Craig Camp

No you got it right away. It just took the rest of us a couple of hundred posts to say it.

Hang in there Mark. I thought your first report was useful and look forward to your next results. Thanks for the effort.

Unfortunately I must object to such second hand information. Put in this context it seems contrived and put up for commercial reasons. It seems to me disingenuous and is trying to prove a point other than the quality of The Wine Clip. I would suggest we stop this pointless argument and let the results of the various tests stand on their own merits. I am quite confident that eGullet members are qualified to make their own decisions. Frankly I let this discussion go farther out of line than I should of and now I must pay the price. The discussion should be only focused on the product and the tests and that is all. Both sides went way out of bounds here on what could have been a great thread if everyone had exhibited a bit of self-control. Thanks to Mark, Doc and Alex for their fine efforts. Perhaps those of us without Wine Clips should listen more and type less. Sammy I will let your post stand, but I find these second hand, gotta hide my identity, types of things detrimental to the argument at hand and of a clearly political nature to prove someone's point. I think you know I have respect for the position you have taken (regardless of if I agree with you) and would request you keep your posts to real data as that is what we are trying to deal with in this thread. Once again, please stay on topic.

Bill - there may be no truffles, but there are plenty of porcini and my father-in-law picked a bunch of other wild mushrooms he is cooking for me tomorrow. Not all the pleasures of fall are lost. Then there is that good looking wine bubbling away up in your neighborhood...

Bill - you got that computer working - bravo!

Cristalino is a good deal isn't it. Amazingly cheap and pleasant.

no, no it is a Sherry which as much as I love it would probably be a bad choice for such a party Look Here

Thank you for your comments, most of which I would agree with. Except this -- Most Europeans are not likely to be drinking wine made in someone's garage. Maybe 50 years ago, but no more. Just like Americans they buy most of their wine from large commercial producers - just like the ones you are promoting. I assure you while many do not see barrels - unfortunately all too many of them see corks. My neighbor makes wine, but he does it as a hobby just as many Americans do. Everyone else buys it from the store - where the wine is much better. The population in Italy is much better informed about wine than Americans as the television spends a huge amount of time devoted to food and yes wine. The Italian equivalent of the Today Show has 3 or 4 major wine segments a week and that does not include all the specials and the Gambero Rosso and Alice channel which talk about wine constantly. The difference is not that they are a bunch of contandini happily stomping grapes - it is just that they are not paranoid of making a mistake.

Rioja will work with the fish, but for me I would lean towards La Rioja Alta - both more delcate and complex. Why not start with Cava? Bubbles make for a great party and match all the foods. (I would really recommend Lustau Fino for starters, but it may be too wild for the school group)

Perhaps an overstatment. I asked him to watch the wine board to help him make up his mind.

The Riedel claim of enhancing the enjoyment of wine has been proven over and over again - for decades. There is no argument among any industry professionals that I am aware of concerning this fact. You can debate all you want as to HOW they improve it, but in fact they do - as does other fine glassware. Try to find a serious winery where that doesn't pour their wine in Reidels anymore. They know how to sell wine. I had invited him to do a Q and A. Looks like that is out of the question.

A very fine and REASONABLE suggestion.

Are you trying to tell me my crystal pyramid decanter does not work? Do you know how much I paid for that? Why I otta...

Great way to put it. Bring on the cheeses.

Mark - Robert Bansberg, the excellent sommelier at Ambria in Chicago, long ago told me of his aborted struggle to get customers to try other Champagnes than Dom Perignon. He stopped we he realized what they wanted was the experience of the bottle on the table - the experience in the mouth was secondary. Now he happily sells great Champagne to those who care and lets the image people have their Dom. Sommeliers that really love wine are in a tough spot when it comes to these kind of wines - predator sommeliers live by it.

And Pierre is no better at it, it seems. Bruce Few wines elicit a more emotional response than Burgundy. Beware the reviewer that treads there.

Actually I think ratings can be meaningful, but only in very specific ways. I quite admire Robert Parker for his organization, consistency and discipline. When he scores a wine I know exactly what he means. If you take the time to read his exceptional notes they tell you far more about the wines than the scores. I am a regular reader and will continue to read his publication with the respect it deserves. Other publications with many different individuals tasting is another argument - in this case scores are not only meaningless, but often misleading and are offered as a commercial product. I myself use scores in my own personal notes. For public consumption I translate them into A, B, C etc. as a method of communicating my personal opinion.

2000 Il Feuduccio Montepulciano d'Abruzzo

In this case I would buy one.

She is a person worthy of respect.

It case anybody cares it is me that is dumping the off-topic crap. I said I'll do it and I am. The topic is the Wine Clip and the tests. If you have questions or debate PM me.

This interesting topic has dissolved into a name calling mess instead of the excellent discussion it was. Please refrain from any more personal attacks and snide comments and return to discussing the time and effort (OK it was not a miserable job) people put into testing the Wine Clip. Off topic insults will end up in never never land. I am working on two assumptions: 1. Mr. Wine Clip is just a businessman who saw a product he thought would sell. He believes in it and is selling it in that way. He would not have put his product out in such a public way if he did not believe it works. Obviously his intention was to get some good exposure for his product - nothing wrong with that. I will say I find Mr. Wineclip's combative approach not in line with Zig Ziglar's concepts of good selling. 2. eGullet is heavily populated by well-educated and experienced amateurs and professionals that are bound to consider such products with a high degree of skepticism. I myself am very skeptical (I am in the experienced not the educated group - went to a state college in the early 70's you know). Although we may to be skeptical of this product there is no reason to treat Mr. Clip as some kind of crook as he gave us samples so that we can make our own decisions. This is hardly the act of someone who does not believe his product works - either by physical or psychological means. Just for my future reference: Is calling someone a "scientist" an insult or a compliment? I believe that as Mark's methods are different from the tests that Alex is conducting that the two in combination will be quite informative. Thanks to Mark and Doc for their interesting comments and I look forward to more from Alex. Let the results speak for themselves. Mr. Wine Clip made the choice to start all of this and now must live with the results - good or bad.

Mr. WineClip has put his product out to be tested publicly - for free. That takes guts and a belief in what he is selling. There would seem to be no reason to attack his ethics as he has been more open than most business people. Please keep the comments to the product and its effectiveness. As with any other product the producer can set the price at whatever they want and then it is up to the public to decide its worth.

Doc you blew it. You'll just have to do it again - and again - and again... unitil you get it right. Back to work!

You know one thing I really miss about Chicago is the Musicbox theatre on Southport. There are some nice restaurants there and a nice little wine shop just across the street, but I forget the name... ...that's the way life is - Que syrah, syrah.