cabrales

I would be interested in recent visits made by members to Pho Hoang on Main Street. The food appears to me to have deterioriated -- including the spicy version of the soup for the beef noodles. Do other members have data points? :)

Steve -- I agree with you on Blanc. For ease of reference, here is a December 26 post in the "Champagne" thread under "Wine and Beer" (in yet another example of posting under the wrong thread ;)) _________ At George Blanc's last week, I ran into a Ruinart Blanc de Blancs from 1979 that was not on the wine list and that was sold to me for 800 Francs. It was sitting in a little corner of the winer cellar like it had always been intended for me. The same evening, I also had the 1988 version from the wine list (less than 600 Francs). Unfortunately, the food at Georges Blanc was disappointing and the service was poor. This was also my assessment of the restaurant the prior time I had visited. The Bresse chicken "G7" style (foie gras and roasted garlic sauce), which had been served at the G7 summit in Lyons in the late 1990s (?), was uneventful. The crepes Vonnasienne, essentially large blinis, accompanying the chicken were soggy. But the wine list saved the evening, given my perverse tendencies towards Ruinart Blanc de Blancs ________________ Below is further detail on the same meal. A white bean and black truffle soup was good, but not something that would tend to display the capabilities (or lack thereof) of a chef. The next dish was a 1/2 portion of frogs' legs, which were swimming in butter. However, the quality of the meat of the frogs was excellent (better than that of frogs used by Loiseau to make his signature dish of frogs' legs with parsley jus (more like a puree) and garlic puree). At Blanc, I had ordered venison, which arrived at the table in an unappetizing brown sauce and which tasted as though it had been subjected to copious amounts of meat tenderizer. I could not even finish my first bite. When the waiter later inquired about whether I liked the dish, I mustered the kindness to say that it was interesting. He asked again, and I responded that the dish was different. (I should have indicated that it was different from acceptable cuisine.) The G7 chicken described represented what I could scrounge from my dining companion's dish. PS: We had the two bottles of Ruinart Blanc de Blancs (no pun intended) after the meal. There were some other finds to be had on George Blanc's wine list. (Edited by cabrales at 7:43 am on Jan. 2, 2002)

Robert -- I'm curious as to what your remarks generally have been for a chef who is doing "la ronde" in the dining room and who has offered an unsatisfactory meal :) When a chef approaches me under these circumstances, I generally neither say things to him that are untrue nor voice my mind. I might comment on the quality of the produce, if it was indeed good (e.g., the freshness of the fish, the availability of a game item), or emphasize the appropriate utilization of a particular herb or spice. I might also inquire into the history of a particularly well-known dish, if it was poor.

Liza -- Agreed. In France, speaking French might also be helpful to avoiding that table, although I know that you are referring to other factors.

I agree that argan oil has, with limited exceptions, an unappealing taste. However, in two dishes recently sampled, it at least did not detract from other aspects of the dishes: L'Espadon, at the Ritz in Paris -- Fine tarte aux truffes noires parfumee a l'huile d'Argan, doucette de Xeres (thin-crusted tart with black truffles flavored with argan oil). Argan oil was used very sparingly in this dish. Meneau's L'Esperence -- Brochettes de petoncles au sesame (skewers of a scallop-like item with sesame). This dish utilized quite a lot of argan oil, but the sesame somehow offset the stench of the oil. This dish was part of four decent-sized appetizers called "Les Petits Plats Nouveaux" (new little dishes). The others were: Caviar a la puree d'oignons (caviar with onion puree) Langoustine rissollee au curry (langoustine browned with curry) Pomme de terre, puree de celeri et truffes (potatoes with celery puree and truffles (black))

Mark -- Thanks for providing your insights on Le Cirque :) On dressing at restaurants, are you adhering to the utilization of your suits for principle-based reasons? Otherwise, a one-time investment might be something worth consideration (not necessarily execution). For men, one could argue that one only needs (theoretically) a single dark-colored suit (and, in the winter, some type of coat) for use at every restaurant, if one cared about initially avoiding the "Rube Table" you describe. (Edited by cabrales at 10:26 am on Dec. 28, 2001)

Bux -- Troisgros has many rooms, and, upon my re-review of the initial post for this thread, is probably not the subject on which Margaret solicited input. Perhaps Loubet's Moulin de Lourmarin would also not qualify, given the large number of rooms, the significant common areas and the non-food services and facilities.

On the authenticy of bouillabaisse, certain restaurants have pledged to be more faithful to the utilization of fish, etc, under a so-called "Charter": http://www.provencetourism.com/activites/details.asp?id_adh=167 http://www.starchefs.com/bouillabaisse/html/english/article.shtml While I have not yet visited the following restaurants, Miramar and Chez Michel are supposed to offer expensive, but appetizing, versions of bouillabaisse. I am uncertain as to why Chez Michel is not part of the Charter. Finally, have members visited the fish market in Marseilles? (Edited by cabrales at 8:33 am on Dec. 28, 2001)

Bux -- I'm in France until the very beginning of January. Even before receiving any euros, I am finding the non-round-number aspect of the euro a disadvantage. I hope the euro coins are not heavy.

Bux -- In an attempt to stay more on topic :), I wanted to ask whether part of the memorable aspect of your Orsi/truffle experience might have been associated with the attention and care that Orsi's greeting and other actions demonstrated. Could part of your enjoyment have been based on the fact that a chef/restaurant's time and effort are scarce? Bux's mention of a chef's making rounds in the dining room may also be interesting in connection with exclusivity/scarcity factors. Have members noticed whether chefs allocate about the same amount of time to different tables, when they do tour the room? If not, would conversation about, and interest in, food generally have more of an impact on the length of time spent at a given table, as opposed to other factors (such as the price of the food and wine consumed)? On Robert's discussion on surprise from unexpected quarters, for me (only) "gastronomic racing luck" is almost invariably associated with special dishes or special attention from restaurant personnel. Neighboring diners might be interesting to listen to or less so, and it might be wonderful to receive a sample of a product not yet massaged by a restaurant, but I am generally so focused on the food and the other aspects of the applicable restaurant that surprises on other fronts have a muted impact :)

Bux and Steve P -- I would not let special favors to other diners alter my assessment of a restaurant from an excellent one to not wanting to return. However, have there been instances where you have been at a restaurant that is difficult to access again (at least in the foreseeable future, whether due to geography or time constraints) and you notice an enticing dish that you would have ordered, had you known about it, but that was off-menu and served to other diners? Is there a sense in which you covet the dish, such that the knowledge that you could not sample it for an extended period of time (if ever) might lead to disutility (not dissatisfaction with the restaurant, but some negative sentiment) on your part?

Liza, Bux & Fat Guy -- I did not know "mystery shoppers" existed, but the topic is fascinating, just as Michelin inspecteurs are. Sorry for having so many questions, to which I trust you would respond only to the extent comfortable for you. Are auditors paid for taking the time to review an establishment, or is the primary method of payment merely the cost of the meal itself? Is wine covered if the meal is reimbursed? Finally, the criteria described by Liza appeared to be somewhat "technical" (e.g., time prior to answering of the phone call requesting a reservation). How are qualitative criteria reviewed by most mystery shopper services (e.g., using a simplified numerical scale, or with more extensive descriptions)? On the separate question of whether age makes a difference in a diner's interactions with a restaurant, I wonder if younger diners could compensate for any initial disadvantages by dressing well and being immacuately groomed. I also wonder if other members may have perceived a correlation between gender (where they are not dining as a couple, and are dining, for example, solo or with friends of the same gender) or race, on one hand, and treatment by restaurants, on the other? It may be impracticable to directly attribute discrepancies in treatment with gender or race -- hence, my reference to perceived correlation instead of perceived causation. And, without making suggestions of any kind, are "dinosaurs" or restaurants in certain geographic regions within the US or Europe the places where such perceived discrepancies might exist? Differential treatment on the described bases would seem to be even more egregious than differential treatment based on age.

I can only second Steve P's observation, some time ago in the "Chef of the Century" thread, of (happy) surprise regarding happenings in a thread during a poster's absence :) Steve Klc -- I appreciate that the scarcity factor has zero direct relevance for you, but could there be ways in which scarcity enhances the "surprise" element? For example, if you receive a dish that has not been ordered (or that is not part of a degustation menu ordered), but that is on the restaurant's menu, would you be less thrilled to receive it than a dish that had neither been mentioned in reviews nor incuded on the menu? As hinted at in Goose in Toulouse (or another book which I cannot recall), Veyrat appears to have a tendancy to provide extra dishes to diners who order degustation menus. However, those dishes, in my experience, are always from the restaurant's regular menu. If a diner were observant and saw the extra dishes being offered to adjacent tables that had ordered similarly, would the surprise element be muted? Your pinpointing the effect of surprise is interesting because posters on this board and others interested in food would tend to be less "surprised" at restaurants merely by reason of having read posts or restaurant reviews. For a diner who has not yet visited a new restaurant, one could argue that, by assembling information about a restaurant (as I am prone to do), he could be balancing the benefits of other people's insights into the restaurant against the reduction of "surprise" elements (not just with respect to dishes, but also other aspects of the restaurant). For me, this would not tend to be a problem because preferences are so subjective that merely knowing what the offered dishes might be, or others' perspectives on a restaurant, would not reduce the surprise elements of my personal experiences there. Steve Klc's comments on surprise also suggest another line of discussion. Some restaurants change their menus with some frequency, and with the availability of different products, the onset of different seasons and developments in the chef's cuisine; others appear to have a more entrenched menu. How much more might you value a restaurant that has a different menu upon different visits? Surprise was one of the things that pleased some diners in the old days at Le Gavroche, when Michel and Albert Roux were interchanging between the positions of chef and person taking orders in the room. Is heightened surprise as to dishes among the things that make worthwhile the increased cost of a "kitchen table" at Gordon Ramsay's at Claridges? Is there heightened surprise when you watch the dish being prepared (in some cases, to a lesser extent) there, or you wonder which dishes are for you and which for other diners? Finally, I am curious about the extent to which restaurants track the special occasions (e.g., birthdays, anniversaries) and the food preferences/dislikes of their special clients (whether this be "high-rollers" mentioned in earlier threads or clients whom restaurant personnel personally like). Also, do such clients expect that a restaurant would remember these aspects, or could there be "surprise" elements there as well? PS: Like Steve Klc, I tend to let the chef and sommelier guide my experience during a meal. Steve Klc -- You mention that, to the extent practicable, you may ask the chef to recommend wines for each of his courses. Is that feasible for bottles because you are dining with large groups or because you drink a great deal?

I'm in France, and several people (who may not have definitive information in this regard) indicated that the Euro can be utilized starting January 1, even though a package of Euros can now be purchased from specified locations (e.g., post offices). My understanding from third-hand sources is that the Franc cannot be used in France as currency starting February 1 (?).

Another appealing restaurant with rooms is Troisgros in Roanne. The facility is easy to access from Lyons, being opposite the salmon pink-colored Roanne train station. Given the TGV, the facility is also reachable from Paris. I like the food at the facility. The rooms are modern, with brown/red/white/orange as some color themes, and priced relatively reasonably. (900 FF bought a wonderful room with a small seating area). Below is an indicative photo: http://www.relaischateaux.com/site/us/FicheAdherent?RcCode=troisgros Common areas at Troisgros were excellent, with a particularly comfortable food library/seating area filled with plush sofas. Food books were available in both French and English. There is also an attractive room for drinks/cigars. Room #38 (significantly more costly) is a duplex, with the second floor being occupied by an enormously long marble shower area. The front of the shower area was all glass.

Bux -- I hope you, like I, don't necessarily consider perversity a bad thing :) At George Blanc's last week, I ran into a Ruinart Blanc de Blancs from 1979 that was not on the wine list and that was sold to me for 800 Francs. It was sitting in a little corner of the winer cellar like it had always been intended for me. The same evening, I also had the 1988 version from the wine list (less than 600 Francs). Unfortunately, the food at Georges Blanc was disappointing and the service was poor. This was also my assessment of the restaurant the prior time I had visited. The Bresse chicken "G7" style (foie gras and roasted garlic sauce), which had been served at the G7 summit in Lyons in the late 1990s (?), was uneventful. The crepes Vonnasienne, essentially large blinis, accompanying the chicken were soggy. But the wine list saved the evening, given my perverse tendencies towards Ruinart Blanc de Blancs :)

Steve --- When you have a chance, please discuss experiences where you have requested a dish at a European restaurant with special ingredients. As always, happy to continue dialogue. I am leaving for vacation, but will continue to check posts (albeit less frequently). Happy holidays to all :)

Macrosan -- I wanted to provide a clarification. I set forth the three initial factors to begin an exploration of the impact of scarcity on diners' perceptions of restaurant experiences. The examples were not intended to suggest that elitism is appropriate. I suppose elitism could be one aspect of a diner's perception of himself that affects his perceptions of scarcity. For example, if a diner is elitist, his perceptions that he is reaping scarce benefits might give him satisfaction because they are consistent with his self-image. Conversely, if a diner is insecure, he may receive satisfaction from having his need to be assured addressed through scarce benefits. I agree that the perception of surrounding diners should be irrelevant in almost every situation. However, I admit, in special circumstances that rarely come to pass, to having felt a sense of glee when I receive "special dishes". The receipt of a special dish without prompting can be distinguished, for me, from the diner's request and receipt of a special dish. I have never requested a "special order" in the sense of a dish that is not on the menu but that I ask be prepared by the cuisinier. I would not choose to risk imposition upon the cuisinier, unless the dish is a signature dish of the cuisinier that is somehow not on the current menu and for which ingredients appear to be readily available. As for Macrosan's point about "never knowingly go[ing] to a restaurant which allows celebrity or favored customers to make reservations unavailable to other customers", I would like to explore whether preferential access to, say, cancelled reservations by repeat customers could be viewed as an aspect of customer service. If cancelled reservations are less offensive, how about a restaurant that tends to have one or two tables left unreserved and available to known diners? Or restaurants with relationships to concierges at certain hotels and that might accord concierges more favorable treatment? Is there an argument that the hotel's sending of customers to the restaurant on a regular basis justifies greater access? It does not particularly bother me when a restaurant makes reservations easier to secure for known, repeat customers or even for celebrities. Some restaurants like to receive media coverage, and it could be rational for them to enhance the perceptions (note) of cache on the part of other diners who may like eating at the same place as a celebrity does. For me, that may be difficult to imagine for a diner truly appreciating the cuisine, though. On your second post, Macrosan, are you aware of instances where a diner with an advance reservation gets cancelled by the restaurant to make room for last minute repeat customers? That would appear to be inappropriate behavior on the part of the restaurant, assuming the original diner had, depending on geography, timely called to confirm the reservation. I have never had my reservation cancelled, and am diligent about furnishing confirmations as appropriate. Steve -- On your experiences with Gramercy Tavern, were the wines you brought expensive wines (not that that is relevant to our discussion)? Would the chef have been helpful, in your mind, if less distinguished wines had been brought? I still have difficulties with BYO (even when I dine alone). That has led me to wonder whether, subconsciously, I am worried it might affect restaurant personnels' perceptions of me. I will consider this issue further.

Dialogue in the "Chef of the Century" thread on the role of perception on a restaurant diner's fulfillment from a meal prompted thought on the extent to which diners may derive satisfaction from receiving (or at least believing they are receiving) scarce items from a restaurant. Below are some preliminary observations. 1. Special dishes that are "off-menu" or otherwise not available to most diners. Among the scarcity categories considered in this post, off-menu dishes (i.e., not just dishes that are not ordered and are furnished to the diner, but dishes that are not generally prepared for other diners) please me the most. The benefit from these dishes is the opportunity to sample them and is less intertwined with "mere perceptual" issues. For certain diners, there may be the added benefit of knowing that surrounding informed diners at the restaurant would perceive the special treatment accorded to the "special dish" recipient, to the extent such surrounding diners were knowledgeable about the menu and the restaurant's cuisine. I imagine that the significance of this aspect of the experience would vary quite a bit among diners. Would the dish recipient diner's perception of the level of culinary sophistication of the restaurant's clientele be relevant? (As an aside: Would members derive dissatisfaction from seeing the receipt of these dishes by other diners? Or would they attribute the special treatment to differences in the frequency of patronage and other factors?) 2. Difficulty of securing reservations. With extremely limited exceptions, I derive almost no enjoyment from securing difficult reservations. If I cared enough about a restaurant, I would likely have inquired into its reservation policy (if any), made reservations in advance and reconfirmed more than necessary. Visiting restaurants is a sufficiently high priority for me to not have to rely on last-minute pleas for cancelled tables or special treatment with respect to scarce reservations. Also, my attribution of less value to this scarcity factor has to do with my belief that, with the exception of a few restaurants in the world, I recognize that I will likely not derive so much fulfillment from them as to make a scarce reservation compelling. I would remain interested in sampling restaurants not fitting this special category, but I would not feel it was a necessity. 3. Attention of dining room team. This can also be a source of satisfaction for some diners. Given the constraints on the time restaurant personnel can spend at a given table, the receipt of a disproportionately greater amount of the personnel's time might not only enhance the overall fulfillment from a meal, but it may offer, for some, perception-rooted benefits.

I'd appreciate leads on where d'Yquem can be sampled by the glass in London (and, if conveniently available, the years offered and general price ranges). Gordon Ramsay Royal Hospital Road is the only place that I have noted. Below are the menus for two seemingly wonderful meals featuring d'Yquems, from Richard Olney's book "Reflexions": 1. At Taillevent, Paris, 15 July 1985 Consumme de Crustaces en Gelee (Gelee of shellfish broth) -- Krug Grande Cuvee Turbot Braise, Sauce au Sauternes (Braised turbot with a sauce of sweet wine from the region in which d'Yquem is located) -- d'Yquem 1945 Ragout de Ris de Veau, de Truffes, de Foie Gras et de Cretes de Coq; Granite de Melon Charentais au Champagne (Ragout of sweetbread, truffles, foie gras and crest of roosters; Granite of melon with champagne) -- d'Yquem 1937 Canteon a l'Aigre-Doux (Sweet and sour duckling) -- d'Yquem 1921 :) Fromages Persilles (Cheese) -- d'Yquem 1980 Blanc-Manger (Dessert containing, among other things, almond?) -- d'Yquem 1893 (no typo) :) Krug 1979 Pour Vous Refraichir le Palais Entre Chaque Plat -- to refresh the palate after each plate 2. At French Culinary Institute, New York, October 21, 1986 Aperitif "Y" (Uncertain if this refers to d'Yquem taken as an aperatif or a distinct item) Salade Francoise, Potato, Truffle & Artichoke Salad, Flavored with Chateau de Fargues -- Chateau de Fargues 1981 Ragout de Homard a la Creme d'Oursin (Lobster and Sea Urchin Ragout) -- d'Yquem 1980 :) Epaule d'Agneau Braisee aux Cepes (Shoulder of lamb braised with porcini mushrooms -- Chateau Talbot 1979 Crepes aux Pommes (Hot Apple Crepes) -- d'Yquem 1975

Two champagnes I like are: S de Salon -- A champagne based on a single grape, the Chardonnay (limited production; may not be to everybody's taste; also expensive). 1993 (and certain 1980's years) can likely be purchased at Galeries Lafayette food section and Fauchon in Paris, among other places. Ruinart Blanc de Blanc

I like the obssessive-compulsiveness of this community, among, of course, other things such as food insight :)

After having completed the previous post, I looked up geoduck in Craig Claiborne's Food Encyclopedia (1985). Here are excerpts: 'The clams can be seven inches across the shell and have a siphon six times that long [rarely]. . . . Oddly, I have never sampled a geoduck, which came as a surprise to many correspondents. . . . Joseph Alsop, the columnist, said that in his opinion, geoduck "cutlets are far superior to abalone [i would not go that far], and you ought to go out of your way to try them. The reason [geoducks] are all but unknown in the United States, although one of the real American delicacies (?), is that these clams, despite their enormous size, are capable of propelling themselves under the sand at close to the speed of light. They make quite conspicuous breathing holes, but locating a breathing hole is only the beginning of the battle. You have to have the knack of foretelling which way [the geoduck] will go, and the strength to dig down for them with utmost rapidity. Otherwise they escape.'"

Geoduck is larger than most other clams, thereby permitting a range of textures within a single specimen. Part of the yummy aspects of it are that parts of the geoduck are inside its shell, and others are sometimes rougher along the skin exposed to the seawater and other times softer in the inside. The taste of fresh geoduck appeals to me, although it is difficult for me to describe why. Sometimes, the geoduck taste is enhanced at Chinese restaurants by using other geoduck as the base for the bouillon in which the actually sampled slices are cooked.

Along certain portions of the west coast of Canada, geoduck clams are available in relative abundance (and at relatively inexpensive prices). Here's a description: http://www.ecy.wa.gov/programs/sea/pugetso...es/geoduck.html Geoduck is frequently on the menus of Japanese restaurants -- sliced and served as sashimi -- or Chinese restaurants. In the latter restaurants, one preparation is to thinly slice the geoduck, and allow the diner to immerse it very briefly in bouillon. A soy sauce or wasabe-based dip would typically be furnished. (See also Steve Klc's September 2 post under "New York -- Citarella's Restaurant".)