Q&A: Homebrewing

[FoodMan]

Thanks for the recipe Michael (we'll call it "Tongo's British Porter"). I will certainly use it. The only difference in my setup is that there is no way I can do a full boil. The most I can boil is 3.5 gallons. The rest will have to be added in the fermentor.

Thanks again.

[TongoRad]

Thanks- I hope you like it! (If you want to add smoked malt as well it definitely works with this recipe.)

Now that I have a better understanding of your setup I will make some revisions to the recipe. I'll post back with the details later.

[TongoRad]

OK- I'm back. Here are the changes for a 3.5 gal. boil.

Mash the following as above:

1 lb. Pale Ale Malt

2 lb. Munich Malt

1 1/2 lb. Crystal Malt 80L

12 oz. Chocolate Malt

with 6.5 qts. heated water.

Sparge with 9-10 qts until you get close to your limit.

Add 5 lbs Light DME to the runoff.

And, since this is a concentrated boil your hop utilization will be low, so up the AAU's to 22 to compensate. This is designed to be topped off to 5 gallons at the end.

Otherwise it is the same.

[FoodMan]

so up the AAU's to 22 to compensate

Thanks again Michael, but how exactly do I do that? Use more hops or boil them a bit longer?

[TongoRad]

Sorry- I should have been more explicit. AAU (or Alpha Acid Unit) represents the alpha acids content of your hops multiplied by the number of ounces. If you had those Northern Brewers at 7% alpha acid, then buying 3 ounces would give you 21 AAU's, and in that case I wouldn't sweat the numbers trying to come up with 22 AAU. It's just hard to predict what the alpha acid will be for the hops at your local shop- they usually are within a certain range- so AAU's are used to give the recipe a bit more precision. Just divide 22 by whatever the alpha acid that you find in your hops to get the amount of ounces to add. In this case add them all at the top of the boil.

FWIW- AAU's ( another term used is HBU's) are a measure of what you put into the beer, where IBU's are a measure of what is in the final product. This calculation is directly proportunal to what is referred to as 'utilization', which is an estimate of how well the hop oils are being isomerized (= more bitterness). The long and short of it is that the longer you boil your hops, the higher the utilization- so those 22 AAU's added mid boil will give you lower IBU's than if added at the top of the boil . Also- higher gravities of the boil will lower the utilization rate, which is why I increased the amount of hops because you will eventually be diluting the wort.

[FoodMan]

Makes sense Michael. Just to be sure the change from 3 to 5 lbs of DME between the two recipes is intentional, correct? Is it meant to boost the gravity more?

Thanks again.

Also for reference, here is the final recipe for a 3.5 gallon boil in one place:

Tongo’s British Porter

Recipe yields 5 gallons from a 3.5 gal. boil.

In the mash tun:

1 lb. Pale Ale Malt

2 lb. Munich Malt

1 1/2 lb. Crystal Malt 80L

12 oz. Chocolate Malt

6.5 qts. heated water.

Mash for 90 min. at 152F (I'd recommend doing a mash-out before sparging. Somehow- either by removing some of the mash, bringing it to a boil and returning it, or by just adding some additional boiling water- get the mash up to 168F for 10 minutes. It stops the enzymes from converting and makes things flow better). I'm assuming 1.027 per pound per gallon, or 77% efficiency, fwiw.

Sparge with 9-10 qts at 168F until you get close to your limit

Add 5 lbs Light DME to the runoff.

Hop additions

About 2.75 oz. Northern Brewer @ 8% (or 20 AAU (2.5*8)) - for 60 min. (You need as close to 22 AAU as possible, so if alpha acid content is less than 8% buy more)

Add 1 1/2 oz. East Kent Goldings at flameout.

[TongoRad]

You got it, Elie!

Yeah- the 5 lbs. of DME is intentional. I removed 3 lbs. of Pale Ale Malt due to the fact that you weren't able to sparge with the full 1/2 gallon per pound. Those frementables had to be made up for, and since you were using DME anyway it just made more sense to do it that way.

FWIW- I figured an even lower efficiency this time as well, but who knows- you might get lucky. The partial mash here is more for flavor than fermentables, though we do want those as well.

If you do the mash-out just make sure to keep it as close to 168F as possible. You can get astringency problems if it gets too hot.

Good luck, again!

[FoodMan]

Great. I am really looking forward to trying this one! I will post any comments, notes or any more questions here.

[Malkavian]

I just ran across a great reference/summary of information about a lot of grains that you might want to use in building recipes of your own.  Have a look at

http://www.carolinabrewmasters.com/06Aprgrains.html

←

I was already quite pleasantly surprised reading through this thread and then you had to go and link to the website of the brewer's club that operates in my area I deal with CBM members just about every day, great bunch of guys, and there is indeed a great deal of information on the site.

I've been in homebrewing and winemaking for about 2 years, most of that also spent working in the field. Always great to see new people getting into the hobby I'd love to contribute some here, comments and a few recipes, but I'd hate to seem as if I'm muscling in on cdh or stealing the spotlight since I'm new.

[cdh]

Welcome Malkavian!

Please chime in with anything that is on your mind. I've done my teaching now... folks are not students anymore, we're all just fellow brewers now. Anybody who has made it this far through the thread and brewed along knows brewing technique...

I've not done a lot of brewing recently, finding myself with 3 kegs of beer, a keg of pear cider and a fermentor full of mead slowly churning its way along... I do have a smack pack of Wyeast Roeselare sitting around that will also occupy a fermentor for 4-6 months... so I'm holding off on adding anything else to the collection right now.

[Malkavian]

I haven't had time to do much for myself either. Most of the summer was occupied brewing in prep for the Oktoberfest in town (about a dozen or 15 5 gallon batches) and after that I felt just a weeeeeeeee bit burnt out on the whole deal.

Recently however the bug hit me again and I have an English bitter going of the following recipe:

Fermentables:

4.5 pounds (2kg) light dry malt extract or about 5.5 pounds (2.5kg) light liquid extract

Specialty grains:

1 pound (450g) English Dark Crystal, approx 155 lovibond

1/3 pound (150g) Flaked Oats (Thansk for the catch Chris!)

Hops:

.5 oz (14g) Target @ 10.4%AA

1oz (28g) Kent Goldings @ 5.1%AA

Yeast: White Labs 017 Whitbread

Notes: Toast flaked oats @ 350F (177C) until light brown, let air and cool before adding to wort. Add Target hops initially, and the Kent Goldings with 30 minutes go in the boil. starting Specific gravity should be around 1.040

Edited December 4, 2006 by Malkavian (log)

[cdh]

Blimey! A whole pound of flaked oats steeped in there?

You've gotta be introducing a bunch of unfermentable starch with those oats if you're not mashing them...

It sounds like you've used this recipe before... how long does it last? That oat starch seems like an invitation to a very short lifespan for this beer.

[Malkavian]

Blimey!  A whole pound of flaked oats steeped in there?

You've gotta be introducing a bunch of unfermentable starch with those oats if you're not mashing them...

It sounds like you've used this recipe before... how long does it last?  That oat starch seems like an invitation to a very short lifespan for this beer.

←

Actually Chris, you brought a typo to my attention I only used 1/3 pound in this recipe; must have been thinking of another formula to get my wires crossed lke that.

You're right, of course, a full pound IS a fair bit of flaked grain to use without mashing. I've done a number of darker brews (stouts and the like) using a couple cups of flaked grains (about half a pound usually) without mashing, and never had any trouble, but at least partial mashing would be the best idea.

I wouldn't want to do such a thing with a beer that'd come out any lighter than this one, it'd be hazy beyond belief.

Edited December 4, 2006 by Malkavian (log)

[FoodMan]

Finally brewed the Tongo Porter this past Sunday. I did have a couple of alterations to the recipe, the biggest one was using 5.5 lbs of light liquid extract instead of the DME. This was done based on the brew shop owner advice. According to him, since this is a real dark brew using a liquid will not hurt and will save me some cash. BTW, Tongo he said your recipe looks great and should have some good "kick" to it. Other subs were due to availability (or lack there of). I will post the altered recipe when I remember to bring my notes with me.

Concerns:

The fermentation period when the airlock was actively bubbling was relatively short, probably 24 hours. Does that sound right? and do I need to wait 2 weeks before bottling still?

I had to move the fermentor bucket yesterday from one room to another and some water from the airlock fell into my beer. Now I am freakign out and worried it might cause contamination! Should I be worried? Should I check on the beer at all?

[cdh]

Don't worry about the airlock water getting into the beer. It has happened before, and hasn't caused any problems for me.

As to the time before bottling, I'd suggest giving it at least 10 days... stuff is still going on in there beyond the initial fermentation. And a 24 hour full ferment is unlikely... It may have gotten 80 or 90% done, but will require some time to finish off.

[TongoRad]

Other subs were due to availability (or lack there of). I will post the altered recipe when I remember to bring my notes with me.

Since you were making substitutions under the guidance of your shop's operator I am sure that it will still make a great beer. There can be a whole lot of flexibility with these things so long as you stay within the framework of the original recipe.

Should I be worried? Should I check on the beer at all?

Just to add to what Chris said, I wouldn't be worried at all at this point, but I would check it after a week or so (maybe 10 days like Chris suggested)- not for contamination, but to get a handle on where your gravity is. Just post back at that point before you do anything with the beer.

[FoodMan]

Thanks guys...I'll give the beer about 10 - 12 days then and check on it. Since I have no Hydrometer, measuring the gravity is not possible. So, I'll probably just have to bottle it then.

[FoodMan]

Here is the new recipe I used with all the edits:

Tongo’s British Porter

Recipe yields 5 gallons from a 3.5 gal. boil.

In the mash tun:

1 lb. Pale Ale Malt

2 lb. Dark Munich Malt

1lb. Crystal Malt 55L

1/2lb. Crystal Malt 105L

12 oz. Chocolate Malt

6.5 qts. heated water.

Mash for 90 min. at 152F (I'd recommend doing a mash-out before sparging. Somehow- either by removing some of the mash, bringing it to a boil and returning it, or by just adding some additional boiling water- get the mash up to 168F for 10 minutes. It stops the enzymes from converting and makes things flow better). I'm assuming 1.027 per pound per gallon, or 77% efficiency, fwiw.

Sparge with 9-10 qts at 168F until you get close to your limit

Add 5.75 lbs Liquid light malt extract to the runoff.

Hop additions

About 2.75 oz. Northdown @ 8% (or 20 AAU (2.5*8)) - for 60 min. (You need as close to 22 AAU as possible, so if alpha acid content is less than 8% buy more)

Add 1 1/2 oz. East Kent Goldings at flameout.

Ferment with London Ale WLP013 from White Labs.

[FoodMan]

A question about priming this, will 4 oz be enough to prime the five gallons?

[cdh]

Should be fine. How fizzy do you want it?

You could look into carbonation calculators to figure what fizzyness you'll get from how much sugar. See http://www.tastybrew.com/calculators/priming.html for one.

[FoodMan]

Should be fine.  How fizzy do you want it? 

You could look into carbonation calculators to figure what fizzyness you'll get from how much sugar.  See http://www.tastybrew.com/calculators/priming.html for one.

←

Thanks Chris. I do not want he porter too fizzy. So, based on your link and on this table at the bottom of the page looks like 3-3.5 oz corn sugar is perfect.

[FoodMan]

Bottled the porter last night. It tasted very good, with a clean mildly roasty flavor. I do wish that "roasty" taste is more pronounced though, but we'll see how it all tastes once it's fizzy and aged for a couple of weeks.

[cdh]

If you really wanted the roasted flavor, roasted barley (unmalted) is where it comes from in stouts. That is the stuff that some real caffeine-phobic folks and faux food afficionados brew and serve as a coffee replacement. A staple on macrobiotic menus and such... but also the key to a roasty delicious stout as well.

[FoodMan]

I invited a couple of friends over for burgers last weekend and popped open the Porter. Certainly exceeded my expectations! It was smooth, mildly bitter and has a lovely subtle roasty aroma that is almost sweet. It was such a big hit that everyone offered to chip in to buy me more ingredients to make another batch and split it between all of us. Thanks Tongo

[cdh]

Looking good!

I've got a new project fermenting myself, which may be of interest, so I'll share it.

For Christmas I got a copy of Brew Like a Monk by Stan Heironymus. It is all about brewing practices in Belgium, and has quite a following amongst the online homebrew community. After reading through it, I decided to build a properly Belgian recipe for a strong dark beer along the lines of the darker Trappist ales that I enjoy, but don't drop five bucks a bottle for very often. These beers are totally about what the yeast do the fermentables, with the hops receding way into the background. Descriptions of these beers always evoke all sorts of complex flavors, from rummy to cakey to cocoa-infused. Very complex and tasty.

The upshot of my reading and planning was a remarkably simple recipe, and an understanding that fermentation temperature control is necessary in getting the desired yeast character to express itself.

The recipe I put together cobbled together elements of a number of the monastic brewing traditions that the book detailed, and is not an attempt to clone any one beer, but rather to brew in the style and see what comes out. Judging by the wonderful aromas that have been wafting about the house and the wee samples I've been lifting from the fermenter, I'm on track.

If you're interested in brewing along, here's what I've done so far (for a 5 gallon batch), with a bit of commentary interspersed:

First the Constituents:

5 lbs Dingemans Pale malt

5 lbs Dingemans Pils malt

Some monastaries use only Pils, others use both... I had both to hand, so decided to use them.

4oz Belgian Caravienne

4oz Belgian Special B

5oz Chocolate malt

The Caravienne and Special B are Belgian caramel malts that contribute aromas... I get an almost floral thing from the Caravienne, and a tangy sharpness from the B. The chocolate malt is a decision of mine, based on a hunch that when Westmalle says they use "dark malts for aroma", that some of the cocoa nose comes from something like chocolate malt. Chocolate malt is definitely used by the Achel brewery, and I've liked their beers. I run the risk of adding an uncharacteristic roastiness by doing this... but I could live with it if it plays out that way.

1lb rolled oats

Oats give a slippery silky mouthfeel to beers that they appear in. I think that a beer like this might benefit from some of that character, so I've added a pound as an experiment. I know of no Belgian breweries that do so in this particular style... but it seems worth a try. Oat starches will need to be gelatinized before they get thrown in with the grains, so I made a great big pot of oatmeal first, then introduced it to the enzymes.

16 fl. oz bottle of Belgian Dark Candi Syrup

1 lb chinese rock candy

The Dark Candi Syrup is a beet-sugar derivative produced in Belgium. This stuff is packed with flavor. It is to beets as molasses is to sugar cane. It is dark, sticky, thick and aromatic. It actually beats molasses in both flavor and aroma as far as I'm concerned. It has less sharpness and an almost woody note in its aroma. It smells a bit like a bourbon barrel, with all of the vanilla and chocolate and toasty notes that implies. On the palate it tastes like a very smooth rich caramel toffee. A pastry chef should get some of this and play around... it could make for stellar desserts. It is also reputed to be responsible for much of the flavor profile and color in a number of Belgian darker beers. 16 fl. oz of this weighed 1.5 pounds. Since it is so flavorful (and expensive at 8 bucks a bottle), I decided to use one bottle of it, and make up the rest of the sugar with something else. A high sugar content is a hallmark of Belgian style brewing, allowing for a beer to be richly flavored, yet not overly thick in body. I decided to shoot for around 20% sugar in this beer, though some beers in this style have an even higher sugar content. I could have used plain table sugar, but when I was last in the local asian market I saw chinese rock candy sugar and picked up a pound of it. This seemed a fine time to use it.

.5 oz Czech Saaz hops 3%AA

.5 oz Tettnanger hops 4.5%AA

.5 oz Willamette hops 4.2%AA

These are all within the Belgian hopping tradition... low bittering capability, delicate aromatics. The Willamette are a substitution for Styrian Goldings... both are Fuggles hop rhizomes grown in out of the way places (Slovenia for the SG, and Oregon for the W), so should be pretty similar. This combination should not be too important, as they'll all be added for 60 minutes to bitter, and no other hops will be added. The flavor contributions will be quite muted. I'm aiming for about 24 IBUs in this beer. Since hop calculations are as much magic as they are science, and no two commonly used formulas agree, I used a number of calculators, and picked a hopping rate that came out at 20IBUs under one formula and 36 under another. I could live with an outcome at either end of that range, and hope that they will average out into the middle.

Since yeast are crucial to this style, I picked up Wyeast's 3787, Trappist High Gravity yeast, a close relative to the yeast used in Westmalle, Westvleteren and Achel... one that expresses itself very differently depending on the temperatures it is fermenting at. I also had some leftover slurry from a beer I fermented with Wyeast's 1762, a yeast derived from the Rochefort brewery's yeast strain.

Next The Procedure

I mixed the 10 lbs of base malt together with the chocolate malt and added approximately 13 quarts of water calculated to bring the mash temperature up to 147, a low mash, to encourage the beer to ferment to dryness. I then sprinkled the ground aromatic malts on top of the mash and closed the cooler for an hour while I made my big vat of oatmeal. (And a pound of oats does make a big pot of oatmeal!) After 45 minutes of steady conversion at 147, I added a quart of cold water to the oatmeal to get its temperature down a bit so it wouldn't denature the enzymes.

I then drained off some of the enzyme rich wort from the cooler into the pot with the oatmeal and let that get to work. Within 15 minutes, the enzymes had really changed the character of the oatmeal, making it soupy and thinner, rather than the thick sticky glop it started out as. Once it got sufficiently thin, I added the oatmeal on top of the mash in the cooler and gave it a good stir. I let it continue to convert for another 15 minutes, and then drained the first runnings. I got about 8 quarts, so I added another 10 quarts to the cooler and stirred it around and left it to dissolve remaining sugars for 10 minutes, and then collected all the wort I could. It pretty well filled my 16 quart pot to within an inch of the top.

I boiled for an hour with the hops, adding the sugars at the last 5 minutes of the boil. I then used the arctic temperatures outside and my frozen over pond to cool the wort down to 60F, and added the Wyeast smack-pack of 3787.

Since Belgian beer depends on the flavor output of the yeast, I treated the yeast differently than they are in brewing traditions that emphasize the malt and hops and desire no flavor input from the yeast. American brewers routinely emphasize making a yeast starter, so that the yeast do much of their reproduction before they're introduced to the beer and can get down to the business of making alcohol and CO2, rather than making flavorful esters while they're reproducing, since yeast ester flavors in American styles are often considered undesirable defects. Since I want all the yeast character I can get, I decided not to make a starter, and to pitch the yeast at a cool temperature like 60F and allow it to rise to what it can in my 68F house. After letting the 3787 go overnight I could see activity and some bubbles rising. At that time, I decided to add something else to the party, and added maybe 125 ml of slurry from a beer made with the 1762 back in the fall. It will be interesting to see how the two Trappist derived yeast play together. I decided that this would be a prime candidate for an open fermentation, without an airlock. I just covered the top of the bucket with a clean dishtowel. It lets more oxygen get to the yeast, and it lets the wonderful yeasty aromas waft around my kitchen.

The beer has been fermenting for 10 days now, and the layer of foamy risen yeast has not fallen yet. Over the first 3 days the temperature rose through the 60s to 70F. I decided to move it to a cooler spot closer to the door, and it dropped back down into the high 60s for another 5 days. That is in keeping with the Westmalle fermentation schedule of starting at 64 and letting it rise to 68. After 8 days, with the yeast still active, I decided to up the temperature a bit and moved the bucket nearer to the radiator, which has raised the temperature to 73... still quite low compared to some Trappist practices which start at 68 and let it slowly rise into the 80s over a week.

That's where the beer is right now... Chime in if you try something similar. I'll update on the flavor as time progresses.