phaelon56

Follow up report: Had a great trip. Ate at a few places with my cousins where they wanted to eat and also at one they recommended (mediocre to bad experiences across the board). one place I picked at random in North Beach (so-so food and terrible service), had one stellar Chinese meal with coffee biz friends and ate my birthday lunch at Chez Panisse Cafe. Mediocre to bad: - lunch at Bangkok Noodles Thai on Powell Street - dinner at Sushi Rika on Bush Street So-so food and terrible service: Cafe Figaro on Columbus Amazing Chinese food: Yuet Lee Seafood on Broadway - seafood soup, stir fried noodles with seafood, flounder with asparagus and black bean sauce and roast salt and pepper prawns. Best meal of the trip. Good food but perhaps too subtle for my taste: Chez Panisse Cafe. The spaghetti with Monterey bay Squid entrée was outstanding but polentina with Parmesan soup was bland and the blood orange with avocado and new olive oil was interesting but lacked something for my taste (and I could have made one just as good at home). I had Tomales Bay oysters to start and they were fantastic. Got a little side dish of anchovies and they appeared to be the typical oil laden canned product like one finds in any supermarket. Maybe they weren't but that's what they tasted like. Dessert was apple/cranberry crisp. Very, very good but the candied tangerine ice cream served with it definitely lacked a creamy texture - I think it was served too cold. And the "French Roast" coffee sucked. Was so smoky it tasted burnt. I believe they use coffee from Blue Bottle in Oakland for the dinner service in the downstairs restaurant area and offer it by the press pot. I wish I had that option at lunch. Thanks to all for the advice and suggestions - I only wish I could have stayed for longer. And I had some great espresso and machiatto's at the Blue Bottle Coffee kiosk in Hayes Valley as well as at Ritual Coffee on Valencia. Very good indeed. And a couple drinks at Cafe Organica that were nearly as good.

Please do let us know - we'll be curious. It looks much like a Gaggia Carezza in overall price-point and features. You can pul some very good shots with machines in that category - as mentioned previously... the challengee is consistency. But if you practice a bit and focus on eliminating the variables so all you do is adjust grind level to get the correct extraction time you should easily get espresso that's better than many independent cafe's serve - and way better than Starbucks.

I've never owned a Krups although I have owned a cheap DeLonghi ($80) and a mid range Gaggia ($300). But if you're interested in really good quality espresso at home and are alreadyconsidering a $250 investment (or thereabouts).... you should really give serious thought to biting the bullet and getting a Rancilio Silvia for about $500. The problem with $200 - $300 espresso machines is that the results can be maddeningly inconsistent even after you've mastered the techniques and some machine idiosyncrasies. Sooner or later you will find your results to be very much limited by the machine itself. Get a Silvia, refine your technique and you'll find it possible to produce truly excellent shots at home more often than not (never every time because even on commercial machines it ain't perfect). And you'll need a good grinder - about $170 - $270 for the grinder. Yes... $700 - $750 for a machine and grinder sounds like a bundle of money unless you've been down the "upgrade path" as so many of us have. Every Silvia owner I've talked to has always made it clear that although they've sometimes "wanted" a more expensive machine (vs. "needing" one) it's only been those who need to steam and brew at the same time that could truly justify getting a more expensive machine. Figure out how much you spend per year for espresso shots, latte's and cappuccino's out in cafe's. Assume you'll spend about 30 - 40% (or less) of that figure to make the same drinks at home. Now do the math on buying a $700 machine and grinder combo. Once I did that exercise I finally stopped fiddling around with cheaper machines and spent about $1400 for the espresso machine and grinder. My real payback period was about two years based on actual spending at the time. Plus I was getting better drinks than I could get in local cafés (at least where I was living back then). And I could make those drinks at home in my bathrobe on Saturday morning. Priceless. Did I mention that you must buy a really good grinder?

I just tried a Daterra for the first time and was blown away. It was the "Ecco Reserve Espresso " (which I think may have been a 2004 COE winner). It was so sweet that even the tiniest bit of raw sugar would have spoiled the flavor for me (I usually add about 1/2 teaspoon to espresso if I'm drinkiing it rather than trying to assess the taste and I also usually add about 1/4 teaspoon to most short cappa's or machiatto's). Pertinent to this thread is the fact that it was made with LM portafilter that was not bottomless but had no spout screwed on - the espresso just dropped straight out the bottom through the small opening. I wonder if that achieves some middle ground between spouted and bottomless? (from a texture or flavor perspective is what I mean)

I took one of my extra portafilter handles to a local "aqua-cut" shop to have it converted but still have to pick it up and test it. And I just spent a couple days hanging out with a coffee business friend whose opinions I hold in high regard. I inquired as to why he wasn't using the bottomless PF I saw sitting on top of his machine. He shrugged and said "because I can't taste any difference". But he's not pulling shots in a busy cafe - he pulls them just to test the coffee - and thorughly cleans any PF at the end of any session (always a good idea). I'm thinkin that for many of us it might make little to no difference. But I'll soon find out how and where my dosing, packing and tamping techniques need improvement and that's worth something to me.

These two statements alone make me unlikely to plunk down $30 although I remain intrigued. I have yet to ever hear of any coffee extraction method (other than Toddy or Filtron which are both cold methods) that properly extracted at any temp much under 200 degrees F. And a 30 second mix with a 30 second extraction? And it's true that you can't make espresso with a French press but you also can't make it with anything other than a real espresso machine. This device was briefly mentioned on the Nalgene Bottle as a Press Pot? thread. Reviewing those comments it appears to be better than I was thinking it could be but certainly up to the claims made by the manufacturer.

AFAIK the class does not travel. But why not use that as a good excuse to visit Seattle and check out the great coffee scene, food and scenery?

But don't confuse espresso machine "cleaning solutions" that have names such as Cafiza or Purocaffe with "descaling solutions". The cleaning solutions are more aggressive. Don't know about toxicity but they're pretty vile. It's essential to thoroughly flush with water after using them and then run a shot of espresso through that you throw away. If your'e using properly filtered water with a drip maker you probably won't have much scale buildup inside. I did a white vinegar flush once every 3 - 6 months when I had a drip maker but found that it took at least 4 to 5 full pots of water flush after that to get rid of the taste residue.

I use mine (which is the "mini" - makes four cups or about 25 ounces of brew at max) on the largest burner of my gas range and have never had a heat issue with the handle. I do lower the heat as soon as the water has moved north. And I keep it just high enough to keep the brew up top - no higher. The handle on mine doesn't even get hot.

The water has to be boiling to get to the upper pot but once the bulk of water has moved north (which happens quickly) you just have tiny amounts of boiling water and steam moving up the tube. This keeps the pressure and temp just high enough to prevent the coffee from traveling south but you're really NOT "boiling the coffee". If you were it would taste horrible and no one (very few) would bother with vac pots. The miniscule amount of water that enters adds just enough steam and movement to agitate the coffee in the upper pot and aid brewing. And Melitta makes a good cheap manual pour-over system. That's the only one of their products I see any value in.

My short version.... I use a grind that's a trifle coarser than I use for manual pour-over drip (Melitta) but finer than what one would use for press pot coffee. It's not requisite but I wait until the water is almost to the boil before I put the top part of the pot on. Also optional but I stir the grounds a bit to fully moisten them once the water rises to the top - as suggested by OCG (Original Coffee Geek) Mark Prince in his excellent Coffeekid.com Vac Pot Brewing Instructions It's worth noting that the water should be at a rolling or steady boil in the bottom of the pot but the bubbling you see in the top is the steam and heated water causing circulation of air and water. The brewing coffee in the upper chamber is closer to the ideal 203 - 205 range rather than being at boiling (which would ruin good coffee). I let mine stay in the upper chamber for about 4 to 4.5 minutes before removing the heat and letting the trip south start. Some folks use a shorter brew time and the electric vac pots seem to dictate a shorter brew time automatically.

Starbucks still sells vac pots in most stores but no longer the manual (i.e. heat on the stovetop) breakable type. Now they sell mostly the "Utopia" - a self-contained electric vac pot that is actually a rebadged Bodum E-Santos. The electric vac pots of this brand work best if you shim up one end with a 25 cent coin or maybe even a Loonie if you can spare one (the end where the heating plate in the base is closer to the countertop - it is an angled plate). That yields a longer brew time and IMHO a tastier cup. I use a manual vac pot at home although I also have an electric one. I prefer the greater control over brew time that the manual system allows.

Just had dinner at Corduroy (Saturday night Jan 7th). EG member Fero Style was out on leave and thus not available as our server but the two servers that handled our table were excellent. Helpful, friendly, offered brief explanations where appropriate and service was unobtrusive. Their timing was impeccable. Six course tasting menu at $65 (4 and 5 course also available at $45 and $55) Amuse: demitasse of soup - cauliflower/parm for her and butternut squash for me. I hate squash but I could have had a huge bowl of just this for dinner and been content. Then: seared scallop with chanterelles and chardonnay sauce lobster salad with cucumber slices, micro greens and basil oil sushi course of seared pepper encrusted ahi tuna cube with seasoned sushi rice braised pork belly on sautéed cabbage sliced Wagyu beef tenderloin with rutabaga Palate cleanser: pineapple sorbet with pistachio wafer Final: chocolate banana ice cream on sliced banana with chocolate tart on side Excellent Italian mineral water at $7 for the large bottle (can't recall the brand but I liked it better than Pellegrino). Did I mention that the service was fantastic? We always had exactly the right utensils on the table for each course but never ones we did not need for that course. Timing was perfect - sat down promptly at our 6:30 reservation time and finished at 9:00. We would have lingered over coffee but had tickets for a 9:30 PM show and had to jet out in a hurry. Neither of us were wowed by the sushi dish - it was okay but not a star. But the rest of the meal was superb. If I was ordering off the menu I think I'd start with soup, get either the scallops or the pork belly and finish with the same dessert. In part due to great company but also supported by truly memorable food and excellent service - one of my best nights dining out ever - anywhere. My best reference point would be a birthday dinner I had at Danube in NY four years ago. Other than Danube being set in a sumptuous and spectacularly beautiful room.... Corduroy trumped it on all counts and did it for far less money (comparable dinner at Danube four years ago was $85 per person and $14 per bottle of water). Highly recommended. Thanks to all who assisted me with info and suggestions on this gem.

I make all possible attempts to avoid buffets in Manhattan and elsewhere for a very simple reason: I consistently get better quality food in manageable portions for less money by just ordering off the menu or sticking to places that are not buffets. I'm not known for being a light eater but I'm rarely able to see any cost benefit to buffets - even if the food were always of equal quality to ordering from a menu (which it rarely is).

David Schomer's class at Caffe Vivace in Seattle. I think Bellisimo in Portland also offers some barista training but I know very little about their program - malachi might be able to weigh in with some perspective on that - he's in that neck of the woods.

No - it's "doppio" for double - as in a double shot of espresso.

Well... well... well.... look what I just stumbled across... a recent post in this forum The mystery of the elusive "short" cappuccino took me to an article at Slate magazine that referenced one of their previous pieces Starbucks vs. Its Addicts that had this to say

I have not been to Italy but in other countries where Parmalat milk is widely used there is often a tendency to steam it straight from the container at room temp rather than having it properly chilled. This interferes with proper development of the microfoam and results in poorly foamed milk, thus an inferior drink. I assume that in the better bars in Italy the milk is properly chilled?

Some claim that the Iranian variety is even better than the Spanish. I've only used Mexican and Spanish brands so I'm in no position to judge (but the Spanish stuff has more flavor per pistil than the Mexcian or so it appears). I do know that I love it in paella and notice its absence when I have paella in restaurants that don't use real saffron (meaning the great majority of paella joints in Jersey City's Ironbound section). If you're referring to products like Goya Sauzon I agree that it's widely used as a substitute but achiote is typically just for color and MSG provides the flavor component (at least it does with products like Sauzon). I happen to enjoy yellow rice made with Sauzon although I prefer saffron rice when available.

Expect to pay about $15 - $18 per pound for a true Yemeni moka coffee - there are three varieties sold in the US depending on time of year and which crop is best in a given season. There is a also a "Red Sea Blend" that's used by some as a slightly less expensive substitute to serve as the moka component in a mocha java blend. It's comprised of roughly 1/3 each Ethiopian Yirgacheffe, Ethiopian Sidamo and a Yemeni moka bean. I'v e been using Red Sea blend lately in place of Yirg in my espresso blend and it adds a very nice depth of flavor.

Thanks for the update Nathan. That's an excellent review you posted a link for. The differences seen in espresso when temps are adjusted even 1/2 a degree are remarkable. I'll be very curious to hear your take on how the blends you work with compare to what you experienced with them before either in a shop or at home (did you have an espresso machine at home before the Cyncra?).

If I recall correctly there is music playing inside Murky Coffee but I don't remember it being at a very high volume level on either of my visit there. But when the weather is warm enough there is some outside seating - it's a lively and pleasant neighborhood to sit in with your coffee or espresso. Object all you wish but it's not arrogance when it's not made as a categorical blanket statement (and in this thread no one has claimed that Americans in general are on a widespread basis making better cappuccino than the average Italian cafe). I've seen comments to this effect in multiple places from multiple people who are not connected to each other and have no vested interest in making false claims. These are folks who are well read, well traveled and have an appreciation for good food and drink of all types. Also - the claim is not that American coffee shops or espresso cafes in general are routinely serving cappuccino superior to that routinely served in Italy. Rather, the assertion is that there is a handful of dedicated coffee artisans here in the US (and the number is growing) who are serving drinks equal to or even better than some of the best places in Italy. Yes there's far far more crappy espresso and cappuccino served in the US than in Italy - no question about it. But there's also a small but growing wave of quality driven espresso purveyors in the US who are routinely serving up top shelf drinks and constantly testing, experimenting and striving for even more consistency and quality. By virtue of my personal interest and travels I've been fortunate enough to sample espresso in a number of these shops and can personally attest to the quality. By virtue of the same travel (usually for business when I have no choice in the destination) I can also confirm how truly wretched the great majority of espresso drinks are that are served up both by chains and many independent shops in the US. As for price - here in the US there is no governmental price control for coffee or espresso drinks. In Italy when such drinks are served at the stand-up bar the pricing is regulated by the Italian government. I'm told that if you sit down and order the same drinks through table service you can expect to pay the same price or possibly even more than you would in the US.

I think I'll be there for dinner on Saturday Jan 8 - the night before RW starts. I'm meeting with a friend for a special dinner but not a group thing. Any thoughts from this group on Restaurant Eve as an option? I'm not sure I can get a table there for that night on this short a notice but they have some stellar coffee offerings (a rarity in the world of fine dining) that I'd really like to try. PM me to discuss so we can keep this thread on topic with Corduroy as the focus. And assuming that I do end up at Corduroy (which appears highly likely) - any ordering suggestions?

Go to Murky Coffee on Capitol Hill - you'll get a very good cappuccino with a properly made ristretto shot and expertly textured milk. Not anymore. Portland has Stumptown Roasters, Chicago has Intelligentsia, Ithaca and NYC have Gimme Coffee (Ithaca also has the excellent new Carriage House Cafe), DC has Murky and nearby Timonium MD has Jay's Shave Ice and Kona Coffee. These are just a few that I know about outside of Seattle but there are many many more that are doing it the right way and new ones are popping up regularly.

Mario Batali claims that the best cappuccino in the world (at least that's he has tasted) is available in the Rome airport - at a stand on the left just after you pass through customs. By chance have you tried cappuccino or espresso there?