Finding Matfer Bourgeat Copper in Manhattan

[chefboy24]

checked out broadway panhandler as they have the matfer bourgeat copper pans....

my problem is... i HATE the sets. so i've decided to get the biggest "saucepan", the big brazier/sautoir, and a good 9.5 inch frypan, unfortunately with no discount. altho panhandler has very good prices.

but i'm wondering if anyone else in manhattan have bourgeat copper?

should i go on the net?

there is one guy with a site in dallas who seems to have the best prices and free ups ground...i am strongly considering him.

jb prince doesn't have anything that heavy, and i've used the bourgeat's when i cooked in boston, i think they are better pans than mauviel or all clad copper.

your thoughts?

[slkinsey]

Phil, from a technical performance standpoint, it's all a wash. Bourgeat and Mauviel purchase their copper/stainless bimetal from Falk Culinair. In addition, Bourgeat's copper/stainless pans are actually manufactured by Mauviel. (All the stainless lined heavy copper brands -- Falk, Bourgeat, Mauviel -- are better than All-Clad Copper Core and Cop-R-Chef, of course.)

This is not to say that one can't prefer a certain stainless lined heavy copper design better than another. Differences include flared lip versus straight lip, different handle anchor points, different handle shapes, different finishes and different pan geometries (although they are all very similar in terms of geometry). The question you have to ask yourself is whether these differences in design are worth the differences in price. Sometimes it may me, sometimes it may not be -- keeping in mind that cooking performance will be more or less identical.

If you've got your heart set on Bourgeat and are already familiar with these pans, my experience is that you are likely to get the best deals over the internet. Just make sure you don't shell out for super-expensive copper/stainless bimetal lids (they're a pain in the butt, and don't contribute to performance at all), and make sure you're getting 2.5 mm thickness (I think Bourgeat is only available in 2.5 mm, but I've seen some internet sellers offering low prices on "2.5 mm" Mauviel designs that are only produced in 2.0 mm).

[chefboy24]

very interesting.

i've heard this before.... i don't exactly have my heart set on bourgeat, but they are the heaviest i've used and i really like how the brazier, fry pan, and sauce pot feel in my hands.

i always was under the impression that the mauviel coppers were lighter?

also - which ones are your favorite?

i'm basically going for the heaviest and most durable possible. i think i'd also prefer flared lip, which is bourgeat

Edited May 14, 2007 by chefboy24 (log)

[chefboy24]

hmm

upon further inspection - mauviel has 3.5 mm copper with tinned interior, altho their stainless/copper only goes to 2.5

i might be interested in the 3.5 mm copper - altho i've heard tinned copper is much more gentle and dents easier (or will totally burn off)

[chefboy24]

oh no!!!

mauviel has a tinned copper line called "CUPRETAM"

this is probably the most fabulous, from a purist standpoint, no?

i'm not of the generation that knows about "retinning"...however....this seems like the higest quality?

[slkinsey]

A few things:

In my opinion, you do not want tin-lined copper. It looks like a bargain, but re-tinning is very expensive and tin linings are not durable. For one, tin melts at around 550F, which means that high heat cooking is more or less out of the question.

The main producers of stainless lined heavy copper available in the US are Bourgeat, Falk Culinair and Mauviel. They are all available in 2.5 mm thickness. Mauviel has several different thicknesses available with a stainless lining: 2.5 mm "Cuprinox"; 2.0 mm "Cuprinox Gourmet" and "Style" (the latter with stainless steel handles; and "Pour la Table" aka "Table Service." The latter is for table serice only, and is not intended for stovetop cooking. So it is possible that you have handled some of the "Gourmet" or "Table Service" Mauviel, which is indeed lighter gauge. That said, the heavy gauge "Cuprinox" is just as thick as Falk Culinair and Bourgeat.

I own pieces of stainless lined heavy copper from all the manufacturers, and lean towards Falk Culinair. I like the fact that they have a brushed finish on the exterior, which makes it easy to keep them bright with Bar Keeper's Friend and a Scotch Brite pad (although, of course, tarnished copper cooks just as well). I like the smaller rivets. I like the flared lips. Most of all, I like the fact that Falk was responsible for rationalizing the US prices for stainless lined heavy copper cookware (Bourgeat's list price on an 11 inch "flared saute pan" was something like $580 back in 1999) and I like doing business their North American distributor.

[chefboy24]

definitely good advice.

actually - i've read that tin melts at as low as 460F!!

you're right...back at CIA i think we had table service copper....and at williams sonoma i think i must have not seen the heavy cuprinox copper/stainless

to be honest....i think buycoppercookware.com really has the best prices

i think i'm going to do:

1 fry pan copper/stainless cuprinox 2.5mm

1 large braizer tin lined cupretam

1 3.75 qt sauce pot tin lined cupretam

all 3 come out to $615...much lower then what i thought i was going to have to pay at broadway panhandler...around $890

because i will definitely use metal tools on the fry pan and probably get the oil up to 460 regularly (as thats the smoke point of a good canola or grapeseed)

but as far as the braiser and the saucepot - i can live with wood spoons, and plus i use my high-temp rubbermaid spoonula for everything.

i think this might be the best for how i cook.

then again if falk does tin lined...i may have to go to thr drawing board?

Edited May 14, 2007 by chefboy24 (log)

[slkinsey]

Falk does not do tin-lined to the best of my knowledge. But, honestly I have to say: I think you're making a big mistake in getting tin-lined over stainless lined. One retinning and you'll wish you had ponyed up for the stainless stuff. And it's not a matter of "if" with retinning, it's a matter of "when."

[chefboy24]

okay i am strongly considering your advice

[Bliss]

I just checked the Falk site [http://store.falkculinair.com/chefpanfaitt.html] and Ebay [http://stores.ebay.com/Belgium4You] where they are selling their entire line. You might look into these sites before going ahead.

BTW, we're loyal Burgundy Wine Company customers!

Bliss

okay i am strongly considering your advice

←

[andiesenji]

checked out broadway panhandler as they have the matfer bourgeat copper pans....

my problem is... i HATE the sets.  so i've decided to get the biggest "saucepan", the big brazier/sautoir, and a good 9.5 inch frypan, unfortunately with no discount.  altho panhandler has very good prices.

but i'm wondering if anyone else in manhattan have bourgeat copper?

should i go on the net?

there is one guy with a site in dallas who seems to have the best prices and free ups ground...i am strongly considering him.

jb prince doesn't have anything that heavy, and i've used the bourgeat's when i cooked in boston, i think they are better pans than mauviel or all clad copper.

your thoughts?

←

Send an email to Chef Ron Askew Sales@CulinaryCultures.com

Tell him what you want and ask for the best price on the Bourgeat "Alliance" pan or pans that you want.

State whether or not you want the lid included.

Free shipping in the US.

Download the PDF of the Bourgeat catalog from here, so you have the part numbers.

Matfer-Bourgeat catalog.

He offers a significant discount to professionals.

see what others say!

[eatingwitheddie]

checked out broadway panhandler as they have the matfer bourgeat copper pans....

my problem is... i HATE the sets.  so i've decided to get the biggest "saucepan", the big brazier/sautoir, and a good 9.5 inch frypan, unfortunately with no discount.  altho panhandler has very good prices.

but i'm wondering if anyone else in manhattan have bourgeat copper?

should i go on the net?

there is one guy with a site in dallas who seems to have the best prices and free ups ground...i am strongly considering him.

jb prince doesn't have anything that heavy, and i've used the bourgeat's when i cooked in boston, i think they are better pans than mauviel or all clad copper.

your thoughts?

←

you might want to check out: http://www.rameria.com/englhome.html

based in montepulciano italy signore mazzetti is one of the last great copper artisans in europe - his cookware is tinned using a process handed down from his grandfather - he crafts every piece himself and uses hand hammering techniques that create a superior durability, better than his competitors - he does fabulous old world work and makes custom pieces using your choice of copper guage and details - his tinning is the best and most durable I have ever seen - he has many pieces in stock - great products and designs - made me a fab 14" flat-bottomed wok! highly recommend his work - he is profiled in the May2007 issue of Saveur Magazine

Send an email to Chef Ron Askew Sales@CulinaryCultures.com

Tell him what you want and ask for the best price on the Bourgeat "Alliance" pan or pans that you want.

State whether or not you want the lid included.

Free shipping in the US.

Download the PDF of the Bourgeat catalog from here, so you have the part numbers.

Matfer-Bourgeat catalog.

He offers a significant discount to professionals.

see what others say!

←