Klong

[Fat Guy]

The Thai word "klong" does have a meaning, a nice one having to do with restful getaways by the water, but to those who don't know about that it's not a particularly appealing name for a restaurant. Please don't worry about the name, though. Klong is the most interesting and enjoyable new Thai place I can recall.

Klong is at 7 St. Marks Place and last night it was happening. Probably 90% of the customers were hip, young Asians. I don't know how they heard about the place -- there must be some informational network I'm not a part of (what else is new?) because the only press I've seen on the place was the opening notice in Time Out. I only heard about it because my friend, a publicist (not the publicist for this restaurant, which I don't think has one), has a friend in the Thai consulate or tourism bureau or whatever who recommended the place so enthusiastically that we felt compelled to go immediately.

It's very modern in there -- not at all the stereotypical kitschy Southeast Asian place of the Penang or Pongsri Thai variety. There's a lot of feng shui going on in there, with a wildly elaborate system of canals and such that I'm sure symbolize great luck and wealth. The chairs and general decor are sleek, which is part of a general trend we're seeing in the Korean and Southeast Asian places around town.

I haven't pulled together any real information on the place. My understanding is that the chef grew up cooking on the streets of Bangkok and speaks no English. There seem to be several owners working the room very enthusiastically. Service is super-friendly though of course still breaking in. The flavors are amazing: the crispest, freshest, most intricately balanced I've had since I was in Singapore whenever that was, maybe 4 or 5 years ago now. I'm not going to pronounce the place better than Sripraphai based on one visit, but it's in that league in terms of proficiency albeit very different stylistically (more upscale in concept and presentation) and of course more expensive (though not very expensive at all).

You can grab a .pdf menu at http://www.klongnyc.com/ and read through all the choices. We tried six items and batted a thousand. The green papaya salad was one of those singular palate awakeners, with a great balance of acid, sweet, spice, and crunch. Firecracker shrimp with plum dipping sauce were crispy and of very good quality (the proteins in general were of a higher caliber than those used at most Thai places). The tuna tartare, which seemed to have a bit of Japanese fusion influence, was one of the more interesting tuna tartare variations I've had: the tuna is ground, served on a crispy tortilla-like cracker, with wasabi, soy, and red onion. Terrific. Lamb pad ped with red chile paste, kaffir lime, and asparagus was one of the better Asian-restaurant lamb dishes I've had and the lamb was of respectable quality. Steamed shrimp in a clay pot with shiitake mushrooms and clear vermicelli was overwhelmed by the spicier dishes so I'd have changed the progression of the meal if I had it to do over again, but the dish was appealing in its subtlety and restraint. The highlight of the meal, however, was the tamarind whole fish, a deep-fried red snapper with super-crisp skin and a sweet-and-sour sauce with sweet peppers and basil.

[Pan]

Thanks for the heads-up, Steven! Wow, Grand Sichuan and now a serious Thai restaurant on St. Marks Place?! What's happening to the neighborhood?

I'll be sure to add some thoughts after I have a chance to check out the place.

Based on the menu, the most expensive dish is $16, and most are closer to $10. As you said, more than Sripraphai but not expensive.

[Fat Guy]

I'll be interested to hear your reactions, Michael, as well as those of anybody else who, unlike me, has actual knowledge of Thai food. My responses to the food were impressionistic and not calibrated to any master recipes or extensive knowledge of technique. But it tasted really good to me.

I should add, I thought the spice levels were good. In other words, although nothing was extremely hot or overwhelming, they weren't dumbing down the spice levels for Western palates (not yet at least). They also offer three condiments: dried hot peppers, a hot pepper sauce, and something else I didn't taste, so you can certainly add heat. But for those who are into super-spicy food, you'll want to ask the kitchen for that adjustment.

[Bond Girl]

Thanks FG for the tip, I will check it out sometimes this week.

[jogoode]

Definitely worth a shot. They have a cheap lunch special that allows you to order among other items panaeng or red curry. The quality of those two dishes can often foretell the quality of the rest of the food. But at lunch I can't try that fried snapper. Steven, is that dish big enough for two people?

[Fat Guy]

Two people who eat like you, skinny bitch? In that case it would be half an appetizer for one. Two normal people? Sure, they could share it.

[jogoode]

Two people who eat like you, skinny bitch? In that case it would be half an appetizer for one. Two normal people? Sure, they could share it.

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Jeez, what'd I ever do to you? Oh yeah, I've eaten you out of house and home at least twice. Get an appetite, Steven.

[Bux]

Jeez, what'd I ever do to you? Oh yeah, I've eaten you out of house and home at least twice. Get an appetite, Steven.

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There must be a moral here. I had a cousin who played football in high school and a little in college as well. He was also a counselor at boy scout camp where food was served family style. He was an all round nice guy, on the whole, but I never let anyone of those kids who sat at his table and who withered away that summer, know I was related to him. I think Oliver Twist got a better share.

[jogoode]

Are you calling me a boy scout camp counselor, Bux? Don't make me take on both you and Steven.

Seriously, the prospect of a good Thai restaurant in Manhattan is exciting. I'd like to hear someone compare it to Pam's Real Thai, which I've heard is the only other Thai place in Manhattan worth trying. Steven, were you happy with the level of spiciness?

[SobaAddict70]

not to mention, how does it compare with the gold standard, Sriphaphai?

edit: Ah, never mind, I saw El Gordo's comparison up there. Guess I'll have to hie myself there sometime soon.

I think I'm officially out of the running for Bottomless Pit.

Soba

[Fat Guy]

Steven, were you happy with the level of spiciness?

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I was but I am not what you'd call a "chilehead." I though the food was spicy enough that plenty of Westerners would probably think it's too spicy, but not extremely hot by any stretch of the imagination. The spicing felt balanced and correct to me.

[kathe]

Thanks for the tip. I am going there tommorrow. Couldn't view the menu- hope they have Larb and maybe even Miang!

kathe

[jogoode]

I was but I am not what you'd call a "chilehead." I though the food was spicy enough that plenty of Westerners would probably think it's too spicy, but not extremely hot by any stretch of the imagination. The spicing felt balanced and correct to me.

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Good choice of words. "Balanced and correct" is better than hotter than it's supposed to be just for the sake of spiciness. I occasionally like food that is very hot -- blistering, I mean. I used to complain when the red curry at Sri wasn't scalding; then I was told that it wasn't supposed to be. Green curries and jungle curries are typically spicier, so if you want hotter, I'm told, choose a different dish. But don't play some macho game and ask the waiter to deface your curry, which is, I suppose, what I was doing. It would be like dumping red pepper flakes on spaghetti and tomato sauce, instead of just ordering arrabbiata.

[SobaAddict70]

hm, I suppose a test will be whether their pad thai is made differently than most pad thai in my experience.

Pad thai is the moo shu pork of Thai food. Moo shu pork was originally an egg dish with a minimum of pork but has since become a pork dish with a minimum of egg. ok, this is probably a gross overreaching statement, but you get the idea. Most pad thai served in this country has become a shade of the real thing. For me, the taste test at any Thai restaurant is whether their pad thai is as Goldilocks would say, "just right" -- a balanced mix of tastes.

Soba

[jogoode]

hm, I suppose a test will be whether their pad thai is made differently than most pad thai in my experience.

Pad thai is the moo shu pork of Thai food.  Moo shu pork was originally an egg dish with a minimum of pork but has since become a pork dish with a minimum of egg.  ok, this is probably a gross overreaching statement, but you get the idea.  Most pad thai served in this country has become a shade of the real thing.  For me, the taste test at any Thai restaurant is whether their pad thai is as Goldilocks would say, "just right" -- a balanced mix of tastes.

Soba

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But the pad thai at Sripraphai isn't good. I think you have found a Thai place with potential if its red curry and panaeng aren't overly sweet, tasting mostly of coconut milk; and if it can put together a salad with a good balance of salty, sour, hot, sweet. But maybe I say this because salads and curries are what I'm most familiar with.

[Jason Perlow]

Personally I find Pad Thai to be the least interesting of the Thai noodle dishes, at least how most restaurants serve it. I'm partial to Pa Kee Maow, Pad Siew and Lard Na myself.

I like Pad Thai when its made with cellophane noodles and has a lot of heat to it -- like Wondee's does in Hackensack. Overly sweetened Pad Thai is not my thing.

[Stone]

Overly sweetened Pad Thai is not my thing.

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And what's what that strange orange glow in many pad thais? I don't recall seeing anything like that in Thailand.

[Fat Guy]

Thanks for the tip. I am going there tommorrow. Couldn't view the menu- hope they have Larb and maybe even  Miang!

kathe

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I didn't have the chance to try it, but larb is definitely on the menu. Whether or not it plays to the strengths of the kitchen, I don't know. We asked one of the managers what to order, and got excellent advice. Whether or not you'd do as well with random ordering, I couldn't say.

[Jason Perlow]

And what's what that strange orange glow in many pad thais?  I don't recall seeing anything like that in Thailand.

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A lot of commercial Pad Thai sauces have liquid tamarind or tamarind paste in it. Some even use ketchup. This is not to say all of those sauces are bad, there is one particular brand I really like, Por Kwan, has a nice balance of sweetness and spicyness, but it does give the noodles that characteristic orange color. It is better when Thai restaurants make their sauce mix from scratch, though.

[Stone]

By "commercial pad thai sauces" do you mean pad thai's made at restaurants, or are their "pad thai sauces" jarred and sold at markets? I've never seen such a thing, and I can't imagine why any restaurant would need it. I've also never seen a recipe for pad thai calling for tamarind anything.

[Jason Perlow]

By "commercial pad thai sauces" do you mean pad thai's made at restaurants, or are their "pad thai sauces" jarred and sold at markets?  I've never seen such a thing, and I can't imagine why any restaurant would need it.  I've also never seen a recipe for pad thai calling for tamarind anything.

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Thai restaurants use the same jarred sauces sold at markets. Some things just have to be commercially made as Thai food is reliant on a lot of condiment type things. However, as with curries, where the better ones use freshly made curry paste as opposed to a product like Mae Ploy (which I like) The better pad thais I have had however, used made from scratch sauces.

[Todd36]

Pulled this from http://www.chetbacon.com/thai-html/Pad_Thai.htm

8 ounces rice vermicelli (either the sen mee or the sen lek

style of Thai noodles or indeed any rice noodles

will do). These should be soaked for a short while

(perhaps 30 minutes to an hour, depending on the

brand of noodles) until soft.

5-6 cloves of garlic, finely chopped.

2 tablespoon chopped shallots

quarter cup dried shrimp (these should be rolled, or roughly

punded in a mortar and pestle to break them up)

quarter cup fish sauce

quarter cup palm sugar

2-3 tablespoon tamarind juice

2-3 tablespoon chopped, pickled raddish (mooli)

1 medium egg, beaten

quarter cup chopped chives

half cup roasted peanuts, very coarsely broken up.

one cup bean sprouts

basic condiments (chilis in fish sauce, ground dried red chili, sugar

and crushed peanuts) at the table, to suit their individual taste.

The above seems like a typical recipe, and it includes tamarind. If you google pad thai and tamarind, up comes lots of recipes. I have no idea what makes the common american version day glow orange, I've noticed the same thing. It can't be the ketchup they often put in. It's probably some sort of commerical sauce. In the scheme of things, making pad thai sauce doesn't seem that complicated or time consuming (it's not like making your own fish sauce from scratch), so I assume decent Thai places must make their own.

At the risk of thread drift, I was at Pam's Real Thai last night and can report it was packed at 9:00, probably as a result of that NYT article.

And in terms of why the hip young'ems found Klong, that block of St. Mark's is an extension of both NYU and Cooper Union (Sunrise Mart is in an NYU dorm and NYU has a large dorm directly across the street from that) and the block has long been a young hip Asian hang out---Witness the yakitori places and Go; young person't food and drink.

[tommy]

i see tamarind as in ingredient in many many pad thai recipes. right or wrong.

as far as the glow, i assumed it was either or both tamarind and paprika, which seems to make an appearance in many recipes as well.

klong's larb is very good, though it's made with kaffir leaf (and chicken), which i don't normally use. overall the food is expertly balanced, and not very spicy at all. i suppose if you want something spicy you'll have to really force the issue. chopped chilis in vinegar are served as a condiment if you ask, though. they're plenty hot.

stylistically i'd compare klong to pam's, but not necessarily to sriprirahaphahi. all are good in their own right and seem to excel at certain styles. klong's should certainly do well, even though Holy Basil is right up the street (and quite good in my experience as well).

and a 4.50 glass of sauvignon blanc from chile can't be beat.

Edited October 12, 2004 by tommy (log)

[jogoode]

Thai restaurants use the same jarred sauces sold at markets. Some things just have to be commercially made as Thai food is reliant on a lot of condiment type things.

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Yeah. Shrimp paste (gapi) is rarely made by Thai restaurants, but is used in many curries. It takes 6 months to make, and I'd imagine it would be difficult to make large quantities of it given the space constraints of living in New York -- it's not the type of stuff you want to have fermenting on your bedroom windowsill. So restaurants buy it at Thai groceries.

I suppose one way to estimate the quality of a Thai restaurant without sitting through a potentially awful meal is to ask whether its chef make his or her own shrimp paste and curry pastes (assuming the chef would admit that he didn't) Or you can, like Steven, follow up on a recommendation.

[Daniel]

Thanks Fat Guy for the reco. Went there last night and had a really enjoyable dinner. My friend and I got the Larb, the lamb ped ped, the tamarind fish, and some duck dish with pineapple, lychee, in a masaman curryish sauce. The fish was terrific, the duck was cooked perfectly, and the larb was really good.

In terms of the spice, I am a big spice guy, and i thought that everything was perfectly spiced. Its hotter then most restaurants.