Curlz

I was JUST about to ask if wfnugent gets free grilled cheese and shakes for life, Glenn!!! Congrats. Great name--can't wait to try the goods!

This is more for other folks looking for Flanken than it is for Markk b/c he (now) has options closer to home, but today I remembered that there's an excellent Jewish deli on Ryders Lane in E. Brunswick (maybe it's officially Milltown)...if I can come up with the name, I'll edit the post, but I know it's in a small strip mall all of a mile or so off of Route 1.

Jason-- Is that the one near Binh Duong? If so, that explains the fish smell in the parking lot!!

EXCELLENT recommendation, Markk!!!

Um...my house? Other than that, I think Tommy recently mentioned a place in Bergen County... Joels' Malibu in Ridgewood. He specifically mentioned the soup--perhaps he'll elaborate.

Closer to you is the one in the same shopping center as Binh Duong, the Vietnamese restaurant that Jason mentioned in your other thread...I've never shopped there, but know someone who did on a regular basis when she lived in Bloomfield. Sounds to me like you need to head to BD for dinner and then shop!

Okay, now I'm officially confused, Rosie! Didn't YOU ask for suggestions? In ESSEX County?

The Newark Museum has a beautiful outdoor space that can handle hundreds--it's billed as their sculpture garden. Even better, they have indoor space if the weather becomes an issue. PM me if you want some personal contacts there! Edit: Substantial parking, unquestionably safe, and for those who haven't been there, a really terrific museum!!

Markk, I may be wrong, but I thought I'd heard that EE closed; hopefully I'm wrong! The RD is really good too--for 'regular' diner food as well as everything else! And they make pretty yummy apple pie, too... And don't be astounded--that's the beauty of eG! Ask a question and we're all going to throw you the info you need. Edit: Livingston Bagel: 973-994-1915 Hours: Mon-Sat 6am-6:30pm, Sun 6am-3pm. That info is according to their bag, b/c I picked up a chopped salad there this morning for lunch today! Just a big DUH that it didn't occur to me to look for flanken--I was a tad preoccupied--sorry! And now I'm off to enjoy lunch...

Markk, Glad you've got solid answers already! I can't remember where you live, but there are also a couple of places in Livingston that I'm sure have flanken. Livingston Bagel (a full deli), what used to be Eppes Essen on Mt Pleasant Ave/Rt 10 and/or the Ritz Diner--which is right across from the EE location. I'd call first to be sure, but I'm positive that at least one of them will have it as well.

Can't tell you how much I love this post!!! I promise to reflect on my own sins and post tomorrow... Thanks for making me smile before I log off!

Dimsum, thanks for starting this thread. I suspect that there are more than a few NJ folks who considered doing so, but have hesitated for a variety of reasons. My most recently deleted post on the topic was put up so I could share a portion of today's Ask Tom chat from the Washington Post. Ask Tom is hosted by Tom Sietsema, the WP's Food Critic, and his chat is where I first heard about eGullet. Since it was SO relevant to the discussion we had been having in NJ, I quoted his first response of the day, which was from a reader who questioned the value of negative posts about restaurants in D.C. in this public forum. Tom Sietsema: Good morning, and thanks for your comments. If you look over the chats in the archives, I think you'll find a diverse mix of topics from week to week, some of which deal with readers' restaurant experiences. I post both positive and negative comments, and I'm more than willing to air concerns or responses from restaurateurs (and have, in the past). A lot of "the trade" follows this weekly conversation, and changes (for the better) often result from problems that get publicized here. You and I agree: most of the people in this business work hard and their jobs are not always easy. But ignoring anything negative would be counter-productive and less than honest. The full chat is here. In my mind, it seems that Sietsema has hit upon the very thing I've loved (so far) about eGullet; it's a place to post our 'reviews' and thoughts about local restaurants, the food industry, food in the media, recipes, etc. Positive AND (sometimes) negative posts, that is. And it's obvious that even in NJ, members of "the trade" are reading--and sometimes, responding. I still say that if we want good restaurants (and other businesses, for that matter) to thrive where we live, work and play, we have to participate in the process. No, I don't expect us to be consultants who pay to have bad experiences and then teach the restaurant owners how to fix their problems. But as Katie has stated in numerous ways, sometimes there are bad nights, sometimes there are issues too big to be fixed by anyone, and sometimes there are actually people running businesses (restaurants and non-) who will actually want to hear what their customers have to say and try to improve themselves. I'm going to jump off the soap box now. Oh, but while I'm up here, one more thing...don't forget to vote on election day.

What a shame! Having been to both KK and IOTH, I've only been to KK once, but continue to stick with IOTH. Perhaps it's just too much for them to juggle in one town.

DITTO.

I've decided to put up this post because I think it's relevant to eG and in particular, to our recent discussion about Rocca. I'm hoping the powers that be will allow this to remain, but I'm also saying up front that I'm not looking to start a whole other discussion here; I may put this up on the General Food Topics page if it seems of interest. In today's Wash Post Dining Chat (which is where I discovered eG, by the way), Tom Sietsema responds to a comment about the pros/cons of posts about bad experiences in restaurants with the following: Tom Sietsema: Good morning, and thanks for your comments. If you look over the chats in the archives, I think you'll find a diverse mix of topics from week to week, some of which deal with readers' restaurant experiences. I post both positive and negative comments, and I'm more than willing to air concerns or responses from restaurateurs (and have, in the past). A lot of "the trade" follows this weekly conversation, and changes (for the better) often result from problems that get publicized here. You and I agree: most of the people in this business work hard and their jobs are not always easy. But ignoring anything negative would be counter-productive and less than honest. Personally, I think he sums up a lot of what many of us were trying to say VERY well! If you are interested in the full chat, the response was to the first question here.

Yes, in a pear! Here's their site: Nasto's

I'd also suggest that you give An American Grill another shot; I can't make any comparisons to what it used to be like, but I think the restaurant is terrific NOW.

So let me get this straight... AND TOMMY WAS THERE TOO?!? Is there something we should know?? I am SO there for this dish, Lou. Can't wait!! And one day I'll understand this double quoting thing, 'cause I obviously messed it up this time!

Agreed...the spaces--both indoor and outdoor--are lovely. Rumor in Hoboken is that they spent $1 million to renovate the place. I didn't post a full review, but somewhere in the Sunday Dinner thread, I said: Further details: it was a weeknight, we weren't starving, but both my mom and I found the menu items less than thrilling. Mom ended up with onion soup that she said was good, but nothing mindblowing, and we both had the frisee salad with onion tart. The 'tart' was a strip about 2 inches long, and it was fine, but nothing incredible. I then had a calamari dish that was also fine. In general, I'm not a huge fan of French food, but from what I've read, one is better off at Epernay in Montclair! It certainly sounds like their menu is more interesting. Now, then...if someone would instruct me on the use of the Quote + feature, my head might spin just a tad slower. Edit: I do find it amusing that the block between 10th and 11th on Washington Street is framed by Maxwell's and the Elysian Cafe; talk about different ends of the spectrum!!! Hey, Tommy--maybe Maxwell's is where you should go tonight!?!

Have to be honest...I don't know that the bar at Elysian Cafe is Tommy's style. Maybe for dinner with the Mrs., but I suspect it's too subdued for Tommy solo!

That's because you're SO difficult. I'm meeting a friend and her 9 month old daughter at Short Hills Mall...think of the thrilling dinner choices WE'LL have! Honestly, I think you should wait 'til tomorrow night and I'll join you. But you'll still have to come up with the place!!

What/where is Joel's???

I guess the one thing I forgot to say in my last post was that it's obvious that you have no reason to return to Rocca, Markk; having read of your experience, I don't blame you one bit, nor would I try to convince you otherwise. I say here's to many ENJOYABLE meals for you at other restaurants!! For those who haven't been there, though, I still say it's worth a try--but that's based on my experience. In terms of Mr. Levy, I'm not defending him nor do I know him, but here's what I see...a guy who hasn't ever posted on eG before, whose personality we don't know, and who feels he has to defend his livelihood publicly since you posted about your experience publicly--which I still agree was okay for you to do! Everyone has a different style; it seems that Lou wants to hear what people think of An American Grill whether it's positive or negative, but I'm sure there are just as many restaurateurs who prefer to handle these issues one-on-one. Perhaps Mr. Levy would have been better served all around if he had PM'd you and then posted a more general response on the board. And perhaps he has reamed out his staff and they'll all be far better from here on out because of your post! We may or may not know. I will say that we've all posted things here we later edited or removed or just wished that we hadn't. Curlz P.S. Rosie, I hadn't seen your last post b/c I was in the midst of writing; I respect the fact that you're the moderator here, but I think this discussion still belongs in NJ as long as the topic is Rocca, good or bad. There are enough of us who have been there to warrant having the conversation! Why is this different from the conversation that was started about Trattoria Fresco? There were good experiences galore, now there's been a fender bender, and people want to discuss it! Just my opinion.

Uhboy. I wasn't going to get in this mix, yet here I am. I want to preface my response to Markk's questions by saying a few things...the first is, I've never worked in a restaurant--I've only seen that world as a customer and through the eyes of friends who have worked as wait staff in upscale places in NYC and moderately-priced restaurants in northern NJ. Secondly, I agree with Tommy--and if I could figure out the double quoting thing, I'd use it here--I wouldn't let Markk's bad experience prevent me from trying a place and forming my own opinion--precisely b/c the experiences posted on eG prior to his were so great. Finally, I'll tell you that my one trip to Rocca was terrific (both food and service), and having read all of the reviews prior to getting there myself and having had that experience, my mouth was agape as I read Markk's post. And again as I read the post from Mr. Levy. The reason I didn't want to get in to the conversation is that I genuinely see errors on both the customer and the management side of things. All that said, I'd like to respond to Markk's question. If I receive mediocre food or service in a restaurant that I expect to be mediocre (let's just use a diner as an example), I feel that it is what it is--yet I'll still speak up if I feel strongly about something—and most certainly, if I find the food to be inedible. Why should I pay for something I find inedible? And why shouldn’t I give them a chance to remedy the problem? Of course, my displeasure is reflected in the tip and in my decision about returning to the scene of the crime when requiring a mediocre meal in the future. I don't think Rocca qualifies as mediocre, though. In a restaurant like Rocca, yes--I would expect the wait staff to notice that something was wrong, but if they didn't (a management issue if they’re not trained properly, a personal/personnel issue if they choose not to give good service in a SERVICE industry), I'd insist that whomever had the problem entree say something, and if the waiter didn’t/couldn’t handle it, I would ask to speak to someone else. Perhaps I’m too bi-partisan here, but I feel like we’re demanding of restaurants (and we on eG probably all the more so), yet I wonder how we can expect to get what we want without speaking up when it’s not executed well? Markk, you ask “Do you feel that you have a responsibility for this, or do you simply pay your bill, leave, and take the decision never to return?” My baseline answer is yes, if we want decent restaurants to exist, grow and succeed where we live, play and eat, we do have to participate as customers! Do we bear the full responsibility? Of course not. And of course I think the first line of all of this should come from the restaurant’s end—but if it doesn’t, I think we all owe it to ourselves and the restaurant to say something. As you said, you are paying for the service and the food—and I’m SO about customer service—don’t get me started on that as a universal topic. But when customers of any business don’t speak up when there’s a problem, how can the business know? Sure, the wait staff and/or the kitchen should have spotted the issue—but they obviously didn’t, or didn’t choose to address it. At that point, I think it’s up to you as the customer to say something. If you go to Target and buy a defective tv, do you return it? Do you tell them why? Do you expect to get your money back or at least a replacement? My assumption is yes. So why is that easier? Is it because you’re not face-to-face with a human being who ‘manufactured’ the item? Please don’t misread my tone here—I’m not trying to instigate more of a controversy on the topic—I’m really just posing the questions. I suspect that it’s easier to speak up when the item being purchased isn’t such a subjective one (i.e., the food is too salty). I don’t pretend to think that I have all the answers—just decided to add my $ .02 to the pot.

LOL!! I believe the scientific name is swimus poopus fishus.