Genever (Holland Gin)

[lostmyshape]

just bought a bottle of Boomsma Oude. only one more bottle left in western PA (says so on the PA liquor board website). i love it for simple cocktails. not really enough character that i'll sip it straight very often. if it's the lamest of the bunch, i'd love to try Bols or Bokma. alas, fat chance of those ever reaching Pittsburgh. after i buy the last bottle of Boomsma, genever will probably disappear from these parts entirely.

been trying to educate people of the joy of this drink. guess i'll have to start writing some emails.

[perfumekev]

just bought a bottle of Boomsma Oude.  only one more bottle left in western PA (says so on the PA liquor board website).  i love it for simple cocktails.  not really enough character that i'll sip it straight very often.  if it's the lamest of the bunch, i'd love to try Bols or Bokma.  alas, fat chance of those ever reaching Pittsburgh.  after i buy the last bottle of Boomsma, genever will probably disappear from these parts entirely.

been trying to educate people of the joy of this drink.  guess i'll have to start writing some emails.

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Damrak from bols is being distributed nation wide it is an exelent genever with all of the caractistis of a bols poduct. Call Remey Amerique in N.Y. N.Y. they are U.S. dsidtibutor they can tell you who your state's distributor may be. I have one of my friends who is a mayor of one of the towns in the Neatherlands on the case to get these company's and distributors a kick in the butt to get us some more dutch gin. meanwhile write the dutch genever companies e-mails tell them you want thier products and we will see what happens

[M.X.Hassett]

Perfumekev thank you for your info. Lets say one were to distill there own gin would this be close to the proper measure of herbs for fine genever

juniper 20g

coriander 8g

angelica root 1g

calamus root 0.25g

bitter almonds 3g

cardamon 0.125g

grains of paradise 1g

or

juniper 10g

coriander 12g

cassia 0.6g

angelica root 0.5g

calamus root 0.6g

bitter almonds 1.2g

cardamon 0.05g

Edited November 4, 2005 by M.X.Hassett (log)

[Rob Simmon]

Zuidam genever gin is available in Chicago, and it's spectacular.

[mbanu]

So says me, anyway--but then again, I've become addicted to Holland Gin Old-Fashioneds, IMHO one of the greatest drinks going. Let's hope Boomsma can pick up the slack where Bols left off.

--DW

Historical footnote. In the nineteenth century, Holland or genever gin was imported at a ratio of 5 or 6 gallons to every gallon of English gin. This makes perfect sense: in the days before the dominance of the dry Martini, when gin was drunk in slings, simple punches (think Collinses) or cocktails (the original kind, with bitters and sugar), the mellow, malty roundness of the "Hollands," as it was known, was preferable to the steely sharpness of a London dry gin, or even an Old Tom, which stood somewhere between the two styles.

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On a related note, I've found that genever is the secret to a good Pink Gin. Made with London Dry it just isn't the same.

[perfumekev]

Perfumekev thank you for your info. Lets say one were to distill there own gin would this be close to the proper measure of herbs for fine genever

juniper 20g

coriander 8g

angelica root 1g

calamus root 0.25g

bitter almonds 3g

cardamon 0.125g

grains of paradise 1g

or

juniper 10g

coriander 12g

cassia 0.6g

angelica root 0.5g

calamus root 0.6g

bitter almonds 1.2g

cardamon 0.05g

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the second formula sounds more like a genever taste. However you have to remember that much of the flavor of genever comes from malted grains giving it more of a wiskey effect.

[M.X.Hassett]

What would you think would be a good amount of malted to add to the second formula.

Edit: or would the malt be added to the mash. (sorry I'm an amateur still with distillation. NOT THAT I EVER WOULD IT IS ILLEGAL HERE)

Edited November 7, 2005 by M.X.Hassett (log)

[perfumekev]

Zuidam is available in Chicago (as is Damrak).  Mr. Wondrich is on board with Damrak as an acceptable sub for Bols Genever.  Anyone know how Zuidam Genever compares?

Also, the galfriend is going to have access to the Duty Free shop at O'Hare on Monday.  I have no idea if they'll have Bols Genever but, if so, is there a particular style that works best  in the "Improved Holland Gin Cock-Tail"?  It's my understanding that there are three styles made, "young", "very old", and "Corenwyn".  It strikes me as unlikely that Duty Free will have more than one style, if any, but if forced to choose, which should she grab?

Thanks.

Kurt

[edited to add Bols question]

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Bol's Damrak is an exelent replacement for Bols jonge genever I tatsed them side by side and found them to be very comparible however the Damrak was a little more fresh with just a touch of lemon. I like it a little bit better than the Bol's jonge.

Keep on e-mailing and writing the genever producing companies. Let's get some more genevers over here. All they want to know is that we are intereseted

so thier distributors will pay to stock the products for the U.S.

[perfumekev]

What would you think would be a good amount of malted to add to the second formula.

Edit: or would the malt be added to the mash. (sorry I'm an amateur still with distillation. NOT THAT I EVER WOULD IT IS ILLEGAL HERE)

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I'm not a distiller so I don't realy know. I think the malting process is done to the grain and then the whole thing is added into the mash!

[perfumekev]

Zuidam genever gin is available in Chicago, and it's spectacular.

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Zuidam Genever is now avalible in N.Y. It is truly exelent! They also make a dry gin that blew my socks off. Go to the website for Zuidam U.S. then call and talk to Richard Ward he is very nice, extremly knowledgable about these products and he is very helpfull.

[Rob Simmon]

I recently got a bottle of the Boomsma Oude Genever, and can't taste any juniper in it at all. Am I missing something, or do I have a bottle of a young wheat-based whiskey?

[perfumekev]

I recently got a bottle of the Boomsma Oude Genever, and can't taste any juniper in it at all. Am I missing something, or do I have a bottle of a young wheat-based whiskey?

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Boomsma genever is one of the poorest repersentations of genever, it doesn't even taste like it. One of my relatives sent me genever from 7 diiferent distillers in young and old varieties from the neatherlands and they are all better than boomsma.

zuidam

bols

bokma

wanwees

dekyuper

and many more

[trillium]

Looks like a company here in Portland, House Spirits, is going to release a genever style gin this month.

"Medoff and Krogstad have several other releases planned, including their own line of gin, which is due out sometime this month. It's modeled after the traditional Dutch style liquor known as Genever -- a strong herbaceous, juniper-flavored gin -- and is similar in viscosity and style to gins such has Magellan and Hendrick's. "

Full story on local spirits production here in one of the worlds most annoying newspaper websites (you've been warned).

regards,

trillium

[perfumekev]

I'm finding a lot of press info on the internet but no official web site for Portland House, Spirits. The Medoff Vodka has a small web site. does any one have info on how to get ahold of this company. They definately sound interesting and I would like to get some of thier poducts to the east coast.

[stickyii]

Keep your eyeteeth, and take a jaunt to Pennsylvania.  We've got it.

I've gotta pick some up to try in Baker's Death in the Gulf Stream.

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Which exact brand have you found? I did a few searches on the PLCB website and came up with nothing.

[perfumekev]

Keep your eyeteeth, and take a jaunt to Pennsylvania.  We've got it.

I've gotta pick some up to try in Baker's Death in the Gulf Stream.

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Which exact brand have you found? I did a few searches on the PLCB website and came up with nothing.

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the vodka web site is at www.medoeff.com they have a distributor in Oregon.

[perfumekev]

Keep your eyeteeth, and take a jaunt to Pennsylvania.  We've got it.

I've gotta pick some up to try in Baker's Death in the Gulf Stream.

←

Which exact brand have you found? I did a few searches on the PLCB website and came up with nothing.

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the vodka web site is at www.medoeff.com they have a distributor in Oregon.

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sorry, that's www.medoyeff.com

[perfumekev]

Keep your eyeteeth, and take a jaunt to Pennsylvania.  We've got it.

I've gotta pick some up to try in Baker's Death in the Gulf Stream.

←

Which exact brand have you found? I did a few searches on the PLCB website and came up with nothing.

←

the vodka web site is at www.medoeff.com they have a distributor in Oregon.

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sorry, that's www.medoyeff.com

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I traked down one of the retailers of medoyeff vodka. They put me in contact with Christian Krogestad of Portland House Spirits. Very pleasanat person . Sure enough they are planing on launching quite a few new spirits including genevers. They are working towards getting N.Y. distribution. I think they are definately a group that should be closely watched. They are planing on doing some pretty unique things. I for one am deffinately interested.

[eje]

I'm not quite sure how close this product is to a wide release, as I believe they did the debut at WhiskyFest San Francisco.

But, the other day at The Alembic Bar in San Francisco, I got to try some of Anchor Distilling's new Genever Style Gin, Genevieve.

They are actually brewing the "beer" from which they make the Gin at Anchor. If I remember the label correctly, is a blend of Rye, Barley, and Wheat.

Very nice stuff. You really get the young whisk(e)y flavor and body in this Gin.

Reading David Wondrich's "Imbibe!" right now, and hearing that Jerry Thomas actually meant "Hollands" Gin for many of his recipes, this product comes at exactly the right time to try some of those formulations.

I can't wait to try an Improved Hollands Gin Cocktail with it.

Hopefully we'll be seeing it in stores soon.

Edited October 31, 2007 by eje (log)

[thirtyoneknots]

Hopefully this will have similar pricing and distribution to Junipero? Count me excited. I always feel like I'm missing out on something when I use the only thing available, Boomsma.

-Andy

[eje]

I talked to a local liquor store and they checked into the Genevieve. Apparently the CA distributor (Young's Market) has it available and at this point it is just a matter of getting it out to the stores.

The price should be about the same as for Junipero.

I'm off now to go pick up a bottle.

Woo!

[eje]

One interesting note of trivia from David Wondrich's new book, "Imbibe!":

The terms Jonge and Oude Genever refer to two different styles of making Genever.

While the Oude may or may not have some actual barrel age, the main difference is that the Jonge is made from Grain Neutral Spirits and the Oude must include some malt wine.

Jonge Genever was not invented until some time during World War I.

So, to follow through, the proper Genever (or Hollands) to make 19th Century Cocktails with, must be the Oude.

edit - grammar.

Edited November 13, 2007 by eje (log)

[Amev]

One interesting note of trivia from David Wondrich's new book, "Imbibe!":

The terms Jonge and Oude Genever refer to two different styles of making Genever.

While the Oude may or may not have some actual barrel age, the main difference is that the Jonge is made from Grain Neutral Spirits and the Oude must include some malt wine.

Jonge Genever was not invented until some time during World War I.

So, to follow through, the proper Genever (or Hollands) to make 19th Century Cocktails with, must be the Oude.

edit - grammar.

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Actually, according to Wikipedia it was in World War II that the Jonge Genever style was born. Due to limited amounts of grain being avaible to make malt wine the amount of malt wine in Genevers dropped drasticly. After the war was over production of this 'new' style Genever continued as 'Jonge' Genever and Genever according to the old recipe was being sold again as Oude Genever. The truely original 100% maltwine Genever wasn't avaible at all anymore.

Another story about Jonge and Oude Genever styles comes from the website of Rutte & Zonen. One of the better Genever producers of Holland. On their site is a story that says the invention of the column still in (I believe) 1831 later brought upon a change between Oude and Jonge Genever. Where the jonge was made with a high percentage of neutral grain alcohol from column still distillation and the Oude being made mainly with malt wine.

After economical recess in the 70's the Genever industry tried to win back some credit by beefing up the minimal quality requirements for Genever. Also more truely old style Oude Genevers were being made again and nowadays van Wees sells up to 20 year oak cask riped Genever.

On another note. Yesterday I picked up a bottle of Rutte Twaalf (Twelve) Oude Genever and made a cocktail based on the Brandy Apricot Frappe recipe, with lemon juice added to the concotion.

I made it like this:

- 2,5 cl Rutte Twaalf

- 1,5 cl van Wees Apricot brandy

- 1 cl Rutte Amandel (almond liquer)

- 1 cl Lemon Juice

It was quite tasty! I'm not done tweaking it yet though. And it needs a name

[thirtyoneknots]

So last week I came across something called Schlichte Steinhaeger Gin which is from Germany, comes in the distinctive neckless cylindrical crock bottle that Genevere comes in, and to the taste is spot on for descriptions of Hollands Gin that I've read (only one I've actually had is Boomsma). Soft botanicals on a funky, malty base, though it's no sweeter than, say, Tanqueray. Only 40% abv, but also under $20/bottle.

Does anyone know this product and/or know if it is an appropriate analogue for Hollands Gin?

-Andy

[pziemba]

I picked up a bottle of Genevieve at a liquor store in west LA while visiting there from New York last week. I've been anticipating this for some time and haven't seen it yet on my recent trips to Astor or Warehouse (though I got to try some at PDT back in January).

I haven't tasted any of the other Holland gins out there, as I've read that the only one available in America isn't that great, but I really like Genevieve so far. The gin botanicals are evident in the nose and especially the finish, but the sweetness of the base spirit brings a whole new dimension to it - a revelation for this gin lover who's only had dry gins until now. It seems to be great for drinking straight (strong, though), and a martini with a bit of noilly prat and a dash of fee's orange bitters was enjoyably different.

I'm really looking forward to trying some of Imbibe!'s recipes with this. Does anyone know when this will be available in NYC stores?