phaelon56

And I had a simlar experience three years ago - adequate but not highly polished service, underwhelming food, small portions and despite one of us having the price fixe lunch - a very high tab (no alcohol or one glass of house wine -can't recall which). Based on reports I'd seen here at the time my experience was an anomaly. But it appears that the demon of inconsistency has reared its head again?

8 miles might have been a slight exaggeration but even 4 - 6 miles can be a real trek from Rutherford depending on the time of day. Where I'm living now (small city in central NY with low population density) I can hop in the car at dinner time and drive 4 - 6 miles in perhaps 10 - 12 minutes (or less). In many small NJ boros the trip can easily take 2X that time at peak traffic hours - not conducive to driving too far for take-out.

How timely. I change the gaskets on the commercial machines at work every six months but just never got around to changing mine at home. Have had my Isomac for several years and only use it one weekends but the rubber dries out and hardens eventually even if you don't pull many shots. I'm taking my rig to a Christmas dinner tomorrow and did a gasket swap-out and dispersion screen Purocaffe scrub today. Can't wait to taste the difference in results (but not until tomorrow - it's too late to drink espresso now if I intend to sleep tonight).

I'm sad to see that the take-out situation in and near Rutherford hasn't improved in the two year since I left there - yikes. Yes NY Pizza has a good pie and also a few red sauce Italian dishes that are okay. I think there may be a place with some Italian take-out that's less typical over in East Rutherford in the street that runs from Station Square (Rutherford) over to the main drag in East Rutherford. Kind of a bakery/deli type place with antipasti and some other less common stuff. There's a very good Jamaican place on Bloomfield Ave in Bloomfield right in the middle of town - I think it's Dev's Jamaican Cuisine. Fairly authentic (so say two different Jamaican friends who have eaten there with me) and very nice family that runs it.

Oh well. FL is closed from January 1 to January 18.

Okay... it's certainly sounding as though I shoudl focus on dinner more than lunch. Thanks for all the great suggestions. The fact that DAT will be in swing is an incentive to explore more full on more evenings. And lunch FL is $225 without any wine or other alcohol? (I assume tax and 20% gratuity are included in that figure)

I've had some very good drinks at a dowtown Lladro (the one near or on Pine right behind a big hotel). Have not tried Pegasus but was very underwhelmed with Cherry Street. That was a couple years ago - maybe they've improved? The owner at Ancient Grounds pulls good shots sometimes and last time I was there he had both Lighthouse and Vivace beans. But it seemed a bit less consistent than Lladro. My big disappointment on last visit (Labor Day weekend 2006) was a machiatto at the Top Pot down under the monorail. Very bitter and poorly extracted - not good at all. But the doughnuts rocked

You can get into an Expobar E61 style machine and a decent grinder (e.g. Rancilio Rocky or its ilk) for about $1,000. Saeco should come into consideration only if you're determined to have a super-auto machine. But you need to get into super-autos at the $2,000 + price point to get one that makes even decent espresso and does an okay job of foaming milk. The cheap super-auto's make a good cup of regular coffee by the cup. The only catch on something like and Expobar / Rocky combo is it's a bit messy if many people are using it, there's a short learning curve and someone has to take responsibility for regular cleaning, backflushes etc.

I expect to be in SF this January and want to celebrate a special day with an extravagant lunch. According to their phone reservations line the French Laundry is open for lunch only Fri - Sun so that's out. I'll have a car and could venture out of the city but if a good choice is available in SF I'd just as soon take a cab there and back from the hotel. I know this is so highly subjective but here are my criteria: - Wine selection and alcohol prices are irrelevant because I don't drink - Dress code is irrelevant as I can dress up or down - Price is no object within reason but if possible I'd like to keep it to $100 - $120 max for one person with tax and tip - Great atmosphere counts - It should be a place where I'll be treated well as a solo diner and not relegated to the bar or to a crappy table - Open to any and all cuisines - Stellar desserts should be available - It would be nice if they have really good coffee - Also open to dinner but would prefer a late lunch instead Ideas?

Not just mothers... how about the millions of us who never drink alcohol and struggle to find appropriate beverage pairings for food? I'd love to see someone tackle this. On occasion I'll enjoy a non-alcoholic frozen drink or a Virgin Mary but finding non-alcoholic pairings for food is a much greater challenge. I drink Ame at home and in restaurants do enjoy a mineral water with a splash of bitters but I'd love to have more variety.

My most memorable was not a creation but was uhhhh... a food editing process. I orded a pizza "with everything on it" whilst walking home extremely hammered after an evening at my neighborhood gin mill. Was too wasted to sit there and wait for the pie to cook so I paid for delivery and walked the three blocks home. Passed out at the kitchen table and was awakened by the delivery guy (had to be close to 3 AM at this point). I awoke with a most serious hangover at noon the next day and spent a few minutes assessing the dark shriveled up bits of something that were stuck to my kitchen walls (these little critters were everywhere!). Ahhhh... anchovies! An item I love on salads and detest on pizza. It appears that I unceremoniously removed every single anchovy as I ate the pie and hurled them in random directions to discard. Food editing indeed. By the way - the pizza was terrible - the only way one could eat it was to be at least half drunk (but this pizza shop did plenty of business - tells you something about my old neighborhood back in those days).

It makes perfectly good sense to me but then again.... so do many seemingly illogical and irrational things If the Valomilk filling has marshmallow and eggwhites and is a sort of light puffy substance that is not stablized by some of the toxic goo found in freaks of nature such as Peeps... the lack of pressurization in the cargo hold of a commercial airliner might cause this. Ever flown on a flight that cruised above 30,000 feet, gotten to the hotel and discovered that your partially used bottle of hair gel had sort of sucked in on itself and was compressed? I have. But I didn't taste it to see if it was still good.

Some of them might even "evolve" from alcohol drinkers into espresso drinkers _ I did (but evolve is hardly the right word to use in my case). Yes - multiple circuits. I'd give two 20 amp circuits to that little room. The previous owner of my house upgraded the entire electrical system from incoming service right to the outlets and got 100 amp instead of 150 or 200. What was he thinking? Now I don't have enough juice left to run a 50 amp circuit to my kitchen and put a commercial 4 group espresso machine there. And that's a shame.

Further thought. If you opt for a pour-over style machine (ie.. not plumbed in) or get one that simply offers that as an option... and if one presumes that the potential client may have a strong enough interest in learning hwo to make good espresso... you could just do a flexible design that might lend itself to both a wet bar and/or an espresso and coffee bar. For those willing to learn the basics of grinding, tamping etc there are some very good "E61 style" machines in the $1,000 to $2,000 price range and some excellent grinders available for $275 to $600. But I strongly recommend against including the espresso gear as part of the purchase price. Sell someone a wet bar that includes a fancy bar blender for making frozen drinks and they won't cal you to find out the bets way top make a frozen margarita. But include some expensive (or moderately priced) espresso gear and you're sure to get calls from people wanting to better understand how to use the equipment. Best bet IMHO is to set up a space that is flexibel with all the water supply connections, drains and water filtration that they'll need for coffee or a wet bar and let them decide.

Welcome to the Coffee & Tea forum! My first espresso machine was a De Longhi that cost about $75. In most respects it's very much like the Melitta. By the way - all inexpensive pump machines tout "15 bars of pressure". No big deal as properly made espresso requires about 9 bars of pressure. You'll get more for your money in some respects by getting a "stovetop espresso maker" aka a moka pot. It produces a rich concentrated beverage that is not the same as espresso but many people find it more satisfying than espresso from a sub $200 "espresso machine". With practice and good fresh beans you can in fact produce a Cappuccino at home that will likely be as good or in many cases better than what Starbucks provides. But the serious budget challenge you mention being imposed by your husband makes it a bit tougher. The cheapest grinder you can buy that will give a consistent grind is a Solis Maestro - about $80 - $110 depending on which version and where you buy it. Or look for a Bodum Antigua at about $70 - $80. You can use a cheap blade grinder for this purpose but you'll need to shake it a few times between grind pulses and experiment to get a reasonable consistency in a fine grind (and even then it has shortcomings). Or find a good local roaster who will grind to espresso fineness, take the bag home and divvy it up into small ziplocs - each with enough for one morning worth of drinks. Store the sealed bags inside another container and pull out one at a time as need but be sure to let them thaw completely before opening the bag. It's a compromise to be sure but better than continuing to open, close and reopen a pre-ground can of Illy or Lavazza that probably wasn't all that fresh when first opened. If you still feel compelled to buy a low end espresso machine please do stick to the pump variety such as the one you referenced. The "steam driven" models are far too messy, inconvenient and inconsistent to be of any value. There's a good reason why steam toy espresso machines are most likely America's #1 Regifted Item And by the way... if you really want to produce first class espresso drinks at home a more realistic investment is about $500 for the espresso machine, $175 to $275 for a grinder and about another $100 for peripheral items (good tamper, steam pitcher, knock box, tamping mat etc.). But I can also comfortably state that when I first got my little $75 pump driven De Longhi and began using it with my $20 blade grinder.... Starbucks was the best espresso I'd ever had (not saying much) and within a month of getting that machine I was making drinks as good as or better than what I'd been paying $4 each for. And if it had turned out to be a disaster or I simply lost interest (neither of which happened) it was a small investment to lose. It's when you make the next jump in quality... after you're hooked... that you need to choose very carefully. A $200 - $250 espresso machine and a $120 grinder will get you more hooked but also more frustrated because you'll find yourself making the occasional shot that is fantastic and others that are just "okay".

I have not tried Tarallucci e Vino. But reports I've received from folks whose opinions I trust indicate that if the owner Ken Nye is manning the Faema or the right barista is working... 9th Street Espresso delivers the goods. I have tried Gimme Coffee at two of their Ithaca locations and found the espresso to be in the same league as Vivace and Victrola. Different but in the same class. Gimme has a location in Williamsburg Brooklyn (which is NYC but most folks who don't live in NYC mean Manhattan when they say "NYC"). Their consistency from store to store is excellent and I assume the Brooklyn store is as good as those in Ithaca. I've also been advised by Gimme's former barista trainer Chris Deferio that I should check out Cafe Grumpy on my next NYC visit. They're about 12 blocks away from the Billyburg Gimme - in Greenpoint Brooklyn. They have a Synesso Cyncra and are using Victrola's Streamline blend. That's a a darn good place to start. I won't claim that the shots at Casa@Cupcake Cafe are on par with the very best but they were much better than I've ever had elsewhere in Manhattan (but I still haven't gotten down to 9th Street Espresso. I'm also told that Intelligentsia will be opening a store in Manhattan. That will definitely be worth checking out once they've arrived.

Thoughts? Yes - plenty. First is that the few espresso or coffee machines available which are designed to be built-in are inherently a compromise. There's a big upcharge for that feature yet for less money you can get machines just as good. And for the same money you can get machines that are far better. How high end are you talking? If I had a customer or potential customers who would be interested in the best possible quality of drinks but with a simple mechanical installation and a short learning curve for using the gear here's what I'd sell them: 1) La Marzocco Swift grinder - auto grinds and auto-tamps and has two bean hoppers - one for decaf and one for regular beans (or two varieties of regular beans - one targeted at straight espresso and the other at milk based drinks) 2) La Marzocco GS3 espresso machine (available at some point in 2006 but not sure exactly when). It's compact, runs on 110V and allows you to either plumb in both the water supply and the drain tray or have both of them manually filled and drained. 3) You should have a 15 amp circuit for the grinder, another one for the espresso machine and a third for peripheral equipment and lighting. 4) Make sure the "plumbed in" option is available to choose from (it's so much easier). Under the counter be sure to include a cold water supply that branches off from the sink supply line and have it feed a built in cartridge style water filtration system (unless you already have a very good quality whole-house filtration system). Also include a drain with open end that the drain tray hose can empty into. This can Y into the drain running off the sink. 5) Yes - the sink. A small relatively deep sink is crucial. You'll need a place to scrub portafilter assemblies, rinse milk steaming pitchers, rinse and wring wiping cloths etc. 6) Very small refrigerator for milk - dorm size cube refrigerator under the counter should be sufficient (if it will fit). If this will see intermittent use I'd opt instead to have a small square stainless steel well in the counter with a drain. Fill it half full of ice and keep the milk in there when you'll have guests and will be using the coffee bar. 7) Knock box for grounds built into the counter or built into a drawer just under the counter. I'm sure I'll think of more later. But don't make assumptions about work flow when determining where things go. Also - an easy option is a superauto machine - there are some Franke and Schaerer machines (and even a high end Jura) in the $5,000 to $6,000 range. Some even have an auto sensor that supposedly simplifies milk steaming. But the compromises are many - you will never ever get stellar quality drinks from a superauto. Good perhaps but not good enough for anyone who's really serious about great quality in coffee and espresso. Also - if auto grinding and tamping was not crucial and you could live with having a separate pump/motor assembly under the counter it would be worth considering the Mazzer Mini-E for a grinder (you'd need two) and the Synesso Cyncra 1 group 110V machine.

Not just burnt - too strong. Consumer Reports Magazine assessed and tested a number of the major coffee chains last year or the year before - including Peet's, Caribou, Dunkin Donuts and others. Starbucks had a significantly higher percentage of caffeine per fluid ounce of drip coffee and came in at 250 milligrams per 8 oz cup. Most home brewed Arabica coffee comes in at 135 to 175 per 8 oz cup with the average chain coming in towards the higher end. Home brewed Robusta coffee (i.e. all the major "big four" brands including Maxwell House and Folger's) would tend towards the higher end because Robusta beans have more caffeine than Arabica. I think many Dunkin Donuts (perhaps all?) have coffee that tastes (to me) a bit on the weak side because they don't use enough grounds per ounce of water. I was never a fan of their blend but have tried it many times over the past 20 - 25 years and find it to be far less robust and full bodied than it used to be. IIRC Consumer Reports indicated that Starbucks publicly admits using a coffee to water ratio that has more coffee per ounce of water than the SCAA recommended levels or what other chains use. I've had their coffee brewed in people's homes when made with the standard two tbsp per 5 - 6 oz of water. It's still not a roasting style I care for but I assure you it tasted far better than it does in their shops. Interesting fact is the figure for Starbucks espresso: 70 milligrams per 2 oz double shot. The SCAA notes the average for a double shot as about 100 milligrams. Why less for Starbucks? I think the use of super-auto machines (typically slightly less weight of beans used per shot than manual machines) is one factor and reduced pull time is the other. Their "efficiency experts" have determined that a shorter pull time per shot saves time and therefore money. By reducing shot time to around 18 - 20 seconds (I believe that's about the duration they use) they save a few seconds off every transaction. Yet years and years of diligent research by Dr. Illy and countless others in the field have repeatedly found 23 - 28 seconds (most folks settle for around 25 - 26) to deliver optimal quality when all other things are equal. But I keep forgetting - that was an efficiency expert they hired - not a quality expert

I've had chicory blend coffee here in the US at some Vietnamese restaurants that use it for their cafe sua da. I don't recall any chocolate notes in the flavor profile. But I have had some espresso blends that have very distinct chocolate notes when consumed with milk.

Isn't this the joint that has all the pipes stuck in the ceiling? (as in pipes that one would smoke tobacco from) When I worked in NYC a couple of my colleagues used to take people there for business dinners. They spoke highly of the steak and quite likely never ordered any other type of entrees.

Ahhh... Fultonville. I'm always stil looking for that semi trailer on top of the structure just off the Thrueway and keep forgetting that they had to take it down - it was sort of a benchmark for me as a distance marker when I was traveling home on Rte 90 from points east. Yes - peopel everywhere really do seem to appreciate good quality coffee and really recognize it when they taste it - even when they're not real coffee aficionado's. All the big grocery stores around Syracuse like Wegman's carry multiple varietals but most of it is pre-bagged and the freshness (i.e. recent roast dates) of all of it, even the bulk stuff, is suspect to me. There are a few local independent roasters. I do the roasting for one of them but we're the only folks locally who seem to focus on a lighter roasting style that emphasizes the optimal flavor of the bean rather than dark roasting.

You missed it when I was doing that - but I was installing copper plumbing for our machines - not making a brulee top for drinks! That's pretty cool - would love to try one sometime.

Thus the beauty (for them) of their "signature" roasting style. They can buy lower grade beans (still arabica and yes they are varietals but lower grade in general) and makes any lack of unique flavor notes by dominating the flavor with the smoky undertones of overly dark beans. It also means that their blends and varietals, unlike those of true specialty roasters, will tend to have a consistent flavor profile from year to year. This is not what one should expect from an agricultrual product of this sort. After all - do cabernet grapes from a particular region taste exactly the same from year to year? It's okay with me - more growth opportunities exist for good specialty roasters. My gripe is with their expansion model and how the economics works against independent operators but that's fodder for a different thread. And "Beani" - welcome to the Coffee & Tea forum - whereabouts are you in the Mohawk Valley that you can get such a good selection of beans in your neighborhood store? Syracuse should be so lucky. But then again - I'll take a bag of "Eight O'Clock" coffee over most any Starbucks beans any day of the week.

I've been told that Caffe Trieste in North beach is worth a visit just for its status as sort of an iconic destination SF culturewise. But I have not heard that they make great espresso. You might go visit the web site for Ecco Caffe Roasters and send them an email through the address listed on their site - direct it to Andrew. They have a well earned national reputation for producing some exceptional coffees - I'm sure they can steer you one to of their wholesale customers who's doing a good job with espresso. And let me know what you find once you get to try a place. I visit the Bay area a couple times each year for my day job and have yet to have any really good espresso there.

I had brunch in Ithaca NY this weekend at Carriage House Cafe in Ithaca NY - on Stewart Ave - just down the hill from the Cornelll campus. Chris Deferio, formerly the barista trainer for Gimme Coffee, is co-managing the joint and has set up their coffee and espresso service. He's not only a championship level barista, latte artist and all-around nice guy... he's done an outstanding job with the espresso and coffee oferrings. My friends had the brie stuffed and also the almond creme stuffed French toast, I had the buttermilk pancakes and we shared garlic potatoes and Niman Farms bacon. Truly excellent breakfast/brunch food - really the best pancakes I've ever had (even better than the ones served at Rick's Blue Heaven in Key West FL - and that's high praise indeed). The latte's and machiatto's we were served at Carriage House were right up there in the top tier of any I've ever had. It's also a much more elegant and upscale atmosphere than the typical coffeehouse - even though it's a relaxed and casual setting.