Should i buy this Handmade Knife?

[Jonpong]

Im thinking of getting this knife from a canadian knife maker, Thomas Haslinger, which is the Evolution, its the one on the bottom right, Santoku style but with straight edges

http://www.haslinger-knives.com/available.html

Anyways, was wondering if anyone had experience with Haslinger or would care to comment on this blade cause its a lot of money for me to commit.

[Octaveman]

Halinger's knives are very nice and you can't do any wrong with getting one. The only thing I've heard is that knuckle clearance is sort of an issue as the handles are close to alignment with the edge. If you use your knives utilizing a pinch grip then I see no issues at all.

Check out this place as they have a whole selection of his knives. The 10" Chef's knife with rosewood handle is a damn sexy thing. I almost bought it myself.

http://www.epicureanedge.com/shopdisplaypr...=27831456585235

[rlummis]

I have one of his 8" chef knives and it is a great knife. I especially like the fine point, so the santuko-ish style would obviously lack that. As far as whether it's worth the cost, it doesn't cut four times better than my Japanese gyutos, but it is a whole lot prettier. He uses some absolutely gorgeous woods. It's a personal call.

Slate did a review of carving sets that included a Haslinger set and they said that the blade was dull initially. I didn't have that problem with my knife.

[Jonpong]

  If you use your knives utilizing a pinch grip then I see no issues at all.

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What exactly is the pinch grip? Is it when the index finger is over the back of the blade and the thumb on the other side? cause thats how i hold mine.

  I have one of his 8" chef knives and it is a great knife. I especially like the fine point, so the santuko-ish style would obviously lack that. As far as whether it's worth the cost, it doesn't cut four times better than my Japanese gyutos, but it is a whole lot prettier. He uses some absolutely gorgeous woods. It's a personal call.

Slate did a review of carving sets that included a Haslinger set and they said that the blade was dull initially. I didn't have that problem with my knife.

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How do you find the steel, edge wear wise, and how easily it takes on an edge? could you compare it to any other knives?

I was checking out some japanese knives, could you recommend a brilliant santoku thats rust resistant? Im just a bit overwhelmed by all these blades and i just wanna find a really good chefs knife and santoku blade.

Edited June 20, 2007 by Jonpong (log)

[Octaveman]

Yeah, pretty much. Some people have the index finger down the spine but technically it's supposed to be opposite of the thumb so you're gripping/pinching the blade with your thumb and index finger on opposite sides of the spine. Just like how it's pictured in the knife skills tutorial but same basic idea as what you do.

http://forums.egullet.org/index.php?showtopic=25958

[Octaveman]

Jon, why do you want a chef's knife AND a santoku? They both do the same job. The gyuto will give you more flexibility because they are available in longer sizes. Most Santoku's don't get beyond 165mm or 180mm. That's only 7 inches.

Check these out. These are hand worked and are very high quality. I can gaurantee you'd be happy with one. They're a brand new knife comissioned by Hattori. Great steel, great design, hand contoured handle, the works.

http://www.japanesechefsknife.com/HattoriF...hefsKnives.html

I've never worked with SV30 stainless steel but I've heard it makes for a very tough blade and can be difficult to sharpen. Difficult = time consuming if you let it get dull. Once the edge is there it should last quite a while but that's also determined by your style of usage.

[A Patric]

Check these out.  These are hand worked and are very high quality.  I can gaurantee you'd be happy with one.  They're a brand new knife comissioned by Hattori.  Great steel, great design, hand contoured handle, the works.

http://www.japanesechefsknife.com/HattoriF...hefsKnives.html

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Bob,

Regarding these new Hattori knives, how easy is it to sharpen the Cowry X of the "upgrade" versions as opposed to a hard carbon steel like Aogami Super steel (AS)? I've read that stainless can be "gummy" which is what makes it hard to sharpen. Is this a problem that Cowry X has? Also are the regular and upgrade lines available now? I can't really tell from the product codes/descriptions.

Best,

Alan

[Octaveman]

Only the VG10 is available now. The upper line won't be available for about a year.

Cowry-X can be a bitch to sharpen. Very tough to remove a lot of metal and/or get a burr but it will depend on what someone is trying to do...thin the back bevel or just touch up the edge. The AS is not as bad since the HRC is much lower at 61-63 as compared to 65-68 with CX. SS's like VG10 are not gummy on the stones and are much easier to sharpen. Don't know where you heard that. Maybe with Euro knives and their softer steel...maybe.

The AS is a tough steel but not so tough as to make it difficult. For example, one may start at 2k to sharpen SS but 800 to start with AS. You can start the AS on a 2k stone but it will just take a long time to get a burr if you're doing it right. This is when it's dull and needs a true sharpening job as opposed to just touch-ups. In that case 3k may be the starting point. It will all depend on how dull it is and what kind of steel.

[rlummis]

How do you find the steel, edge wear wise, and how easily it takes on an edge?  could you compare it to any other knives? 

I was checking out some japanese knives, could you recommend a brilliant santoku thats rust resistant?  Im just a bit overwhelmed by all these blades and i just wanna find a really good chefs knife and santoku blade.

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Haslinger had to change the steel he used since I bought my knife, so my information is outdated. The S30V that he uses now is supposedly a very good steel, although the true technophiles in the blade forums argue extensively over how hard it should be. That said, I find my knife more similar to the European knives--not quite as hard as the Japanese and correspondingly easier to sharpen. Again, though, to purchase a custom knife is largely a matter of aesthetics rather than pure function.

[Jonpong]

Jon, why do you want a chef's knife AND a santoku?  They both do the same job.  The gyuto will give you more flexibility because they are available in longer sizes.  Most Santoku's don't get beyond 165mm or 180mm.  That's only 7 inches.

Check these out.  These are hand worked and are very high quality.  I can gaurantee you'd be happy with one.  They're a brand new knife comissioned by Hattori.  Great steel, great design, hand contoured handle, the works.

http://www.japanesechefsknife.com/HattoriF...hefsKnives.html

I've never worked with SV30 stainless steel but I've heard it makes for a very tough blade and can be difficult to sharpen.  Difficult = time consuming if you let it get dull.  Once the edge is there it should last quite a while but that's also determined by your style of usage.

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Thanks for the link and info. I had wanted to replace my chef's knife but the gyuto is definitely the knife i would consider getting now that you pointed it out. And the VG10 steel is similar to european knives im assuming, so sharpening is much easier than traditional japanese knives. I like the style and design of japanese knives but the hassle of maintaining them has kept me away.

[Octaveman]

VG10 is NOT similar to Euro knives in any respect other than it's stainless. Higher quality steel that has been heat treated to be harder and more durable than any steel used by Euro companies.

I think you're confused about what Japanese knives are. "Traditional" Japanese knives have very specific purposes and are all single beveled (sushi knife or Yanagiba for example). A "Western" style Japanese knife is double beveled just like any other knife around the world. Maintaining a western styled Japanese knife is basically no different than maintaining Euro knives but there are differences that make Japanese knives superior and keeping those differences intact requires a slightly different mind set when it comes to maintenance. But it's no big deal requiring additional work, it's just different.

[A Patric]

Since you mention the issue of bevel, do you know of a list anywhere of the pros and cons of single vs. double bevel?

[Octaveman]

I don't know of any. A single bevel is not all that appropriate in a western kitchen unless you're preparing a lot of Japanese food requiring super thin prep of various ingredients. Out of all my knives only two are traditional single beveled...a yanagiba and a deba and neither see a whole lot of use.

Edited June 22, 2007 by Octaveman (log)

[budrichard]

I have been collecting custom knives since the early 1970's and have a number of custom 'kitchen knifes' and well as many other custom types.

What i learned was that each custom knife cuts a little bit different depending on blade steel, blade dimensions, handle shape and weight. Some of the custom blades i absolutely will not let others use because the difference in sharpness is so extreme that an accident is a certainty. About 4 years ago I standardized on Wusthof because the blade and cutting charachteristics are similar and Wusthof manufactures just about every type of blade and impliment that one could want.

I still use my custom knives but have not purchased any more custom 'kitchen knives'.-Dick

[Jonpong]

VG10 is NOT similar to Euro knives in any respect other than it's stainless.  Higher quality steel that has been heat treated to be harder and more durable than any steel used by Euro companies.

I think you're confused about what Japanese knives are.  "Traditional" Japanese knives have very specific purposes and are all single beveled (sushi knife or Yanagiba for example).  A "Western" style Japanese knife is double beveled just like any other knife around the world.  Maintaining a western styled Japanese knife is basically no different than maintaining Euro knives but there are differences that make Japanese knives superior and keeping those differences intact requires a slightly different mind set when it comes to maintenance.  But it's no big deal requiring additional work, it's just different.

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What i meant by "traditional" was that the steel wasn't stainless, and as i understand it the steel is much harder than european knives so it takes more work to sharpen the edge, but would keep the edge longer than the softer euro steel.

But since you stated that VG10 is harder, im used to using Henkels, would a 1000 grit and 4000 or 5000 grit whet stone be feasible for using on the Hattori knives?

[Octaveman]

But since you stated that VG10 is harder, im used to using Henkels, would a 1000 grit and 4000 or 5000 grit whet stone be feasible for using on the Hattori knives?

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Absolutely. Stones used can apply to any kind of steel but it's that steel that determines HOW you sharpen it, not what stones to use. Your choice of brand could make a difference as they are not created equal. Shapton Pro's are the cream of the crop when it comes to cutting ability and convenience (no need to soak). I've had mine for a long while and they show very little wear. King Deluxe stones are very good too.

[Jonpong]

Fantastic. I was planning to get a pair of shapton stones. Time to whip out the card and start shopping. Thanks for all your help Octaveman.

[Jonpong]

Octaveman, how would you compare these knives to the ones you recommended?

http://www.paulsfinest.com/Hattori-Knives-p-1-c-26.html

[Octaveman]

Not sure which ones I recommended. You mean the Hattori FH line above (others)? If so, no comparison. The FH line blows this knife away in fit and finish, quality of materials, comfort, geometry, design...everything. I've had a Hattori HD gyuto before and didn't really like it all that much. It chipped on me the first time I used it and in several places. Have no idea how it happend either. Sold it and never bought another one.

I recommend the FH line without reservation. You will not be dissapointed.

[Jonpong]

Hey Octaveman, so my FH Gyuto arrived and its an amazing knife! Thanks for the recommendation again. Cheers.

[Octaveman]

Awesome, glad you like it. Post some pics when you get a chance!!!