Oolong Teas: a complex world between green & black

[nakji]

Last night I picked up what my local tea shop was calling a "Wulong Wang", from Fujian, Anxi. Loosely translated - King of Oolongs? A quick internet search didn't turn up much but that it is probably a TGY mix of spring and autumn leaves. I brewed up a pot last night for some guests. It had a much browner, darker colour than TGY, but retained the floral taste of TGY overlaid with a bit of roastiness.

Anyone ever tried a "Wang" tea?

[Wholemeal Crank]

Have never had an oolong by that name. But it sounds delicious. TGY green, TGY roasted, love it any way I can get it, pretty much.

Tonight I'm doing an experiment: comparing the ginger flower fragrance dan cong (Po Tou) from Tea Habitat prepped in my small Chao Zhou pot vs a porcelain gaiwan. Using just 60mL water (measuring cup, to be sure it's even) for each infusion, water about 190-200 degrees, and so far, no significant difference in flavor. However, the tea is delicious (fruity, spicy, sweet), so the experiment will continue. I love the little Chao Zhou pot--the fit and finish are definitely a step above the rest of my collection--so it won't be neglected even if the results continue to be a draw.

[Richard Kilgore]

WC, you'll likely not notice much difference until you have used the Chao Zhou for at least a couple of months dedicated to Dan Congs. You may be able to help that along by leaving leaves (water poured off) in the pot overnight after you are through with a session. Then continue doing that for each of a week's worth of sessions and see what happens.

[Wholemeal Crank]

(regressing to early toddlerhood, stamping feet impatiently)....but I want it now!

[nakji]

I couldn't find many English language hits on "Wulong Wang" either, although I did find lots in Chinese. Unfortunately, my Mandarin was not up to reading them. It's Google translate for me, I guess.

I get a lot of really nice TGY in Suzhou; I'm in Beijing for a few days over Golden Week, so I'm going to keep my eyes out for some more toasted-profile wulongs.

[Wholemeal Crank]

Another day, another oolong....

Dayu Shan 2010

Taiwanese spring oolong tea from Wing Hop Fung,

A very nice oolong, quite pricey, actually, and I'm not sure yet if it's worth the price. I'm trying to understand the buttery flavor other people have reported in Taiwanese mountain oolongs, like Da Yu Ling. Making this one in a small clay pot, about 5 grams of tea in about 100 mL of water. The water is near boiling--the Pino is keeping it between 198 and 212 degrees throughout.

First infusion was 30 seconds, not too sweet, but rich, floral, warm, a little spicy, and yes, a little buttery....I think that what I have been thinking of as a sun-warmed hay could be interpreted as buttery.

A little longer 2nd infusion is spicier, vegetal, still a little of the 'buttery', but the floral/sweet elements are a bit overwhelmed because of the overlong infusion. Third infusion, down again to about 40", better, the buttery is more prominent, but the sweet/floral is not as strong as the first infusion. 4th at 45 seconds is spicy, sweet, floral, but the buttery has receded this time. By the 8th infusion it's getting pretty much to slightly sweet or spicy water.

In the end, this one presently lacks the very strong sweet and floral notes I expect in the best Alishan oolongs, and I suspect the difference is not the nature of the tea, but the storage conditions with the tea in a large jar instead of tiny vacuum sealed bags.

[Will]

WC, you'll likely not notice much difference until you have used the Chao Zhou for at least a couple of months dedicated to Dan Congs. You may be able to help that along by leaving leaves (water poured off) in the pot overnight after you are through with a session. Then continue doing that for each of a week's worth of sessions and see what happens.

I don't think you'd notice much of a difference in the taste of tea brewed in a Yixing or Chaozhou pot after a few months (even with daily use) compared to the same pot when it was brand new. I have had pots dedicated to the same tea for several years with frequent use, but you'd still be hard-pressed to find much aroma or taste of that specific tea in the pot. This is not to say that one shouldn't dedicate pots to a particular type of tea (or that one shouldn't avoid brewing flavored / scented teas in earthenware / stoneware pots). Keep in mind also that, in my experience (and also based on what I've heard), Chaozhou pots season a little more slowly than Yixing. This is odd since IIRC, they're supposed to be more porous by quite a bit. And, while Chaozhou pots are not a bad choice for some teas, especially dancong or high-fire tieguanyin, I don't think there's any special reason to choose them over Yixing pots, other than that they're from the same region.

You might see a difference between a particular pot and another pot, or a particular pot vs. a thin-walled porcelain gaiwan. I personally find that for me, most dancong will have a little more fragrance and less astringency when brewed in a thin-walled (eggshell) porcelain gaiwan or pot. Using a pot is pleasant, because it builds up a patina over time, but I do find that with a lot of teas, using thin porcelain provides the results that taste better to me. This may simply be because of heat, so you might be able to use slightly cooler water with the pot and get similar results, but I don't think it's quite as simple as that. Anyway, my point is just that if you prefer the way a particular tea tastes when using porcelain, no reason not to simply use that for brewing.

Edited November 15, 2010 by Will (log)

[Will]

I couldn't find many English language hits on "Wulong Wang" either, although I did find lots in Chinese. Unfortunately, my Mandarin was not up to reading them. It's Google translate for me, I guess.

I don't think you're missing anything interesting. The term is just a generic term used by vendors to indicate the tea's grade, but there's nothing really to "learn" about it. It says nothing really about the style of tea or how it stacks up vs. a similarly named tea from another vendor.

I get a lot of really nice TGY in Suzhou; I'm in Beijing for a few days over Golden Week, so I'm going to keep my eyes out for some more toasted-profile wulongs.

Good luck, but I wouldn't hold your breath. The higher-fire stuff (especially with tieguanyin) is not that popular right now in mainland China. A lot of HK, Malaysia, and Singapore merchants have heavier-fire stuff, probably because of the high number of Chaozhou people there. Most of the shops buy their raw maocha from the tea grower, and then roast it according to their own "recipes"... it seems like the number of people who have this skill in mainland China is definitely declining, since the market for the modern, air-conditioning processed greener teas is so high. In Beijing (or Shanghai, for that matter), you will probably have more luck if you go to a store that specializes in Wuyi Yancha. If you have the time, head to Maliandao (马连道茶叶街), though know that this is a huge, huge, huge tea shopping area.

Closer to you, there are two similar, but smaller, tea malls in Shanghai, including Tianshan (天山). The high-fire stuff is even less popular there, because green tea (and very lightly processed oolongs) are really much more popular in that area. There are one or two decent Wuyi Yancha stores in Tianshan - the one I've been to is Qi Ming Cha Ye on the second floor - not sure if their shop is still there (I think their company site is http://wysqmcy.com/, and believe they have a shop in Beijing also). I have gotten roasted and / or aged Tieguanyin at Tianshan also, but I believe it's just the stale stuff from last season with a heavy (and not that well balanced) roast.

[Chris Amirault]

Greg at Norbu Tea must be clairvoyant or something. While I was in Arizona, I grabbed some charcoal roasted Dong Ding Ooolong from Taiwan because I liked the smoky malt of it. Lo and behold, in my recent order from Norbu, I found a sample size of 2009 Winter Tie Guan Yin from Taiwan, which is also charcoal roasted. Deep copper color with rich woodsy and nutty aromas and flavors. I'm getting me more of that.

[Wholemeal Crank]

That charcoal roasted TGY is almost too roasty-toasty for my everyday drinking--I prefer the Dong Ding overall--but that high-roast TGY holds marvelously in the thermos for a long day or a long drive. I've enjoyed some of it my last couple of drives to Las Vegas.

[nakji]

Good luck, but I wouldn't hold your breath. The higher-fire stuff (especially with tieguanyin) is not that popular right now in mainland China. A lot of HK, Malaysia, and Singapore merchants have heavier-fire stuff, probably because of the high number of Chaozhou people there. Most of the shops buy their raw maocha from the tea grower, and then roast it according to their own "recipes"... it seems like the number of people who have this skill in mainland China is definitely declining, since the market for the modern, air-conditioning processed greener teas is so high. In Beijing (or Shanghai, for that matter), you will probably have more luck if you go to a store that specializes in Wuyi Yancha. If you have the time, head to Maliandao (马连道茶叶街), though know that this is a huge, huge, huge tea shopping area.

Closer to you, there are two similar, but smaller, tea malls in Shanghai, including Tianshan (天山). The high-fire stuff is even less popular there, because green tea (and very lightly processed oolongs) are really much more popular in that area. There are one or two decent Wuyi Yancha stores in Tianshan - the one I've been to is Qi Ming Cha Ye on the second floor - not sure if their shop is still there (I think their company site is http://wysqmcy.com/, and believe they have a shop in Beijing also). I have gotten roasted and / or aged Tieguanyin at Tianshan also, but I believe it's just the stale stuff from last season with a heavy (and not that well balanced) roast.

Thanks, Will. I've really noticed it's almost impossible to get a hold of this kind of oolong in Suzhou.

I was, however, able to find a (quite pricey) "shui xian" toasted oolong from the Song Fang desk in City Super. It's exactly what I was looking for, and I'll no doubt pick some more up next time I'm in Shanghai, despite the price. If I'm after a bit of adventure, it'd be fun to hit a tea mall, though.

[Chris Amirault]

That charcoal roasted TGY is almost too roasty-toasty for my everyday drinking--

It's the Islay single malt scotch of tea, that stuff. And I loves me some Islay single malt scotch.

[Wholemeal Crank]

Long time, no oolong discussion!

Alishan High Mountain Taiwanese Oolongs from Norbu

March 2011

I thought I had set aside unopened packages of each of these to use in this comparison tasting, but realized that I'd twice dipped into the collection at some point in the past few months, and hadn't dated when the packages were opened.

1) Ali Shan High Mountain Beauty Summer 09

(freshly opened for the tasting)

2) Alishan High Mountain Oolong Winter Harvest 2009

(package already opened, date unclear)

3)2010 Spring Ali Shan High Mountain Oolong*

(package already opened, date unclear)

4) 2010 Spring Ali Shan "Tsou Ma Fei"*

(freshly opened for the tasting)

5) 2010 Winter Ali Shan High Mountain Oolong - 1,200m Elev.

(freshly opened for the tasting)

Teas tasted by debunix, on Flickr

*Because there was such a marked difference in the teas, I stopped comparing the 2nd (Winter 2009) and 3rd (Spring 2010) after the first infusion, because I can't be sure what changes are due to their having been opened.

2.5 grams of tea in the medium gaiwans with about 75mL water (2.5 oz) per infusion, water 200-210 degrees

Dry leaves by debunix, on Flickr

Sweet smelling, peas & grass, tightly rolled green leaves

Liquors by debunix, on Flickr

First infusion 45 seconds, no rinse, all liquors yellow, but the first two--the summer and winter 2009 harvest--were a little orange in tone, and the other three a little more green

1 this one is VERY distinct today--unbelievably sweet, rich, deep, floral

2 sweet, floral, spicy, but none of the amazing deepness of the high mountain beauty, and really lacking the high notes

3 basically, the same as 2

4 sweet, rich, floral, spicy undertones

5 very hard to separate from 4--equally sweet, rich, floral, spicy undertones

I think I 'get' the difference now between the summer high mountain beauty and the others, the difference triggered by the bug bites, and wish I'd tossed a few more packets of this into my last order from Norbu. (Here's hoping no one reads this and a few of them are waiting for me when I next order!) As noted above, the previously opened teas were markedly inferior to the others, so I stopped comparing them to the others at this point (they were not wasted, used to brew up a bulk thermos of tea for the rest of the morning).

Second infusion about 45 seconds again

Still tasting that strong difference between the high mountain beauty and the other two: it is perhaps a little nuttier, reminds me of mahleb, a middle eastern spice made from the pit of a black cherry, a flavor similar to but not quite the same as almond extract. It also coats the tongue a little more strongly than the other two. The winter 2010 is a little more sprightly vegetal, a little greener, than the Tsou ma fei, but the difference is very subtle. It is the first time in a while that I have compared the Alishan oolongs together, and such a delight to enjoy them in this depth.

Third infusion, about 1 minute, and they smell so good. The taste differences are there in the color and the scent--that warm nutty roundness, a hint of overripe peaches in the summer beauty, a more delicate floral note in the winter tea, and something in between in the Tsou ma fei. I hate saying the Tsou ma fei is just 'in between' the other two, because that seems to suggest it is 'lesser' than the others. It's just that it has no unique flavor that is stronger or more distinct than the other two--it has a hint of the mahleb/peach of the high mountain beauty, but also a little more of the floral/vegetal/sprightly flavor like the winter tea. And it is fabulous.

4th infusion, about a minute and a half, the sweetness is fading a tiny fraction, but otherwise the flavors are still the same, and the difference between them holds up. I am drinking this infusion with a buttermilk biscuit and nectarine jam for breakfast, and they synchronize fabulously, oh my, yes.

Tea with jam and bread by debunix, on Flickr

Pleased tastebuds, contented stomach, slightly tea-drunk brain: happy camper, me.

(later)

Woke up the leaves for a 5th and 6th infusion, 2 and 3 minutes apiece, delicious, the sweet floral nature diminished as expected by this point, and a rich spiciness and astringency to the fore. Still the differences between them remain--the essential character of the three teas are persisting even to this point.

The 7th infusion was weaker because I got impatient and didn't wait long enough. 8th was better again because I was more patient. The 9th shows that the leaves are done; even at 10 minutes, the infusion is weak, though still sweet, floral, pleasant.

Wet leaves by debunix, on Flickr

The summer beauty leaves are smaller, and many do indeed have ragged-looking edges as though bitten

Jassid-bitten? by debunix, on Flickr

And afterwards, this rather ambitious tasting led to quite a lot of gaiwan-washing: some used for brewing, some as tasting cups, a few extras being called into service as 'insulation' for later loooong infusions.

Aftermath by debunix, on Flickr

[Wholemeal Crank]

Less ambitious today....but it's a chilly gray tea morning.

Trying a more formal tasting for the 2009 Wood-roasted winter Shui Xian from HouDe: 2.5 grams tightly curled leaf, 2.5 oz water in a gaiwan.

30 seconds 1st infusion--sweet, silky, earthy, toasty, warm, a bit too dilute, should have let it go longer, because the warm flavor is there, but nothing else yet.

1 minute 2nd infusion--now the grassy, herbaceous flavors are strong, but not bitter, and it tastes utterly different--chameleon tea! (this is why I am quite in love with it)

30 seconds 3rd infusion--what will it be this time? The hay/straw/warm toasty flavor is still noticeable now, but the grassy top notes are strongly present too. Mmm.

1 minutes 4th infusion--again, a nice mix, a little more of the grassy/herbaceous notes above the warm, toasted finish.

1 minute 5th infusion--very similar.

90 seconds 6th infusion, flavor fading a little, should have been a longer infusion….and can be a longer infusion…..returned tea to the gaiwan for another minute….and….warm toasty hay/straw still dominant, but a bit richer now.

And….checking kettle…there's no more water left. I think I will call it done for now.

I love the shifting balance between complimentary but distinct flavors that I can get with this tea--the roasted/warm and the bright/herbaceous profiles.

[Wholemeal Crank]

A bunch of new teas, gray rainy weather, and another tea tasting....

2008 Song Zhong #5

Phoenix Dan Cong Oolong from TeaHabitat,

A first brewing of a spectacular tea. I was intending to reach for my 60mL Chao Zhou pot, having planned on a small series of infusions, but without really paying attention grabbed a larger pot instead. So there were fewer than anticipated infusions because the tea was really quite dilute. Despite that, it really shone.

Sweet, scent of dried apricots from the long, thin, twisted, quite dark brown leaves

Used 1.5g leaf in 100 mL clay pot--which as you can see is not much for the size of the pot

205 degrees, first infusion 20 seconds--still that apricot scent, floral in the first infusion, and the flavor matches--stone fruit with flowers. Oh my oh my.

2nd infusion, 45 seconds, sweet, floral, fruity, more intense with the longer infusion. A touch of spice--cinnamon, mace--on the back of the tongue, along with the floral.

3rd infusion, 45 second, more of the same--floral, fruity.

5th infusion, 1 minute--spicier coming to the fore, with the fruity/floral notes still rounding out the flavor, felt more at the sides of my mouth and in the sweet aftertaste. I open my mouth, inhale though it, and the sweet floral taste remains. I set a part of this apart in the aroma cup, and when I remembered it a couple of minutes later, it had cooled, but still, wow!, it was brilliant.

6th infusion, probably 2-3 minutes, more floral and fruity, didn't drink it slow enough to really process the flavors in great detail.

Setting it aside for a while now, before I float away on this pool of tea inside me.

A 7th infusion again needed more patience. Will go away from the next one for a while, but pour water over the pot to try to keep it hot and brewing….

And 8th at about 6 minutes was clearly demonstrating that the leaves were spent. Sigh. They're still an elegant mix of red edges and green middle.

Can't wait to do this one again with the Chao Zhou pot and double the leaf.

[Naftal]

Hello-

I wanted to share with you the three most unusual oolongs I have had:

Milk Oolong- It really has a dairy taste without adding milk.

Four Seasons of Spring-It tastes like lilac.

Honey Phoenix-It has a nice peach-like flavor.

Edited April 6, 2011 by Naftal (log)

[Wholemeal Crank]

I've read quite a bit about 'milk oolong', and there seems to be both a natural leaf tea that is very hard to obtain in pure form, that gives the impression of milk when drunk plain, and a horde of counterfeits including tea treated with powdered milk, sometimes disclosed to the buyer and sometimes not. All the stories about the counterfeit made me reluctant to seek it out from shops unknown to me, and I haven't seen it offered by one with which I've already done business.

Where did you get yours? And did it taste like milk? I'm very curious, but wary.

[Naftal]

Hello-

The chinese teahouse I frequent (Goldfish Tea) imports their own teas from China. The tea does have a dairy taste that might remind a person of the taste of whole milk.They sell their teas on the internet at this site.

Edited April 7, 2011 by Naftal (log)

[Wholemeal Crank]

Quiet topic lately. Today I roasted an unsatisfying oolong for the first time, and it was quite easy with pleasant results.

I took some Taiwanese Tie Guan Yin, one that was not brilliant first time around, and got forgotten in the back of the cabinet, spread it out on a flattish bowl, put it in the convection oven at 275 (put it in during the preheat, no waiting), and let it go about 20-25 minutes. I played with the timer, the infrared thermometer, and looked at the balled up leaves and sniffed to decide when to stop, but I did not keep detailed notes. In particular, I forgot how hot the tea leaf was when I removed it from the oven--I am sure it was over 200 degrees, but not sure beyond that.

It had a pleasant cocoa scent, and is infusing up quite nicely as a lightly roasted tea, much better than it did as a stale green oolong.

I will keep this in mind for future 'forgettable/forgotten' teas. The delightful Bancha and Houjicha I've been drinking lately suggest this might also be something to try with sadder greens too.

And the last posts up there remind me that I recently tried some 'Milk Oolong' from Dragon Tea House on Ebay. I was already ordering the teeny tiny yixing pot and gaiwan (discussed in the teaware topic), and when I saw that they carried a Milk oolong, decided to add some to the order. I found it too strongly 'milky' to believe it unflavored, and so strong that it was unpleasant to my taste buds, like many of the jasmine teas I used to crave but now really don't enjoy, but several of my colleagues enjoyed it, so it did not go to waste. I think I'll stop seeking the stuff out, because even the toned down later infusions still didn't strike me as a flavor that really enhanced the oolong experience, but if I do find myself ordering something else from a supplier vouched for like the one mentioned a few posts above, I might try a small sample.

[Wholemeal Crank]

Last night, worked on a tasting of Norbu's Fall 2010 Jin Guan Yin, a greener oolong. This was my first gongfu cha tasting of this one, because I opened the package for the first time while traveling and without proper gongfu setup. It just wouldn't get bitter or lose a rich sweetness no matter how I abused it. I was bulk brewing it in my thermos and really impressed with the results under those harsh conditions, and became very eager to see what it could do when more carefully brewed at home.

2.3 grams in porcelain gaiwan, about 75mL water—1 gram/ounce

Water 205°F/96° C

1st, about 30 seconds

Sweet and rich, floral, delicious, marvelously pleasant

2nd, about 20 seconds

A little more spiciness in addition to the floral sweetness

4th, forgot at 2-3 minutes

Splendidly rich, floral, spicy, but no hint of bitterness

5th, also quite a long infusion

Less sweet, but amazingly floral and still very rich, deep flavor

6th, shorter infusion

Lighter and sweeter, deliciously floral

7, 8…and more, out to about a dozen infusions, probably could have been longer if I hadn't overdone the middle ones so much.

I really like this tea, and particularly the staying power both when brewed gongfu cha and when I've bulk brewed it for my thermos—it still has wonderful flavor hours later, not to be compared to the fresh brewed, of course, but far better than most green oolongs I've tried for that use. I just ordered quite a bit more, anticipating a lot of afternoons at the office with the thermos full of this one.

[Wholemeal Crank]

I've been drinking several new oolongs this last month, more from my latest order from Norbu. Today was my second time with a very green Dong Ding - 2010 Winter Taiwan Oolong Tea from Norbu. This one has a rich deep green sweetness from the first whiff of the tightly rolled leaves.

I prepared this one with 3 grams of tea and about 60mL of 205°F/96°C tap water, in a small unglazed porcelain pot. First infusions (about 1 minute) are very strongly floral, sweet, and delicate; the second one brings out a bit more spiciness; the middle infusions nicely balance a rich caramel sweetness, fresh summer hay, and a peppery spiciness, but if they go just a bit too long, some astringency and even bitterness comes out. Later infusions again fade to sweet water—with this tea to water ratio, the 5th and 6th are already stretching to 2-3 minutes, and by 7 and 8 it’s at least 5 minutes.

It reminds me very strongly of the other new oolong I've been drinking a lot, "White Oolong", also from Taiwan. These notes were started with my first tasting, which was so delicious that I'm already halfway through the bag, having brewed it already half a dozen times since I opened the pouch just over a week ago. I will try to get both of them together for a comparative session later, but meantime, here are my notes on the White Oolong:

White Oolong - 2011 Spring Taiwan Oolong Tea by Norbu Tea

1st 30 second steep, 205 degrees, leaf enough to coat bottom plus of empty gaiwan, filled up when unfurled (too lazy to weigh it, bad me)

Very delicate and floral, a bit underwhelming, really.

2nd, again 30" (short but this is now well-opened and this 30" is more than the prior 30", effectively) similar, delicate, spicy, and very like an Alishan….but not quite.

3rd, went longer—2 minutes—still delicate, floral, light, delicious, and not-quite-Alishan! I guess this is the ‘flavor of the tea varietal’ used. Mmmm.

Somewhere 5th or 6th infusion….yes, I see the difficulty in labeling this tea. The flavor is very like a white tea in delicacy, but there is an element of depth and richness and spice that is distinctly oolong in nature, and the staying power of the tea is all oolong. This is wonderful stuff.

Preparing a 2nd series of infusions after the first one started to lose power….delicious stuff, spicy sweet. I am a fan.

….

(Sometime later) Stopped taking detailed notes, but the flavor of this one kept it pleasant right out to sweet water stage. I must have liked it because I drank 3 sessions of it in a row. Drinking it again now, a couple of days later, with some Dan Cong and Tie Guan Yin in between, and it still sings to me. Mmmm.

I let the first infusion go longer and am loving it from the first sip now.

Even the leaves are elegant and lovely as they unfurl—a rich deep green--but the dry leaf balls are larger and a bit paler than the Dong Ding. I just have to stop drinking it long enough to do the comparison tasting before I finish off my first batch of it. It's quite different from my favorite TGY, but I am equally smitten with it.

[Richard Kilgore]

Da Wu Yi Fenhuang Oolong from Norbu.

On his site, Greg makes a strong case for brewing this tea gongfu cha style. I almost always prefer all Oolongs in a gaiwan or Yixing, but after blowing most of my 10 g sample this way, I decided to try it with a more or less western style leaf:water ratio in a larger Yixing that has been dedicated to DanCongs and similar teas. About 7 ounces of water and 3.2 g leaf. I am currently sipping my fourth infusion at nine minutes, and this tea may still have one more infusion to go. Still like drinking flowers. A cup with filter may not give the same result as this well-seasoned Yixing, but I would not say this is a tea to avoid if you have no way to brew gong fu cha.

[jpr54_]

thanx for your reviews-

i ordered some of the teas u mentioned in your post-

this is my first order from norbu-

[Wholemeal Crank]

Let us know how you like the teas you get.

Yesterday I wanted to brew up a thermos full of tea but the 2010 Fall Shade-grown TGY was running low, so I added a bit of the 2011 Dong Ding (green version), and it was a delicious mix. Even the dregs made for a great cuppa!

[350degrees]

im going to taiwan in a week. gonna return with a whole mess of oolong!