Gilt

[tan319]

We are in the day of age where it is no longer relevant how much talent a young chef has. Cooking a carrot perfectly ala Robuchon is no longer enticing to the majority and chefs and restaurants are forced to invent some type of gimmick to draw attention to themselves to stand out from the pack.

Chef's now must be able to foresee the future and predict the next thing that will excite an ever easily bored customer. And these gimmicks are always a gamble when it comes to how the press is going to perceive it.

Problem is chefs must push the envelope more and more to be noticed.

In a more extreme case an example is Chef Liebrandt's blind folding customers and in a more simple case Ducasse's box of pens. In both cases the press trashed them and are still unrelentless to this day.

Of coarse then you have Batali's orange sneaker and shorts gimmick that draws a pubic relation's pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.

Chef's spend years developing their talent and career and after all that sweat and sacrifice their ship finely comes in only to have to gamble on what will be the next  attention grabber. Only to be sunk by some critic.

It's a shame that it all comes down to a roll of the dice in the end.

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But do "we" really think Liebrandt did "that" dinner to garner attention or because he was reading about a custom or an incident and he thought it would be fun to do?

You're a chef, do you or ANY of you ever get tired of just using the same old technique day in day out just because people will respect it?

I'm sure ( and I know you're not saying Liebrandt doesn't) Paul can cook a carrot perfectly ala Robuchon. Just look at who he's worked for in the past!

A Whos Who of Michelin starred chefs.

What's the gimmick Liebrandt is using now?

Charging a lot for wine in some peoples minds?

Charging a supplement for an ingredient used?

Per Se does that, many others in the city.

Maybe not as much, maybe more.

Whatever it is, too many people have raved favorably about the food, and if it's brassy or ballsy to say I want to own my own place, well then, so be it.

doc, she was talking that VH-1 out of the side of her mouth vibe to me.

Nicely negative-ish

[Megan Blocker]

Gael Greene has a quick blurb about Gilt on nymetro.com this week...

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I couldn't really tell if she liked it or didn't. She certainly wrote some positive things, although the tone came across to me as negative.

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I think she's sort of pulling the whole "those crazy kids today" attitude - almost like, the food is good, but it's not her kind of place (a little over-the-top for her, perhaps?). Which is a totally viable and legitimate position, I would think.

Having not been yet myself, I can't comment, but that's what I took away from her piece, at least.

[robert40]

I'm not sure what Liebrandt's attention was with the blind fold thing. But if it was a gimmick more power to him as far as I'm concerned. A chef in NYC needs an extra edge there to be noticed more then anywhere.

My point is that more then ever chefs and restaurants need to pull tricks out of their hat more then ever hoping the press will say 'WOW' and not thumbs down.

Its like throwing feathers in the air and trying to predict where there going to land.

I hope the best for Liebrandt because he is determined to do the work he wants to do and has refused to sway from it. He deserves a break and I hope the critic's give him one.

[robert40]

Chef's spend years developing their talent and career and after all that sweat and sacrifice their ship finely comes in only to have to gamble on what will be the next  attention grabber. Only to be sunk by some critic.

It's a shame that it all comes down to a roll of the dice in the end.

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Launching a restaurant is indeed a roll of the dice, but not for the reason you state.

A single critic can't make or break a restaurant these days.

You have mediocre places like Café des Artistes and One if by Land that aren't adored by any critic, but are consistently packed, year after year. And you have places that fail, like Laurent Tourondel's late lamented Cello, despite rave reviews.

Gilt will have plenty of press—three critics have already written about it, and it's been open less than a month. A welter of negative criticism would be damaging, but I see no sign of that happening.

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No? Look at Ducasse and all over a box of pens and some squab knives.

Did it go out of business no, but with any other person then what may be the most popular chef in the world ? My bet is it would have been long shut down.

And he's still strugging over that first wave of press. Maybe I'm wrong but I truly believe Ducasse would likely have a two month waiting list like Per Se if the initial

press would have been different.

And in the case of Liebrandt remember the the very first negative review in Gourmet magazine was of Atlas. Bad is not the word for it. They ripped him through the dirt. Was it the reason for it closing or his leaving? I'm not sure.

But I'm willing to bet the owners were not happy campers no matter how much talent he has because in 99% of the cases its only the bottom line that matters.

[robert40]

Let me add that in the case of Cello I think it was a matter of the owner thinking this is not fun anymore. Not that it failed.

[Busboy]

Huh. I was thinking about posting a "whatever happened to that guy who ran Papillon?" thread when I stumbled across this. Though it was before my eGullet days and thus there are now written records, my wife and I were blown away by a tasting menu a few years back at Papillon -- though disappointed that we didn't get to slurp appetizers off anyone's back or wear a blindfold at any point.

I've been waiting for Paul to resurface and, based on the reports here, looking forward to maybe getting another taste of his cooking next time we journey to the Big Ap.

[JohnL]

Yesterday (wednesday) the Post carried steve Cuozzo's review of Gilt.

In pithy Post fashion the review was headed: "The Ego Has Landed"

subhead--"Presumptuous Gilt faces trials"

In short--Cuozzo gives the place a very good review. He notes the high prices (he gives a slap to the restaurant for "the shakedown wine list" and the $18-$28 supplements--but also notes that Gilt has exteremely high overhead--Rent aside, he states that to execute the complex dishes and deliver the luxury the target patrons expect, there are 90 employees for just 52 seats. ( a higher ratio than Le Bernardin).

It is the complexity of the dishes (and the quality--Cuozzo uses "sublime intricacy" to describe a dish of "Scottish langoustine in Preparation, royale, tartar and crispy."--going on to describe its preparation:

"The creature is alive in the kitchen. In a frenzy of simultaneous maneuvers, different segments are cut, rolled, spiced, grilled, consommed, pureed and creamed. The results are embraced in a fantasia of Shanghai cabbage, cucumber, green mango, Thai lentils, cilantro, micro licorice basil, saffron and garlic."

Basically Cuozzo concludes that Liebrandt's cooking may be worth the high prices--he asks if people whose meals are not covered by a newspaper will spend as much as they do at "Daniel, Jean Georges or Le Bernardin on a cult figure, 29 year old chef in a hotel dining room?" He does note that Gilt in comparison to Liebrandt's earlier places--Atlas and Papillon--" is many times more mature with magical dishes like ocean trout cooked with clementines and sunchokes It's (Gilt) even potentially great."

All in all a very good review.

Edited January 19, 2006 by JohnL (log)

[xdrixn]

Gael Greene began a sentence with a conjunction.

B-

Edited January 19, 2006 by xdrixn (log)

[JohnL]

Its just all Whiny BS.

Gilt isnt ripping anyone off.

Its an expensive place, dont want to go ?

There are lots of other restaurants on the island.

The fact that two people in the same industry have the same opinion isnt a definite barometer of credibility. I am suspicious of food writers in general and I dont really think they reach independent conclusions. I am sure cuozzo read Bruni's article last week, its just as possible he may have been influenced by it.........as it is that he reached his own independent conclusions so that theory does not work.

happens all the time.

Every high end restaurant in NY has incredible markups on wine.

Every high end restaurant in NY peddles bottled water.

Its hypocrisy using GILt as a scapegoat.

They do the same thing at Ducasse, Per Se, JG, daniel,Marche, Cru, Bernadin ect ect.

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I agree with you.

Bruni was not "reviewing" Gilt--he was writing a piece with an angle: NY Restaurant rip off's.

Which he was likely inspired to write after visiting Gilt on preparation for his formal review.

IMOP--Bruni focuses too much on Gilt--in what should be a broader focused piece, thus, turning it into a sort of mini-review.

What bothers me about Bruni (and many of thge other writers at the Times) is I feel as though there is an all too obvious attempt to find the "hook" in every piece.

Rather than just good writing and reviewing and then looking for a hook to hang a headline on--it seems as though the Times folks go into the review of piece looking for the hook first and then hanging the review or writing on it.

Contrasted with Cuozzo and the Post--it is clear that Cuozzo went in and wrote a review and then he or an editor "found" the hook to hang the headline on.

You are correct about prices in New York City--the place is expensive and difficult to do business in. Prices can be outrageous (ever look at the cost of a steak at Lobel's?).

I feel Cuozzo handled the price issue at Gilt (see my post below) very nicely.

He put things into perspective--which is what the Times has trouble doing.

[reachej]

It's expensive... It's fine dining, and well done at that. With all of the extras that have already been mentioned, everyone ends up with a tasting menu, three courses of which have been chosen by the customer. If they had just called it a tasting menu no one would have blinked an eye. Should they have to? I left after more than 2 hours and had more food than I really needed. The place is expensive (for food, I won't get into the wine), but far from overly so in the intended genre. It's great, the rest is just semantics.

[ASM NY]

Just came back from my birthday dinner at GILT.

First impressions: the place is small. 15 tables, when we arrived at 7pm we were only one of four tables that actually had people sitting having dinner. By the time we left (10:30) there was a full house. Given the number of courses that are served at any given moment in time, I did notice the staff sometimes having a bit of a hard time "manouvering" around the tables. When we walked in, the average age in the room dropped by 20 years.

The service was solid. Very helpful, very friendly, a little more formal than it needed, but overall no complaints there.

The menu. Split into two: Classical and Modern. The classic, to give some additional options to the older customers that might not be feeling so adventurous. Overall I did get a sense that there is some restraint in the chef's creativity and what he would ideally like to serve, as if NYC may not be ready for it. Three course menu: $92, tasting menu $135. (everyone gets the canapes, amuses, petitfours and chocolates)

Quick note on the food: We had the tasting menu, and they were extremely flexible in making substitutions and letting you mention items that you may not like. My wife had to constantly remind me to try to put many of the different elements of each dish on the fork before eating. In this place it makes a huge difference, and this is where I see some real genius in the chef's cooking. The combination of flavors just exploded in your mouth.

CANAPES

- Beet Crocant with vinegar salt - I was a little bit disappointed to see this item brought to the table since we tried this exact item at ElBulli 2 years ago, and it's straight out of their 2003/2004 cookbook. It's delicious, but not an original.

- Passionfruit/Saffron Marshmallow with Chorizo powder. This was outstanding, it wasn't sweet at all and the flavors contrasted well.

- Arugula financier with Stilton and walnut chutney. Delicious as well. Very light.

- Oreo cookie. The "cookie" was made with squid ink, the filling was caramelized onion.

AMUSES

(they bring all of these at once, and in my opinion, it crowded the table. It makes very little point to bring them all at once, it hurries the meal a little bit, and it becomes difficult to switch from one dish to the next)

- Jerusalem Artichoke Foam: Served in a small cup. Very light, a little salty, there was grapefruit and fennel at the bottom. Very tasty.

- Shrimp: Served raw, with a crunchy green peppercorn disk. This was "ok", wasn't crazy about it.

- Rabbit/Chicken Terrine - Very tasty, quite smoky flavor.

- Sea Urchin Custard - I have never been a huge sea urchin fan, but the texture and flavor were sublte and delicious.

DISHES

- Oysters: A trio of oysters with a slice of black truffle, covered with lemon foam. The flavor from the truffle had a hard time coming through. It came with a side of a "sandwich" of foie gras, cheese, apple and truffle.

- Kampachi Sashimi: It came with rhubarb, an olive oil sorbet, piquillo pepper sauce and sprinkled with pink salt. The combination of all of these together was really something else.

- Diver Scallops: Served over small pieces of cauliflower and covered with a lobster roe biscuit and with a caper/berry sauce on the side. The biscuit was very sublte and crunchy, and all of it combined with the sauce was outstanding.

- Dover Sole: covered with a sliver or Comte cheese, with chanterelles, leeks with a dijon/tarragon sauce (foamy). This also came with a small side of peruvian potatoes (tiny!) with duck.

- Apple/Wasabi sorbet with lemongrass powder and Manni olive oil. Small dish to cleanse palate.

- Pine-smoked Venison Tenderloin: It came served over sweet potato and covered with small soufleed potatoes. It came with a foie gras/peking duck sauce (could only taste the foie gras).

DESSERTS

- Lemon "Bomb": A very light lemon mousse with champagne sorbet and crunchy lemon "drops".

- Tangerines: Tangerines with tangerine gelee, lychee sorbet and crunchy tangerine chocolate drops.

- Begniets/Parfait: 3 Chocolate Beignets, peanut butter parfait with almond crust and caramelized fleur de sel. This was the only major let down of the evening. The beignets were tasty, but the parfait was just too big and it was as if someone had just poured 1/2 jar of jiffy on the plate.

- Warm Tangerine/Chocolate Cake: The cake was good, but not overly original, but when combined with the pepper reduction and the chile ancho parfait it was a very good combination.

PETIT FOURS

- Pistacchio financier

- Casis drop (very good)

- Mini lemon merengue

- Passion fruit/coconut

CHOCOLATES

(I usually pay little attention to these, but these in particular were off the charts, it was as if you were biting into a coffee bean or a mint leave, very difficult to describe, just make sure to try them if you go).

The ones that I thought were great:

- Earl Gray with matcha powder

- Coffee

- Mint

In conclusion, after reading many of the comments in this forum I came in with very high expectations and the restaurant did not disappoint. I totally see myself returning. When comparing it to meals in Per Se, I would say that even though the place is not as fancy or the service as polished, the food is as well executed. The food is certainly more creative and "fun" and would probably take a dinner over Per Se (independently of the price, which is considerably less).

[flyingsaucier]

Just a little insider, the general manager at Gilt is the former maitre'd at per se and so as most of the server. This is probably the reason the service is fluid and graceful. Talkin about choreography!!

[docsconz]

Just a little insider, the general manager at Gilt is the former maitre'd at per se and so as most of the server. This is probably the reason the service is fluid and graceful. Talkin about choreography!!

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Welcome to eGullet, flyingsaucier! This is interesting and somewhat surprising information. Did these people leave Per Se specifically to work at Gilt?

[IML]

Doc,

The transplanted per se alums followed the manager and good pay.

[docsconz]

Doc,

The transplanted per se alums followed the manager and good pay.

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Two important things.

[iheartoffal]

I had a feeling...

[JohnL]

After reading ASM's interesting post (and some others) -seems to me that Mr Bruni did the restaurant (and Times readers) a disservice by singling it out for its high prices with little or no context.

It will be very interesting to see how he handles things in his formal review.

Interesting how the Gilt menu is divided. NYC is more than ready for this cutting edge cuisine (witness WD-50 etc) but one must consider the location--Gilt is ensconced in prime uptown real estate. The overhead must be phenominally high--Gilt has to go for a very well healed crowd which may or may not be as adventurous--especially at these prices.

Thus, it makes sense that maybe they are hedging their bets a bit--also given the chef's experiences at Atlas (same neighborhood) this may be a smart thing to do.

[oakapple]

It sounds like Gilt's menu is undergoing some refinement. On the website, there is no division of the menu into "Classic" and "Modern" sections. No tasting menu is indicated, only the $92 prix fixe. I believe someone said upthread that the present menu has fewer dishes with supplements than it did before, so perhaps the restaurant is paying attention when critic after critic whines about the cost shakedown.

After reading ASM's interesting post (and some others) -seems to me that Mr Bruni did the restaurant (and Times readers) a disservice by singling it out for its high prices with little or no context.

As I see it, Bruni may have done them an enormous favor, since he offered advance notice of what his complaints are likely to be. If the restaurant cares what he thinks, there is still time to make adjustments before the "permanent" review—the one most visitors to the Times site are likely to see for years & years—gets written.

Of course, the restaurant may not care what he thinks. ASM said the place was full, so the Bruni piece probably hasn't cost them any business. Indeed, it may actually have been good for business. There's an old saying that there's no such thing as bad publicity; the only bad publicity is none at all.

Interesting how the Gilt menu is divided. NYC is more than ready for this cutting edge cuisine (witness WD-50 etc).....

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There really is no "etcetera." Until now, WD-50 has had the avant-garde niche pretty much to itself. The question is whether that genre can succeed in a space that was formerly known for conservative haute cuisine. Edited January 30, 2006 by oakapple (log)

[JohnL]

It sounds like Gilt's menu is undergoing some refinement. On the website, there is no division of the menu into "Classic" and "Modern" sections. No tasting menu is indicated, only the $92 prix fixe. I believe someone said upthread that the present menu has fewer dishes with supplements than it did before, so perhaps the restaurant is paying attention when critic after critic whines about the cost shakedown.

After reading ASM's interesting post (and some others) -seems to me that Mr Bruni did the restaurant (and Times readers) a disservice by singling it out for its high prices with little or no context.

As I see it, Bruni may have done them an enormous favor, since he offered advance notice of what his complaints are likely to be. If the restaurant cares what he thinks, there is still time to make adjustments before the "permanent" review—the one most visitors to the Times site are likely to see for years & years—gets written.

Of course, the restaurant may not care what he thinks. ASM said the place was full, so the Bruni piece probably hasn't cost them any business. Indeed, it may actually have been good for business. There's an old saying that there's no such thing as bad publicity; the only bad publicity is none at all.

Interesting how the Gilt menu is divided. NYC is more than ready for this cutting edge cuisine (witness WD-50 etc).....

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There really is no "etcetera." Until now, WD-50 has had the avant-garde niche pretty much to itself. The question is whether that genre can succeed in a space that was formerly known for conservative haute cuisine.

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The fact remains that Bruni offered no context for the prices. He had an angle and he pursued that angle. A bit more on why restaurants charge what they do was in order.

Cuozzo notes the high prices in his review and provides some context.

You are correct about WD-50--my point was more that in NY location is extremely important in a restaurant's menu, pricing, and focus especially when engaging in anything "experimental.". Looking at failures is probably a better way to make that point--wrong place wrong time etc--Meigas, Rakel and Atlas are three that come to mind.

There seems to be some confusion about Gilt among those who have not been to the restaurant and are relying upon what they read-internet, Bruni etc.

Interestingly, those who have been there from Cuozzo to folks here at egullet (ASM, BryanZ et al) offer a different perspective from the web site and Bruni.

Oddly, no one who has actually experienced the place--seems to be making a big deal about the prices.

(Bruni practically "condemned" the place over its pricing practices.)

In fact--Bruni's attempt at any context was a backhanded slap at the food--the sole (fish) reference.

IMOP--Bruni is slowly and steadily devaluing the relevence of the Times restaurant reviews.

The cumulative effect of this Gilt issue (more to come in his full/formal review of Gilt, wanna bet that when this comes out we will be spending a lot of time comparing his review to his comments about Gilt in the pricing practivces piece instead of discussing the review wand the restaurant?)

along with his "waiter" piece, l' affaire Del Posto and the confusion over his awarding of stars, his obsession with decor and color schemes etc etc etc..........

Edited January 30, 2006 by JohnL (log)

[ASM NY]

Interesting how the Gilt menu is divided. NYC is more than ready for this cutting edge cuisine (witness WD-50 etc) but one must consider the location--Gilt is ensconced in prime uptown real estate. The overhead must be phenominally high--Gilt has to go for a very well healed crowd which may or may not be as adventurous--especially at these prices.

Thus, it makes sense that maybe they are hedging their bets a bit--also given the chef's experiences at Atlas (same neighborhood) this may be a smart thing to do.

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A few things:

- I think that more relevant than the neighborhood itself is the fact that the restaurant is in the New York Palace hotel. I got a sense that more than a fair share of the tables were guests of the hotel (at least both tables next to us), and a good share of the customers were an older crowd (60s). I think it's almost a necessity for them to have a more "classic" option for the patrons of the hotel.

- The tasting menu was not printed and we were not told what was in it, we were just told to highlight any things we might be alergic to or might not like.

- The supplements for a few items on the menu were still there.

Edited January 30, 2006 by ASM NY (log)

[Bux]

. . . .

Interesting how the Gilt menu is divided. NYC is more than ready for this cutting edge cuisine (witness WD-50 etc).....

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There really is no "etcetera." Until now, WD-50 has had the avant-garde niche pretty much to itself. The question is whether that genre can succeed in a space that was formerly known for conservative haute cuisine.

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It's also taken Wylie considerable time to pack the place. I realize the location may be off center for restaurants in it's price and class, but my sense is that it's still the easiest place offering that quality of food experience in which to get a reservation. New Yorkers are not knocking down the doors for avant garde food of this ilk.

JohyL is correct however in that location may be part of the problem. On the other hand, price is always an issue in more ways than one. Not only is the potential clientele reduced when the price rises, but the really well heeled tend to be more conservative in their tastes. The young are traditionally the ones most ready to accept new ideas.

American, and New York, gastrotourists still flock to France more often and more regularly than to Spain in spite of the more exciting press emanating from south of the Pyrenees. If most anglophone tourists in France are happy with lamb chops, most in Spain are sastisfied with pre-cooked paella. Roses may be home to elBulli, but you'd be surprised at how many cafes and restaurants along the beach, in the town proper, proudly advertise branded paella from a commerical supplier that's merely reheated in the restaurant kitchen.

[JohnL]

Nothing illustrates my point about "perspective" more than ASM's posts and also Bux's post.

Bux has an "understanding" of the NY food scene based upon his experiences-thus his post here provides some valuable perspective about restaurant prices (for one issue) that was missing from Bruni's piece (Cuozzo did provide perspective on pricing and Gilt specifically in his review).

ASM also adds some valuable context to the fine review of the experience of dining at Gilt provided in earlier posts).

What I have been trying to get at is my sense (and others) that Bruni is just not bringing much to the table so to speak.

In the restaurant pricing piece ---Bruni offers nothing more than some basic reportage about about current practices restaurants engage in--do we need the chief restaurant critic to write this stuff?

[dRock]

Why is it that every restaurant Liebrandt has been associated with lands flat on its face? For such an amazing talent it worries me that gilt may face the same consequence. I have not yet gone to Gilt and I plan on going soon but it just seems to me the this place may suffer the same fate as Papillon did. I hope not.

[Sneakeater]

To the extent that's so, I think it's because he keeps getting located in the highest-possible-rent most-conservative-possible-audience district. Everybody talks about how long it took Wylie DuFresne to get people to come down to the LES, but actually I think locating WD-50 there was a stroke. The rent (at least back then) was low; the crowd you could expect to venture there was adventurous. Does anybody think WD-50 would have succeeded if located on Central Park South? (Obviously, despite that, I have to second the observation that WD-50 is perhaps the easiest of this City's top restaurants at which to get a reservation.)

I think we'd all feel less concerned for Gilt's future if it were located in, say, Tribeca instead of in the New York Palace.

What I'm trying to say is that I think it's less the truth that a restaurant like Gilt can't succeed in New York than that perhaps it's less likely to succeed in Midtown.

[peteswanson]

Lets not forget how the media is playing a role in Gilt...disregarding the Bruni piece of price,etc. the first thing every publication mentions is how he blindfolded guests for a tasting menu (I beleive he didn't do this very often, maybe even one time) or one of his less appealing creations from years back. They do him no justice in writing about this, when in fact they should be focusing on where he is now...(he was 25 at the time of Atlas, obviously they tend to overlook the fact that he was a young chef trying new ideas out..something which rarely existed in restaurants in those days). His menu is one of the strongest I have seen in the city (I can't wait to dine there) and all this attention to something he did maybe once in the past is probably turning some people away.