Barrytm

Here are some posts on that oven http://ths.gardenweb.com/forums/load/appl/msg0713272216482.html?49

Porthos, I didn't answer earlier, because I was afraid I was going to offend you, but I think you are on the right path now. Your earlier question about btu of the burner was a path that I don't think would give the answer you needed. Assume a manufacturer made two identical ovens, and put a 10,000 btu burner in one, and a 20,000 btu burner in the other, which would be more efficient? The answer is probably the 10,000 burner oven, but only a very tiny bit. Since the 20,000 btu burner was twice as powerful, it would stay on about half the time, so the size of the burner is not the big difference in efficiency. Instead, efficiency would depend on the size of the oven cavity, the amount of insulation ( including how much venting there is to the outside of the products of combustion ) and how tightly the thermostat holds the temp, and the duration of cooking. The only way to measure those is a direct measurement, understanding that for different temperatures and different times, you will have different efficiency curves. My WAG, is that in terms of efficiency, a well insulated electric oven will be more efficient than a gas oven, because both are very efficient in converting the power to heat, and a gas oven is usually vented more thoroughly than an electric oven. OTOH, the question of which is more expensive would depend on rates for electric and gas in your area. When you then throw the toaster oven into the mix, a WAG is that is should cost less to operate than a gas oven since while it is not insulated, the oven chamber is a small fraction of the size of a full sized gas oven, but again there is no way to know without running tests. Of course, if you are going to make toast, pretty sure the toaster oven will be cheaper, and if you are cooking a turkey, the full sized gas oven would probably be cheaper since the long preheat time will be offset in part by better heat retention for a long cook. Looking forward to seeing your results. Once you are done with those tests, you might want to test your toaster oven with our without convection to see which is better . Convection adds the electrical power of a fan, but reduces time and temps, so it may be more efficient, no idea.

I have baked bread, the results have not been fantastic. Generally, we want a high temp high humidity environment when the bread is loaded, after a few minutes, you want to vent the humidity, and lower the heat a little. I set mine on combi mode ( which is full steam + convection heat ) at 440 F. 440 F is a little low for loading lean bread, I like 450 or higher. The bigger issue for me is that we want the steam to keep the outside of the loaf moist so that it will expand while cooking. It is my unfounded guess, that the convection air works actually dries out the skin, that is because even with 100% humidity setting, it does not seem as humid as when they inject steam into a bread oven. You would likely not be happy with 100 % steam only, since that only goes up to 212 F, but try it and report back. The bread setting on your oven is probably a combi mode at high heat for a few minutes, then regular convection mode after that.

Nice choice, since it comes with a Broil element, you might have to clean out dust bunnies from your full sized oven in a few months, the Miele will be so fast to warm up, doubt you will use your regular oven much.. I don't in any way mean to criticize your choice, but I did look at the manual, and Miele is just as silly as the Viking I bought. The manual lists 13 different cooking modes, and so they have to make up names for the different functions. For example, the call one mode Surround, another is called intensive. It is hard enough for someone to write a cook book, but they would have to go through all the manuals for the different manufacturers to see what the different names are. BTW, my Viking has a function "SteamHeat". Do you know how much steam it introduces in that function - none. But as it says in the manual, since the vents are closed while the oven is on, any moisture released by the food is converted into steam. Hopefully more of the manufacturers will adopt the gaggenau approach - set the moisture amounts as 0 to 100, then set the heat, and start cooking.

Seabream, you are right, there is not much in the way of cookbooks or recipes. Here are some links to get you started. https://sites.google.com/site/combisteamconvectionsteamoven/home/recipes-and-guides

Mike, I have made cheesecake in a steam oven a few times, it cooks very quickly and does not crack, even though it is nearly solid in the middle by the time I take it out of the steam oven. I cooked at 190 F. Here is a Miele steam oven recipe, it says 1 hour and 30 minutes, which was solid across the top, not jiggly in the center when I did it, so I think a shorter time would work, and cooked the second one in under an hour. http://mieleusa.com/mielerecipe/recipe_list.asp Here is another site that says if you are cooking in a steamer at 100 C it should only take about 30 minutes. http://www.blackbookcooking.com/white-chocolate-cheesecake Since you are making small individual cakes, I would definitely do a test run, and check them early and often. BTW, I did the plastic wrap around the springform pan held in place by a rubber band , and it worked great.

Haresfur, most of them max out at 225 C or 440 F, not sure why. Also, most of them do not have a pure bake mode without convection, and instead, if you want a dry heat, you only have a convection mode. Since a typical conversion is to subtract 25 degrees, the equivalent temp in non convection is 465 F. OTOH, there are certain things I bake where I don't want convection, and want a higher temp, so I use a different oven.

Seabream, I have a built in combi, that is not plumbed, and love it. First, while a countertop can do a nice job, they are limited to 120 volts, most of the installed units ( other than the new Viking which can be installed) are 240 volts and can double as a regular oven. Since it is not plumbed, there is a container you fill to generate steam. I thought it might be a pain, but it has never been an issue for me. Most of the containers are quite large, and mine lasts for a long time. I almost never need to empty water out of the oven. If you are in combi mode, much of the water vapor burns off when it hits the floor of the oven. In steam mode, it would definitely pool on the floor of the oven, and you would have to use a sponge to get it out, which I have done a few times, again, not much of an issue. However,. they come with a slotted pan and a solid pan, and you are instructed to put the solid pan under the slotted pan, and the water collects in the solid pan and you just dump it out when you are done. I did a combi steam chicken tonight, it sat in a slotted pan, the solid pan under it collected all the drippings, and clean up was pretty easy. IMHO, the Gagg is at the top of the list- it is plumbed, which is a nice bonus, but the best is that the controls are pretty straight forward - choose the amount of humidity and then the temperature, and that is it. Most of the others have various modes which can be a little confusing. Many have preprogrammed cooking settings for food types. Some people love that, I don't, I find it too confining and would much rather set it myself. Things to consider include whether it comes with a broil element. While you are buying it for combi mode, you will likely find that you use it in non combi mode more often than you regular oven. Because the interior is pretty small, it preheats in under 5 minutes, so it is much quicker to use than a regular built in stove. Having a temperature probe is a real convenience, especially when you are starting out. In combi mode , it is much quicker than a regular oven, and the probe can help you keep an eye on how fast your food is cooking, though it is not a deal breaker. I looked at all that were available a few years ago, and ended up with a Viking that was being discontinued because the discount was fantastic. There are two related down sides to combis. First, they are not by any means mainstream. The only manufacturers selling them are pretty high end, so the prices are high end to match. Once mainstream manufacturers start selling them, pricing should drop. Second, since there are so few, recipes and cook books are hard to find. Again, if they ever pick up in popularity, that may change. You can find manuals for some of the combi's here https://sites.google.com/site/combisteamconvectionsteamoven/home/recipes-and-guides

You might want to consider a small fridge to handle things that you take in and out of a fridge several times a day, like butter, milk, drinks, condiments etc, to minimize the number of times you have to open the chest freezer. When our power goes out, which used to happen pretty frequently, we would put those types of things in a cooler with some ice so that we only have to open the regular refrigerator door very rarely.

Porthos, I think your daughter will be much happier if you buy a see through container with straight sides, like a Cambro in the above post. For bulk fermentation, the general rule is that you follow the recipe for the amount of the rise ( some recipes say double in volume, others say triple ) and that the time frame is just a rough guideline and may be way off. With a slope sided bowl, it is virtually impossible to determine when it has doubled in size, unless your daughter is a math wiz. With a straight sided see through container it is dirt simple, put the dough in, put a rubber band around the outside of the container at that level, and then put a second rubber band at twice that height - when the dough reaches the second rubber band - it is done ( assuming the recipe says double in volume ). Having an assortment is really helpful if your daughter does different amounts of dough regularly. If she only makes one size, try to find something where the batch will go about 1/3 of the way up the container, that makes it easy to see when it doubles. If you buy a very big container, it can be harder to measure how much is doubled.

FauxPas, when I steam salmon, or most other fish, I usually brine it first, or soak it in a marinade, otherwise you sometimes get that white oozing on top of the fish which is coagulated protein. It doesn't impact the taste, but I don't like the look. The same thing happens with sous vide. BTW, nice job on the chicken and the bread.

I am not a professional knife sharpener, but probably have spent over $750 on sharpening equipment for woodworking tools ( water stones, diamond stones, loose diamonds, grinders, powered sharpeners, ceramic stones, and microfinishing films ) For by best japanese knives I go with microfinishing films, but for ordinary kitchen chef knives this does a great job for under $5.00 - and you can keep it in the knife drawer and use it and put it away in a few seconds, which means you are more likely to use it and keep your knives sharp. http://www.amazon.com/Smiths-CCKS-2-Step-Knife-Sharpener/dp/B00032S02K/ref=sr_1_4?s=kitchen&ie=UTF8&qid=1395106683&sr=1-4&keywords=knife+sharpener BTW, if you haven't tried microfinishing films, they are pricey, but last a long time when used with a little mineral oil. I get the PSA's and stick them to a piece of granite. Also I second both the use of a Sharpie and a 3, 5 and 10 power loupe to examine what you are doing.

I have a 24 inch combi as well, the Viking, and bake bread in it pretty often. It has a pro bake mode, but it does not say how long it steams, so I have not used that mode much. More often, I use the combi mode and switch steam on and off manually. I often bake free form like ciabatta, for that, I preheat a pizza stone for 30 minutes with the steam off, the turn on steam and heat for 10 minutes, then load the loaf, and turn off stream 5 or 10 minutes later. I usually bake only 100 percent whole wheat, so I can't compare my results with most photos I have seen.

Andie, I owned a Whisper mill, which is similar to a Nutrimill, and yes an impact mill is quicker than a stone mill. IMHO, a stone mill does not heat up the flour as much as an impact mill if it is set correctly. Also, most stone mills give a greater range of adjustment than an impact mill. I agree that it takes some time to adjust a stone mill correctly, and if set too fine, it will burn the flour - which is where the phrase came from " keep your nose to the grindstone" since the miller had to be careful to keep the stones close enough to make a fine flour, but no so close that the flour overheated and developed a burned smell. BTW, the makers of the Nutrimill now make a stone version which looks like the Komo and is called the Nutrimill Harvest Grain Mill - have not read any reviews on how it works http://www.breadtopia.com/store/nutrimill-harvest-stone-mill-250w.html but it is priced at around $400

Jo, if you do some research I think you will find that nearly any mill will do a much better job than store bought flour. For store for, they remove the ingredients that go rancid. While the komo is highly rated, you can usually find a stone mill on eBay for around $200. I have taken apart a few of them, and the better built ones, Lee, AllGrain, will last practically forever.

Rotuts, the first one I bought was sold under the Westinghouse Tritec Oven name - though it was not on the Westinghouse website and was not in way supported by Westinghouse. I bought a returned model off ebay, it was missing an o ring, but once I bought one and put it on, it worked okay. I just checked and I am surprised to see it is still available on Amazon http://www.amazon.com/Westinghouse-SA66915-Tritec-Oven-Stainless/dp/B0057R5KY2 it has a very confusing series of buttons and dials - you had to hit a certain button, then turn a different dial, and the water container was extremely small. I I subsequently bought the Viking VCSO after it had been discontinued, so I was able to pick it up at half price and it is like night and day. I think we need to get a critical mass of these units sold, so more people will clamor for them, once that happens, main stream makers, not just the high end lines, will start offering them at a reasonable price.

I bought one of the cheaper versions of a countertop combi to test it out, got hooked and bought a full sized unit. Just posting to clarify that the manual with the full size unit says that at higher temps, you won't see the steam as visibly as you would when the temp is below 212, so even if it doesn't look like it is steaming, it may be adding a bit of moisture. Here is a link that has links to different manuals and recipe books from diff manufacturers. I am not aware of any general cookbooks for combi steam ovens that are in wide circulation. https://sites.google.com/site/combisteamconvectionsteamoven/home/recipes-and-guides

Nwin. if you have rust on the elements, take a photo and send it to Anova and ask what they suggest. I had some rust on the heating tubes, and they told me to send it back, and the replaced it with a new one for me.

I have one and it works better than I expected. First, while it talks about a double press, it isn't really a double press, you press it gently at first, and that triggers a spring which retracts the nozzle, then you continue to press a bit further and a red light comes on showing that the heating bar has turned on to seal. So I never release the bar, and it isn't awkward in any way - you just depress it part way, then all the way. I have not used it to vacuum liquids, but I do use it for sous vide, and freezer, and it works very well - with one fiddly issue. Once you finish the vacuum, and you press the bar to seal, the heating elements come on, and then a buzzer sounds signaling you should let up on the bar, and then press the two corners of the machine to open it and release the bag. There is a dial that you set - which is probably just a timer, to tell the buzzer when to sound. The one fiddly issue is when you first use it, and I set it to 3, I get a perfect seal. If I do another bag, it is fine as well. If I seal a large number of bags in quick succession, the heating elements retain some of the heat so that by the time I get to the 5th or 6th bag, if I wait until the buzzer sounds, the bag will be melted in spots, so you have to learn to turn down the time setting as you go along. The manual describes this, and it is probably true of sealers that use a similar type of heating element. In fairness to the machine, the problem usually turns up when I take a bag and cut it in half, then I vac and seal one end, then just seal one end, then vac and seal the other end, and if I do a few rounds of that, it is not surprising that the elements would pick up some retained heat. Usually I can compensate by turning the dial to a lower number as I am working so that the seals still come out fine. So that is the one fiddly issue I have run into. There is another issue that sounded that it would be trouble, but it hasn't bothered me at all. When the nozzle is fully extended, the vacuum starts. So the best way to do it is to turn off the machine, a little rocker switch on the top, extend the nozzle, put the bag in place, close the machine and push down on each corner, then flick the switch on - once the bag is vacuumed, push the bar slightly, the nozzle retracts, then press further, and when the buzzer sounds take out the bag. The correct procedure is to switch it off, then extend the nozzle and repeat. If you then extend the nozzle without turning it off, the vacuum will start before you have the next bag in place. I don't find that to be a problem at all, sometimes I reach over and hit the switch to stop it, and sometimes I don't, it doesn't really matter to me either way, and since the switch is there on the top, it is no real problem. In terms of liquids, it has a small jar at the rear, the pump goes into a tube which goes into the top of the jar, another tube also goes into the top of the jar, and that tube leads to the nozzle. So if you pick up water in the nozzle, it will get trapped in the jar. In theory, it should be able to get most of the fluid out of a bag, though some of the fluid will end up in the jar ( and in the nozzle ) and as long as it is not too much, it won't get into the motor. I have used it for steaks that were pretty moist, and it did suck some of the juice into the jar , but it is easy to open it and clean it out. They don't mention it in the ad for the machine, but I got a mason jar adapter for a food saver, and you can run that with a hose to the jar at the rear of the machine ( though the food saver jar sealer does not come with a hose, and the hoses from the Sinbo are not quite the right size to fit - so I got another hose). Another bonus that I don't think was advertised when I bought it is that it comes with an extra set of heating elements, so when the original one eventually wears out, you can replace it. Finally, I have only used it with Chamber or flat bags - not the food saver bags. I had read that you could run into a problem where the bag collapsed in front of the nozzle and still left air in the rear of the bag. I have not had that happen - Usually, I just cut the bag before I insert the nozzle so that it is pretty near the food so there is no problem. A few times I just massaged the bag a bit to make sure the air got to the area where the nozzle is. I ended up buying the 8 x 12 boil safe sous vide bags from Web Restaurant - I think it was around 7 cents a bag including shipping - which is pretty good, especially because I can often cut a bag in half and use both halves. The minimum order is 1,000 - but compared to the much higher price per bag for a food saver bag, I thought it was a good bargain.