docsconz

A discussion of the general term of "New Paradigm" restaurant is now ongoing here.. While the term was coined to describe MSB, that is a better place to discuss more general applications of the term, especially if the reality exists outside of MSB.

Can anyone add any other examples besides Momofuku Ssam bar in NYC that would fit the definition9s) given above? Is this a trend or an idiosyncratic single restaurant?

On this discussion of Momofuku Ssam Bar in NYC, the descriptor "new paradigm" restaurant has been used frequently in relation to that restaurant. Though I have dined there, unfortunately, I'm still not really sure what the term means, whether it is exclusive to that restaurant or there are others in NYC or elsewhere to which it applies. Please enlighten me and any other Society members who may share my ignorance and confusion.

Great report and photos! Thanks for posting the link. It is interesting and instructive to note the similarities and differences of our meals one week apart. Though we did not have entirely the same meal, one dish was quite notable by the difference in presentation from one week to the next - the gorgonzola ice cream. Below is the version that we were served. Yours appears to have been turned over with the bowl now a dome concealing the remainder of the contents adding mystery to the dish. Other dishes were also somewhat different, but I thought that to be the most profound change in presentation.

This is a fascinating thread. I don't know if you have learned much, Craig, but I sure have. I'm particularly curious about other service animals besides dogs in restaurants and reading of any specific experiences there.

Sorry all, it's taken me a full 2 weeks to recoup from my trip. Bite Club was great fun. I echo, almost bite-for-thought, what BryanZ wrote upthread. Pictures can be found on my flickr. Just some thoughts: 1. Portions, on a whole, were rather large... I know that most people will complain when portions are too small, so I guess I shouldn't complain. I know D & A are gracious hosts who want to show their generosity. But, I could have done with half the portions of most courses. 2. Cauliflower "flan" needed more caviar - not enough saltiness to spread around the generous cut of flan. Otherwise, it tasted just like Keller's "Cauliflower Panna Cotta" - which was D's inspiration for the dish. I told him he hit the target. 3. I'm being very picky when I say that I found the soft shell crab a bit more mature than I like - the skin had gone papery - beyond the tissue-thin screen that is optimal. D said he sourced them from Citerella, so I'm sure they were high quality, but they were just older than I prefer. 4. Wines were very interesting on their own, but (admittedly a neophyte to wine, take my comments with a grain of the proverbial), very few pairings worked for me. I thought the Chateau le Casenove Cote du Rousillon "La Garrigue" overwhelmed the goat. I especially enjoyed the Canadian vin gris more on its own than served with the dessert(s). 5. A is a worthy pastry chef. The poached pear with cassia ice cream dessert rocked. I love rose-flavored sweets, but I found them weak in her "Flight of Rose" - none had a very pronounced rose flavor. 6. The Casunziei (beet ravioli with poppyseed) could have used more butter, or some kind of moistener. I also would have liked some cheese grated over it, or some crunchy sea salt. 7. Cheeses are great, but as a cheese fanatic, I would have appreciated more precise references. Epoisses was the only one I recognized. I wished that they would have been presented according to name. Of course, I got them from Daniel after the dinner in an email request. Thanks, D! 8. Pork belly was, hands-down, my favorite course. It tasted not unlike Cantonese char sui pork - but infinitely more succulent - it was belly, after all. Fun was had all around and I was glad to be included (I understand I was Bruni's replacement). The food was fantabulous. I don't know how D & A are able to pull off all of this in their kitchen. Admirable. ← But I always thought you were Bruni! Seriously, nice report with good constructive criticism. Seeing your photos and reading the descriptions has whet an already strong desire to try the offerings of Bite Club.

You may very well be right, but not because it has such an incredible variety. That only necessarily means that one can purchase many different types of sausage. The best of any particular variety may yet be somewhere else. By no means am I arguing against your conclusion, just the argument used to support it. ← It would have been closer to my original intent had I written "look at their variety, too". My conclusion was based primarily on what I've sampled, heard and read about them, but that they offer such a large variety means most likely they have the turnover to support it and the expertise to craft such an array, assumptions which might not be weighed heavily but should be considered... ← No doubt.

My reaction to Momofuku ssam Bar was in some respects very similar to my reaction to El Poblet in Spain. It wasn't that I didn't like it or saw no value in it. I was simply disappointed compared to my expectations. In the case of El Poblet there were other factors as well from a criticism point of view as the two restaurants could not be more different stylistically.

Some people, no doubt, but the question is how many and, more importantly, how many of those people are at the restaurant on any given day on account of that validation, and how many of those people are confused by the lunch/dinner situation? I don't know that it's possible to determine the answer with scientific accuracy without a survey that's never going to happen, so the best we can do is reason it through. I mean, Doc, you went at the end of March, before the Beard Awards were announced, right? Do you really think that if you went back to Momo-Ssam tonight the crowd would be different? Or that if you had gone before the Times review it would have been different? Or that if Frank Bruni had given a no-star review and David Chang had been passed over for his Beard Award, that it would have made any difference? These new-paradigm places, in particular, seem to acquire their audiences before the major reviewers ring in, and don't especially appeal to those with traditional expectations of the restaurant experience. I don't exactly know who's reading the New York Times these days, but I do know that it's not the guiding force on the East Village scene as it might be on the Lincoln Center scene. So, fine, maybe a few middle aged Times readers from the Lincoln Center neighborhood took cabs down to check out Momofuku Ssam Bar, found it uncomfortable and weird, and never came back. I can't see how that changes anything. ← While I don't discount the influence of the NYT and Beard awards as much as you and Nathan, they certainly don't hold the influence that they used to. As for the "new paradigm" places, I'm not quite sure what that really means, but one element of it would be how word of them is spread and that would be through sites and organizations like our own Society (where I first heard of it and determined the need to try it) as well as other sites and various bloggers - in other words the internet.

I don't have the answers to your questions, but I would bet that NY would come out much higher than most people would expect. People tend to think of the City when they think of NY and often dismiss it as an agricultural force. That would be a mistake as north of Westchester and indeed east of Nassau, it is quite fertile indeed. One advantage some of the warmer agricultural states such as California, Texas and Florida would have is that they can produce crops year round.

No doubt David Chang was known before the NYT review and the James Beard award, but what they offered to some people was validation.

You may very well be right, but not because it has such an incredible variety. That only necessarily means that one can purchase many different types of sausage. The best of any particular variety may yet be somewhere else. By no means am I arguing against your conclusion, just the argument used to support it.

What was the Ssam demographic may not have been familiar with the Beard awards, but the demographic familiar with the Beard awards is now aware of Chang and his work. Don't you think they will be interested in checking it out? Why do you insist on such a narrow demographic for the restaurant unless that is the only demographic that it will appeal to? ← I don't. but....a. the demographic at Ssam Bar hasn't changed in the last couple weeks (to my knowledge); b. frankly, I think most of the hypothetical people who would be influenced by the Beard award but were otherwise unfamiliar with Ssam Bar aren't going to deal with the lack of reservations, the racuous atmosphere and the uncomfortable seating. (or they're going to come for lunch.......) ← not to generalize or stereotype, but... Exactly how much time do you spend there? I would agree that the general clientele has probably not changed a whole lot and that the sucess of MSB has not been dependent on the NYT or the Beard award, but I doubt very much that they haven't been a factor even if many of the people who might have been made curious to try it may not fit the usual demographic or may not return once they have.

When mentioning Esposito's, are references being made to the Esposito's on Court St. in Brooklyn or another one elsewhere? The one on Court Street is my favorite destination for Italian sausages of all types.

It wasn't until this whole discussion that I was aware of any supposed "dichotomy." Maybe those who are truly into Momofuku were aware of this apparent disconnect between lunch and dinner, but I imagine most of the world has not had the opportunity to be in that camp.

What was the Ssam demographic may not have been familiar with the Beard awards, but the demographic familiar with the Beard awards is now aware of Chang and his work. Don't you think they will be interested in checking it out? Why do you insist on such a narrow demographic for the restaurant unless that is the only demographic that it will appeal to?

Do you think that restaurant customers in general are unaware that the Times published a rave review? Or do you think that Ssam Bar is an unusual phenomenon, to which the norm doesn't apply?Personally, I suspect that the Times review and the Beard Award have both brought in new customers. How could they not? These new customers might remember nothing in detail about the review or the stars, but they'll be aware that the Times loved it. ← Of course they brought in new customers just as all the raves here have brought in new customers. Restaurants don't operate successfully in a vacuum. They depend on word spreading through various means. Those means include these forums, the NYT, Beard awards, word of mouth and other modes. Certainly some of the Momofuku regulars may not be familiar with the Times review or the Beard awards, but undoubtedly others are and some of the more recent ones were probably brought there due to the Times and the Beard award. How many stay regulars or even repeat customers is another question.

On page 111 of the First Edition of Rick Bayless' Mexican Everyday is a great recipe for "Skirt Steak Salad with 'Wilted' Greens, Tomato, Avocado and Lime.

Wine Change: Alvaro Palacios Finca Dofi Priorato 2004 Hen from the Golden Eggs Egg cooked sous vide with a golden croquante and vegetable mushroom soup. The egg was very lightly cooked and almost raw. This is a kind of dish that I usually love, but this was just ok despite its visual interest. Borage stalks, fleshy aloe vera, wild white thistle from Montgo and grilled raw red The "grilled raw red" is not a mis-print. That is exactly what the menu said and I have no idea what it means. This was a hodge-podge of a dish that did not nothing for me from a taste perspective. I simply did not like or understand it in any way other than the fact that it had an interesting presentation. Neck end of Iberian pork "Joselito" on a gel of Velvet Horn (Codium Tomentosum) with our fresh seaweeds and smoked wood scent This dish was nearly great, as the cooked rare pork was in itself spectacular and delicious. What left me scratching my head though was the accompaniment. While it did not detract from the dish it didn't add anything discernible either. Wine Change: Coto de Hayas Garnacha from Campo de Borja. The other wines were good and fine accompaniments, but this wine was quite unusual and worth commenting on. A dessert wine, chocolate and cherry flavors were clear and predominant over any others. Perhaps a bit dual dimensional, it was nevertheless quite tasty and different from any other wine I have ever had. It also matched well with the desserts. Infusion of Stevia Rebaudiana with Petals, Flowers, Wild Herbs and Apple Peel.Light and delicious with a floral taste of summer, elements of citric sourness provided a nice contrast. Before this trip I had never heard of stevia, a South American plant known for its own type of sugar. I would not be surprised to see more of it in the future. Aloe and Violets Beautiful and delicious - one of the clear winners of the meal. Panettone of Chocolate....Torreblanca Family's Tribute Yes this did use the famous panettone of Paco Torreblanca as its principle ingredient. It was really, really delicious as odd as it was to see someone else's dessert creation incorporated into another as an integral part. I am glad that I had that. It was a particularly fine match with the wine. In summary, the lunch was good, but maddeningly erratic with a sense that much was done primarily for visual effect and less for gustatory effect as I feel that a number of dishes were either hindered by their preparations or were simply conglomerations of ingredients without any clear purpose or benefit aside from the visual. Certainly there were dishes that I enjoyed very much, but with the exceptions of the Denia red prawn and the desserts, as good as some dishes were I do not feel that the manipulation of the cooks were much to the benefit of the ingredients beyond what less elaborate preparations would have been. I enjoy culinary artistry as an important component of a fine dining experience, but the bottom line is that the dish must still be delicious and the artistry must add something beyond the purely visual. I don't insist that a vanguard dish be better than the sum of its parts, but it should at least equal them. many of the dishes herre fell short of that mark to me even though most were still good. I would be interested in returning to El Poblet, but primarily to try some of Dacosta's simpler preparations.

Wow, this is very cool, indeed. What part of the market are you located in? It does not appear that you will be open for some time. Any idea when? I wish it was open when I was there earlier this month as my wife and I popped into Barcelona solely to visit the Boqueria. Please give us more details about what you will be selling and how it will be made.

I think that this would be fascinating for the readers and possibly useful to you as well as you may be able to glean useful information, insights and feedback from the eGullet Society membership. Personally, having been to South Africa not too long ago, I would be very interested in the local aspects of your project.

Sticky Senia Rice on a bed of smoked eel with pearls of red fruits and wild rosemary flowers from Montgó It would be difficult to find a prettier rice dish than this sticky and soupy meloso one, but as pretty as it was, I found it to be unbalanced with its flavor profile as the dominant tone came from the sweetness of cherry. Prawn, Denia's Rose Wine change: Guitian Godello 2004. Prawn, Denia's Red More than any other this dish illustrates the lack of synergy in the cooking that we experienced with this meal. The "rose" prawn, while artful, interesting and still tasty, paled in comparison to the simply prepared "red" prawn served simultaneously. The rose element served to distract and detract from the brilliance of the basic prawn. It seemed that the dish was contrived not as an enhancement, but as a device. I like devices, but this one didn't work for me. Shallow-fried red mullet coated with different pulses (beans, peas, mange tout, pea blossoms) with a delicate gel of the fried bones and eucalyptus scent The fish was well prepared as were the pulses. Each individually were good - together in no way better than the individual elements. I preferred eating the components separately. Given that it was May 1st, a holiday, I asked the waitress if the fishermen fished that day. She replied that she "didn't know." The Other Moon of Valencia This was a dish comprised of calamari and sepia that was full of tonal and textural contrasts. The construction was similar to a calamari meringue with an ink fondant within and plenty of sepia croquantes outside for contrast. The most technically impressive dish of the day and one of the most technically impressive dishes in my experience, it still left my palate underwhelmed in terms of flavor. I love calamari and can think of many preparations from simple to complex that I would have preferred eating. Visually striking and conceptually cool, this dish ultimately lacked the flavor elements of a truly great dish. Sprouted" Seeds, berries and pulses with dice of pork dewlap (neck) caramelized with paprika from Jarandilla de la Vera. (Representation of the plant beginning with the seed, then the roots, the leaves, the blooms and the fruit.) This dish was fine when I managed a bite of pork along with the other elements, but it needed much more pork as the vegetal elements were rather bland on their own. The concept of incorporating all aspects of a plant's evolution was interesting, but unapparent on the plate itself. to be continued...

This was a restaurant that I expected to be wowed by and I wanted to be wowed by, but instead I was disappointed by. As I hope to show, the food was creative and beautifully presented, the underlying product fine and the location lovely, but unfortunately the food lacked pizazz on the palate - at least compared to the products themselves and other ways of preparing them. Indeed, this was the kind of meal that helped me to understand some of the criticisms of creative cuisine. Nothing was bad and some dishes were quite delicious, but it appeared to me that the principle goal of the modern cooking here was to show off technical wizardry. While I am all for technical wizardry, it should be used in the service of preparing food that is at least as good as that prepared more conventionally. My impression here was that the food lost something in the translation from pristine product to final dish. Instead of a synergy, there was a subtraction - at least to my palate (and my wife's) on the day that w were there. Despite that, as with my experience at Pierre Gagnaire, there clearly is enough artistry and expertise that I would try it again should I find myself in the area with time beyond what I would need to dine at the places I didn't get to this time. The approach. Yes, that is a Ferrari at the lower left of the photo. The sign. The entry. The table setting. The art on the wall. There were several of these, each with a different bird shape. i thought they were pretty cool. The bread The olive oil for the bread. There are a number of menu options available at El Poblet, including a couple of degustations and a la carte. The carte tended to more traditional preparations while the principal degustation was definitely more Vanguardista. Given Quique Dacosta's reputation as a bright light of the vanguardista style and our mutual interest in that style of cooking, we chose the degustation. One very nice touch was that the degustation price included wine accompaniments. The wording below in italicized bold is taken from the menu. They started us off with a cocktail that included lemon, apple and ginger. It had a nice balance between bitter and sweet. The drink was intended to accompany the first course. Rum and Coke of Foie with a Mist of Lemon Zest and Wild Rocket This dish was light, creamy and not too sweet. With a subtle foie flavor this dish, rich and elegant, was one of the best foie preparations of the week. Crunchy Artichokes in vinegar of Spanish "Champagne", dressed on green olive oil with filaments of saffrony gelatin and wild oranges. This was a nice dish. It had bracing acidity from the vinegar and orange and nice textural contrasts. The saffron flavor was strong while that of the orange was subtle. The Living Forest: The suggestion is a device and way to understand the cooking. 'The Living Forest' represents perfumes, textures and products that we can find in a walk around one of our forests. Go into it.Served at room temperature, this was a beautiful dish. Though it was flavorful with pulverized vegetables and mushrooms, it was not transcendant. Stylistically it reminded me very much of the work of Adria, though to my palate it lacked the flavor harmony present in Adria's similar work as this tended to an overly sweet balance. This was the first dish where in retrospect I began to think that the dish did not equal the sum of the parts. Hoarfrost (Dried Fruit, Trees' Hoarfrost and Shrimp) To eat the hoarfrost produced on nut trees during cold nights is a magic way to refresh oneself. The smoke scent of the fire, made by countrymen to allow defrosting, stimulates us to appreciate this dish and this moment to eat hoarfrost produced on tree leaves.The "hoarfrost" served cold and composed of pistachio and olive oil cream, by itself was fairly bland. When paired with the shrimp, the combination worked. Our wine for the next few courses was a Ginesta from the Penedes. Abstraction of the Sea. (Seaweed and Mushroom Salad with Rice Vinegar) on a layer of potatoes with bitter almond aioli and a gelatinous seaweed veil - evoking a hit from the sea Possibly my least favorite dish of the meal, I found it bland with no real appeal. It didn't evoke any conception of the sea in my mind. Though this was a pretty composition, I thought the dish a failure in terms of taste or its evocativeness. Maybe it could have used an ipod. Oysters "inspired by the Guggenheim Museum (Bilbao). A signature dish of El Poblet, I like this more than my wife and others that I have spoken with. The large Brittany oyster was warm, but tasted very much of itself. I found this to be much more evocative of the sea than the previous course. This dish was one of the highlights of the meal for me and one of the better composed oyster courses that I have ever had (I still prefer cold, plain oysters with a little lemon most of all). The Guggenheim "shell" in mother-of-pearl color was a fitting case for the briny morsel. Dacosta is well known for his rice dishes. The next course would be our opportunity to try one. to be continued...

Thanks, Dave. That is an interesting suggestion. I don't believe that 1960 was particularly notable for port, but if a port won't have lasted reasonably then what would have?

Thanks, Bud. That is the dilemma for 1960 in that I haven't been able to identify let alone find any area of the world in which 1960 provided a superb age-worthy vintage. Of course, the world of fine wine was much different and smaller then than it is today. Madeira is one of the very few locations that I have identified that may provide an acceptable bottle from that vintage. I'm hoping that someone will be able to identify some obscure gem that I will then be able to go out and find