Aloha Steve

Since your first post showing the loaf, I've been all over the net gathering info. LOL I have three questions: What did your loaf weigh before and into what size dutch oven did you put it in. If you were going to buy a size specifically for bread making, what would it be and does it matter ? I know 4 questions I should just add to my signature, EDITED FOR GRAMMAR AND SPELLING

This maybe true for NK bread as I have not read the acknowledged master baker's books but all the bread books I have, say seem side up when proofing in a basket I tried this yesterday. The load came out of the basket, onto the peel and did not spread, which for me is a first. I then put it onto a hot stone, covered with large SS bowl. 30 minutes later, took of SS bowl to finish uncovered, and found the loaf flattened Should I have heated the SS bowl along with the oven and stone ?

Kerry, wouldn't it be simply be putting into the dutch oven loaf seem down ? After all, is it not proofing load seem up ? Instructions called for proofing seam down, next time I'll do it seam up! I've never made, as you see up thread a little I am going to try NK in the next days. There well may be a good reason for proofing seam side down. Let us know how it works out.

Kerry, wouldn't it be simply be putting into the dutch oven loaf seem down ? After all, is it not proofing load seem up ?

Mario Batali's B & B Ristorante, just a few steps from Zeffirino in The Venetian would be a far better choice with a more creative menu. Well David, one of my favorite musical groups is Blind' Faith' (I'm dating myself I know) Zeffirino canceled and B&B booked Many thanks for the info. We went to Bouchon for Brunch the bread was great, the bread pudding type French Toast ok, my Croque Madame and fries were very good, my MIL's corn beef hash with Egg, very good. B&B's just finished about 1/2 hour ago, party of 7 celebrating my Mom's 80th. I tasted a lot of things, I ordered: Warm Lamb’s Tongue with Chanterelles and a 3-Minute Egg, I liked the egg and the mushrooms, could not distinguish the taste of tongue in there. It was good. Beef Cheek Ravioli with Black Truffles and Crushed Duck Liver. Small portion for the $$. Tasted good, sauce very good. Tasted the liver, did not taste the beef or the truffles. I think that I got so spoiled eating fresh, delicious truffle at Le Meurice, last winter that I cannot find it any place else. After all it could have been picked that morning and driven up to Paris. Whatever the case may be, I will not set my sights so high, thinking I will taste it like "that time". And you know that the say about the FIRST time, about a lot of things, maybe that's a factor too. “Brasato al Barolo” with Horseradish “Gremolata” was my main or my secondi dish and, alas I was disappointed. It was described as a incredibly most, marinated over 8 days in a wine and then slow cooked, short rib off the bone. Yes it was good. However, this past Tuesday I ate at Alan Wong's, arguably the best restaurant we got in Hawaii, had the tasting menu, and the last dish before dessert was a small braised short rib. I was too full to eat it at dinner, so took it home, warmed it up the next day and it was fab and beat the one tonight by a mile. Service was not quite on as well. 5 of us were seated, drink orders taken, the last two, came in 10 minutes later and were not asked for their drink order for 15 minutes. Perhaps the hostess did not tell the waiter, the rest of the table was now seated. But we did tell the waiter they were on the way, I think he could have been more attentive. We finally asked a busser if he would please send our wait person over, then after a while the other two drink orders were taken. I thought the service was slow, we had to ask for bread we were not offered any first. But hey, we were there at the busiest time of the evening so this should be taken into account. Did the guy earn the $100+. tip we left him? This by itself was not really off putting as the next part. I was very disappointed in this last bit here: I may be off base here please feel free to correct me if I am. I let them know it was my mom's 80th at the time of reservations, at the time of seating and even joked with the waiter about fitting 80 candles in dish. We were all too full to order dessert. What they did for her, was bring a pitiful little plate of tiny cookies and the chef? wrote in chocolate Happy B-day, I think. The plate was too small to really say and read anything. The bill before tip was around $550., one would think they could put a candle in a $10 dessert and say, if not sing Happy Birthday ! AND, what really was a bummer was two tables away, there was a cake with at lest 10 candles burning on it with about 7 staff were singing Happy B DAY to a person at that table, about 15 minutes before my moms little plate came. Were my expectations too high, was I incorrect to think a real dessert with a candle was appropriate, to be comped ? Not at all, your expectations SHOULD have been high--especially given the name over the door and the prices you were paying. And it is egregious given the fact that you were treated differently compared to another table in the dining room. That is simply unacceptable. That was not at all the experience you should have left the restaurant with. Not at all. Part of what sets Las Vegas apart is that it stakes its reputation on creating special experiences for people. Whether the party next to you was VIP's or not, it shouldn't matter and whether you made the notation of the birthday at the time of the reservation or when you walked in the door shouldn't matter. All guests should be treated special on a special occasion. I highly doubt you'll be back and I expect your words here will have an influence on others who may choose not to dine there when they travel to Las Vegas. I'd recommend a detailed letter to the Management. It won't erase the bitter taste in your mouth, and it may only elicit a "we're sorry, please accept this gift certificate as a token of our sorrow," type of pitiful excuse for your poor experience. (You know, just the type of sad excuse and rebate you'll probably never use). But, in the end, you may feel better for getting it off your chest, and again, you are right for expecting more. Much more. Thanks for your comments David. I was so unsettled that I called the restaurant that night, got the name of the GM and his email address. I wrote him how I felt, gave him the link to my post. I did not bother with a call to action to give me a rebate. He wrote me a long email in return saying: Service was during the height of the rush, which I knew and already told him in my email "I understood that". My family are not the model customers, some patrons are. Have you ever heard the comedy bit by Jackie Mason, how a jew orders his food ? He was observing my family when he wrote it. It is hilarious and as is the case a lot of the time, with bellyaching humor. All EG's should listen, you will laugh so hard......but anyway The GM wrote me to say he is sorry my experience was not what it should have been, I should understand it was the hight of the dinner service, told me please contact him when I'm next here, you will be taken care of and made sure to have...yada yada. AND that the restaurant's policy is, not to comp a $8-$12 dessert with a candle and that the table next us bought the cake themselves. I'm not sure if really read my email. It was NOT inflammatory, accusatory nor contained any swear words. No reason not to have read it though. He did not address what was and still is my biggest 'problem' with dining there that night; The table next to us had a birthday cake with sparkle candles, 7 staff members and thew rest of the table sang Happy Birthday to this gal, sought of "in front" of us. I had assumed she bought a cake, made arrangements for it to be served with all the fanfare. We did not pay for a cake, I did not expect a cake. What I had a right to expect was for an expensive restaurant to have someone in the drivers seat during the Sat. night dinner service who could think on his/her feet! The the wait-person, host, management, whomever oversees customers, KNEW it was my Mom's 80TH. I told host at podium and hostess when they seated us, my mom had not arrived yet so I could talk openly. I joked with the waiter about it and he acknowledged my joke. When I made the reservation and confirmed the reservations told whomever I spoke with. EIGHTIETH BIRTHDAY PARTY FOR MY MOM. To present her, 10 minutes right after the celebrating at the table next to us, with a saucer size plate, with unreadable words in dark chocolate, with cookies the size of my fingernails is just plain not good business sense. At, almost $700 with tip, (remember three of us no alcohol and my mother in law ate one simple pasta dish period) for 7 people........is inexcusable for me to accept. Someone should have thought "hmmmm, how will the guest feel at the next table" "MAYBE, in this case, we should give them a decent dessert and make a little show, so she does not feel bad if she compared her celebratory experience with the guests next to her" I do not think that the email which the GM sent me means the restaurant will comp me and a companion for dinner. We don't drink alcohol, so drinks and or champagne holds no allure for me or Ginger. But mostly, there are so many GOOD restaurants in that town now, I don't want to waste my time going back. I did not respond to the GM, but now that I have wrote this, if I did not round file his email, I will cut and paste it as my response.

I See...I did not know that. I'm trying no steam today. I will heat up the stone in the oven as usual, sliding the loaf onto it which will be on parchment paper. Then instead of throwing hot water into a cast iron pan, I am going to cover it with a stainless large steel mixing bowl and the let the loaf make its own heat. Remove cover 2/3 of the way and its supposed to be good that way. Nothing against EG.....if you are really into bread type baking.....thefreshloaf.com is the place.....besides here a-course.

Those loafs look pretty good and crusty to me !!!! I just mixed a batch of no-knead on Wed. Based on that 5 minute book's formula, they are probably close to the same as yours. Supposed to stay in the fridge for two weeks, pull out what you knead (pun intended;) and keep the rest in the fridge. I'll try it on Tuesday, to give the dough some time to flavor up. Right now, I am on the 2nd rise of a Spinach Cheese bread. Made with a poolish, which I threw together at 1:00 am this morning. Two more rises and shaping to go..........I am skeptical about the NK being as flavorful as traditionally done.....taste buds will tell. As I mentioned above: Those loafs look pretty darn good and crusty to me !!!!

They look great. And is inspiring me to try making them myself!

Got it thanks Chris.

There are no exact "equals". The strains of wheat used are different, and that's just to start with. Yes, dougal I understand that now. You've put it most simply: the wheat, milling, packaging, and all the other differences in production from our country to France's will make it different. Protein level can be equaled but the not the rest. Thanks.

Just commenting on the volume of the dough. I thought I'd give it a few more days to ferment and flavor up.

Just what constitutes a New York Style crumb cake? I am looking for a good cake to freeze. It freezes well. We cut it into single serving size, (hahahah whatever that means cause I'll just eat two if one is not enough) & freeze all the time. I eat it frozen, the crumbs still perfect, but the cake tastes better 20 minutes after taking out.

Just what constitutes a New York Style crumb cake? I am looking for a good cake to freeze. It is equal to the best desert I make. Now you can only find something like it at, ye gads, Starbucks......and it is NOT what we use to be able to get in almost any deli in the City. This recipe, if you like cinnamon, vanilla, butter and CRUMBS, you must try it. And on a scale of 1-10 of difficulty, 10 being the highest, for you Darienne, its a -1 If you or anyone would like it be a pleasure to share my recipe.

Hey Doc, after reading about everyone's fantastic results, I decided to mix up a batch and see if I could follow. I wonder if I made a mistake ? The dough almost tripled, 3 hrs, before putting in fridge 14 hours ago, just checked and its now only doubled, the original volume. Too much mixing together in the proof container ? I used my favorite wooden spoon, which I also use to mix Crystal Light fruit punch, some of the red stuff got into the mix, my bad really, for not thinking thru, that stuff is nothing but chemicals. However, it only a left trace amount a few red streaks on the top of dough. Lastly, I tweaked the recipe from 20 gms semoilna to 100 and lowered AP to 700. Other than that, a gram here or there of the other ingredients, and it is the same formula as above.

Thanks for all the replies. Since I keep the house A/C-ed 24/7/365, so humidity and going over 80 degrees does not happen, perhaps that's why I am getting 3-5 days with no real loss of flavor, crunch etc. As for the critters, I'm going to start putting the loafs in the oven when not in use and after use has reached standing temp.

The best for me is New York Style crumb cake w/ coffee. I wonder, if MILK were substituted, how many of what we chose for coffee would also be on your milk list ?

AFTER the bread comes out and is cooled, how do you keep it tasting good for a few days ? I keep mine on a wood cutting board with a microwave dome cover with holes, on top. My loafs usually last 3-5 days and are in pretty good shape throughout. Meaning crusty, fresh tasting which I think if refrigerated or kept sealed in plastic they would not be. How do you keep yours and not worry about bugs?

3 days ago made Authentic Pumpernickel from RLB's Bread Bible. I've posted about it up topic before. Added KAF's Deli Rye Flavor in the sponge and it made it better tasting which I did not think possible. Great after-taste. Today I made Classic Irish Soda Bread from CI. It tasted like a big biscuit. On its own, eh. But with butter or sweet mustard and the corned beef I made today...yummy

Gosh Jim, when you said DIY, I thought you meant design it yourself and have someone else, the contractor, do the work.

I know this is article is a bit dated, however, I cook with the #2 best from the article, Lurpak, since the winner is not available around here. I buy the #1 overall winner, which is surprisingly a butter made in CA and its sold here for 3.49 for 1/2 a pound, for spreading. This is a website with good info about butter but I have not had time to go thru it. I'd like to know what is considered, as close to today as possible, as above article is 3-4 years old: The best to bake with and best tasting on its own ?

Beautiful. The respective flavors seem to leap out of each.

I made Chinese style roasted duck yesterday. I followed instructions. Two hours in, I thought, I wonder what temp the breast should be; probably like chicken ? I web searched, saw anywhere between 128-138.....Aghast, I took mine out of the oven for good and let it sit. After the last basting I did, 5 minutes before, I decided to check and the temp was at 173 First duck I ever made, my family are very picky eaters, my 6 year old does NOT eat food which have names of living things he knows. At dinner time, we all ate every single piece of meat possible and the 6 year old whinning for more, we had to promise him I would make two, one for him and one for the rest of us, the next time. I don't own JC's TAOFC and do not intend to buy it. I am 90% sure, I like Italian food better than French

Not sure even if it is here in Hawaii but will be taking a look tomorrow. Check your Safeway's too. KAF: AP, Bread, Whole Wheat and White Whole Wheat all on sale today (and until April 6th accoring to the shelf tag) for $3.99/ 5# bag, regular price $5.99.

Roast it I did Blether. After reading ScoopKW's recipe, I tried to sell it for 1/2 price, no takers. No way could I do that recipe or have the space or spouse to allow me too. Lucky for me Ohba came to my rescue and sent me a easy Chinese roast duck recipe. I did not have enough honey, so I subbed hoisin for some and I am very pleased. Thank you very much Ohba ! There are a few parts missing as you may be able to tell With the rest, I will take the skin off, fry it till more crispy and then put it back on or next to the meat and eat. I learned that trick here about frying chicken skin, it should work for the duck too. I also have some very nice rendered fat, about 6 oz. very clear and about as much with some of the sauce I used to cook the duck. I'll try skimming the top as much as I can, once the liquid has cooled. And I am saving every bone & cartilage piece to make stock.

Just found this about KAF's road trip to visit the farmers that grow their goods. Its very interesting and convinces me that the name brand for me remains KAF whenever possible. If I needed a speciality flour or had to buy something in a pinch, I would go for name brand, Bob's Red Mill probably, every time. Kansas Wheat Tour