ADNY (Alain Ducasse @ Essex House)

[robert brown]

What I consider "joie de vivre" comes from more than earth-shattering preparations. It has also much to do with the attitude that ownership or management decides to assume in it relationship with its patrons. That special quality is one that I found a lot more in Italy (especially in the small towns) than elsewhere. In Steve's context, however, I would agree that it is rare in a great two-star or three star Michelin restaurant, or even in a revered restaurant outside of the Continent, that an unforgettable or "perfect" meal (in terms of the food) rarely exists without a profound feeling of having immensely enjoyed oneself in terms of your relationship to all aspects of the restaurant. (Great chefs are usually great restaurateurs.)There have also been times when a desultory meal has suddenly been transformed by a dish so sublime that you can't stop talking about it, and, like a magic carpet ride, carries you to its (the meal's) conclusion.

[Fat Guy]

I don't remember discussing the lunch versus dinner issue, and I hope if I did I said what I'm about to say here: If you order the same, it's the same. The only difference is the presence of a cheaper lunch option or two, which will of course earn you an inferior meal. Especially were I to have only one experience at Ducasse to look forward to, I'd go with the full menu, lunch or dinner -- it makes no difference foodwise. Certainly, as at almost any top restaurant in New York, lunch is a bit less celebratory and intense than dinner. If you care about such things, go for dinner.

[Rail Paul]

Fat Guy -

Thanks for your comments on lunch and dinner, which raise an interesting question:

Does the same cookstaff usually cook both lunch and dinner in a fine restaurant? With many restaurants offering 11 pm seatings now, that could mean 14 hours of employment on a single shift.  Or, is lunch delegated to a sous chef or line chef to prepare in some places?

Thanks

[lizziee]

The French seem to treat lunch differently than we do in the States. My son, who worked at a now 3* star in Paris, reported that at lunch the clientele was almost exclusively French, while at dinner, it was predominately Americans, Japanese and English.

At Ducasse in Paris (at his old restaurant in the 16th), we have been there for both lunch and dinner. The menu was the same, but the clientele was much as I described above. For example, the couple sitting across from us were celebrating their anniversary at lunch. (Around 4:30, with just the 2 tables occupied, my husband and the other gentleman got to talking about cigars. Of course, out came the cigars and they drove us to our hotel around 5:30.) When we are celebrating a special occasion, it rarely would be at lunch.

[Fat Guy]

At ADNY there is a single brigade that works every meal. That's possible because the restaurant operates on a limited schedule. At most New York restaurants, there are enough cooks and sous-chefs to cover a couple of shifts -- even three shifts in some cases. The better chefs mix it up, rotate the schedule and distribute the talent so that every meal is good. At some restaurants, however, there is definitely a weaker crew working lunches and Sunday dinners.

[cabrales]

As members may know, ADNY is only open for lunch Thursdays and Fridays. The next long weekend involving either of those days that I am in NY, I'll be sampling the lunch menu.  

[lizziee]

Fat Guy,

When you say a weaker crew at lunch, are you talking about New York or Paris?

[cabrales]

I received the latest Ducasse newsletter, which reminded me that there is a Chef's Table in the kitchen at ADNY (seating up to six people). Have members eaten at that table, and how much more expensive generally would dining there be?

Note there was also a nice picture of a lemon, with the following associated indication: "Did you know that Monaco's neighbor, the old French resort town of Menton, hosts a unique lemon festival every year, to pay homage to the golden fruit, which is the symbol of the city?" Have members visited Menton during a festival period?

[Fat Guy]

Lizziee: I was talking about New York, though for all I know it's true of Paris too.

Cabrales: You can probably squeeze 8 at that table, and I doubt it's all that much more expensive to eat there than in the dining room -- it may even be the same (just order from the menu) if the table is available on short notice anyway. But you'd have to ask. Still, I'd choose the dining room for a first visit -- it's more representative of the Ducasse experience -- and maybe ask for a tour of the kitchen.

[cabrales]

Steven -- Thanks for the advice. I have already visited for the first time, although that preceded my membership on the board. Still, I will probably revisit and sit in the dining room. I wonder what the minimum number of diners for the chef's table might be. Perhaps it would be a lower number if the table were not filled close to the day in question.

[Fat Guy]

When it's empty, they'll seat one person in there. I've seen it done.

[cabrales]

I had a disappointing meal at ADNY recently. Amuse consisted of small pieces of cooked tuna, coupled with slightly larger pieces of soft pork. Also included were a slice of boiled egg, lettuce strands and various Mediterranean-type spicing. We purchased the $160 menu for three courses. First, veloute and royale of sea urchin -- average. Second, turbot cooked on the griddle, spread with minced shrimp and fresh herbs. This dish was poor. The "layer" of minced small shrimp and herbs was not appetizing. Worse, the saucing had cooled prior to serving, causing a bad consistency. Then, Maine lobster in a cast iron cocotte, squash blossoms with zucchini filling, Choron sauce. This was alright. Meyer lemon souffle, juice and zest in a delicate gelee was good. It is sad that the dessert was the best dish of the evening. We drank Alain Ducasse private-labelled Champagne, Domaine Rulot Mersault Perrieres (spelling) late 1990s, and a white Burgundy-based dessert wine ($50/glass). The only item I sampled from the lollipop/candy cart was the lemon lollipop. While I had great company and therefore had a great evening, the meal itself was, as was the case on other visits to ADNY, disappointing. I rate ADNY a good-minus. Note I am not eager to spend time discussing this evaluation of my meal; subjectively, I have written ADNY off (not that that is different from before the meal).

[tommy]

it just dawned on me how expensive that is. silly.

[cabrales]

tommy -- The expense wouldn't be a negative aspect if the cuisine were very good. Sadly, it was not. However, I continue to like the decor of the restaurant and its lushness. I appreciate Arman sculptures, and the large wall of musical instruments, together with the smaller sections higher up with splashes of burgundy color, were at least visually appealing.

[Fat Guy]

I can't decide which gives me less confidence in your taste, Cabrales: Your dislike of Ducasse's food or your enjoyment of Arman's sculptures!

[cabrales]

Well, at least my tastes are consistent. I have not found Ducasse's cuisine particuarly appeaing, whether sampled at Plaza Athenee (Paris) (although the cuisine is better than at ADNY, based on several meals at each), Louis XV (Monaco), Spoon (London branch; misguided), Bastide de Moustiers (poor, particularly after B Witz left for La Celle) or the co-venture with Bruno, Hostellerie de l'Abbaye de la Celle (better than Batide). I suppose I liked Plaza Athenee slightly better the last time I went.

On Arman, I really enjoy Arman sculptures, including at Cello in NY (both outdoor large sculpture and indoor ones), Troisgros at Roanne (it's the outdoor sculpture in the plaza facing the restaurant), Maximin at Vence (like Troisgros, forks and spoons, but placed on the wall in a mural-like work) and Michel Rostang in Paris. Arman is likely to be an artist who enjoys cuisine.

[Robert Schonfeld]

Arman is likely to be an artist who enjoys cuisine.

Ok, Cabrales, you've piqued my curiosity. Would you be good enough to elaborate on this?

[Fat Guy]

... if you have the time and feel comfortable discussing it, of course!

[cabrales]

One can't tell for sure with Arman, but in certain French contexts, artists used to barter works for meals, or be friendly with a restaurant enough to gift works to them.

Cocteau used to provide designs to La Mediterranee (spelling) in Paris, where one can still see some of his works, together with beautiful murals by other artists (one is unsure whether the mural artists furnished works for meals). The murals are a subject of a thread I began a few days ago on this restaurant.

Apart from Arman, there is a artist whose oil paintings one finds at Troisgros and Auberge de L'Ill. At Troisgros, the one painting by this unidentified person is not placed in a prominent position. When one proceeds up the main staircase from the entryway to the hotel/restaurant at Troisgros to the gastronomic library (to one's left), one continues until the very end (without going to the library). There, one will find a large painting in hues of pink and red. It depicts the forms of both Jean and Pierre quite prominently, but they do not have facial features. However, they are easily recognizable; they are depicted in chefs' whites while in the kitchen. When I visited Auberge de L'Ill for the first time recently, I noticed the same artist's work in the main dining room (the one you turn right to reach, from the entry area; the one with white/green tones). There, on the left-hand-side of the room, is a large painting of the Haeberlin chefs, not in tones of red/pink, but with the same lack of facial features and in an unmistakably similar style to the Troisgros painting. When I wandered about to review the artwork at Auberge de L'Ill, I saw that there were still lifes of flowers, etc. in the greeting area of the restaurant/hotel by the same artist.

Pic sells postcards of works of an artist called Peyret (?), whose designs include cartoon-like figures (including one of doves carrying by strings a cartoon character). When I asked a staff member why these postcards were being sold, she indicated that Peyret had liked the restaurant. Inside one of the ladies' washrooms (the one between the hotel main area and the sitting lounge with the vaulted ceilings where the pool table is located), there is a large glass window with beautiful Peyret designs (cartoon characters prominently featured).

Other members' observations of artists whose works appear at several restaurants would be appreciated.

[Robert Schonfeld]

Thanks for your reply, Cabrales.

Of course, there is a longstanding relationship between artists and restaurants, ranging from starving painters bartering for food to celebrity artists of highly varying degrees of quality providing commissioned works, whether in exchange for food or cash payment.

Imho, the quality of art in restaurants is, to be kind, not good. Naturally, there are exceptions, and members may wish to cite their favorites, but in general terms they serve to prove the rule. It is better, I think, for restaurants to concentrate on issues of design and decoration, where aesthetic success is more achievable than it is with works of art.

[Bux]

Beginning September 10th, Alain Ducasse at the Essex House is no longer open for lunch. Starting Monday, September 16th, the restaurant opens for dinner from Monday to Saturday.

[pete ganz]

Damn him! Now where will I get my lunchtime sea scallops and Osetra caviar??

[guru]

I guess the rent is not so expensive after all!

[Wilfrid]

Pret a Manger must have hit him hard.

[Fat Guy]

Didn't he lose his pastry chef to Pret? Oh, that was Gramercy Tavern.