Varietal

[rich]

Even if I hated it and Kahns desserts, I would want to know whats behind them and protest a review like this just as loudly.

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Catch a wave and I'm sitting on top of the world.

[BryanZ]

tan, I'm right with you on this one. I posted something to a similar effect on the Bruni thread.

[Pan]

tan, have you dined at Varietal?

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Pan. I think you know where I reside so the answer is no.I don't see where it matters.[...]

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My implication was that if you've never dined at a restaurant, it seems questionable to have a view of how good or bad it is, or to cheerlead for it on any basis other than I suppose being a friend or/and fan of someone involved (but then you could be accused of being personally biased). No offense, just making explicit what was implicit in my question. And I now see that your objection is evidently to the nature of the review, not to the pro or con judgment on the restaurant that is contained within the review. (Or is that incorrect and do you object to any kind of negative judgment in any review?) I could offer counterarguments to your critique of critiquing, for the sake of argument, but would rather not do so in this thread. For the record, I have been ignoring most of Bruni's reviews and didn't read this one. It just struck me as odd for someone who's never been to the restaurant to offer an opinion about the review. If it had been a good review, would you have been as likely to criticize it?

Edited March 24, 2007 by Pan (log)

[tan319]

If it had been a good review, after the ambulance brought me back from the dead, I would have at least had to read it again while they were still there.

Yes, I'm objecting to the snarkiness of the review, the nature of it if you will.

One can have negative thoughts, write about them, without being a jackass

Jordan is what I would call an e-friend, I interviewed him for my website but, like I said before, you've never seen any comments from me, ever, in this thread proclaiming him a genius of dessert.

Not only does the tone of the review hurt EVERYONE involved, the chef, the owner, etc., reviews like this have a negative effect on people trying to do something different then Del Posto, etc.

tan, have you dined at Varietal?

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Pan. I think you know where I reside so the answer is no.I don't see where it matters.[...]

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My implication was that if you've never dined at a restaurant, it seems questionable to have a view of how good or bad it is, or to cheerlead for it on any basis other than I suppose being a friend or/and fan of someone involved (but then you could be accused of being personally biased). No offense, just making explicit what was implicit in my question. And I now see that your objection is evidently to the nature of the review, not to the pro or con judgment on the restaurant that is contained within the review. (Or is that incorrect and do you object to any kind of negative judgment in any review?) I could offer counterarguments to your critique of critiquing, for the sake of argument, but would rather not do so in this thread. For the record, I have been ignoring most of Bruni's reviews and didn't read this one. It just struck me as odd for someone who's never been to the restaurant to offer an opinion about the review. If it had been a good review, would you have been as likely to criticize it?

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[655321]

whatever the reasons may be for Chef Kahn's decision to leave, they are his own and at his own accord. all that i know is that i am making reservations there tonight before he and his deserts leave the stage at varietal.

there's no doubt that he will resurface, but the question is where and when. better get on the ball if you want to catch a taste of something unique and inspired.

[BryanZ]

Where's FoodPassion when we need him?

[JohnL]

tan, have you dined at Varietal?

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Pan. I think you know where I reside so the answer is no.I don't see where it matters.[...]

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My implication was that if you've never dined at a restaurant, it seems questionable to have a view of how good or bad it is, or to cheerlead for it on any basis other than I suppose being a friend or/and fan of someone involved (but then you could be accused of being personally biased). No offense, just making explicit what was implicit in my question. And I now see that your objection is evidently to the nature of the review, not to the pro or con judgment on the restaurant that is contained within the review. (Or is that incorrect and do you object to any kind of negative judgment in any review?) I could offer counterarguments to your critique of critiquing, for the sake of argument, but would rather not do so in this thread. For the record, I have been ignoring most of Bruni's reviews and didn't read this one. It just struck me as odd for someone who's never been to the restaurant to offer an opinion about the review. If it had been a good review, would you have been as likely to criticize it?

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Was this a "bad" review?

I thought it was pretty balanced and overall: favorable.

[phaelon56]

Moderator's Note:

Let's keep this discussion focused on Varietal itself including any specifics about the recent review and comments on that review. Discussion of a more general nature regarding approval or disapproval of Bruni's reviewing style belongs here:

Bruni and Beyond: NYC Reviewing (2007)

[Sneakeater]

Today eater reports that Ed Witt is leaving Varietal.

So BOTH Witt AND Kahn are leaving?

That'll make it lot easier for them to concentrate on their wine program.

[rich]

Today eater reports that Ed Witt is leaving Varietal.

So BOTH Witt AND Kahn are leaving?

That'll make it lot easier for them to concentrate on their wine program.

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Maybe I can apply - I do both savory and dessert. It will save a full salary. Of course, I don't use eggplant or rutabaga in any of my desserts - oh well, maybe next time.

[jkahn]

whatever the reasons may be for Chef Kahn's decision to leave, they are his own and at his own accord.  all that i know is that i am making reservations there tonight before he and his deserts leave the stage at varietal.

there's no doubt that he will resurface, but the question is where and when.  better get on the ball if you want to catch a taste of something unique and inspired.

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i apologize for my lack of posting gentelmen. i sent out my official press release today which explains my future plans, in order to put to bed any speculation as to my reasoning. i have resigned from varietal restaurant, and i am moving to california to put together my own project. i cannot disclose any further information at this time, but i will try to keep everyone up-to-date on any advancements or new developments. my reason for leaving varietal in no way had anything to do with any of the reviews. this is a decision which i've been contemplating for quite sometime, and the reviews just came out at a coincidental time. for the record, i really wasn't upset by bruni or platt's review. in fact, i was more confused than anything. he didn't really remark whether he like or disliked the desserts, he more so just explained what they were and didn't dissect the dishes like he normally does. if he didn't like them, i would be okay with that, but i would have appreciated some sort of explanation. in any event, thank any and all of you who have been very supportive of me over the last few months. and i really appreciate those of you who made it out to the restaurant to experience what we do. we were always excited to have egulleteers in the restaurant. though i am leaving new york, i will certainly miss it. there is a wealth of talent here, and those who live here are very fortunate. i am slipping under the radar for a while, but i can assure you that i will not fade away, and i will resurface in the future with something extraordinary.

thank you,

jordan kahn.

Edited March 29, 2007 by jkahn (log)

[BryanZ]

he didn't really remark whether he like or disliked the desserts, he more so just explained what they were and didn't dissect the dishes like he normally does.  if he didn't like them, i would be okay with that, but i would have appreciated some sort of explanation.

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Indeed.

This makes me so sad. Really really, really sad. It looks like the next time I will have the opportunity to sample Chef Kahn's creations will be on a future visit to California. I think he should stay around and work with Liebrandt. That would make things better.

[docsconz]

whatever the reasons may be for Chef Kahn's decision to leave, they are his own and at his own accord.  all that i know is that i am making reservations there tonight before he and his deserts leave the stage at varietal.

there's no doubt that he will resurface, but the question is where and when.  better get on the ball if you want to catch a taste of something unique and inspired.

←

i apologize for my lack of posting gentelmen. i sent out my official press release today which explains my future plans, in order to put to bed any speculation as to my reasoning. i have resigned from varietal restaurant, and i am moving to california to put together my own project. i cannot disclose any further information at this time, but i will try to keep everyone up-to-date on any advancements or new developments. my reason for leaving varietal in no way had anything to do with any of the reviews. this is a decision which i've been contemplating for quite sometime, and the reviews just came out at a coincidental time. for the record, i really wasn't upset by bruni or platt's review. in fact, i was more confused than anything. he didn't really remark whether he like or disliked the desserts, he more so just explained what they were and didn't dissect the dishes like he normally does. if he didn't like them, i would be okay with that, but i would have appreciated some sort of explanation. in any event, thank any and all of you who have been very supportive of me over the last few months. and i really appreciate those of you who made it out to the restaurant to experience what we do. we were always excited to have egulleteers in the restaurant. though i am leaving new york, i will certainly miss it. there is a wealth of talent here, and those who live here are very fortunate. i am slipping under the radar for a while, but i can assure you that i will not fade away, and i will resurface in the future with something extraordinary.

thank you,

jordan kahn.

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Jordan, thanks for taking the time to reply. Your leaving for California is NY's loss and California's gain. Best wishes.

[Sneakeater]

MAJOR loss for NY.

Jordan, thanks for the few months you gave us.

[Sneakeater]

(FUCK I wanted you to be at that Liebrandt restaurant.)

[rich]

I want to start by saying I appreciate Jordan posting here, but I'm seeking clarification on one point. In the statement it says "...I've been contemplating (the resignation) for quite some time..."

With the restaurant open barely three months, how long could this contemplation have been? It sounds like the thought process began shortly after the opening - and that seems a bit odd.

[docsconz]

Varietal on Eater's Deathwatch

[Swicks]

*crosses fingers for Southern California*

Good luck chef!

[docsconz]

Wayne Nish will be the new chef at Varietal, making a more traditional cuisine.

[flinflon28]

And apparently a $48 three course menu. Since I live three blocks away I say it's finally time to try this place soon!

http://www.nypost.com/seven/04042007/enter...teve_cuozzo.htm

[rich]

Wayne Nish will be the new chef at Varietal, making a more traditional cuisine.

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Does that mean Nish is leaving Nish and Nish is closing?

The Times reported today Kahn's going to SF.

Edited April 4, 2007 by rich (log)

[oakapple]

Wayne Nish will be the new chef at Varietal, making a more traditional cuisine.

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Does that mean Nish is leaving Nish and Nish is closing?

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Read the Post article. Nish is doing what a lot of chefs do, but that he (so far) had resisted: running two kitchens at once.

Nish is at least an established chef, but Cuozzo wonders it it's too little, too late. I am not sure Varietal's clientele would find a $48 three-course prix fixe attractive. I would have chosen a menu that lends itself to grazing.

The other problem will be Getting The Word Out. Varietal managed the unusual feat of getting reviewed by every publication in town. But the reviews are over now, and the critics aren't likely to rush back for Release 2.0.

[JohnL]

I think this proves that a restaurant can't be all things to all people.

Wine and food need to work together.

If you are serving highly complex food with unconventional flavors then the wine list needs to complement that food and should be very carefully chosen. The food must take center stage.

If you are compiling a large and varied wine list and featuring flights and tastes as then the wine takes center stage and the food can be top flight but should be simpler and less complicated/complex or exotic. Choices should not be difficult--food should call out for wine not challenge the diner (and the staff) to find something that will work.

Deserts should follow suit. Dishes that would encourage one to order a glass of wine to accompany them.

Somehow it seems that Varietal was a case of say the three tenors (Hockenberry, Witt and Kahn) all on stage at the same time each singing a different aria.

No question re: the talent but a hell of a confusing time for the audience!

Look to Veritas! They get it.

Edited April 4, 2007 by JohnL (log)

[Nathan]

Cru tries to be both...and seems to make it.

they even used to have an avant garde pastry chef

[oakapple]

I think this proves that a restaurant can't be all things to all people.

Because Varietal failed so quickly and spectacularly, you could probably come up with 100 explanations. As I saw it, Witt's cuisine, for what they were charging for it, didn't have a good enough ratio of hits to misses. It might be as simple as that. I also thought that you had to be a little gullible to buy into their concept of the wine list.

Depending on what you compare it to, there certainly are examples where a similar concept has worked.