jupe

I've been baking a couple loaves of whole wheat today, and after I put them in the oven it occurred to me that baking and brewing (I do both) have a lot in common. Both use different types of grains for different flavors, both rely an enzymes to convert complex carbohydrate to simpler sugars, and both include fermentation. So I got to thinking, what other ways do they intersect? What ideas can I take from one process and apply it to another? The first thought I had was using heat to convert complex sugars into simpler ones in baking. This is required in brewing, as the sugars contained in barley aren't wholly digestible by yeast. So I've been contemplating experimenting with holding pastes at different temperatures to try and control the enzymatic process. It probably won't work, but might be worth a little exploration. While thinking about that, I realized that perhaps a better experiment would be to use specialty grains directly in whole wheat bread. Specialty grains in brewing, for those who are unfamiliar, are grains that are used to control the color and flavor of the brew. For example, barley is roasted at high temperatures to create black malt, chocolate malt, black patent, and many others which contribute highly to the flavor of stouts. Same with amber malts, crystal malt, peat malt (used in Scotch whiskey), and many others. So my question is this: has anyone tried, say, an oatmeal stout wholegrain bread? Not actually using beer in the bread, but the grain profile used to make a stout. I have a nice grain mill, so I should be able to process any grain. Any experience, thoughts, or gotchas? Cheers, and happy saturday!

when you say corn bread are you referring to the style of rye that reinhart mentions in the bread bakers apprentice--rye completely encrusted with corn meal?

For some reason I've always had terrible luck making rye breads. Not any one thing in particular, but it seems like it brings out the worst bad habits for me--loaves sticking to pans like cement after baking, not giving enough time for bulk rising or proofing, shaping badly, and so on. On the one hand it's been driving me batty, but on the other hand I've learned a ton of what not to do (drinking wine while cooking usually works for me, drinking while baking is a disaster in the making). So yesterday I decided to make a couple loaves, and I decide, "dangit, it won't win this time!" and start up a batch of 60% white, 40% dark rye. After applying all the painful lessons I've learned in the past three years baking bread as a hobby, I can now say I've baked a loaf of rye I'm really, really proud of. It is far from perfect--I didn't score the tops of the boules deep enough so I got larger holes than I wanted, but all in all it's the tastiest, most attractive rye I've ever baked. Not as good as some of the sourdoughs I've done (must--revive--starter!!), but it's moments like this that really reinforce this hobby. I used 600kg white flour, 400kg dark rye, a large handful of oats, two tbsp of honey, 20g salt, and a little grapeseed oil. I finished the top with oats and the bottom with corn meal. The crust is pretty thin (which is what i was shooting for), and the crumb is airy, fluffy, and dee-lish-us. next up has *got* to be pumpernickel.

about ten years ago, before i had any concept of how to cook a bird, i thought to myself, "hey, a christmas goose sounds great!". i had never had goose nor had i ever done anything more complicated than a (badly roasted but still tastey) chicken. i ended up roasting the goose for 6+ hours in a pan at 350 with the bird sitting in it's own fat the whole time. greasy doesn't even begin to describe it. it was pale, tough, soaked through with oil. imagine equal parts stock-scum-plus-solids and crisco. I think that's the only time i've ever thrown christmas dinner away.

you guys are making me so hungry, i'm glad dinner is almost ready. i love all the vegetarian suggestions!

has anyone else checked out the stuffed pumpkin that was linked above? i don't know how it tastes, but talk about looking spectacular. what i think i've resolved to doing is a hybrid of my original plans and these great suggestions--appetizers, then soup, then groaning table of turkey/stuffed pumpkin/other traditional items, desert. i just have to be careful, since my oven (while awesome despite it's age) is on the small side. i may, out of necessity, smoke the bird (yep, got a bradley oh, and all the vegetarians do cook beast because they all happen to have significant others who are omnis. and the lady who won't eat seafood regularly prepared it for her fisherman ex-husband i'll be doing some dry runs this week, and if anything looks or tastes particularly spectacular i'll post some pictures--hopefully they won't get nominated for the awful looking food thread.

wow, great ideas--i especially like the faux beef wellington thought, that would be a fun curveball though due to pragmatism, i may due lasagna or enchiladas. good, solid comfort food that everyone could enjoy (isn't that what thanksgiving is about?).

luckily (no offense meant) no vegans, only sliding scale vegetarians. i'm still stuck on what would be a substantial and memorable main for the folks that don't eat poultry or mammals. this is particularly killing me since i was vegetarian for years, but mostly i was a vegetarian because i didn't like food. what main can you do with the same sense of grandeur as a roast animal, but not be a roast animal? maybe i'm a little ambitious, but i like to see genuine smiles on peoples faces when they've had something new or different. also, since i was a vegetarian in a previous life, i like to see omnivores think to themselves, "well, this vegetarianism wouldn't be half bad". again, maybe i'm a little ambitious/perverse, but it's fun. p.s., when i cook for vegetarians, i usually do indian--ethnic dishes are not out for this thanksgiving. thanks!!!

I'm planning a thanksgiving dinner, however because of the specifics guests I have a semi-broad range of dietary requirements. I'm not unusued to one or two at the same time, but this is what I'm working with: * 4 guests are omnivores * 1 guest is a strict vegetarian * 1 guest is a vegetarian but will eat fish and seafood * 1 guest is deathly allergic to eggs, but will eat veg/seafood/chicken * 1 guest will eat anything but seafood in addition: * 2 of the omnivores won't eat anything with olives * 1 of the omnivores won't eat anything with pickles * 1 of the omnivores won't eat anything with mushrooms * there is a 50/50 chance between two and four more omnivores may show up at any given time there aren't any other food allergies i'm aware of, and i've interrogated them all pretty well. my basic problem is this: i want to make the afternoon/evening a stress free, memorable, and most importantly tastey experience for all involved. that, in my mind, means as much mise as possible, as much prep as possible, and not just recycling stereotypes for the food groups as possible (for example, i do not accept baked salmon for the semi-vegs and a salad for the true-vegs as an option for the main course). however, i also want to do a multi-course meal (3-5ish), since i think they are more interesting, engage the guests more, and mostly cause you don't need to plan to have everything done at the exact same time. equipment-wise i have four electric burners, 1 microwave, 1 slow cooker, two refrigerators, and 1 chest freezer. pots and pans, plates, and silverware are not an issue. serving-ware may be stretched, but not overly. so, some of the ideas i've been floating around are: * cauliflower soup--always seems to be a pleaser, but i'm open to suggestions * vegetable samosas in puff pastry--love the home made crust, but could a continental take on this work? * charcuterie plate, cheese plate, pickle plate--i can get high quality soprasetta and others at a reasonable price, artisinal cheeses, and i have jars of home cured pickles (onion, carrot, bean, and cabbage) * deboned and stuff turkey--a slightly different take on the thanksgiving turkey. basically, butterfly, debone, add stuffing, tie and roast. gonna give it a trial run this weekend. however, i'm missing a few things: * pure vegetarian main--doesn't have to be big, but gotta have it, and doesn't have to be vegan * possible fish main--if the pure veg is robust enough then this may work for the second guest * other side dishes/courses--yes, we all love mashed potatoes/etc., and they will probably be there, but are there other special items that can be crowd pleaser's in this configuration? hope this doesn't sound too rambling, but trying to wrap my head around all these permutations has been a challenge. thanks!

so i gotta ask--what is with the meme that oregon truffles are the bees knees? (as opposed to Chinese/Asian truffles that seem to get a bad rap). Is it ripeness? i'm completely new to domestic truffles, so i reeeeeeally appreciate guidance before forking over a bunch of cash to taste them. on the flip side, i'll be in portalnd in a few weekends and would happily post some truffley pics thanks for all the input, from a total newb!

well, if i can get some info without paying the $500 admission (!!!) to the local truffle festival i'll spill the beans right here i know i can buy them mail order, but it just seems silly since i'm sitting in the epicenter of oregon truffle land.

When are they ripe and where can I buy them? I live just outside of Eugene, but haven't seen them around anywhere. I know the truffle festival is in January, but I would love to get my mits on an ounce or two before Thanksgiving. Is that even a possibility? Thanks!

considering it takes three days plus a heck of a lot of work and beast to make a pound, i would expect no less. with the 1" pieces, what is the final thickness?

I've been research recipes for beef jerky today, and I must say I am very amused. Virtually every recipe has instructions on how to slice the tasty hunk of cow, but they are all wildly different. In the last hour, I've seen advocates of: * Slice as thinly as possible with the grain * Slice 1/2" thick against the grain * Slice 1/4" on the bias * Don't cut your meat, use Oscar Meyer bologna (I'm not kidding!) I am a proponent of lots of ideas, but I just don't see the advantage of not cutting with the grain of the meat. In my mind, jerky is supposed to be chewy and not brittle, not paper thin, and definitely not against the grain--cause then it just isn't chewy enough What do you guys think?

hmm, i guess i just assumed they added the culture than let it sit for three days. do you know if this is true, or if it is just three days old? the only difference i could think of would be naturally occuring bacteria changing the ph, but that would be more akin to making a lambic than a highly controlled product. oh, and the last beer i brewed was an outstanding, though hazy, imperial IPA.

well, if they are letting it acidify for three days, then they aren't using the same type of culture that i'm using it probably means one of three things: first, they are using a culture that that acidifies much slower than the mesophilic you or i can buy (since you brew, think of the difference between fermenting a standard ale and a lager--lagers take much longer to finish fermenting the whole way down). second, they may be using temp. to expand the length of time they can ferment the milk. and third, they may be using a secondary innoculation to break down more acidic compounds--winiers do this all the time by adding malolactic culture to break malic acid down in to less hard lactic acid. brining with Perry sounds intriguing. they is a great commercially made perry here in the bay area called Ace that may go really well with a high cream content hard cheese. or, if you have a fruit press, you could always make your own

i've been making pressed cheeses (chedder, etc.) for about a year and a half now, so (hopefully) i can share some of my experience on this thread. Salt: flaky, non-iodized salt has always treated me well. it may or may not be coincidence, but every time i've used iodized salt it hasn't aged as well. this may be because the iodine messes with the bacteria that is responsible for the flavors that occur with aging--or it might just be superstition. besides, i enjoy the flavor or plain kosher no-iodine salt to just about any others. citric acid: never used it, cause you don't gotta (except for moz, which i've never made). the bacteria you innoculate the milk with, given time, will produce more than enough acidity. one time i left a batch to ferment over night--the curds tasted like sharp cheddar. i loved it, my wife didn't. to each their own. rennet: i haven't had a problem using year old rennet. then again, the biggest problem (imho) isn't rennet, it is using homogenized milk. homogenized milk, in my experience, takes much longer to set than others. in some cases, it has taken 3-4 times as long. this is important, because the acidity of directly affected by the time the milk is left to set. the step after the milk firms up (paraphrasing the steps, so don't go nuts) is salting, which arrests alot of the bacteria growth, so that time between you adding rennet, culture, and it firming is pretty crucial. however like i said, i like sour and my wife doesn't. milk: you don't need raw milk to make great cheese. but you do need milk that hasn't been homogenzied to death. here in the san fran area i use milk from strauss creamery, and it is wonderful. basically, if the cream seperates, you are good. there are some people that advocate using dried milk, but i haven't tried that. so, i'm not a cheese expert by any means, but those are the things i've come away with in these last few years. i love fermented foods (i'm a darn good brewer as well) and i'm alway looking for ways to improve. thanks!