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Jason - I've tried a variety of fish types. I don't mind the texture I just don't find that I get that yummy umami mouthfeel with this technique and fish. For example I tried Monkfish SV and it was good but not really yummy like the same fish seared at a high heat and then finished in the oven. I've also cooked trout (from a recipe by Tetsuya Wakuda) at a very low level and then finished with shredded seaweed. The texture is basically that of the SV fish but the recipe does suit this technique. And I enjoyed so the texture is not the problem but the lack of flavour is. Al - good point about trying the fish slightly firmer - maybe that is the answer? I agree it would probably be problematic to sear and sv.

I am interested in the results of the fish sous vides. I love rare meat and the results of the sous vide process on meat can be nothing short of phenomenal. But I am not so sure I like fish this way. It is not that I don't like the texture or the idea - for example I love raw fish in sashimi and sushi - it is just that I find the taste or overall experience of sv fish kind of lacking. This is rather counterintuitive for me as we are always being told that fish really suffers from overcooking and would therefore seem to be an ideal candidate for the precision sv method. But I think the practical results are rather different. We recently ate at a technically very good restauarant and everything was exellent with one exception - and that was the fish which had been cooked sous vide. It just lacked flavour and I don't think that the problem was the quality of the fish (wild sea bream) but just the technique of cooking itself. My girlfriend is Italian and from a place where they cook a lot of fish and shellfish and she found it particularly unpalatable. Indeed in Italy fish is cooked much more fiercely than we often see it done here and it is normally absolutely delicious. It tends to have a roasted/maillard outside and a juicy inside but it normally not nearly as rare inside as we are used to being told to cook it. Is the answer to adopt a similar method as we do with steaks (sv then grill or flash fry) or is SV not really so appropriate for fish cooking? I am not convinced that it makes fish anymore tasty than the traditional methods and sometimes in fact it comes well short.

I think that you comfortably have it a month in the fridge as it has been cured. 6-8 weeks if you re-vacuum it and refrigerate it. 4-6 months in the freezer. I most often freeze mine as it is so handy and it doesn't seem to suffer texturally. To be honest I have had some excellent stuff that I brought back from Italy and was still using from the freezer for nearly a year later - but that's pushing it a bit.

Ravelda - I think I'd like to take you up on your kind offer. Always good to meet a fellow egulleter and even better to have an expert guide in an unknown marketplace. I'll PM you. Muichoi - Interesting that you think that the Sheepdrove and Daylesford products "pappy". I didn't find the Daylesford chicken pappy and others seem to like the Sheepdrove poultry. I'll look out for that in my next tastings. You are definitely not alone in liking the Label Anglais though!

Thanks RJS1 - I was previously unaware of the fact that they have a butchers in Maida Vale. I will definitely be paying them a visit in person as some of the other stuff looks good too. Their website could do with some revision I had to click through about 10 pages to get to the chicken ordering page!

I wonder if any expert egulleteers can help me. Let me explain - I went to Arbutus and had a lovely meal. One component of a dish really stuck in my mind. It accompanied a main and was some sliced razor clams in a lovely savoury green sauce. I seem to recall salt, herb, and shallots, possibly some stock. The clams were lightly cooked, sliced and lay in their shell with a little pool of the sauce. Anyway it had been playing on my mind for weeks and I had to know how to make it. So I wrote a polite (I hope) letter asking if they could possibly let me know how to make it or just what was in it. In best Blue Peter style I enclosed a SAE (remember them?). Unfortunately they never got back to me. Anyone here had it and can take a stab at the recipe?

Thanks William. I will add them to my list to try. I've actually never made it to Smithfield Market. What is the procedure, best time to go etc. I go a lot to Billingsgate Market and it is tremendous value but does necessitate an early (6-7ish) morning!

Thanks John - I've added them to my "to try" list. I have a soft spot for Waitrose so will try there. My taste tests so far have all been conducted using a Marcella Hazan recipe - two organic lemons inside the chicken, salt and pepper and nothing else, no oils, no butter. When the chickens are good this is a great recipe for a tasty chicken.

Thanks Erica. We're in London - so nowhere near the Cotswolds but it looks like they might be able to supply mail order. I may try them based on your recommendation - it makes sense to try a variety. Plus I love Guinea Fowl which they also supply.

Folks - thank you so much for your advice. Looks to me that the Label Anglais will be the best, easiest bet. Do you recommend the Pimlico or Borough premises? I really, really want to buy something from Loose Birds of Harome. That is a name to be reckoned with. Tragically it doesn't look like they do mail order...how sad. Reg Johnston is not available online and the Ellel minimum order is too high. Shame because it looks like a nice product. Any other recommendations still welcomed. I will try to report back on the findings.

I believe he has but still consults on the menu and has a trusted disciple in place. Or am I mis-remembering??

I support the recommendation for Nahm. The flavours and balance are visionary. Having said that I must agree that it can be expensive. I had my first taste of David's cooking in the original Darley Street Thai in Sydney and I will never forget just how fresh and good the flavours were in the curry that I had there. Everything just seemed to pop and taste so fresh yet in harmony. All this cost only about £5. Nahm is considerably more expensive (i.e. 10 or 20 times more) but the guy is an undisputed master. After all this is the man that the Thai government has employed to re-establish the authenticity of Thai cuisine in Thailand. I don't think you'll get a stronger recommendation than that...

A month or two ago we had the most awful chicken ever. It was from Somerfield, cost £3 and tasted like cotton wool with a remarkably similar texture to that cosmetic aid. It was surprisingly moist leading me to believe that it had probably been pumped full of water or dunked in some additive laden brine. It was an offence to all poultry. Reflecting on this monstrosity we realised that to pay £3 for something that had been raised to weigh a kilo and half and expect it to taste good was ridiculous and we have vowed never to buy anything like this again. We've started tasting various freerange organic chickens and have been very pleased with the results. Here's what we've found so far - Tesco Organic - About £9 for 2kg bird. Pleasant flavour especially when cold. Texture not too good. Overall a bit of a dissappointment. Whole Foods Generic Organic - About £10 for approx 1.8kg bird. Very ordinary but definitely better than normal supermarket varieties. Daylesford Organic - Over £12 for a 1.8kg bird. Expensive but totally worth it. Exquisite flavour and luscious , pleasantly chewy texture. The undisputed star so far. Anyone have any other recommendations to try from UK based fellow egulleters? They don't have to be Organic just well raised and tasty. We are in London but will travel for food! PS I know Poulet des Landes are amazing but they are a little expensive at about £28 a bird. Having said that all price points will be considered.

It sounds like a great solution. My only concern is that the bowl for the smoking material looks so small that I can't imagine that it would be easy to get many hours of smoking out of it. I agree though that the SV would probably really intensify the flavour. I'd love to hear how you get on with the Pipe. If it works I will definitely be getting one. As a side note anyone know what temperature wood begins to smoke at? I might try an experiment with my precision hotplate.

Chuffi, Boiling is different from simmering. Boiling always takes place at 100C (actually not strictly true the boiling point will alter minutely depending on altitude) but to all extents and purposes you can count it as 100C. Here are the other temperatures of common cookery terms - Poach 71-82C, Simmer 85-96C, Boiling 100C In terms of the pasta boiling is boiling but you would not want to just boil away at maximum temperatures and add water (as mentioned above) with proteins because of the various points when proteins denature. These occur at less than 100C and could result in stringy or oddly textured meat, fish etc. if you choose to boil them in the cookery process.

How sad. She seemed like a lovely, smart lady. Definitely an eGullet fixture. She will be much missed.

Great guys - thanks for all the advice. The Ideas in Food guys cook for 250F (121C) for 5 hours. I wonder if 75C would be better? Digijam - that smoking gun looks great. Thanks for pointing it out cos I love a kitchen gadget. Have you used one? I am just wondering how much flavour one can induce into the ribs using one of these. I guess one uses it for 5 or 10 minutes which doesn't seem like it would induce much flavour compared to a 5 or 6 hour long slow cook in a real smoker.

Thanks Al - that looks spot on. I think I will try their method with a rub then Sous Vide and finish under the grill. I will use =Marks recipe for the finishing sauce as it seems to get rave reviews. I wish I had a smoker. Eventually I want to try to make my own but that is someways off. I wonder if I could add a tiny little amount of hickory smoke powder to the rub prior to the SV in order to get a little smoke flavour.

Hi Chris, My thinking is - keeps em moist, keeps em tender, doesn't dilute flavour like when they are boiled, possibly chance to add flavour in the sous vide stage, not time critical.

Have been doing some rib research on eGullet and thought I'd ask a question of the experts here. I have no smoker or BBQ grill at the moment so I want to experiment using indoor equipment. I was planning on - 1. A short brine for the loin ribs 2. Cooking sous vide at 170F for one hour 3. Removing from sous vide bag and putting on some of =Mark's sauce (mentioned upthread). 4. Finish off under the grill in my oven (think it is called broiler in the US). Do you think this will work? Could I add some of Klinks rub first prior to sous viding or would that be too overpowering? Remembering that Sous Vide really exagerates whatever flavours are in the bag. I know that this will never be as good as a proper smoker setup or a long slow cook but I would like to try a compromise method.

Hi - love the Gremolata! It will lose a bit of its vibrancy if you make it too early - actually the acid in the lemon juice will attack the herbs and cause them to lose some of their colour. If you can I'd make it at the last possible minute as it will taste and look much fresher. If you really want to make it early don't worry it will be still be good - just not as "fresh" tasting or looking. By the way if you have any left over you can freeze it quite successfully.

Bryan I enjoyed, vicariously, your little European mini tour. Nice pictures and intelligent criticism. But I feel moved to have to take issue with one comment of yours that I feel is very wrong, viz - I think that there are many restuarants you could have eaten at in the UK that would have nullified your above paragraph - you just didn't eat at any of them! Your sample size is a bit small to come out with this. I mean there are about 3 or 4 places in London alone that are doing more avant garde stuff than you had in this thread. And what about the Fat Duck? They surely are doing some interesting things? I realise that your sample size was necessarily small but I think if you are looking for this kind of cooking you were really looking in the wrong place with the London venues you chose. You ate at more traditional venues or mainstream ones with no pretensions to even gourmet cooking let alone experimental cuisine. I mean the roasted meat (shwarma) place you really enjoyed at the start of your London trip would probably be universally avoided by any foodie based here. It would be a bit like me looking for some techno-gel and airs at White Castle. It ain't gonna happen. I can't agree on the service challenging notions either - there are loads of people doing this in the UK. I think the problem is that you just didn't make it to any of the right restaurants. Just wanted to put the record straight that there really is plenty of innovation in dining here in the UK.

Reporting back on my Steak sous vide adventures. I SVd a really thick huge piece of wonderful dry aged steak seasoned only with some salt for 5 hours at 51C. To serve I grilled it for mere seconds over some charcoal at inferno heat levels. The charcoal smokiness added immeasurably to the final product. It was one of best steaks I've had. Next time I am going to try 6 or 7 hours for experimentation purposes - I'd like even more tenderness. On to chicken - I want to SV some chicken pieces in some duck fat. I was thinking 1 hour at 140F or should I go longer or higher? I am planning or searing after for some of that ol' Maillard action.

Infernoo - So your nickname is very apt! I don't think that it would be hard to hack these ovens. Most probably the door is kept closed by a door interlock mechanism such as a little solenoid that pushes a little bar and locks the door. Disable the solenoid, most probably by simply removing a wire from the solenoids power supply, and you have the ability to open the oven door whenever you need it. I'd like to do this to my oven also and for the same reason as you (pizza). My oven doesn't have pyrolytic functions as only the top of the range oven had that. However I am quite sure that all these oven have the same functionality as each other and that the capability to switch on the extra features is there on most models. You just have to find out how to do it. I am researching how to do it on the Gaggenau ovens but there is not a lot of information out there. One idea I have was to disable the temperature regulator and then control the oven using a PID. Basically then the elements run at full whack until you throttle them back to whatever you require. I feel quite sure that the Pyrolytic ovens don't have any special elements to make them go hotter but they may have better insulation to protect the surroundings. If you use a PID you have the advantage of super precise temperature control at any level. PS Can you tell us how you got high powered wok burner? I'd like to try that myself.

Great question Fat Guy! The chef is a guest in your house I don't think he's judging you, he's pleased to be there. I've heard many chefs complain that no-one asks them out to dinner parties because everyone is too scared. So they are just pleased to be asked out to dinner. That said I don't think this would be the time to do your El Bulli lite! Keep it fairly simple. We once had a Michelin starred chef to lunch. We made grilled clams with rocket and herbs. Followed by some wild boar pappardelle. He loved it because a) Everything was seasonal b) It was simple and tasted good and c) He felt comfortable. So I say treat him like your other guests and don't show off (too much anyway!).