JAZ

Just wanted to let everyone know that I split off the very interesting side discussion of bitters into its own thread. In case you're wondering where all those posts went, check out this thread.

I think, Tana, that it's undeniable that the trend toward naming every new drink a fill-in-the-blank martini is spurred by marketing. "Martini" conveys elegance, sophistication and, well, coolness in a way that "cocktail" does not. I don't think it's an accident of language that everything is now a "martini" rather than, say, a daquiri or a margarita, even though, in construction, the new drinks are often closer to them than they are to the classic martini. Yes, I wish that new drinks were not all called "martinis." No, I don't think it's going to stop. I really like the creativity in bartending these days (even if I personally don't like many of the drinks) and if usurping the name "martini" has helped that trend, then I (very reluctantly) have to say that it's not all bad. This is a very new attitude on my part. A very big part of me still wants a martini to be gin, vermouth and bitters. Period. As a lover of the language, I really, really wish that new drinks had the great names of older drinks -- how can a "fill-in-the-blank martini" compete with a Corpse Reviver, a Satan's Whiskers, a Monkey's Gland, a Blood and Sand? When I create new drinks, half the fun is coming up with a cool name. But, marketing rears its head in the cocktail world, just as it does everywhere else. Is a Key Lime Martini, language-wise, any worse than a Mexican Caesar Salad? I've come to the conclusion that this is one battle I'm not going to win. It doesn't mean that I'm going be calling my new drinks "martinis," but it does mean that I'm over my outrage. But, believe me, I do understand your point. You're not alone. PS Reading Steven Pinker's book The Language Instinct totally changed my attitude about "word abuse."

Welcome! Here are two versions, both by eGullet members: Click here for a recipe by beans, and here for Katie Loeb's version. Of course, they may be different from the one you had, but at least they'll give you a starting point. Good luck!

I'm happy to announce the winners of Gary and Mardee's books: The winner of Gary's The Joy of Mixology is sml311, and TrishCT has won a copy of Mardee's The Bartender's Best Friend. Congratulations! Thanks for participating in the Q&A.

For me, it's not the gin and chocolate part that sounds weird (whenever I see those little chocolate bottles filled with various liqueuers and liquors, I always grab the Beefeater ones), it's the chocolate and lemon. That combination just doesn't work for me. Maybe this drink will change my mind. But this means I now have to buy some creme de cacao. Along with some Pernod for the Corpse Reviver. This could be an expensive thread.

Without the white wine, I think it sounds okay (it'd be better with gin or tequila), but then I like Clamato. With the wine, though, I just don't know; it sounds very odd.

Beans's suggestion about the Tanquerey 10 is a good one -- the 10 is a gin that many haters-of-other-gins (read vodka lovers) actually like. Another possibility is sliver (blanco) tequila. I'm a big fan of tequila gimlets, so I know it would work for me. Depends on how you feel about tequila. For a totally different approach, you might keep the vodka but add a splash of grapefruit juice or a shake of orange bitters, either of which would add some complexity.

A couple more suggestions: Add some sliced green onions or slivers of white onion at the start, along with the aromatics. Also add a couple pieces of ginger to start (remove later -- or you can grate it and leave it in the sauce).

Try using chicken thigh meat instead of breast. It has more fat, so it'll stay moist even without brining and will have much more flavor than the breast meat. It also sounds like you used about three times the cornstarch I would have -- I use about a tablespoon in a quarter cup water, and thicken the sauce only at the very end. That way, I can control the consistency better.

Personally and on behalf of eGullet, I want to thank Gary and Mardee for such a fun and educational Q&A. It was a great week. And my thanks to all who participated, both new and old members. Stay tuned to find out the winners of Gary's and Mardee's books, and remember that if you register for their class, Cocktails in the Country, and mention eGullet, you'll get a free copy of Gary's book. Now, let's continue over drinks in the lounge. . . um, I mean the Cocktail Forum. After all, we can't leave Fat Guy to fend for himself, now can we? Click here to get to the Spirits and Cocktails forum. See you there!

Okay, for my second one, I tried your proportions (less of my cherry syrup, though) and it definitely gets the scotch up front more. I think my syrup is still throwing it off a bit, even though I eased up even more on it. It's been a while since I've had Cherry Heering, and although from my recollection, the syrup I have matches the flavor pretty well, it doesn't add the extra alcohol. So that's undoubtedly a factor. For the record, I'm using a scotch I hadn't tried before, recommended by my spirits shop. It's called "The King of Scots" by Douglas Laing & Co. It's pretty good, but lighter than I expected (I'd gone in asking for Teachers, which I guess is no longer to be found in these parts) and the guy said this would be similar. I remember Teachers as having more smoke and peat -- this is a lot like Dewars. Guess I should have gotten the Famous Grouse. Well, it was a promising start. I'll continue to experiment.

Okay, I'm hooked. I just went out, bought some scotch, came home and made a Blood and Sand. Sort of. I didn't buy any cherry brandy, because the only bottle I could find was huge, and I wasn't sure I wanted to make that much of a commitment. But I did have on hand a big jar of Amarena Fabbri cherries, so I figured I could use some of the syrup from that instead. Then, I when I grabbed the bottle of sweet vermouth from the bar, I realized there was only about a teaspoon left, but I did have a bottle of Lillet Rouge, which is close enough for me. So, my version of the Blood and Sand was 1/2 ounce each Scotch, Lillet Rouge and orange juice (I used fresh squeezed), with about 1 1/2 teaspoons of the syrup from the cherries. It's amazingly good; sweetish but not cloying, but it doesn't taste much of the Scotch, which surprised me. I wish I had a digital camera, because it was a very cool looking drink -- the cherry syrup gave it just the hue and texture that you'd think a drink called Blood and Sand would have Now of course I'm wondering how it compares with the original, so I may have to run out and buy the cherry brandy after all.

Great! I didn't know if you'd be able to make it back. I never would have appointed Doc the expert had I known.

I guess that in the grand scheme of things, whisky mildew doesn't rank as one of the world's biggest problems, but it certainly sounds nasty. Good thing I don't drink much real old whisky.

No reason why we can't continue on until the end of the day; then we can move the discussion(s) over to the Cocktail forum. Doc, you want to step into Gary's shoes and play expert?

I second the Aquavit and Balthazar suggestions, and would add Bay Wolf too.

I'll jump in here, because Doc just described my drink of choice for years. Regular. The Sapphire doesn't have enough juniper to stand up to all the lime. Edit: Never mind. We're trying to teach you to mix for yourself. Taste them both and decide. If you choose the Sapphire, you're wrong, but that's okay.

I'll check with my best source for hard-to-find stuff. At the very least, they carry a pretty complete selection of Marie Brizzard, so I should be able to find that. And, now that you mention it, I was thinking of the JW Blue version -- I think you referred to in passing in another thread. When I sell my book, I'll celebrate and try it. Until then, do you have any favorite Scotch to use in the drink? Dewars, Teachers and Black and White are my standbys.

I just thought of another great alternative, especially for daytime parties (brunches, pool parties, etc.) In Gary and Mardee's New Classic Cocktails, they have a drink called the Tart Gin Cooler, which is equal parts gin, grapefruit juice and tonic, with a splash of bitters. My mom's a big fan of tonic, but she doesn't drink alcohol anymore, so I make her a version of it without the gin (she's okay with the amount of alcohol in the bitters, but as Gary mentioned above, all bitters contain alcohol, so check with your guests before you add it). It's really great, as is the orginal with the gin. (In fact, the Tart Gin Cooler has beaten out the Americano as my favorite afternoon drink.)

Okay, Gary, you've mentioned the Blood and Sand twice now, and you've got me intrigued. I love Scotch, but rarely use it in cocktails, so this sounds like a great opportunity. When you say "cherry brandy" though, what exactly do you mean? I think Grand Marnier is made in a cherry version -- is that it? The only cherry liqueur I've had (aside from Maraschino, and I know that's a whole different animal) is Cherry Heering, which to my mind is ungodly sweet. And just because I'm lazy and don't want to go back and find the thread where you mentioned an "upgraded" version of the Blood and Sand, can you refresh my memory on that too?

Well, I only concentrated on it for a very few drinks that I really liked, so I knew I'd be making them a lot. Not that I can't (and don't) measure much of the time, but it's sort of nice to just be able to pour a drink and have it turn out right. But you're right -- free pouring is not necessary in the least. It will, however, make one look (and feel) more confident, and I thought Steven might want that.

That would be my advice as well (focusing on a limited number of drinks as Trillium suggested). When I decided to learn how to make cocktails (instead of just drinking them), I bought a book, invested in some ingredients and equipment, and picked one drink a week to work on. I started out by measuring very carefully, then tinkering with the proportions if I thought it was necessary. Then (provided that I liked the drink enough to keep making it), I worked on being able to "free pour" the amounts reliably. By that time, the drink was internalized, and I moved on to the next one.

Here's a non-cocktail-related question. Sometimes you two work together on your books and articles, and sometimes you go solo. Specifically, you each have written your own cocktail/bartending guide. What determines whether you collaborate or not? Is it interest, or approach, or just circumstances?

I love stems too. My current favorite looks very much like the one you show on the right, but the stem on mine tapers down more. One thing that I really like about it is that the top curves in almost imperceptibly, which helps minimize sloshing. And come to think of it, maybe that's why I never like to fill it to the rim. But my glass is very small, especially when compared to the newer giant glasses -- it holds just shy of 4 ounces if filled to the rim; a better size drink for the glass is 3 ounces. So I make my drinks small, they stay cold, and I can switch drinks more often that way. Besides, they're just so damn cute. What I don't have is good rocks glasses. Any suggestions on those?

Welcome to the party, Audrey! You know, there probably isn't any reason not to add the sugar right away. It's just that when I was starting to experiment, I wanted to get the heat and flavor level right and then play around with the sugar level. So that's the way I started doing it, and that's the way I continued. The jalapeno-mint syrup works really well with alcohol too, especially tequila. Makes a great south-of -the-border julep.