame Simon Difford for my brazen declaration of the use of shots or jiggers as a measure in England.

One thing I always wonder about in areas where the amount of booze is regulated, is how you make drinks like the Fifty-Fifty.

Are you required by law to measure no more or no less than 35ml of booze into any cocktail? So something like a Fifty-Fifty ends up a 70ml drink to get the ratio right?

What about 80 proof liqueurs, like Cointreau or Grand Marnier? Is the shot size of those spirits also regulated?

Just curious...

[thirtyoneknots]

The only thing that bothers me about recipes written in parts is when there are dashes involved.  If I'm to use one dash of, say Yellow Chartreuse or Absinthe, then the other ingredients must have a specific volume measurement, otherwise, how is the drink going to work properly?

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A dash is a pretty imprecise unit of measurement anyway, sort of analagous to saying "to taste." It's all very dependent on your preferences and the ingredient being dashed (and what it's being used for in the drink). It's just sort of a matter of trial and error to figure out how many dashes of something to put in a given volume of cocktail.