Flounder Roe

[johnnyd]

A trip to Portland Maine's Old Port district always includes some fish market reconnaissance. Shad Roe was in stock earlier this week at $9.95 per pair but that's too much for my wallet.

Imagine my delight yesterday when, having sold out of Shad Roe, Harbor Fish Market decided to try selling Flounder Roe instead.

Inspired by Peter The Eater's Poached Haddock Roe from early March (and the fact that they were $2.99/lb) I decided to give 'em a whirl.

I bought just a handful (1/3lb) to try out. Each were about four or five inches long.

I chose a simple method: poached in butter with a spritz of lemon.

About 5 minutes a side on medium heat. The damn things explode if the heat is too high.

I poured the whole thing on a slice of local crusty white,

...and called it Lunch!

They were milder than expected. Reminded me of fresh grilled sardines. I imagine these - like most fresh roe products - would be a seasonal fishery and not available all the time.

Flounder roe may eventually be subject to draconion harvesting laws once people find out how delicious they are and demand goes through the roof.

And I can say I had 'em for lunch back in April 2008 for a dollar a plate!

[suzilightning]

that was one thing my mom always got. when we were cleaning the flounder and found the roe we put it aside for her. she soaked it in a little milk for about 1/2 hour then lightly floured them and shallow fried them. served with the flounder itself, some boiled potatoes and lima beans that was breakfast!

[johnnyd]

Peter used cream in his haddock roe recipe, and I've heard of soaking in milk. I decided to try it the way my mom cooked shad roe before I went out and bought a bunch more of it and try another method.

What other ways to serve - anyone?

[sanrensho]

What other ways to serve - anyone?

Brine and marinate as the Japanese do for mentaiko and karashi (spicy) mentaiko. Or toss with pasta.

That meal looks amazing by the way. I wonder how it would taste slowly poached in flavored olive oil?

[johnnyd]

What other ways to serve - anyone?

Brine and marinate as the Japanese do for mentaiko and karashi (spicy) mentaiko. Or toss with pasta.

That meal looks amazing by the way. I wonder how it would taste slowly poached in flavored olive oil?

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This was also mentioned on Peter's thread. I'll have to find the mentaiko marinade recipe - I love mentaiko. That's a great idea.

And thanks for the thumbs up - it was really good tasting too. So what if I added garlic and paprika to that olive oil? It's something I do for fresh shrimp we get around here, but that might be too strong a treatment.

[sanrensho]

So what if I added garlic and paprika to that olive oil?

I think it sounds great. Karashi mentaiko is fairly well spiced, and I think it holds up due to the richness of the protein.

[Henry dV]

Salted and smoked would be the way to do it for me !!

[Kent Wang]

Brine and marinate as the Japanese do for mentaiko and karashi (spicy) mentaiko. Or toss with pasta.

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I just bought a bunch of striped bass roe for something like $7/lb from Chinatown. Any mentaiko recipes? How do you recommend tossing with pasta, poach in butter like johnnyd?

[johnnyd]

So far, for mentaiko, I'm finding a combination of salt and either chili powder (what kind, I wonder) or paprika, which I'd favor owing to it's mellower depth. I see a five day soak in some kind of dashi prior.

Why is a mentaiko brine/soak/marinade recipe so hard to find?

[sanrensho]

I just bought a bunch of striped bass roe for something like $7/lb from Chinatown. Any mentaiko recipes? How do you recommend tossing with pasta, poach in butter like johnnyd?

A typical mentaiko spaghetti recipe might be mentaiko, softened butter, shot of cream, squeeze of lemon juice. I see recipes calling for soy sauce as well. I'll try to dig out the last recipe I used. Bear in mind that this is using brined and flavored roe (mentaiko).

Toss the above just with the residual heat from the pasta (as in a carbonade). Top with chiffonade of shiso (or basil) and nori, both are a must.

I've never cooked with raw roe sacks, but in lieu of mentaiko, you could lightly brine the roe sacks first in sake, touch of dashi, soy sauce, salt and sugar before cooking as above.

Jonnyd, I will try to transcribe a Japanese recipe for mentaiko, if someone doesn't get to it first. This is the one I'm looking at (for karashi mentaiko):

http://www.ajiwai.com/otoko/make/ment_fr.htm

Edited April 3, 2008 by sanrensho (log)

[johnnyd]

I just bought a bunch of striped bass roe for something like $7/lb from Chinatown. Any mentaiko recipes? How do you recommend tossing with pasta, poach in butter like johnnyd?

A typical mentaiko spaghetti recipe might be mentaiko, softened butter, shot of cream, squeeze of lemon juice. I see recipes calling for soy sauce as well. I'll try to dig out the last recipe I used. Bear in mind that this is using brined and flavored roe (mentaiko).

Toss the above just with the residual heat from the pasta (as in a carbonade). Top with chiffonade of shiso (or basil) and nori, both are a must.

I've never cooked with raw roe sacks, but in lieu of mentaiko, you could lightly brine the roe sacks first in sake, touch of dashi, soy sauce, salt and sugar before cooking as above.

Jonnyd, I will try to transcribe a Japanese recipe for mentaiko, if someone doesn't get to it first. This is the one I'm looking at (for karashi mentaiko):

http://www.ajiwai.com/otoko/make/ment_fr.htm

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In spite of the proliferation of mentaiko spaghetti recipes, I really can't wrap my brain around that starch as a mentaiko vehicle. Maybe it's because I've always had it as a nigiri?

That website had eleven steps - with pictures! A little help with the translation would be most helpful.

[sanrensho]

Johnnyd, you're right, there aren't that many recipes for making mentaiko (even in Japanese) because I think most people are used to buying it.

The recipe I linked to is for the spicier karashi mentaiko using hot pepper powder, but I think you can modify it to make a regular mentaiko by leaving out or minimizing the hot pepper powder.

This is a rough and dirty translation, so I've left out some of the finer details, but this should give you an idea of the process. The steps correspond to the ones in the link.

http://www.ajiwai.com/otoko/make/ment_fr.htm

Pre-brine:

120 g raw pollock roe

salt

170 ml sake

30 g salt

Main brine:

190 ml sake

6 g katsuobushi (bonito flakes)

1/2 tbs shoyu (soy sauce)

20 g hot red pepper powder

5 cm section of kombu

1/2 tbs yuzu (optional)

1 tbs sugar

1. Sprinkle salt on the roe and refrigerate. After one hour, wipe away any excess moisture and place the roe in the sake to clean and kill some bacteria.

2. Set the roe aside, and strain the sake to remove anything that came off the roe sacks. Add the 30 g salt and bring to a boil at low heat for about 5 minutes to burn off the alcohol.

3. Remove salt/sake mixture from heat and cool using ice bath.

4. Pre-brine: Place roe in ziploc with the boiled (and cooled) salt/sake mixture and brine for 10 hours (7-12 hours).

5. Shaping: Says the oviduct that attaches the roe sacks to the stomach are ripped/open. Scoop up the roe using a spoon and place the sacks with the opened oviduct face down in the strainer. Place plastic wrap over the roe sacks and leave for 10 hours. Apparently, commercial producers use this step to firm up the sacks and improve absorption of the flavored brine.

6. Mix hot red pepper powder, sugar, soy sauce and yuzu juice (optional).

7. Bring 190 ml sake to boil and simmer at low heat for 5 minutes to burn off alcohol.

8. Remove from heat and cool using ice bath. Add kombu. After 30 minutes, bring to boil and add katsuobushi. Simmer on low for 1 minute. Remove from heat.

9. Strain well and add mixture from step 6 to above mixture while still hot. Cool this mixture over ice bath.

10. Place roe in ziploc and add above brine mixture. Refrigerate at temperature of 0-5 degrees Celsius for one week. Shift the roe sacks around in the brine mixture several times during this time.

11. After one week, remove roe and place in strainer to drain any excess liquid for 1/2-1 day in fridge. The finished mentaiko can also be frozen for reuse later.

[sanrensho]

In spite of the proliferation of mentaiko spaghetti recipes, I really can't wrap my brain around that starch as a mentaiko vehicle.  Maybe it's because I've always had it as a nigiri?

It works really, really well. And packed with umami goodness.

[johnnyd]

The recipe I linked to is for the spicier karashi mentaiko using hot pepper powder, but I think you can modify it to make a regular mentaiko by leaving out or minimizing the hot pepper powder.

sanrensho-san! You da bomb. I have all the ingredients except yuzo so I am definitely doing this - the spicier version of course. Maybe I can fake the yuzo by using a meyer lemon/lime juice combination? I'll post the process!

The sheer quantity of mentaiko spaghetti recipes can't be ignored. It will be something to try with all that mentaiko I'll have on hand.

[johnnyd]

Harbor Fish opens at 8:30am The one morning I'm late someone comes in and buys the last four and a half pounds ten minutes before I got there!

Fortunately, my pal Brad says the guys are cutting more flounder today and Monday and will put aside some nice "fatties" for me. He also said the market was getting calls for flounder roe, surprising the crew there. I predict the price will be higher on Monday.

Who in Portland is reading this thread?

Edited April 4, 2008 by johnnyd (log)

[Peter the eater]

Flounder roe may eventually be subject to draconion harvesting laws once people find out how delicious they are and demand goes through the roof.

That stuff sounds and looks delicious . . . thanks for sharing.

"Once people find out" resonates for me - I am always being amazed by seafood. In my city there's a good restaurant that has a locally famous kombu entree for $20: click

It's absolutely tasty and worth the price, but diners here regard it as totally exotic (myself included) because its available nowhere else.

It's seaweed, prepared well.

[johnnyd]

At last! Freshly cut today:

Flounder roe has returned to my fishmonger at $2.99/lb. I will begin sanresho's mentaiko preparation later today and let's see what happens.

[sanrensho]

Flounder roe has returned to my fishmonger at $2.99/lb.  I will begin sanresho's mentaiko preparation later today and let's see what happens.

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Those look beautiful, you lucky b*stard. Looking forward to your reports.

[Daniel]

I went to this Japanese Market Mitsuwa yesterday on my ride home from work.. They had pollack roe but, since I wont be home to cook much this week, I didnt purchase. But will give that recipe a go.. Nice photos Johnny

[johnnyd]

So the first hurdle is weight conversion.

The recipe calls for 120g of roe which is about 4oz. I bought 1 and 1/3 lb and fried up a good size handful for lunch yesterday, so I'm betting (since I don't have a scale) that I have at least 3/4 lbs left, so I'm going to triple the measurements on sanrensho's instructions.

I know that the results may be dire, but it's worth a try. The photos on sanrensho's link are marginally helpful, as the first show two roe sacs and subsequent photos show at least ten, which is closer to what I have currently salting in the fridge, but mine are clearly a larger size.

If I actually have a pound (or 453g), it will just be a milder result. Frankly speaking, the flounder roe is the mildest roe I've had in memory so this could be a benchmark to measure other experiments.

I asked the Fish store if they ever keep cod roe and they said it's cut at sea and rarely kept on board. Tossed to the gulls, in other words. I have to change that routine, yessiree.

[johnnyd]

Salted Roe has been refrigerated for one hour,

Step 2: Roe placed in Sake (2.15 cups) to clean, then strained, boiled with salt (2.11oz)

Cooled in ice bath, and deposited with roe in ziploc,

With all the handling, the stuffing is starting to ooze out of the roe sacs, causing little clouds of eggs to float about the brine, which, if I may add, is excrutiatingly salty.

So far, this experiment looks like an unmitigated disaster! But as we all know, some of the weirdest preps yield terrific results. Let's just say how pleased I am to have the rest of eG along as we watch johnnyd make a complete and total hash of this recipe! No, but seriously, we'll see what happens.

Step 4: Pre-brine in place. Step 5 slated just before bedtime, 10pm.

Edited April 24, 2008 by johnnyd (log)

[johnnyd]

My lips have recovered from my sake/salt brine adventure and per instructions I let the roe sacs chill overnight. Unfortunately, my day was so busy I didn't get to the next step until now - or 8 hours after the recipe calls for re-brine - but the flounder roe looks firm and smells faintly of sake so on with the experiment.

Steps 6,7,8,9 - pepper/shoyu/sugar/limejuice paste is mixed and sake has been boiled, konbu and katsuobushi added and strained,

I put the un-cut roe-sacs in a freezer bag (step 5 called for splitting the sacs open and place face down but I didn't bother - seeing how firm they get now, I will certainly try it next time) and poured in the pepper mixture (which tastes delicious).

10. Place roe in ziploc and add above brine mixture. Refrigerate at temperature of 0-5 degrees Celsius for one week. Shift the roe sacks around in the brine mixture several times during this time.

See you in a week.

[Peter the eater]

Wow - I'm not sure I can wait a whole week JD.

[sanrensho]

Coming along nicely, I see. That looks really, really good.

I'm sure it'll be perfect with a bowl of hot, steaming rice or as a filling for onigiri (rice balls).

[johnnyd]

At last!

Time to open the bag after nine days. During the weeks marination I occasionally pulled out the tray and shifted the roe sacs around.

Let's take one out and see what happened...

Hi there, handsome!