Squeat Mungry

Yeah, that Stephen Jay Gould couldn't write worth a whit.

Wow again, marlena! We may disagree about Chez Spencer (and I'm truly sorry to hear you had a bad experience there), but we're definitely on the same page re: the Nut Tree. Some of my fondest memories! I do miss it. Cheers, Squeat

Thanks so much! Can't wait to make my first batch. I know already this will become a new staple at my house. Thanks again, Squeat

Begging has worked for me in the past, so I will add my voice. PLEASE post this recipe! Cheers, Squeat

hmmm, I don't think it was that place. The place in question had a name that was more "square" than the Persian aub Zam Zam, lol. The Persian sounds interesting, though. Does it still exist? I'll have to stop in there for a martini next time I go to SF if it's still there. Well, yes and no. The bar itself is still there, but the main attraction (the old proprietor/bartender) is gone. He was known for throwing people out if they ordered a drink he disapproved of, looked at him sideways, or simply did not meet with his (entirely arbitrary) approval. He never seemed to have a problem with me, though. It's on Haight street near the park if you want to check it out, but be forewarned that it cannot be described without using the word "dive". I'm still trying to think where you might mean, but am coming up blank. When I want a well-made martini, I usually make it myself, but there is an excellent neighborhood bar near my house that specializes in classic cocktails, and they do a great job. It's called the Orbit Room and is on Market at Laguna. Cheers, Squeat

Isn't there some old bar in SF that was rated to make the best martini in America? I read about it some years ago but can't remember the name. Anyone else know this place? I think you must (or at least may) be referring to the venerable Persian aub Zam Zam itself, as renowned for its eccentric proprietor/bartender as for its fabulous martinis. That guy was a real character, and stories abound, but he knew a "perfect martini" calls for equal parts sweet and dry vermouth.

Yes, in the end, you have to come here to really experience San Francisco sourdough. Our yeasties just don't like it anywhere else! Here's an informative article with some insight into Acme: http://www.mv-voice.com/morgue/2003/2003_0..._28.dining.html Cheers, Squeat

Again, what DrinkBoy said. I'll point out that Bunuel's (or whoever's) martini is my favorite martini recipe, not my favorite martini. I love it because it is sublime, surreal, and it plays up that (in my opinion as well) misguided quest for the "dryest" martini imaginable. Also, I apologize for "talking down" when I said "martini glass". It is indeed a cocktail glass. When I'm ordering or mixing, I do prefer to have enough vermouth to work the magic with the gin. What would make me happiest of all would be to be able to walk into a neighborhood bar, a hotel bar, or even a nightclub and order a "perfect martini" and get one served correctly. I have a feeling DrinkBoy could honor this request. Used to be the case in San Francisco at the Persian aub Zam Zam, but those days are long gone. Maybe I'll make a mission out of this and check out the hotel bars (probably most likely) or Buena Vista or Cliff House. If I find it, I'll report. For ordering drinks the bartender does know how to make, I have to admit I've jumped on the "dirty" bandwagon once or twice.

I suppose it is time for me to submit my favorite martini recipe, attributed (as I heard it) to Luis Bunuel. 1. The night before, gather the following and place them in the freezer: Gin, vermouth, martini glass. 2. Just before dawn, arise and pour the gin into the glass. Position the bottle of vermouth so that the first rays of the rising sun will penetrate the vermouth bottle and strike the gin in the glass. 3. Garnish with olive if desired. Enjoy. Cheers, Squeat

For the record, I don't think of Bayless as a "horrible person", either. Just deeply disappointed in his decision to make this endorsement vis a vis his role as overseer at CC and his reputation as a supporter of local sustainable agriculture, etc., as I have explained. In fact, though I have never eaten at his restaurants, I have enjoyed his shows on PBS. Squeat

I assume that the reason our Northern California Albertson's and Safeways are not on strike is that there is a different union involved? At least I don't think they're on strike? I don't shop at either, so I'm not sure, but I do live directly across the street from Safeway, and didn't notice anything... anybody in NoCal have details? Thanks, Squeat

I noticed that the Vettel article did not mention Bayless' connection to the Chef's Collaborative. Poking around under "What's New" at the CC site this morning however, I did find this letter, dated Friday: http://www.chefscollaborative.org/index.ph...news&news_id=14 The spin begins! Cheers, Squeat

I have to say I enjoyed the term "Bayless-class". - Fat Guy

Not sure, but I did see another BK ad today from the same campaign, and in it a honey-djion (I think) chicken sandwich was being touted by one Rachael Ray... =R= I think this must be the same one I saw, though I missed the very beginning (where I assume they showed her name), but I wouldn't know Ray from Adam (...er?) to look at, though I have heard her name. Hopefully she has not spent years campaigning for sustainable agriculture and local artisanship? Edited to replace a word with one I didn't make up.

Maybe you could apply for a Rick Bayless Scholarship? This made me laugh very hard. [Host's note: To minimise the load on our servers, this topic has been split. The discussion continues here.]

Thanks everyone for all the good wishes! I will definitely keep eGullet posted with developments as I make this move. For the record, even though I don't patronize fast food restaurants, I don't judge those who do, nor those who work for the corporations that run them. That said, when I'm in a bigger-picture, Fast-Food-Nation sort of mood, I do feel a bit sorry for both groups, which I suppose makes me smug... but what the hell, I've already outed myself as a hypocrite. Anyway, thanks again. Cheers, Squeat PS Does anyone think BK may have pulled this ad? A couple of days ago I realized I had never seen it. I've been watching as much tv as I can handle since then, but still haven't seen it, though I have seen one that must be part of the same campaign.

I think this thread may be dead, in the sense that most of what there is to be said on the subject has probably been said until there are further developments. (It has been damned entertaining, though -- I can't remember when I've laughed so hard.) However, I would like to offer a little post-mortem, if only because the thread itself has helped me to learn something about myself. I began to think about why I reacted so strongly to the news of Bayless' endorsement compared to others who posted, quite sensibly, "what-else-is-new -- get-over-it" types of opinions. The more I thought about it, in fact, the more I began to feel a bitter irony in the fact that I was, indeed, a pot calling the kettle black. I have made compromises in my life, and adjusted my own justifications for my behavior more than once in the past. Indeed at the moment I work in litigation, something I swore to myself 20 years ago (upon reading Dickens' Bleak House) I would never do. (Yes, I have always been an idealist and have the scars to prove it. I have nothing against lawyers, however, today.) So really the height I piss on Bayless from is not all that great, although he is the one with the big check. But I am a very small pot, and Bayless is a very large kettle, at least to me. And I think I have figured out why. It does indeed have to do with context. The context of my own life. I am the product of two very old southern families (North Carolina). Southern traditions were very strong in my family, even though I grew up all over the country (my father was a Coast Guard officer), and spent my adolescence in Europe (Holland) and the San Francisco Bay Area, which has become my home. My mother was no Alice Waters, but she was a sensible woman with a strong sense of tradition, and we were raised on fresh food simply prepared, and learned to respect and value both the taste and the nourishing qualities of our food. We were never fed fast food, unless the circumstances were just right -- circumstances which my sister and I learned to recognize and act upon: namely, be on a road trip (there were many) when there is no (then still Pepin-quality) Howard Johnson's in the vicinity. Then, simply introduce just the right amount of nonstop begging. The last time I was in a fast-food chain restaurant was in 1996, when I decided to see whether McDonald's french fries still matched up to the rare cherished memories of my childhood. (They did not, though they still smelled great.) The point, if I have one, is that my family background combined with awakening to adult life in the Bay Area during the time of Waters, etc. to make me really believe that the quality of food is important to the quality of life. I came to see people like Waters, Tower, etc. as representing a kind of philosophy not only of food, but of living well. It is as ronnie_suburban suspects: I am more diehard about the subject, and therefore more deeply disappointed in Bayless. Unlike Fat Guy, whose opinions as expressed in this thread seem to match my own most closely, I DO subscribe to the stated principles of the Chef's Collaborative, and I will feel badly if their mission is compromised by Bayless' action. And (here's the happy ending) this entire thread has been most useful to me in clenching a decision I have been in the process of making, which is to get the hell out of making myself unhappy as a drone in a litigation support firm, and get the hell into making myself happy by making others happy with high-quality food. I'm not sure where exactly this is going to take me (I can't afford full-time culinary school), but I'm excited about it. Call it a step in the right direction. So, I guess, thanks Rick Bayless! And, I'm sure, thanks eGullet!

Actually, this is more or less the point I was trying to make above. It may not be "important" that this was a hypocritical act (see definition #2 above). But it was. Is it important to you? Apparently not. To Bayless? Time will tell. To me? Yes, to the idealistic idiot who still lives within me. To CC? Damn straight, IMO. Cheers, Squeat Edited for trying to spell on only one cup of coffee.

What DrinkBoy said.

Or we can point to his hypocrisy, hold him accountable for it, and take the position that a serious chef shouldn't endorse crap. It's so easy to haul out the tired old reductionist witch-hunt metaphor anytime anybody accuses somebody else of doing something wrong. But sometimes people do the wrong thing, and pointing it out isn't a witch hunt anymore than any other challenge to a wrong idea or action. Taking a position on an issue of principle and aesthetics is hardly tantamount to searching out and harassing dissenters. Rick Bayless made this choice, he has been well paid, he hardly deserves a pass. Particularly in the case of the Chefs Collaborative people, he has blind-sided them and forced action on their parts -- yet they are taking the time to make a reasoned judgment; hardly a witch hunt. And he certainly doesn't deserve that pass now that he has compounded his poor judgment with disingenuous propaganda that removes any remaining doubt as to his hypocrite-sellout status. Amen, Fat Guy! Hypocrisy is the issue, and hypocrisy is what it is. When I brought this subject up on a local food forum, I was quickly poo-pooed for "crucifying" Bayless. (And I live in Northern California, arguably the birthplace of the kinds of values represented by the Chef's Collaborative!) But I went to American Heritage, and this is what I found: "1. The practice of professing beliefs, feelings, or virtues that one does not hold or possess; falseness. 2. An act or instance of such falseness." So, to what current developments does this apply? Tony Bourdain doing Food TV? No way. (Props, dude! and double props for joining in this forum!) Um, an administration that speaks of nothing but freedom while systematically stripping away civil rights and lying about reasons to invade foreign countries? I think so. Let's see...an overseer of an institution devoted to sustainable local agriculture and healthily produced food shilling for a corporation whose only consideration of food is as a medium for putting money in its coffers? Yes, I think so too. Shame on Bayless. I only hope he hasn't completely destroyed Chef's Collaborative's effectiveness. Cheers, Squeat

I spent much of my "growing up" time in my family's home state of North Carolina, and I can attest to this. There's even a kids' song called "Way Down Yonder in the Paw-Paw Patch". The heroine is one Susie, and that is where she is, "pickin' up paw-paws and puttin' 'em in her pocket." Later in the song it is revealed that -- incredibly -- Susie is "a queen of old Hawaii" and that "she can teach you how to hula." In our family, they were used similarly to bananas. Cheers, Squeat

Thanks for the report, girl chow. You hit three of my favorites. Too bad you had to rush through Delfina... a leisurely dinner there is a wonderful experience. Isn't Acme a revelation? I agree with Gary, you should pressure your local Costco to carry it.

Okay, 4 more for me: Nancy Zaslavsky's A Cook's Tour of Mexico Pepin's Complete Techniques Paula Peck's The Art of Fine Baking Paula Wolfert's Mediterranean Cooking Oh wait. 2 more (for re-upping with local PBS station): Here in America's Test Kitchen and 365 Quick Tips from them as well.

tryska, loco moco is a Hawaiian dish consisting of sticky lumps of rice, topped with two hamburger patties, topped with a fried egg, topped with greasy brown gravy... and I'm not kidding! Usually served with aforementioned macaroni salad. Go figure. Squeat

I don't get loco moco, and I REALLY don't get macaroni salad! SuzanneF, I assume you mean NYNY, since I can vouch that Buffalo, Syracuse and Rochester are very much a part of America. Cheers, Squeat