Bux

I think you've enumerated the inherent qualties that eliminate melons, eggplant, etc. I wonder about a very ripe pear. Perhaps a pear could never be supple enough to resemble flesh which must be the first qualification. Above all, I appreciate the permissiveness implied in your post.

How many fruits can be voluptuous? Certainly a peach. A tomato, a plum, a persimmon? An orange or a grapefruit can be zaftig, but I don't think they can be voluptuous.

I don't do it as often as I used to, but I'm still quite liable to order something I don't like, or at least something I have little aforehand knowledge about whether I'll like it or not. I don't do it as often because I'm just older and weaker (in terms of giving in to my own tastes) or because I'm running out of things I don't like. In terms of the latter it's a case of try it again, you might like it next time--hey this stuff isn't so bad, I only thought I didn't like it. Much of what we like is the result of acquired taste. Acquiring tastes is a neat hobby. It's akin to stamp collecting or wine collecting. Well it would be akin to stamp collecting if you collected mint US stamps with the idea of actually using them in the future. At the same time it's not like wine collecting for investment.

Friedrich just did a piece on Portugal. I haven't read it. Esilda's been hankering to go there for some time and she's clipped the article for me. I gather the essence of the article is that you do better in the inexpensive places serving local foods. My feeling about Spain is that the same thing may be true in many areas. I didn't find it true in the Basque area where I found excellent haute cusine, but the little places weren't as satisfying as in France. In Catalunya, I found compelling haute cuisine and superb local food, at least in Barcelona. I'd be careful about the less expensive places in the coastal cities catering to tourists. As for Jacqueline Friedrich, I wouldn't be surprised to find her name on the byline about an article covering both ends of Catalunya. Galica is another place of interest to me. Some good seafood, but not much interest in the nueva. One of the key things over looked by us all is the development of road food in France and not in Spain--hey, three star R&C inns are the road food of France. --is that the French were travelers in their own country, if xenophobic about the rest of the world for most of the 20th century. The Spanish seem far less so. Through most of the automobile age, they've had fewer roads and cars and it seems less desire to go anywhere. I remember reading about an area in the northwest where the people are known for their reluctance to travel. Wouldn't you guess that we traveled west from Bilbao and when the Michelin road map we bought in France gave out, we couldn't find a shop that sold maps of more than the town in which we were at the time. I think we reached Santiago de Compostela without finding a map, but it didn't matter as there were so few side roads and we had a small scale tourist board handout map. Too many different issues to handle in one thread let alone one post and I'm hardly an expert on Spain--one is sorely needed here.

Point and Dumaine provided wonderful food at logical stopping points along the way from Paris to Nice, but that drive has been a one day drive since high speed cars and the autoroute. As Loiseau realized, Saulieu was now an easy drive away from Paris, and he had to provide R&C rooms as well as a three star restaurant to make it a destination for Parisians. The town itself offers nothing and it's no longer on the main road. Nevertheless, people make a point of going there as they do to Bras in the middle of nowhere and the rest of the three star restaurants that rely on tourists for the bulk of their business. So it's a matter of established pattern and of luxury inns at the end of the road. Arzak is far from the center of San Sebastian, Martin Berasategui is in a suburb of some town not far from San Sebastian, but far enough away not to be a suburb. Can Roca is on the outskirts of Gerona (a lovely enough city worth a day of sightseeing). Lesguard and Sant Pau didn't seem to be near any hotels that looked inviting although Sant Pau is right at the train station. El Bulli is not even in the town of Roses. At none of these places can you stumble well oiled from dinner to bed. You have to dedicate yourself to eating in them. The appeal is reduced for those who can afford to make the trip. I've read that Roellinger's clients asked if he had rooms when they reserved for dinner. Santamaria is adding rooms. Maybe others will, but the proper atmosphere isn't there yet. Dining in France has a legendary history. Spain hasn't drawn the same kind of visitor from the U.S. Read the articles in the NY Times. Jacqueline Friedrich writes about the food in France. Penelope Casas writes about the hotel accomodations in Paradors, but the food is secondary. There are Americans at El Bulli, but at the other places I've mentioned, there was far less English heard and many empty tables at a weekday lunch at some places.

That link didn't work for me. It's possible that it only works from the computer that entered the qualifying date for reasons of cookis or scripting. To respond, I'll assume all one star restauarants are included and then note that of all the starred restaurant in the city, I've only been to Jean-Luc Figueras. Two factor's diminished my appreciation for our dinner. I came down with a head cold that affected my appreciation of food and particularly of finesse in flavor. We requested that each dish be split into half orders so two savory courses became four, but they followed so quickly that we never had time to reflect on a course. As I recall the next course was in the hands of the waiter at our side as the last course was being cleared from our table. The restaurant seemed eager and ready to accommodate our request with the recommendation that we change one of our courses as it would be hard to plate as a half order. We had two of the specials listed in Michelin. The canelones de cigalas, without a binder for the seafood, tomatoes and black olives, seemed more like a summer roll than either an Italian or Provencal pasta and more applealing intellectually than delicious. It was unadorned except by a sauce that was mostly on the side. My wife thought it was buerre blanc, I wasn't at all sure. The Tarta fina de butifarra del perol a layer of rustic (blood, guts, hoof and head as far I would guess) sausage meat on phyllo disk with with sliced ratte potatoes and black truffles was less intellectual, but impressed us very favorably. The simplicity went with the simplicity of the decor, and the earthyness contrasted with the elgance, both in good ways. We were tired, I was not in the best of shape. We enjoyed two fish dishes, but they made less of an impression on us. The service was quite good, if too efficient. It was a meal not quite up to the starred meals we had in the provinces and not quite as relaxed as the less formal meals I've had in Barcelona, but it deserved its star and I need to return to better evaluate it. Lizzee's been there and recommends it. I'd guess it's a short taxi ride from the train station, but then again there are several stations and some of the metros stations seem to serve the main train lines as well on separate tracks. Sants is the only train station I've used, but you can also get the train I took at the plaça de Catalunya. Food is reasonably priced in Barcelona, hotels are expensive and taxis are inexpensive. I also have very high marks for Ca l'Isidre--not listed in Michelin--Les Flors 12, phone (34) 93 241 11 39. It's less upscale and more traditional, but excellent. Lizzee and Wilfrid can comment on it as well. What's your target here. Are you passing through to el Bulli, El Raco de Can Fabes, etc. or is Barcelona your destination?

I wish I were in a position to offer thoughts on my favorite Bernachon chocolates. It would imply not only that I was in Lyon frequently, but that I had a budget to lavish on studying the Chocolates. (Studying here can be seen as a euphemism for "pigging out on.") One of the last three times I was in Lyon, I could not manage to get to the shop when it was open and purchased a small box of ready packaged bonbons from the salon du thé next door. The first time I was there, I had to leave the shop for a minute so I could collect my thoughts and returne to make a selection without stress. They were all quite wonderful as I recall, but it was sometime ago. By my third visit, my appreciation for chocolate had begun to be a bit more sophisticated and I thought it best to start at the beginning. I bought a box of the intense Palets d'Or--Bitter chocolate ganache with a couverture of dark bitter chocolate--the day before we returned to NY. I ate them slowly upon my return. Over the week or so, I found my palate changing. With each day, I found them sweeter and sweeter. For me that may be the definitive bonbon from Bernachon, although Steve Klc is in a better position to offer a definitive answer.

I guess my eight favorite restaurants would almost by definition be the eight at which I most often dine. Would that be true? I might be reluctant to name them as some may not be very good at all. I can think of restaurants I've frequented soley for convenenience and which I'd be loathe to name as favorites. We don't eat our all that much in NYC and by the time I've reached the eighth last restaurant in which we've eaten, I will likely find that I've changed my mind. So many personal considerations go into choosing restaurants that I wouldn't even find my list necessarily advisable for other people. As for best, I haven't been to some of the restaurants that might qualify and I've not been to others in two years, but I am sure they still quality for inclusion. It would be dishonest for me to include or exclude too many that belong on such a list. I must decline although I understand that those far less qualified than I, are repeat contributors to Zagat. Zagat surveys are not on my list of very useful publications. Daniel, Cafe Boulud, Eleven Madison Park and Blue Hill are places I've really enjoyed and I suppose they belong on my favorites list. Would they all be in the top eight if I had more recent dining experiences or a bigger budget? I really can't say, but I suspect not. Then again I liked Ducasse very much, I just found it a bit too expensive to hold a place on my dance card. Daniel may push my budget as well, but as I've earned some of his money, it's easier for me to justify spending it there. Cop out, I know, but no one's perfect.

Number one in my book. I follow your lead. I just end up in a different place.

I don't know what her track record is on re-reviews, but considering all the press l'Astrance is garnering and the inevitable price increase for a restaurant that was so under priced when it opened, I think a year and a half is not rushing things. I'm happy to see reviews of important restaurants that are up to date and there's little that's so stale as restaurant news and opinions that are not up to date. It's a shame when sites are not kept up to date and bigger shame when topical items are not dated. In this case it serves the reader less poorly than it does Ms. Well's reputation to have what are obviously old pages appear as current opinion. In the case of France, it's obvious that we're dealing with old information or will be when one calls for a reservation. In the case of Spain, it's less obvious that the reader is missing all that's happening at the moment. To have these pages appear as current without posting dates is either an oversight, an attempt to have the entire site appear as current to the uninformed reader or just a reflection of the fact that P. Wells doesn't talk to the webmaster and he doesn't understand the material. The first is sloppy, the second two are serious indications of Wells' aloofness to it all and to how her name is being used to make money off her commercial endeavors. I've earlier noted how I feel that people leave messages for her and no one even responds on her behalf to say that she doesn't respnd here. On the other hand, the message board appears active if I access it from my bookmarks, but Idon't see a link on the home page.

Cabrales, I do not know, but I believe it may be reserved by any diner willing to guarantee a certain number of diners. I do not recall the size of the table nor how many diners it would comfortably accommodate.

What do you mean by "so quickly?" Was this a second review of l'Astrance? I seem to recall an earlier one, now that I think of it. That one was glowing too,

I believe Le Bernardin (NYC) has a table with a glass wall separating it from the kitchen and no view of the regular dining room.

As I read this thread, it appears that favorites lists may be far more reliable than bests lists. As much as Shaw and I have mostly disagreed on individual restaurants, I am still really surprised by his groupings below the very top. Come to think of it, we may differ about the top as well. There are too many restaurants in which I've never dined and too many at which I've dined to infrequently to want to rank them in either subjective or objective terms however. Eleven Madison Park is a restaurant I love, but I've never felt the food is in quite in a class with Blue Hill. It's harder for me to make that same distinction between Cafe Boulud and Blue Hill. One thing that stays on my mind is that my regard for certain chefs is not always in line with how I rank their restaurant(s). I should say that it's not always in line with how I rank the food served at their restaurant as it's often not the service, but the food that doesn't live up to the chef's abilities. Not having enough money to eat around, means I am only a regular at certain restaurants and this may affect the fact that I see little inconsistency at these places--or maybe I go back because it's consistent, but after a while it becomes difficult to see one as the chicken and the other as the egg.

I happen to agree about the lighting and it's better again than it was at one time. It's a NY thing and I don't get it either. I like very bright restaurants, especially when the crowd is good looking. Then again, I shouldn't overlook the possibility that they lower the lights when they see me or Simon coming through the door. As for the basement thing, it's few steps down, but there are front windows on the street. Most NYer's would find it quaint and charming and rather not what "basement" might imply to us. He probably showed up for work thinking he would be serving diners not pissers that evening. I'll have to ask my wife if the staff smiles at her. I only flirt with the distaff staff when I dine out. The crux, or should I say "meat" of the matter. Please clarify this. Was the meat "off" as in spoiled--not a good ingredient--in which case it should have been returned, or are you saying that it's not a good ingredient. That would be an even greater criticism of Scott. While the restaurant offered several ingredients, Scott chose this one above all the others. There remains the possibility that you found fault with the way it was cooked, although we have no information on that. I have to note is that this is one of our personal benchmark restaurants. I've never stopped to count how small a best group would have to be for me to include Blue Hill and I find it hard to rate straight sushi restaurants with western ones. Nevertheless, I'm not surprised to hear anyone include it in their "best" list. Samantha, I have been speaking to them about doing an eGullet Q&A with us and have pretty much arranged for both Dan and Mike to field questions next week. We should be able to get the forum up and running for questions from members next week. I mentioned this thread when I spoke to Dan this morning and he said he thrived on criticism.

I'm inclined to agree with Robert on this. To take a table in the kitchen rather than the dining room seems to miss the point of going to a restaurant. I am however, willing to rethink my position and in doing so I am far less inclined to be completely dismissive. It changes the dynamic for sure. For one thing it shifts the focus from the dinng experience to a, perhaps, more food centered experience. You give up the pleasure of the theater of the dining room, for the theater of the kitchen. Let's not negate the appeal of voyeurism--the appeal of being able to view what had previously been hidden from view, what's still inaccessible to others and that which may have long aroused your curiosity. I won't deny the perversity, but that's part of voyeurism isn't it. There may well be a morality about this which doesn't interest me. The kitchen table can also be seen in light of JD's post in the Season of the Switch - Part Three where he cites The Financial Times economist Peter Martin in A homely challenge to branding where Martin speaks of new trends in spending at the higher end. "... a broader trend in which people are increasingly purchasing 'experiences' rather than goods per se. ... - Many of the experiences they seek are 'positional', i.e. conferring status."

At least one minor gastronome has done just that. We've been spending about half our time in Spain and each trip brings new surprises in terms of interesting and delicious food. It has called for some palate adjustment--French food is different from Spanish as it is from Italian--and palate adjustment is the antidote for "for the been there done that" syndrome. "Absolutely delicious" is the very subjective end of a reaction to a meal. Arzak, from an earlier generation of Spanish chef, served us an absolutely delicious meal years ago in San Sebastian and Santamaria in his El Raco de Can Fabes will do that today about an hour north of Barcelona. He'll do it in a style that it Catalan, but in a way that will leave an experienced connoisseur of French food believing that Catalan cuisine belongs within the world of Burgundian, Alsatian, Provencal, Norman and Perigordine cooking. Santamaria is adding guest rooms to his property, but we drove there for lunch from Barcelona and others report that it's an easy enough train ride. Nevetheless, you are correct in noting the absence of Relais Gourmands with rooms. Almost all of our memorable meals in northern Spain have been at stand alone restaurants. In many cases these restaurants have been in the suburbs of major cities or in some location without adjacent hotels of appeal. We neither search out nor gravitate to the most luxurious hotels. For those that expect the level of comfort attendant in Relais & Châteaux properties, Spain is a different proposition. There is not the same tradition of catering to the traveling gourmet. I suspect that will change. To address the absolutely delicious again, I'd say it was as evident in the starred restaurants noted for their creativity as it is in Arpege and Gagnaire and we found it far more evident in the unstarred restaurants. Unfortunately some luck along with a little research will be required. We've hit some exceptional places if all you want is delicious. The research is not just a matter of getting recommendations, but of learning where your tastes match local ones. While few foods will please me as much as well done deep fried items, I found my attraction to things a al Romana in Catalunya brought dishes that were heavily breaded and not pleasing. Rice dishes were invariable delicious at a basic level and the seafood was often exquisitely cooked--perhaps to a degree rarer than in France, which pleases my palate. Nevertheless, when I score, I'm not yet convinced I know enough to claim it's more than luck. That's a risk I'm willing to take as it's paid off well.

If nothing else, this goes a long way towards clearing any doubts I had about la Régalade.

Postscript to the bread pudding recipe: This is a very homespun simple dish that really works for large gatherings and informal get togethers as well as family meals. You could add raisins soaked in rum, if your tastes run that way. We often serve this with fresh pineapple. It's a sweet pudding and the tart fresh pineapple is a good foil when in season.

There are several versions of this recipe floating around in our files and each is marked with revisions and question marks. The following recipe should work, but it's hard to accurately say how much bread my wife uses. It is important to use a good artisan made loaf with body and a good crust. Do not use a squishy supermarket French bread. Budin de Coco Puerto Rican-Style Coconut Bread Pudding 4 large eggs 1 1/2 cups sugar 1/2 teaspoon salt If using coconut milk: 1 (14-oz.) can coconut milk (usually from Thailand, available in most supermarkets and in Chinatown) 4 1/2 cups whole milk or If using cream of coconut: 1 (16-oz) can Coco Lopez brand Cream of Coconut (available at your local bodega) 4 cups whole milk 1/4 cup water 2 tablespoons vanilla extract 1 (1-pound) loaf French bread, stale 16 tablespoons (2 sticks) unsalted butter, melted In a large bowl, whisk together he eggs, sugar and salt until pale in color, about 2 minutes. Whisk in the liquids and vanilla. Cut or tear the bread into small (about 2-inch) chunks. Add the bread to the bowl, stir well, cover and set aside at room temperature until the bread has soaked up all of the liquid. Be sure the bread has absorbed all the liquid it can. Center a rack in the oven and preheat the oven to 375ºF. Butter a 9-inch x 12-inch ovenproof pan with sides at least 2 inches high. (A Pyrex baking dish works well.) Pour the butter into the bowl and stir to combine. Transfer the bread mixture to the pan. (Do not fill the pan all the way to the top as the mixture will rise as it bakes and then deflate as it cools.) Put the pan on a rimmed cookie sheet or baking pan (to catch any drips) and bake for 1 1/2 to 2 hours until a knife inserted into the center of the pudding comes out clean and the top is nicely browned. Remove from the oven and set aside to cool. The pudding can be served slightly warm or at room temperature. Keeping: Once cool, the pudding can be covered and refrigerated for up to 3 days. Bring to room temperature before serving.

I'm a bit perplexed. I could swear I posted this recipe yesterday, but I don't see it. I'm annoyed as well as I had made some adjustments and comments that I don't think I saved elsewhere. I promise I will get a version of the recipe up soon. In the meantime, for those who are interested in French food there been an interesting recipe posted in the French board. It's in the Roellinger thread and has cococnut milk and curry powder, but seems more of a French recipe than a fusion recipe.

Robert, if people are not filling the tables at restaurants that were impossible to book last year, I suspect we will see another revision in pricing--and I hope it's down, although Steve P.'s suggestion that the chefs will seek out fewer of the super rich at even higher prices may have some substance. I think the been there, done that, is a major factor in travel and food destinations nowadays. When you travel to be wowed, repeated visits to the same restaurant are less likely to have that effect. In fact, after being wowed for a while, the wow effect is minimized and wow ain't what it used to be.

I just noticed the subtitle for this thread. Of course this is all about the chefs not seeing their books in the red, but as well in the black as possible. I don't know how many of us regularly charge strangers a price below market value for our time or products. It's one of the sad facts of life that fine dining as evidenced by three star restaurants in France, is priced out of the reach of not only the majority of people, but of a good number of connoiseurs as well--at least on a regular basis. On a scale of injustice, I wonder how that relates to the ability to live in luxurious dwellings and to access the finest of medical care. Speaking of injustice, it's obvious we all don't have the same access to the same level of legal counsel. Supply and demand will set the prices, and as long as chefs can raise their prices, they will. The economy may have more of an effect on restaurant pricing than any particular indignation. A personal choice to stay away will only have an effect if there's no one to take your place at the table. This seems a bad time for restaurants to increase their prices in general, but in general restaurant in the middle upper range are more affected by economic downturn than those at the very top--or at least they were when they had a carriage trade. Now that they rely on a kid stockbroker's Christmas bonus, it may be another story. The Frenchman may take to the streets if he finds the price of bread or the metro unjust, but he has little sympathy for diners at three star restaurants. On a different tack, Bouland posts that restaurants fill in their own information. Can we think of reasons why a three star restaurant would purposely inflate or deflate their prices when filling out the questionaire? My guess is that their tables, if full, are not filled by those making price comparisons in the first place. I would think the last thing the restaurant needs is a diner who's figured his meal to the last cent and not likely to spend on wine. Thus I don't see the discrepancy as deceitful in terms that it was preplanned. Maybe I have too much sympathy for those who are chefs or who own and run restaurants, but pricing here is subject to supply and demand as is the rest of what most of us buy.

ah, finally, a truth I can wrap my mind around. Adam Smith couldn't have said it better. Are you sure you want to define value within such a narrow context? Bear in mind Oscar Wilde's definition of a cynic: "A man who knows the price of everything and the value of nothing."Or have I missed a deliberately ironic intention? Indeed. Caught again using "value" where I meant "price" as if I didn't value my reputation. Call it unintentional irony.

Read her review on les Magnolias in the suburbs of Paris. She can get awfully cranky when things don't go smoothly for her, even when it's her own fault, but there was a time when she was an invaluable source and I've found useful recipes in her cookbooks. She has a web site and on the site, in addition to her reviews which are available without charge, there is a message board. It was underused the last time I looked. Saddest yet was that of the few who posted, several of them posted thinking that Patricia Wells would answer their questions.