Tonyfinch

Cappers,Gaby's is next to the theatre(The Wyndham's I think) which is next to Leicester Sq. tube on the Covent Gdn. side of Charing Cross Rd. It has been there for donkeys years,is(or was) run by Israelis and used to be called Gaby's Continental Restaurant.Several years ago it had a makeover and dropped the 'continental' bit,but it still serves mostly mid-eastern staples (falaafel in pitta,stuffed aubergine, kebebs with tahini etc.) along with hot salt beef and latkes(I'm not sure if they serve hot tongue). The food in general is very ordinary there but I was truly impressed by the salt beef on my last visit and its not an expensive place,given the location. Steve -OY GEVALT! You mean you don't have fried gefilte fish balls and patties in NYC?? I can't believe it. Do you mean you only have those grey boiled lumps? We'll have to have both a salt beef AND a gefilte fish tasting. We can do it at my flat in Wapping but it'll take a bit of organising as I'll have to call in samples from Jewish London. Let me know if you're serious and we can get an e-gullet group together and I'll invite the Jewish Chronicle.

In the interests of research had salt beef sandwiches from the Brick Lane Beigel Bake (my nearest) this evening. Had a sandwich rather than a beigel as I find the beigels too heavy and chewy for salt beef. The salt beef was moist and served in great chunks and there was plenty of it and it was cheap (£2.20 a sandwich). However it was too salty- a sign that corners were being cut in terms of soaking and cooking-maybe not surprising in terms of the incredible turn over there,. Salt beef should not actually be salty but,like salt cod,the salt should impart a rich and savoury underpinning to the final product.In this case I felt my blood pressure soaring as I was eating and I've already downed three pints of water since. I just thought-a salt beef and hot tongue sandwich stand at Borough Market would go down a treat. Anyone interested in going into business?

Last time I went to Borough Market-about 2 months ago-Stefano Cavallini,he of the Halkin fame, was there cooking pasta and sauces and promoting his book and other products.Has he gone into the wholesale business or something? I had the best Italian meal I've ever had in London at his restaurant a couple of years ago. I find the chorizo sausages John refers to a bit greasy for my taste, but there's another chap cooking delicious Caribbean specialities and another serving an amazingly restorative fish soup.

The best cooked meat at Borough market are the venison burgers cooked by the guy from the farmed venison company(forget name). The venison is also delicious to cook at home.

I've not eaten at The Fat Duck and it may well be wonderful but reading the menu above the dishes strike me as sailing very close to the parodies featured in the restaurant in Mike Leigh's film "Life is Sweet"-you know, Liver in Lager and Duck in Chocolate Sauce,and so on I am also highly sceptical of all that pseudo-scientific and quasi-philosophical guff which purports to lie behind these combinations and ,in contrast to LML, the phrase "too clever by half" springs reflexively to my mind when seeing them. Is this REALLY "cutting edge" cuisine or is it pretentious nonsense for the terminally jaded?

Michael,if the dishes recounted by Cabrales are not "clever" than maybe you can explain your definition of the word.

Jon,the best salt beef in (far) North London is to be found at the B&K Salt Beef Bar in Edgware.They also make the best fried gefilte fish balls I know. If that's too remote good salt beef can be found at Harry Morgan's in St. John's Wood,though you have to ask them specifically to serve it with the fat.They also do decent hot tongue-a delicious Jewish speciality that's becoming even rarer than good salt beef. The salt beef served at the famous Brick Lane Beigel Bake is of poor quality and ,I've always found the salt beef at both Reuben's and Bloom's in Golders Green to be on the dry side.

Opposite The Crown on Cricklewood Broadway is Kebap 49. From the outside this looks like an ordinary take away.Go through to the restaurant and you will be served with a delicious Turkish meal,including wonderful stuffed aubergines and vine leaves,herby salads,Turkish pizzas and Kebabs and fresh breads straight out of the oven.Finish with home made Turkish Delight and coffee and you have the best meal in Cricklewood for a bargain price.

Just to add,Cabrales brackets Petrus quality wise with Embassy,but the latter is much cheaper.Leaving aside the caviar,the average price of a 3 course meal at Embassy is around £34 (and that includes the more expensive lobster mains) compared to £55 at Petrus (£60-70 for the tasting menu). This is a significant difference and I reiterate that I think Embassy is one of the best value for money restaurants of its type in London right now and that a lot of the criticism (the flash,clubby clientele,too many greeters etc.) seems to me to be just carping.

Blimey,Cabrales. Your dedication to the cause is truly admirable.

Easily the best salt beef in the West End is served at Gabys near Leicester Sq. on Charing Cross Rd. Hot,moist,pure brisket(silverside is heretical) and,most importantly,a good ratio of FAT. People who ask for salt beef without fat are completely missing the point. And if you're going to have a salt beef sandwich the bread must be caraway and the mustard must be English. Dogmatic,moi?

The film "La Grande Bouffe" was known as "Blow-Out" in the Uk and was made in 1973. It was influenced by De Sade's "120 Days of Sodom" and involves 4 guys who meet up in a country house in order to eat themselves to death. European films in the 60s&70s by left wing film makers,such as Bunuel and Pasolini, often used food as a metaphor for the excessive consumption of the Bourgeoisie, and treated the process of eating and drinking with ironic disgust.The British film "The Cook The Thief His Wife and Her Lover" continue this tradition. Eastern influenced food films such as "Tampopo" and "Eat Drink Man Woman" stress the unifying and harmonising power of food,as doesthe sweet(in the best sense of the word) film "Big Night". Food used to be a political issue in films. Is it now?

You,re right. Sounds like what you need are places which help YOU crap.

That's what eating bathcaps does for you

Simon,what is it about Le Flaneur that you hate so much?

They wouldn't have used butter today. They'd have used Flora

Cabrales Viet Hoa-70,Kingsland Rd.Walk up Kingsland Rd from Shoreditch and its on the right hand side. 020 7 729 8293

Stellabella. When you arrive in London on July 3rd give me a ring and we'll arrange for you to come over for a meal. Phone me on 7 790 5170-my work no.Look forward to hearing from you .

I don,t know about anyone else but that's a menu that makes my mouth water and ,caviar apart,cannot be said to be too expensive for a high quality restaurant in Central London. eg. both lobster dishes are £24.95 whereas when I ate at Green's recently the lobster dish on the menu was £37,similar at J.Sheekeys. I think embassy is underrated at the moment

I was mesmerised by the cooking scenes in "Eat Drink Man Woman" and came out desparate for a plane to fly me to Hong Kong to eat-so I settled for Fung Shing in Soho instead. Babette's Feast is an interesting meditation on the unifying power of food but is a little too arty and aesthetic to really work as Food Porn-maybe Food Erotica instead-more intellectual but not half as much fun. Hitchcock's Frenzy has a running theme whereby the policeman's wife is doing a Cordon Bleu course and is always serving him up "fancy" French food when all he's dreaming of is a plate of Bangers and Mash.

Stellabella. My wife and I are flying to Atalanta on July 22nd arriving about 2pm. We'll be back in Atlanta for the flight home on Aug 9th. When are you coming to London?

Rick Stein seems like a decent enough chap and I respect his enthusiasm for and commitment to fish and seafood. However surely those prices reflect his status as a celebrity chef and show more than anything that to really get ahead of the game,a talent for self publicity and keeping yourself in the public eye is all important. At least Stein and Gary Rhodes do it via their passion for food,rather than throwing temper tantrums ,chucking people out of their establishments,bullying hapless underlings or branding plongeurs with brulee caremelizers(or whatever). However were I to go to Padstow I would not eat at Stein's because I sense it must have already succumbed to the pressure to move into the realm of tourist trap which inevitably results from such unrelenting demand. I agree with Adam and I'd spend my time(and money) at Basildog's place.

The Viet Hoa does another soup (not called Pho,I think its called Can Hua,or something) which you can order in two sizes and with fish or chicken or beef (fish is best) It comes packed with okra, onion cherry tomatoes,chunks of pineapple and is suffused with chili and lemongrass and is the best hangover cure I know in NE london. Other local favourites are New Tayyab,where I normally eat at least twice a week-try their sizzling grilled foods and thick,unctious dahls-Il Bordello for basic Italian(reliable but not exciting),the |Butler's Wharf Chop house BAR(not the main restaurant) , Pellicci's Caff on Bethnal Green Rd for a fry up and Faulkner's in Dalston for fish and chips.

I think there is a difference between Britain and the USA on this. There is no critic in Britain who wields anything like the power of some of their American counterparts.We discussed at length some aspects of this over on the Robert Parker wine thread.Americans,in general,are far more inclined to see the critic as guru and to "follow" critics in a way that Brits are far too sceptical to do.

Hope we can meet up Stellabella. I'm still open to recs for our trip to the Deep South in the Sunmmer (see Gulf Coast and Blues Trail on Southern USA board).