Marshmallows: gelatin vs. gellan

[martinlersch]

I've experimented a little with flavoured marshmallows (banana/parsley, mango). The flavour is a lot more intense when the mixture is still soft. Once it sets, the flavour get's locked up by gelatin. The other day I came to think about gellan, a gelling agent which is reputed to have an "outstanding flavour release". So I thought, perhaps it would be possible to make marshmallows with gellan.

I tried the following recipe (which works OK with gelatin):

200 g sugar

65 g water

65 g mango purée

10 g gellan

Sugar/water was heated to 115 °C. Once gellan was added, everything solidified so I added the mango purée and heated it all in a bain marie. This melted the gel again, but it all became very sticky and it was impossible to whip it. I tried to add more water, but it was of no help.

Well - this first experiment was a disaster, but my question to you all is if you know about any recipe for marshmallows using gellan? Any suggestions on procedures and amounts are also welcome.

[schneich]

gellan is no protein, and can therefor not be whipped, since there are no proteinfibers do denaturate and bind to each other....

cheers...

torsten

p.s. if you are after a "molecular" marshmallow you may want to experiment with a foaming agent and agar or gellan or sosa vegetarian gelatin.

Edited June 24, 2007 by schneich (log)

[martinlersch]

Yes, proteins are excellent foaming agents. But many polysaccharides can act as foam stabilizers as well. That's why I was optimistic about gellan. My main goal was not to make a "molecular" marshmallow (whatever that may mean), but to utilize the flavour release properties of gellan.

You suggest to try the following:

foaming agent + agar

foaming agent + gellan

foaming agent + sosa vegetarian gelatin

Do you have any suggestions as to which foaming agents could be used? An obvious pair would of course be gelatin and gellan. Any other suggestions?

[sugarseattle]

i had a similar problem, but what I noticed rather than the gelatin stole the flavor was that the gelatin was all I tasted, so I ended up masking the flavor with another flavoring agent, such as more vanilla. maybe there's something you can do there, like for example some banana extract with your bananas, or some lemon zest, just something...

[chiantiglace]

well some polyssacharides will hold air like xanthan gum, and xnathan gum will form a gelled substance in the presence of another polysaccharide like iota carrageenan and konjac. At TIC they experimented with marshmallows with agar and xanthan in a aerating device they have, it apparently worked but came out quite stiff. If you are careful with the quantity of konjac you use you could probably dvelop a pretty versatile (fun) marshmallow.

[rmillman]

well some polyssacharides will hold air like xanthan gum, and xnathan gum  will form a gelled substance in the presence of another polysaccharide like iota carrageenan and konjac.  At TIC they experimented with marshmallows with agar and xanthan in a aerating device they have, it apparently worked but came out quite stiff.  If you are careful with the quantity of konjac you use you could probably dvelop a pretty versatile (fun) marshmallow.

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I have not used konjac before but it seems like an interesting colloid (some info I found with a quick search below). Have you used it for anything?

Here is a site with lots of information on it.

http://www.konjacfoods.com/index.htm

Edited July 6, 2007 by rmillman (log)

[chiantiglace]

ah, its kinda neat but it is ridiculously strong. You could easily make a punching bag out of konjac.

I have a few ideas rolling around upstairs, but its not a priority.

[schneich]

you guys should definatly check out a product called "ovoneve" its a refined pure egg albumen you can tune any meringue recipe to make everything much more stiff and air holding. i do fruit meringues simply by putting some sugar and 10 g of ovoneve in 500 g boiron puree, beat it in the kitchenaid until you have a giant meringue glob, dry in the oven and voila: fruit meringues...

you can also make marshmallow with it...

ovoneve website

[martinlersch]

well some polyssacharides will hold air like xanthan gum, and xnathan gum  will form a gelled substance in the presence of another polysaccharide like iota carrageenan and konjac.  At TIC they experimented with marshmallows with agar and xanthan in a aerating device they have, it apparently worked but came out quite stiff.  If you are careful with the quantity of konjac you use you could probably dvelop a pretty versatile (fun) marshmallow.

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Interesting! I guess if it came out stiffer than normal marshmallow it probably wouldn't serve the initial purpous (better flavour release). However, since the texture of marshmallows is quite fascinating I'd be very interested to learn more about this anyway.

Do you know more about the relative amounts of agar and xanthan used? How about the water/sugar ratio? What aerating device is used?

And BTW, what is TIC?