Lan4Dawg

I grew up in Georgia and even through count less camp meetings, church socials, receptions, "all-day preaching/singing & dinner-on-the-grounds, revivials, family re-unions, &c I seldomly remember fried green tomatoes. There were almost always fresh, ripe, peeled tomatoes some where on the table but never green tomatoes. The only time we ever got fried green tomatoes was in the fall when the frost was about to hit and every one knew that they would lose those tomatoes on the vine and had to do some thing w/ them. Then you would pick the green tomatoes and pickle them or fry them or make a green tomato casserole or some thing w/ them just to use them before the cold got to them. In the summer months you did not dare pick a tomato before it ripened b/c the finished product was just too good.

thx Trillium, & to think when I started I thought it was such a simple question. edited to add that I still have not found my orange bitters

now this is going to date me but when I started working in the restaurant business in d/t Atlanta (1978) bar pricing was $1.00 for well brands, $1.25 for call, & $1.50 for "super call". Super call was JWB, Pinch, Crown, Glenlivet, Glenfiddich, certain liqueuers, and cognacs (that was all we had b/c that was all we needed. We had three vodkas--well, Smirnoff and a new product called Stolichnaya). Martinis had a $0.25 bump b/c they were 2 ounces instead of 1 1/2 and it was 2 for 1 at happy hour which ran fr/ 5-7pm and after 11.00. We did add $0.25 per drink on nights when we had a live band as an "entertainment charge". Now if you do some quick figuring we have raised drink pricing by approximately ten times since 1978--figuring a call martini @ $1.50 then and $15.00 now. Not even gas prices have risen 10x since then. Housing prices have risen but not by that much. Even if you talk about alcohol pricing alone there is no excuse for such a dramatic increase in pricing. A bottle of JWR in 1978 cost me about $10. The same bottle costs about $18.00 today (& that is at a discount liquor store). That is a tremendous price increase but nothing like the cost increase of drink pricing. Even the cost of a six pack has not increased that much. I used to purchase an import at $3.99/6 and now that same brand costs $5.99/6. How do you explain such a dramatic price increase?

yes but was this grain, like Powder Milk Biscuits, grown by Norwegian Bachelor Farmers?

okay, now back to the original question...... We agree that fresh lime juice & simple syrup is better than Rose's or a Rose's substitute BUT: if you need to purchase a sweetened lime juice product for what ever reason should you buy Rose's--eschewing all others--or are there acceptable substitutes? Beans votes against Finest Call brand and we know that there are other brands out there including one made by the Angostura folks.....

I was at the liquor store the other day and in need of lime juice for gimlets, &c. I reached for the Rose's as usual when I noticed that there were a couple of other brands on the shelf. I had never really paid attention before as I always just looked for & purchased the Rose's. I remember Finest Call but can not recall the names of the others. Not being in the mood to experiment I went ahead & bought the Rose's but thought I would ask if any one has done a serious taste test w/ lime juices and is Rose's the best? or are they similar enough not to worry about it? or is there a better one and we just reach for Rose's out of force of habit? While we are at it. Which one of you snuck in to my house and stole my orange bitters? I had almost half a bottle and it has completely disappeared. I have searched every where and can not find it for the life of me. Which ever one of you took it please return it as I really do not want to make a trip to the liquor store just for orange bitters & my martinis are just not the same w/o them.

Vodka: Burnett's-we seldomly use it except for an occasional Cosmopolitan for the Fuss or to infuse so I buy some thing cheap but decent. Actually I have never done a "taste test" but read some where that Burnett's was the best cheap vodka on the market so purchase it. We also have some thing a friend brought to us fr/ Russia when she visited & a couple of bottles of flavored vodkas that were "inherited". Gin: Bombay for every day usage but I have some Plymouth's and Hendrick's on hand when I feel like some thing different Scotch: Fuss likes Ballantine's so that is what we buy. She also likes J&B so we usually have some of that around. There is a bottle of LaPhroig Single Malt and Aberlour Single Malt on the bar as well. Bourbon: Maker's Mark! There are a couple of bottles of Woodford Reserve that we have been given as gifts and a bottle of Pappy van Winkle that I bought on a whim but I always return to MM. Tequila: I usually buy Sauza as a general tequila for margaritas just b/c it is relatively decent and inexpensive but there is a bottle of Jose Cuervo on the bar for appearance sake Rum: Cruzan for the seldom times we use rum but some how we inherited a bottle of Captain Morgan's and a bottle of Malibu Brandy: I usually keep it just for cooking but there are a couple of bottles of E&J as well as Almaden Rye: Old Overholt-kept on hand to have it Irish: Bushmill's Crown Royal and CC for those who want it Incidentals: Southern Comfort (the Fuss likes Scarlet O'Haras in the winter months), Marie Brizzard Anisette, Luxardo Maraschino, Marie Peach Liqueur, Dubonnet Rouge, Laird's Apple Jack (primarily for cooking), Triple Sec, Apricot Brandy, Orange and Blue Curacao, Raspberry Liqueur--what ever is on sale & bought for mixing purposes Grand Marnier, B&B, Hennesey, and assorted ports and sherries. Rose's Lime, Rose's Grenadine, Angostura, Peychaud's, Orange Bitters

as much as I appreciate the kind words & understanding that I do plan on stealing the phrase when talking w/ some one not familiar w/ this board I must admit that "chilled spirits in a pretty glass" does belong to jbonne. This topic started w/ "what happened to vermouth" and has since evolved -- or devolved -- into a discussion w/ all things wrong in the cocktail world and I have enjoyed it immensely. I could spend half the night on the subject. ":^) But let us give the Reader's Digest version: most bars are under-supplied--they will have 37 types of vodka yet no Maraschino liqueur and 18 different single malt scotches but no orange bitters most bar tenders (present company excepted) have no idea how to make a classic cocktail and it would take a manual and three lessons to explain it to them. It is not necessarily their fault. When was the last time some one actually ordered an Old Pal or an Aviation? and if people want a lousy martini and do not know the difference then you give it to them. most bars are too busy catering to teeny boppers who want vodka and some fruit juice mixed together in a cocktail glass so they can not taste the alcohol but look the part--I am just waiting for some place to introduce the "Shirley Temple martini" for the younger set. Or would it be called the Shirley Templetini? to worry about classic cocktails or preparing traditional cocktails properly. most companies are too busy promoting and marketing their "cool new liqueur" to actually be concerned w/ a real cocktail. and if you can take a kahlua and cream and put it into a classic cocktail glass w/ the moniker "mudtini" and sell it then why not just change the name?

ordering a "dry" martini is like ordering a "medium rare" steak or a "three minute" egg. That is not really what the person wants but what they think they are supposed to order b/c they saw it in the movies or on television or read about it in a book. (the number of perfectly cooked medium rare steaks I have returned to the kitchen b/c they were not "done enough" has probably added several miles of walking to my life and the old joke about the man who applied for a job as a personal chef and got it b/c he cooked the "perfect three minute egg"; when asked how he had done it he revealed that he had cooked it four minutes). I worked in a bar where we used no vermouth in martinis. We just chilled the gin or vodka and put it in the glass. One of the waitresses took martinis to a table where, sure enough, a woman sent them back b/c they were not dry enough. The waitress walked around the restaurant and told every one she met that the martinis "were not dry enough". All of the employees had a great laugh about the incident and she took the very same martinis to the table, apologized profusely for the problem and, sure enough, the woman took one sip and deemed the martini "perfect!". I make my martinis about 8:1 or there abouts. People who do not even drink martinis like to vigorously point out that I am putting too much vermouth in my martini. I just continue mixing and point out that if I wanted gin straight up I would be drinking gin straight up and not a martini. Most people laugh and leave it alone. So, in answer to your question it has nothing to do w/ a martini. It has nothing to do w/ the gin, or--Bacchus forbid--the vodka, or the vermouth, or even the garnish. It has every thing to do w/--as you so literally put it--"chilled spirits in a pretty glass". I some times think if you put gerbil urine in a traditional martini glass, garnished it w/ a kidney stone, marketed it as the latest drink craze: a "gerbiltini", people would flock to order it just b/c of the glass. Call me cynical (insert crowd shouting "you are cynical" here) but I have little faith in the masses.

Great post Lan4dawg---thanks for sharing and taking the time to convey the memories with some great writing! Can just picture the old guy telling about making the lemonade...fishing in the cooler for the coke and also the passing around of the mason jar or paper 'poke'... thank you for the kind words. I enjoyed the memories it brought back while writing it. As a "PK" (preacher's kid for those uninitiated) we had several little churches through out north Georgia with situations similar to the one I described.

A couple walked into the restaurant rather late. He was older, business man type and had obviously already had a few. She was young and rather attractive and by means of dress, make up, and hair style as well as attitude most definitely worked at one of the (ahem) "dance studios" (ahem, cough, cough, nudge, wink, cough) up the street. He made a big deal of seeing the wine list and ordering the most expensive champagne on the list (a Dom @$200 if memory serves. This was several years ago). The wine steward is very pleased w/ himself and goes through the motions. After opening & serving he stands back to judge their reaction. She takes one sip and grabs him, "May I have some orange juice? I just love Mimosas!". I have never watched any one in my life go fr/ such an absolute high to such a picture of dejection so quickly as I did that wine steward. We also had a number of parties for recording types and, being in Atlanta, that meant "rap" & "hip hop" which meant that we would bring the cognac list to the table and return w/ Hines & Coke or Martel & Sprite or an XO & ginger ale. Then there was the time a man asked for the most expensive scotch we had in house. (I heard about this second hand the next morning) The bartender went to the wine cellar where we kept the expensive bottles and poured some 25 year old Maccalan for him straight up and in a scotch tasting glass. The waiter returned a few minutes later saying the man wanted ice and ginger ale and could not understand why we served it the way we did. I witnessed a man steal a pretty stiff shot of Remy Napoleon off the liqueur cart. He returned to his table and took one sip. He then proclaimed it to be awful and complained loudly and long to any one who would listen about how awful the stuff was and when he realized I had seen him made a big deal about how we should not have had it available for him to steal since he did not like it. He mixed it w/ whatever he had in front of him and never did finish it. I took the host aside and explained that we would have to charge the party for the cocktail. The host, luckily, understood and I have no idea what happened to the man later. There are times I am very glad I am out of that business.

I see several reasons for Midtown's restuarant growth. First of all the growth of Midtown itself. There are a lot of offices, firms, businesses, &c that are moving into Midtown fr/ downtown Atlanta. The Federal Reserve is there. A bunch of law firms and banks moved into that region. Therefore you have a clientele already in that area. Midtown is booming w/ people not just during the day but folks are living in that area as well which is a draw. A new building will some times give a break on rent to get a restaurant into its space. Some firms want on "on site" restaurant for entertainment purposes and the building owners are willing to deal w/ the restaurant. Secondly, Buckhead has problems, whether real or perceived, w/ crime, parking, drunken "kids", traffic, &c. and is seen as more of a "party spot" than a fine dining destination now. The stand bys in that area will continue to do well but new places are going South where they--and their guests--do not have to compete w/ the problems that plague Buckhead. Also it is easier to get into Midtown fr/ the suburbs than into Buckhead. You can exit directly into Midtown fr/ 75-85 w/o having to loop around and get caught in traffic and that means a lot to folks who have to drive as much as we do in Atlanta. And, as I stated above, Midtown has people actually living there. You can walk to a restaurant and then back home. There are a few apartments in Buckhead but they are not geared to walking as those in Midtown are.

"all day preachin' & dinner on the ground", home-coming, revivals, camp meeting, &c where under the big oak tree--about midway between the poured concrete table where all the food was displayed and the cemetery and far enough fr/ the gravel parking lot to keep the dirt out of them--were two huge wash tubs. One of those wash tubs had tea and the other one had lemonade. Both of them had a huge block of ice floating right smack dab in the middle. The tea, or swee-tee--as it was pronounced, contained so much sugar it would actually make the fillings in your teeth hurt and the lemonade was not far behind. There was always one old gentleman in the church who was responsible for the lemonade and he would have some contraption--usually of his own making--that would squeeze the hundreds of lemons necessary to make the lemonade. Usually he would have a folding lawn chair set up some where in the vicinity and tell any one who would care to listen (& usually some who did not) about every thing he had done to make the lemonade for that afternoon. The story was the same every year but children would always find it riveting and adults would just roll their eyes and find a reason to be else where. Then, of course, there is Co-coler. If you ever hear any one put the extra "ca" in the middle then you know they either "ain't from 'roun' here" or are "puttin' on airs". There is nothing in this world like walking into the little general store and flipping a nickel on the counter then reaching your arm--all the way past the elbow--into that big cooler and feeling around for that fluted stubby bottle. Invariably you would grab something and about half way out realize--and all you needed was the shape of the bottle to know--that you had an "arah see" instead of a "co-coler" (I never did understand why RC has two syllables and Coca-Cola is four syllables yet when said properly they both have three syllables). At that point you weighed your options. You could continue to lose all feeling in your hand and arm while fishing around for the "co-coler" and hope that they would not have to amputate your fingers b/c of frost bite or you just pulled out the "arah see" & asked for a moon pie. I think there is a law in Georgia, Tennessee, Alabama, and some counties in Mississippi that forbid the drinking of an "arah see" cola w/o a moon pie. When you were a little older you noticed that at several gatherings of adult men there was a paper "poke" that was passed around. It was done very discreetly and, although every one knew exactly what was happening, no one--at least no one in polite society--mentioned it. Inside that "poke" was a bottle of brown liquid that you would later discover was bourbon. Either that or there was a Mason jar w/ the clearest liquid you ever did see and woe be unto any one who thought it might be water. Many a young lad has discovered the difference on a "double yellow dog dare" and regretted his bravery for several days after the fact.

just past B'ham in Bessemer is the Bright Star. It is a couple of miles off I-20 but well worth the detour. The Northport Diner in Northport (just o/s of Tuscaloosa) used to be very good but I have not been there in a number of years so can not vouch for the place in recent years & of course Dreamland in T'loosa although I understand it has gone down hill some since the founder passed. Enjoy your trip.

Fuss does a lot of stuff w/ our peppers. My brother brings a grocery bag of Datils up fr/ St. Augustine late in the summer and she uses those along w/ the habaneros, pepins, fingers, jalepenos, &c that we grow on the deck to make jellies, sauces, relishes, &c. Most of the receipts she uses are fr/ the Ball jar company's "Blue Book" or one of the dozen & a half pepper books I have around the house (I collect hot sauces & the kitchen is done in tabasco colors & peppers). If you want a specific receipt e-mail me (lan4d@joimail.com) and I will pass it along rather than bring on the wrath of the copy right gods by posting it here. One of my favorite things to do is just put the peppers in a jar and cover w/ vinegar then use the vinegar for flavoring. It is exceptionally good on greens, beans, fried catfish, & cornbread.

I found fresh key limes at Save Rite yesterday @ 20 for $1.00 so I made a batch of key lime margaritas last evening. They were quite tasty and Fuss said she preferred them to regular lime margaritas. Now I still have some key limes left over and Save Rite still has bunches at that price so..... I am thinking of key lime daquiris and gimlets. any other suggestions for cocktails w/ fresh key lime juice?

pluff mud! It is a black bean dip made in the low country and named after the gooey, sticky mud that forms in the marshes & swamps around Ch'ton. We got some just b/c, well, w/ a name like that we had to try it. Apprently there is a cottage industry in and around Ch'ton making pluff mud pies, dips, sauces, &c. I had a receipt around here some where for a version of it but can not find it to save my life. Essentially it is black beans cooked down w/ onions, garlic, peppers, spices, &c.

I hate to do this to you Artichoke but the best pork rinds are those like the ones we found on the side of the road on our way to North Carolina last w/e--fresh out of the big, black cauldron bubbling w/ grease & still popping and snapping when they drop them in that paper grocery poke. As for pickled okra, we found some fresh okra that was absolutely beautiful at a little market by the side of the road (& just down the street fr/ where we got the pork rinds) and the Fuss has already pickled them. She got about 6 quart jars out of the batch we brought home w/ us & they are in the cabinet marinating their little pods away. After teasing you thusly it only seems fair to say that Golden Flake does make pork rinds although they are not my favorite. Turkey Creek makes a pretty good product that we find in convenience stores around here & I think Gwaltney--the ham folks--have pork rinds. I am surprised w/ the Atkins' diet/low carb craze and the first Bush's "love" of the things you are not able to find pork rinds readily and easily just about any where.

& the "Gifted Gourmet" once again rides to rescue me fr/ my own ineptitude. ":^) & therese, you are correct about the web making such books all but obsolete (which explains why it is on the half price shelf at Wal*Mart). However one of the reasons I like it is to thumb through and find interesting and bizarre things and brands that you did not even know existed and read about some of the products. It is also fun for being adventurous--for example, if you like this ham or corn meal then you might want to try that one for comparison purposes. It also serves as a gentle reminder of things fr/ our past. I had forgotten some of these products even existed until I read about them. Now I not only have a reminder but a source.

There is (or was) a book called True Grits, The Southern Foods Mail-Order Catalog by Joni Miller (Workman Publishing, NY) that is nothing but a source book for finding classic Southern items by mail order. It has everything fr/ Cheerwine to White Lily Flour to Zapp's Potato Chips to Gwaltney Genuine Smithfield Ham to Goo Goo Clusters to Ledford's Borrowed Beans. The book lists the address and telephone numbers along w/ a brief description of each company and item. The copy I have was published in 1990 so pre-dates the internet hence there are no web addresses included. I do not even know if it is still published & if I could remember how to link the Amazon thingy I would do so (sorry Rachel--feel free to edit). Sorry but no mention of Mt. Olive brand pickles however the local Save-Rite (aka Winn-Dixie) does have the gallon size jars of whole dills @$2.99.

I enjoy Dixie Dining and use it as a resource. The only problem I have w/ it is that they tend to add suggestions to their list w/o reviewing the place and occasionally you do wind up w/ a "stinker". That being said, many of the places they mention do include reviews and many of those reviews are pretty thorough. I also like to use it either to get ideas about restaurants in a specific area or as a confirmation of a place I found by different means.

sorry, but I had to postpone until tomorrow. The Fuss came down w/ cold/flu this morning while I was out so I had to make "healing soup"-- chicken, pasta, and vegetable w/ lots of garlic & ginger. It is what she craves when ever she does not feel good. She is doing much better now so the stuff does work. I hope you people are not expecting pictures. I have a digital camera but my cat has a better idea of how to use it than I do & I am embarassed by all of the effort jmcgrath put into his presentation. (Reminds me of when you had to turn in a report at school and yours is torn fr/ a note book and dog eared and the other kid shows up w/ a professional binder and computer generated graphics.)

I have seen peach vodka and recently. Of course I live in Georgia so it might be a regional thing. It was at Tower Liquors (if that helps). There is a peach liqueur made by Mathilde that we used to use at the restaurant for making "peach martinis". We would mix it w/ vodka @ 4 parts vodka to 1 part liqueur (or there abouts) w/a splash of peach juice for the martinis. That might work for what you want to do (w/o the peach juice) Good luck w/ it.

Any one mind if I play? The only problem is I do not know if I will have time to go by Costco this w/e but I suppose we are allowed to use items previously purchased fr/ the store. If so then count me into the mix. Gwinnett County, GA -- Duluth Costco let's see, after a quick trip to the kitchen.....I have Ahi Tuna filets in the freezer as well as butter, lemon, capers all of which I purchased on my last trip so what about seared tuna w/a picatta style sauce? over basmati rice (also purchased fr/ Costco) and use the frozen green beans and almonds (both came fr/ Costco) for a side dish of green bean almondine? There are a lot of mixed ethnicities in there but it should work. None of this is in the receipt archives so I hope I am not cheating.

I thought Seagram's was Canadian. I believe you are correct but I remember seeing the Seagram's name listed prominently last year b/c they were one of the sponsors.