Oats

[helenjp]

Another research project has begun here...I decided that I'd lived too long without porridge, and ordered some. To me, "oatmeal" means primarily raw ground oats, not rolled oats or porridge.

I quickly found that US steel-cut oats are coarser than the medium or pinhead "oatmeal" I was used to in New Zealand. (southern NZ's damp cool climate produces good oats, but they are mostly sold as rolled oats).

I have/am about to try these brands/types....any other products to watch for? Favorite oatmeal uses?

Bob's Red Mill Scottish Oatmeal

This is the closest to fine, pinhead oatmeal that I know of - nice for baking, and nice for coating deepfried or oven-baked fish or chicken.

I didn't know that BRM also produce steel-cut oats, so I haven't tried them.

Arrowhead Mills Steel-cut Oats

Much coarser than British-style medium oatmeal.

McCann's Original Steel-cut Irish Oatmeal Almost identical to the Arrowhead product to look at. Crisper and with more flavor though, when I compared a tablespoon (raw) in a little milk.

I like the steel-cut oats better than the Scottish Oatmeal for making porridge in my rice-cooker overnight though (on the congee setting, with less water). The Oatmeal cooked to a hard paste, because the water wasn't boiling enough to agitate it, whereas the long, slow cooking suited the AM steel-cut oats perfectly - have yet to try the "porridge test" with the McCann's.

[Jensen]

I've been eating the steel-cut oats (McCann's and McCann's wannabees) so I can't really comment on the pinhead oats. In fact, I had porridge for lunch today I like that the steel cut oats are chewy when I eat them. I tried cooking them overnight in the slow cooker but they ended up tasting just like rolled and/or instant oats...all mushy and icky. yech.

(It has occurred to me that perhaps I undercook them but what do I care? That's how I like 'em!)

Now I'm worried...should I be trying pinhead oats for my porridge?

[helenjp]

When I cook porridge in my rice cooker, I mix steel-cut oats half-and-half with extra thick rolled oats - definitely more texture and flavor than regular rolled oats, and if you can find extra thick WHOLE GRAIN rolled oats, consider yourself in porridge happy land!

If you like your oats chewy, then pinhead oatmeal would be too smooth for you, I think. I've always mixed it with rolled oats for porridge, anyway.

[Jensen]

If you like your oats chewy, then pinhead oatmeal would be too smooth for you, I think. I've always mixed it with rolled oats for porridge, anyway.

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Okay. I'm relieved. Now I don't feel like I'm missing anything outstanding.

Perhaps this is the right forum to bring up this though...

The Spouse likes porridge made from rolled oats and claims that my porridge made from steel-cut oats smells/tastes like kerosene. He had an <ahem> interesting youth so I don't question his ability to distinguish the flavour of kerosene but has anyone else noticed this?

[emmapeel]

I have a really dumb question...I always thought porridge was oatmeal, am I mistaken? If so, what is porridge?

<ahem> interesting youth

I spit out my wine!

Edited March 16, 2005 by emmapeel (log)

[Jensen]

I have a really dumb question...I always thought porridge was oatmeal, am I mistaken?  If so, what is porridge?

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I think porridge is really just a "mush" made from some sort of grain. To me, porridge is made with oats. But I also acknowledge that congee (another favourite of mine) is "rice porridge". And, I have a friend here in CA who is of Portuguese extraction who claims that porridge is Cream of Wheat cereal.

So, I've settled just on "mush" when discussing it publicly and "oatmeal mush" in my own world.

[helenjp]

In the US, porridge *is* oatmeal, but in ex-colonies, oatmeal is the stuff porridge is made from (ground or cut oats, in their raw state).

Steel-cut oats...kerosene...they certainly tasted different to me, but kerosene wasn't a description that sprung to mind!

...So where does your Spouse sit when he eats? I recall my mother saying that she complained for weeks that her food tasted of kerosene while staying at a beach cottage, and being told to shut up and stop being so picky, until somebody finally noticed that she was sitting under the lamp...

Mush...now that is definitely not a colonial word "Mash" was for chickens, oh wait, we didn't call them chickens, we called them hens or fowls...

[emmapeel]

Great! thanks, now I get it. "Mush" and "Porridge" are childhood words to me. Mush is from the Little Rascals famous for the scene in a orphanage dining room, the kids spreading the word around the table... "Don't eat the mush!" "Why?" "It's spoiled!" and Porridge is fairy tale food. Boy, was I was thrilled my parents didn't feed us Mush!

Cream of Wheat has always been a favorite of mine, but now I only eat McCanns Steel Cut. They are great and chewy.

[ramodeo]

I have always used bulk organic steel cut oats from my health food store, so I can't really compare varieties, but I think they're probably a medium size. They stay pretty chewy and pop a bit in your mouth. I use the Cook's Illustrated method to cook them, which toasts them first in a little butter, then simmers them in a milk/water mixture. The toasting makes a huge difference in flavor, I think. Can't eat plain, regular cooked rolled oats anymore.

[therese]

In the US, porridge *is* oatmeal, but in ex-colonies, oatmeal is the stuff porridge is made from (ground or cut oats, in their raw state).

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Porridge isn't too commonly used a term here (at least in my experience), but when it is it usually evokes either something to do with the UK or one of the "other" ex-colonies.

For us porridge is not specifically made of oats, but of any coarsely ground grain.

I'm a big fan of steel cut oats, and also find that doing them overnight in the slow cooker makes them too soft for me.

[helenjp]

How about "gruel" for a really unappetizing image!

By the way, I should note that the congee setting on my rice cooker is a TIMER function - so it's not cooking slowly all night, though it is soaking in water all night, then starts to cook about an hour before the set time.

[slkinsey]

I have always used bulk organic steel cut oats from my health food store, so I can't really compare varieties, but I think they're probably a medium size. They stay pretty chewy and pop a bit in your mouth. I use the Cook's Illustrated method to cook them, which toasts them first in a little butter, then simmers them in a milk/water mixture. The toasting makes a huge difference in flavor, I think. Can't eat plain, regular cooked rolled oats anymore.

Interesting, my process is somewhat similar to the Cook's Illustrated method (see the recipe here) but much more simple. I toast the oats dry in the pan until they take just the tiniest bit of color and begin to smell fragrantly nutty. Then I add 2.5 times the volume of water plus a healthy pinch of salt and simmer on low for around 30 minutes, stirring occasionally with a heatproof rubber spatula. At the end, just as I'm getting ready to take it to the table, that's when I stir in some butter. I wonder what's the advantage of using butter at the beginning rather than at the end. I've always thought it was better to toast things like grains and bread crumbs dry. Usually when I'm using butter in cooking, I think it's better to add most of it at the end rather than cooking it for a long time. It seems to provide a more "buttery" flavor that way. It's also interesting to see how the butter emulsifies in the porridge and changes its texture when you add it at the end.

Like most of their recipes, the Cook's Illustrated method seems overly fussy to me (don't add the salt until 20 minutes in to the cooking process?). I can't imagine using two separate pans to cook something as simple as oatmeal porridge. Do you really do all that stuff -- use two separate pans and all that -- or do you just toast the oats in the beginning? What do you think is the benefit of using water and milk as the cooking liquids? I've always thought that one of the miracles of steel cut oats is how creamy and rich it is just from the oat starch. Back when I used to eat rolled oats, I always poured on some milk at the table. After a while I realized that I don't do that any more with steel cut oats. I'll have to try the CI method next time to see if it makes any difference.

I agree with you (and apparently with Cook's Illustrated, too) that it makes better sense to buy steel cut oats in bulk rather than buying the "brand name" varieties. Most of the time the stuff from the health food store is in better condition, and it's often around three times more expensive per pound.

[ramodeo]

I use the CI method because I do like the overall result better than just boiling with water and salt. I haven't broken out individual steps and tested them, though. I do use two pans - I get the toasting going in a non-stick skillet and put the water and milk on in a sauce pan at the same time. Hot toasted oats into nearly simmering liquid seems to speed up the whole process. The oats absorb all the butter, and I just wipe the non-stick skillet and put it away. Not too much trouble, really. I don't feel a need to add more butter to the cooked oats - and I usually do to other hot cereals. I don't know if that's because the oats are just so satisfying, or if that couple tablespoons of butter at the beginning provides enough flavor because it is soaked into each grain and toasted, KWIM?

As for the salt - the CI article has an explaination that says salting at the beginning of cooking prevents some of the starch and gum components of the oat grain from leeching into the cooking water, which would make for a less creamy cooked cereal.

I like using the milk cuz I prefer the taste, and because we always seem to have extra milk to use up in our house. And then I don't have to add any at the end.

I have also found that this method works well for making big batches (6-8 servings). I put the extra in the fridge and microwave reheat portions for several days after.

[slkinsey]

As for the salt - the CI article has an explaination that says salting at the beginning of cooking prevents some of the starch and gum components of the oat grain from leeching into the cooking water, which would make for a less creamy cooked cereal.

Interesting. I'll have to give that a try and see if it makes a noticable difference. My gut feeling is that it won't, because there have been a number of times when I have forgotten to add the salt at the beginning and threw it in towards the end -- and I don't remember thinking "wow! this is much creamier than last time." But, you never know.

Now that I think about it, I do have a bunch of heavy one quart saucepans. I should make several batches in parallel (toasting with butter versus adding the same amount at the end, and adding salt at the beginning versus adding the same amount after 20 minutes). It will be interesting to see if there are any clearly noticable differences.

[cakewalk]

"Don't eat the mush!"  "Why?"  "It's spoiled!"

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I think it was "don't drink the milk." "Why?" "It's sperled."

There was a previous thread on oats (I can't find it, but it's there), which prompted me to go out and buy steel cut oats. But I haven't got around to making them yet. That's the thing about regular Quaker Oats. I can microwave them and they're ready in about three minutes. I guess I'm sperled!

[emmapeel]

I think it was "don't drink the milk." "Why?" "It's sperled." 

Yes, Cakewalk, you're right. They were going to use that "sperled" milk on the mush.

I must try the method of toasting of the steel cut oats first, to taste the depth of flavor.

Edited March 16, 2005 by emmapeel (log)

[eje]

That's the thing about regular Quaker Oats. I can microwave them and they're ready in about three minutes. I guess I'm sperled! 

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Oatmeal Porridge is my favorite breakfast; but, I guess I'm not quite so picky about it. Though, perhaps a bit anal about method. I buy thick rolled oats in bulk. I use the microwave to cook them in a large bowl. 1 cup water 1/3 cup oats, Medium for 5 minutes. Add honey, raisins, walnuts, and a pinch of salt. Return to microwave and cook another 6 minutes on Medium Low. Stir in some whole milk yoghurt and dig in. Dates are also nice, as are dried apricots.

We don't have a dishwasher, so I hate to get extra pans dirty in the morning.

I will have to try the steel cut some time. I'm sure there is some way to program the microwave. Unfortunately, my rice cooker doesn't have a timer or congee setting. I knew I should have sprung for the fuzzy logic model.

Erik

Edited March 17, 2005 by eje (log)

[nr706]

Toasted Steel-Cut oats are especially yummy in making an Oatmeal Stout.

[helenjp]

I hesitate to say it, but when I tasted organically grown wholegrain oats, I was amazed at how much flavor they had. I'd buy 'em again, if I could find 'em.

I thought the McCann's taste had a lot to do with the crunchiness (not hardness) of the grain, so toasting a cheaper grain before cooking it would likely improve the flavor quite a lot. Oats sold in bulk??? I should be so lucky! I'm definitely on to try the toasting method, but will probably toast it dry and gradually add water to the same pan.

Butter - porridge is wonderful served with a little salty butter or even Chinese/Japanese sesame oil and some toasted sesame seeds. Good peanut butter's not bad either. Dates sound fantastic!

I don't like reheated porridge myself, because it seems to lose a lot of flavor.

Milk...guess this is a personal preference. I sometimes make porridge with half milk/half water, because all milk is a bit gluey for my taste. Do you guys pour milk on your hot porridge? I used to hate porridge until I discovered that it was the lukewarm milk on the cooling porridge that was the problem!

Microwaving...do you think it's better than pot-boiled if you prefer a really chewy texture? I like it cooked a bit longer, and also have 2 big sons to feed, so the microwave doesn't speed things up for me.

Oatmeal stout...I hear about it, but I don't see it! <sob>

Edited March 17, 2005 by helenjp (log)

[nr706]

I'm curious - does anyone know why oats/oatmeal is typically associated with breakfast, while other, similarly textured things (i.e. mashed potatoes, risotto) are usually associated with dinner? I don't think I've ever seen oats as a side dish/starch on a restaurant menu.

[eje]

because all milk is a bit gluey for my taste

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I don't really like milk either. I only add Yoghurt at the end.

Another really tasty thing to do, (and I mean really tasty,) is to substitute Apple Juice for some of the water in the cooking liquid.

>I don't think I've ever seen oats as a side dish/starch

Neither have I; but, I think a recent Martha Stewart Living had a recipe for whole Oat Groats cooked kind of like bulgar with kale. I will have to look for it. It looked very tasty.

Erik

edited to fix spelling

Edited March 17, 2005 by eje (log)

[emmapeel]

I also don't use milk in oatmeal but I did once try the following from Martha Stewart which used heavy cream. If you like sweet oatmeal, I once tried this recipe for Oatmeal Brûlée. It was a lot of work, and very good, but I only tried it once. (It was enough.)

Edited March 17, 2005 by emmapeel (log)

[...tm...]

Since I like to pretend that eating oatmeal makes up for all the other stuff I eat, I tend to have oatmeal every day for breakfast. I make a week's worth or so at a time using. I just toast the oats in butter or clarified butter and add twice as much water as oats and simmer, stirring occasionally, adding a little salt near the end of the cooking time. The first batch is always the best, but I think it reheats fairly well. I usually add some more liquid for reheating, plus any variatios like nuts, fruit, yogurt, cream, butter or cinnamon and sugar. I think I'll be working the toasted sesame oil helenjp suggested into the rotation.

I use bulk, organic steel cut oats because they are cheap and good here. The wierd thing is that one time, when I took a shower during the simmer stage because I was running late and didn't stir at all, the texture of the oatmeal was just fine when I came back, but there was a greenish residue on the top. Has anyone else seen this? It seemed to be one of those natural reactions, like how garlic can change to green or blue in acid. I haven't found any evidence that oats contain anthocyanins or sulfur compounds that can turn green, but I haven't looked that hard. Anyway, I just stirred it a couple times and the green was no longer perceptible. Mmm, green oats.

[slkinsey]

I'm curious - does anyone know why oats/oatmeal is typically associated with breakfast, while other, similarly textured things (i.e. mashed potatoes, risotto) are usually associated with dinner? I don't think I've ever seen oats as a side dish/starch on a restaurant menu.

Probably because it is commonly consumed somewhat sweetened. And perhaps also because rolled oats -- the kind with most people are familiar -- wouldn't have a very appealing texture as a savory side. You're right, though, there's no reason some "parmesan steel cut oats" wouldn't make an interesting part of a savory meal. Probably have to call it something silly like "avenotto" to get people to make the nexessary paradigm shift.

[Jensen]

I'm inspired...

"Avenotto" is in the making right now. Okay, I'm still eating it for breakfast but then I'll eat rice for breakfast too!

Will report back when it's all done.

Edited March 17, 2005 by Jensen (log)