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annecros

eGullet Society staff emeritus
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Posts posted by annecros

  1. It is not realistic to expect to be able to buy Prime beef in the US at almost any price. Somebody, somewhere (fine restaurants and beef billionaires I suppose) in the US has cornered the market and it is just incredibly scarce. What is sold as prime is often top of choice, and is very good. What is in the typical grocery store is select, but Whole Foods and such places carry Choice. Breed specific beef is becoming the thing lately, once again at a premium.

    Prime beef is available at any number of butchers in San Francisco, New York, and most other major cities. It's also available mail order from dozens of different sources. Lobel's in NY is the only mail order butcher I've used, they're extremely expensive but the quality is excellent.

    I was under the impression (from my beef purveyor) that all beef was inspected by the USDA in order to differentiate choice or prime. The top 3% is prime, then you have your diffrent "levels" of choice and so on. I would hate to think that someone was getting choice for prime. Especially when you're paying that much of a price on the retail end!

    I was told by people in the industry to never pay prime unless I was allowed to see the stamp on the primal. It does hover around 3% of beef slaughtered, which explains its scarcity and price. A little over half makes choice or better, 40% or so makes select, and the rest is pretty much dog food. There are grades within the grades as well.

    http://www.ams.usda.gov/lsg/mgc/Reports/BeefHistory2005.pdf

    Pretty graph I stole and used in my technical proposal here:

    http://www.ams.usda.gov/lsg/mgc/charts/beef/beefprime.gif

    You would be surprised at the amount of ungraded beef out there as well. There is no law that says you have to grade beef before you sell it. Now it does have to be inspected, but it does not have to be graded, and the slaughterhouses absorb that expense in operating cost. Quite a bit of cheap beef out there is ungraded, and believe it or not quite a bit of expensive beef out there is ungraded as well.

    http://www.fsis.usda.gov/Fact_Sheets/Inspe...ading/index.asp

    Select has almost taken over the supermarkets because it is a "leaner" beef, and can be marketed as such like that is a good thing.

    I was also lectured (these guys were a lot of fun to work with, and their technical knowledge was amazing, but it is sort of like talking to engineers) that the grading system seriously ignores several factors that have an effect on tenderness and flavor, including breed-feed-cut-storage-age of the cow etc. A large part of the gene pool in our beef is brahma. Big cows, but not very tasty. Prime beef is slaughtered so young it is almost veal. There's a big push in the industry to revamp the USDA grading system.

    The USDA also does a yield grade (how much beef can be expected from the carcass) but that just means there is a third stamp on some primals.

    Edit to add: It pays to know your USDA stamps, found on the last link above.

  2. too much info, but.....

    I'm taking seasonale (4 periods per year) and it isn't working very well.  Apparently I am getting my period like every 2-3 weeks now.

    Ever try just taking packs of pills back to back?

    I have been eating salads with tons of fish sauce, lime juice, and sugar. I think I am eating too much salt, because I feel really bloated, a few of my taste buds are popping up (they hurt), and my jaw feels really tense. TOO MUCH SALT

    Ah! so that's why my jaw is so tense and my tastebuds are inflamed! I had Pizza Hut (my pms salt-craving satisfier of choice), and now I'm experiencing all those symptoms, too!

    If I had any caramels left, I'd be dipping them in salt and munching away. As it is, I'm about to leave for the grocery store to get some of my favourite black bean salty sembei. Mmmmmmm....

    what do you mean take pills back to back? seasonale? or regular bcps? I'm confused.

    glad to see I am not the only one in pain here. I had 2 inflamed tastebuds, but one went away and I still have one left. Thank goodness I don't have any fever blisters. I get those all the time and consuming fish sauce, lime juice, and tomatos together while having one is not a good idea.

    I almost bought some sembei on saturday. That is the last thing I need :biggrin:

    My daughter just takes her regular pills back to back, skipping the "spacer" pills. Every three months or so she'll take a break. It works well for her. I was concerned and talked to our family doctor about it, but she said that doctors and nurses have been doing it for years. She was a chief resident in an ER department, and she said she personally went two years without a period.

    Just wait until you get to my end of the spectrum. I am of that "certain age" where everything is trying to shut down. Family history of hormone related breast cancer, so replacement therapy is out of the question - I get my period every two or three weeks - and it is BRUTAL - then I go two or three months without one - also BRUTAL because it is pregnancy scare time (even though it is highly unlikely, one ovary and tubes tied) and the last thing I need at my age is a baby. PMS seems to be a constant for the last couple of years. I can't wait until it settles down.

    I keep gallon bags of boiled peanuts in the freezer to take care of my salt craving. Then my feet feel like I'm walking on sharp rocks due to the water retention.

    Yep, I get a little grumpy sometimes...

  3. Please people its "a quick dip in leftover" jus  not leftover au jus...chalkboard meet nails.

    As far as standing rib goes, I have normally done the sear first and low to finish, but I tried the Paula Deen method a few months ago and I must while it doesn't appeal to most purists it actually works very well.  375 for an hour. Turn oven off and leave it closed for 3 hours. Do not open the oven door for any reason whatsoever. A quick reheat about 30 mins before serving at 375 and then a 15-20 minute rest.  I did this on a 4 ribber and it came out final temp of 130. Very pleased with the roast and something that requires very little ability to get very acceptable results.

    I stand corrected.

    :biggrin:

  4. Help!

    Last night we cooked a rib eye roast - kind of fun!  But it is a little too rare as leftovers.    What will happen if I put it back into the oven for a short bit?    Should I even attempt this or just microwave the slices  or  what ... someone please help.

    I wouldn't nuke it, personally. Thinking back I don't believe I have ever rewarmed one in the oven whole, but I don't see why not as long as you let it sit out a bit to come closer to room temp. I normally go the sandwich route with a quick dip in the leftover au jus to warm then onto a crusty toasted roll with more au jus, maybe some cheese. Yum.

  5. Is all US beef just beef? Here (at least in the better butchers) you can choose which breed, length of aging, and they will tell you the feed, age, provenance and history of the animal. THis is partly because of the better record keeping following the BSE scare

    Local Dexter, grass fed killed at 30 months and aged for 4 weeks for me.

    I'm jealous. Would love to get that personal with my cow, but although it is possible at some specialty meat purveyors, it tends to be rather pricey and out of range for your average person.

    Beef is graded in the states: Prime - Choice - Select.

    http://meat.tamu.edu/beefgrading.html

    It is not realistic to expect to be able to buy Prime beef in the US at almost any price. Somebody, somewhere (fine restaurants and beef billionaires I suppose) in the US has cornered the market and it is just incredibly scarce. What is sold as prime is often top of choice, and is very good. What is in the typical grocery store is select, but Whole Foods and such places carry Choice. Breed specific beef is becoming the thing lately, once again at a premium.

    I like the Certified Angus Beef program and it is a good compromise. But you still have to be careful, because much that is sold as "Angus" in the grocery stores isn't really. In fact, the "Certified Angus" isn't really a purebred Angus either, just shows enough traits of the Angus breed that it passes. It is more affordable than the designer meat out there, and is very good.

    http://www.certifiedangusbeef.com/

    I've eaten quite a bit of the Certified Angus, and have always been pleased.

    After working with a beef company on a project it is amazing I still have an appetite for meat, but I do.

  6. While I'm generally a fan of the low and slow, there is a lot to be said for both methods.  I've done a lot of ribs over the years, and one this past weekend that was just terrible.  Hate to admit it....  but gotta be honest.  There are issues that are out of our control.  This was just a bad piece of meat.  Bought from the same butcher 6 or 7 times... all just wonderful.  This time... yuk.  Low and slow gives you a little more leeway with regard to meat quality.  If you get stuck with one a little lower in quality, the time will give the collagen a better chance to dissolve.  Also makes it a little harder to overshoot your desired temperature.  The high temps, on the other hand, give you a wonderful flavor and crust.  I think next time around, ..... may try a low and slow, let it rest for half hour, and then crank the BGE to 800 or so, and do a 2nd cook for about 5 minutes, just to build the crust....

    There's nothing more dissappointing than a bad piece of meat, is there? I got one about a year ago that was absolutely devoid of flavor. I was really sad.

  7. If I do try to make my own cream cheese, is it ok to let the cheese drip out in my porch (it is screened but not heated)? I mean, with all the snow and ice, it will be sufficiently cold enough to let the curds drip there?

    I would think it would be fine as long as it is not cold enough to freeze the curds. That would be pretty gross.

    I think some people do thier drying in the fridge. I do mine in the kitchen because it comes out cheesier.

  8. First of all, are we talking USDA Grade Prime meat or the generic apellelation that is used these days for a properly termed 'Standing Rib Roast'?

    I purchase my Prime USDA Grade Rib Roast from Zier's in Wilmette, Illinois. Is is dry aged 21 days at the store. Aging in your refrigerator for a few days accomplishes nothing and merely deludes yourself into thinking you have accomplished something significant.

    The debate and screwy methods of cooking cause me mirth because nothing could be simpler than cooking a true Prime Rib Roast. Pepin has a method that chefs have been using for eons.

    Season, sear in a hot oven, cook at somewhat reduced temperature above 300F( I remove when internal temp is just above 100F) and the let rest for a long time(at least an hour). Simple/works. -Dick

    I agree that the quality of the meat is the first concern.

    Prime is almost never found, and when it is it is quite often "accidentally" mislabeled. What is served and sold as "prime" bears very little resemblance to the prime of 75 years ago.

    The rib roast in the store is no better than "select" - twp grades down from prime - and,that's a fact.

    Top of choice is not bad at all. In fact, most would be surprised that it was choice. Including people who have long believed they were eating prime.

    I agree that dry aging is difficult in a home fridge, but there are modifications that could be made to a fridge to accomadate the requirements. I'm not big on dry aging, so I will stop here out of ignorance.

    Presalting is a seperate issue from dry aging.

    I see you like your beef rare! Good for you!

    I think the time honored way of cooking this roast is to shove it on a spit and keep turning it until you can't stand not eating it anymore.

    :biggrin:

    It is funny, but it is so much fun playing around with a big hunk of meat you know will take a great deal of effort to make inedible. At it's best, it almost always ranks in one of those "best things I have ever eaten" categories.

    Indulge us, budrichard! We want to play!

  9. I am a huge cream cheese fan .. made smoked salmon cornets last night filled with cream cheese, butter (for good mouthfeel), freshly ground black peppercorns, fleur du sel, and green onions .. it was definitely delicious next to the potato pancakes ....

    gallery_10011_1589_195769.jpg

    That is so pretty! Makes me want to snag one and scarf!

  10. Wow I've never seen a cream cheese recipe for homemade cream cheese before...I am someone that makes a lot of cheesecakes and I'm gonna try that out! thanks for the info

    Robert

    Chocolate Forum

    Let me know how it comes out for you. I have only ever used the all buttermilk version, never the whole milk version. Whole milk sort of scares me about this recipe for some reason. I've never had a flop, or anything even remotely close to a flop. You just have to plan ahead.

    In my opinion, it is fresher and cleaner homemade.

  11. annecros--tell me about feeding the dough you saved and how to refresh it, please!!  I would love to try this to get a bit more sourness in the bread. 

    Thanks!

    Oh, it is so standard. Equal portions flour and water. I am sure others here who have more experience with sour doughs will chime in, and I am honestly incredibly inprecise in my cooking! I think this is why this recipe appeals to me on such a gut level.

    I pinch off a tablespoon of the ferment before I shape and dump it into a glazed crock that would otherwise be gathering dust on a shelf. 4 tablespoons of flour (been half and half rye/bread flour lately, just because) then because the ferment is stiffer, 6 tablespoons of cold water, stir it up (but casually, so that the dough will not think it is important or something) with a wooden spoon, cover it with the lid and ignore it. The next morning after about two cups of coffee I have the "climb" on the side of the inside of the crock ("they" tell me you look for this, and it sort of looks like refuse on the inside of a milk glass that a teenager has left on the dresser, in all honesty, I think it is where the dough puffed up and then blew out) and the liquid inside is full of tiny bubbles. I dump about a third of it out, go back in with 3 tablespoons of flour and 3 tablespoons of water, stir it nonchalantly while talking to someone else in the room or the TV, cover it with the lid. Ignore it until late afternoon when I make up the next batch of dough. I then dump it into the flour, salt, yeast stir up then add water for a shaggy ball.

    I have had much better success recently in proportion to the amount of inattention I pay to the loaf. In fact, I am almost convinced that ignoring it is a vital step in the process.

    :biggrin:

    Third loaf is cooling now, and fourth crock of goop is being ignored. Will let you know how it comes out.

  12. Do you like fresh cheese in general? Some people don't, but honestly the silver wrapper won't be fresh, just "freshish" cheese.

    Hubby and myself like this one, homemade quark:

    http://www.natureparktravel.com/eating&drinking/quark.htm

    He giggles when he gets home and sees a laden dish towel hanging from the handle of one of our cabinets. He scoops out the curd and throws in fruit or spreads it on toast. Great for cheesecake, if you are into the European style.

    alanamoana, yep, though I like other things better, I would be happy to take a swipe at the foil covered rectangle any day! Straight up!

  13. Anne, there is usually just two of us so I often roast small prime ribs with just one rib. 

    I usually follow  Barbara Kafka's high heat method (Roasting a Simple Art) which starts the roast at 500°F for 45 minutes and then makes some adjustments depending on the size.  But for small roasts like last nights,  I just start and finish at 500F.

    Ann

    Thank you. I'll have to give it a whirl!

    :smile:

  14. K8memphis,

    you have to be really careful about what you read in diet books. The title "Doctor" seems to have no connection to the veracity of the information. Medical schools do not teach nutrition, and they do not teach people how to do research.

    Any information that isn't backed by a study that's been published in a peer reviewed journal is about as compelling as heresay.

    Notable authors who made careers out of citing unpublished studies include Dr. Atkins and Bary Sears (the guy behind "The Zone"). The real journals are full of studies contradicting almost everything these two ever said. But it didn't stop them from selling boxcars worth of diet books.

    Do yourself a favor and look for real studies on the subject. You might even find some reviews of this particular doctor's claims.

    Have you seen the peer reviewed studies that concluded that the Atkins diet actually lowered cholesterol in individuals who had problems controlling cholesterol otherwise? I guess I have to go dig them up, but I remember reading them when I kind of scolded my sister who had a gastric bypass for being on Atkins. Had to eat crow. Prefer mine stuffed and roasted, though braised is my next experiment when I am forced to eat it.

    All PhD's who are in the medical profession are "practising" and there is so much they don't know about individual's, genetics, and the variations within the population and gene pool. That kind of bothers me about studies, blanket bans, and a nanny state telling me I must not eat something. It is so individualized - if it makes you feel better physically then do it. If you feel like crap, well stop that!

    You would be amazed at how many doctors use just this method to determine drug dosages, diet and exercise reccomendations.

  15. ...Since we all have our own opinions, it seems to me that the only way to preserve my freedom to eat what I want is to preserve the freedom of others to eat whay they want, even if others happen to want to eat things like trans fats.

    That's it in a nutshell. For me, and in my opinion.

    Me three. But except for head cheese--I can't even stand to look at it much less think of what's in there. Spam now is ok. Head cheese is out. :raz:

    Corn syrup and cake mix would probably run second & third, ahh...

    :laugh:

    Sorry babe. Hubby loves a hunka, hunka head cheese (gross to me). But, he tolerates my (inexplicable to him) preference for dumping ketchup on deep fried chicken livers (he can't understand not smothering them in the onion gravy, I make for him).

    We got each other's back!

    Corn syrup? How else would I make marshmallows for my children to stuff themselves with empty calories?

  16. Jmahl, Mark, Two beautiful prime ribs, cooked two different ways.  Guess it is just a matter of personal preference.  Not that one is superior to the other.

    I favour the High Heat method.  I roasted a small one rib prime rib last night, just big enough for two thick slices.  I took it out of the oven when it was at 115°F and the temperature went up to 129°F while it rested.  Next time I'll take it out closer to 110°F so that it doesn't go over 125°F.  I also pre-salted for 24 hours.    I've pre-salted chicken and pork but never beef before. 

    gallery_27944_2966_621380.jpg

    Now, there is NOTHING wrong with that hunk of meat! Good job Ann T.

    When you say high heat, do you mean high heat throughout the roasting process? Or start and stall kind of high heat?

    I'm just wondering if this is the solution to small roasts. With just hubby and I, the only time I buy a small roast is when it is on sale and then I cut it into steaks when I get home. Maybe there is a way to roast a one rib roast that gives you decent results?

    Looks like you have done well with it.

  17. I mean I don't know how the kids in Dublin got rickets. To use your same argument, are you saing that eating whole wheat stuff gives you the rickets? No, of course not. They were in yet another of Ireland's famous famines, starving.  They obviously needed some vegetables & stuff huh?

    Well, honestly you are right, more than dairy and whole wheat were rationed during that war. Including sugar, gasoline, coal and chocolate. I don't see any "correlative" studies done on the famine concluding that the lack of sugar, gasoline, coal and chocolate contributed to rickets.

    I thought citrus was the cure all for that particular malady? I'm sure they were hard to come by in war era Ireland as well.

    I think if you approach a "study" with a preconceived intention of the outcome, people tend to consciously or subconsciously stack the deck in order to reach the conclusion they are looking for so desperately.

    Everything in moderation, including moderation.

  18. Anne~

    with a large chunk o' meat like this, how far in advance will you presalt?

    I can't wait. My favorite meal of the year  :wub:

    Kathy

    At least 24, but maybe as much as 36 or 48 hours. Honestly, this is the first time I have oven roasted more than 5 ribs. I have smoked a whole rib though, but seasoned it a little differently with a cajun style rub, and I went with 48 for that both times. I think of it as a sort of very short dry aging almost, and I am partial to that tang of salt from the crust as a contrast to the pure beefiness of the interior. It crusts up nicer from the drying and salting in the fridge as well, from my experience.

    My favorite meal as well! :wub: Hubby usually requests this for his birthday in October, but things just didn't work out with the timing last fall. He's just as excited as I am, and is the one that dubbed the roast "Junior."

    I just wish I had more opportunity to experiment, as it is I eat so much I sweat suet the next day!

    If Junior behaves himself, I may have to take pics and post his "coming out" party.

  19. I would love to see someone do high and low heat method side by side, with the other variables kept the same. Which would mean starting the low heat one a lot earlier, so you eat them at the same time.

    My inclination is always for more fire: I love the crisp skin and the deep roasted flavors that only come from a healthy dose of the maillard reaction, which won't even occur below 300 degrees. In the last week I roasted cornish hen and pork tenderloin at 550 degrees, and chicken at 500. All came out tender, juicy, and with a crisp, mahogony brown finish with deep, complex roasted flavors.

    I have no doubt that I'd like the browned crust of the high temperature roast more; what would be interesting to compare is the meat on the inside. I'd expect to see more of a gradient from well done to extremely rare in the high temp version, and I'd also expect it to retain more moisture overall. but i have no sense of which would produce more tender or flavorful meat in the middle.

    Then there are the 2 temperature methods people mention. If it's a tossup between high and low, maybe the dual approach would give the best off both worlds.

    I have seen some who start on high (for a shorter time frame than blast and off), turn off, then finish low - so I think there are about three variations. I've never seen high for the duration, but I would imagine you would get a larger gradient. Wish I had two or three home ovens and two or three roasts to play with.

    Roasting in the oven I blast and then off. Now smoking, low and slow is the only way to go, IMO.

    Starting with a quality product has the most effect on taste and tenderness, I think. I do blast roast chicken pretty good, but Turkey I go low and slow. Big fan of presalting here as well, in all cases where I have a hunk of meat.

  20. I pull at 120-122.  I find anything more makes the roast more well done than I would like, once you factor in the resting time.

    Makes sense. 120 it is, and for the minority that likes it better done, they can just boil their piece in au jus or stick with the ribs if they must!

  21. This is Jack's method.
    Yumm!

    I'd go more extreme: 140F/60C oven and cook to 135F/57C - about 12 hours or longer. The very long cooking times helps the collagen dissolve, giving super tender meat.

    If you look carefully at your photo you will see that the outer half inch or so is grey and overcooked, and the meat has lost a lot of juice into the dish. Cooking at an even lower temperature will stop the outside overcooking, and the juices escaping. You will need to sear the outside first though.

    Yeah, I love the leftovers too. Additionally, my kids are young adults that bring gladware with them to haul leftovers home in after any family gathering. Junior just may remain intact. Funny, for our crowd, 17 pounds of Turkey would seem like cutting it too close for dinner, take aways and leftovers.

    What is Jack's method? I sort of searched for it, but got too many results.

    I don't sear the outside unless it is a small roast either. With the blast and turnoff, the crust is very nice and crispy, especially with an overnight salted and seasoned.

    I think you'll have less leftovers than you think! :smile:

    Doh! Thanks Marlene, I see it now. Our crowd ranges in the doneness factor (I'm solidly a true MR from the middle of the roast, stepdaughter and son like the better done end cuts) so roasting the whole thing may give us a bit better range to keep everyone happy. I am thinking of cooking to 125, but may stop at 120.

    Still meditating.

  22. I've got a 6 bone Prime rib to do for Christmas and I'm serving 8-9 people.  I'm cooking the whole thing.  It makes great sandwhiches the next day!  I make a lot of Prime Rib roasts and  I do not subscribe to the low and slow method for Prime Rib.  I believe there's a thread around here somewhere where I tried Jack's method and there was no real noticeable difference to me.  For anything smaller than a three bone roast, I'll sear the outside first, but anything larger, is going to crisp up quite nicely on its own in the oven, particularly if you are using convection and brush the outside with a little olive oil.

    Yeah, I love the leftovers too. Additionally, my kids are young adults that bring gladware with them to haul leftovers home in after any family gathering. Junior just may remain intact. Funny, for our crowd, 17 pounds of Turkey would seem like cutting it too close for dinner, take aways and leftovers.

    What is Jack's method? I sort of searched for it, but got too many results.

    I don't sear the outside unless it is a small roast either. With the blast and turnoff, the crust is very nice and crispy, especially with an overnight salted and seasoned.

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