philadining

Well, yeah, we start all meals with one of those, as an amuse bouche, I figured that was understood....

I wouldn't bother with Philips in your last few weeks... Big thanks for your other comments, I'm going to check some of those spots out... Totally agree on Olive Tree being quite nice, have heard similar so-so things about Mundo and Tapas, but haven't tried them myself.

From Table Talk today

I'm not sure if this is helpful at all in this context of the home kitchen, but I thought a technique I've witnessed could be inspiring. I just got back from a crêpe pilgrimage to Toronto I make from time to time. The place that keeps drawing me back is called Le Papillon, and they make their crêpes on a big flat-top grill. They're never flipped, stacked or moved: the batter is poured onto the flat-top, troweled-out to a paper-thin film, then as it starts to set-up, the fillings are put on top, while it's still on the grill, then it's folded-up, put on a plate, and served immediately. (This one had bacon, cheddar and apples in it) I know not many of us have huge flat-tops at home, but I thought some of the technique could be useful: the texture of these crêpes is mind-blowing, they're both crispy and soft, elastic yet firm. And I think that comes from the heat on one side only, and from their not ever sitting in a stack. I've seen a similar technique in Paris, at a little place that used the smaller, domed Breton griddles. They too never flipped the crêpes, just put the filling on as the batter firmed-up (I don't know how they managed to prevent the ingredients from rolling off the convex surface, I chalked it up to pure intimidation.) Moments later, the edges were folded-in, the whole thing got slid onto a plate, and we were eating it seconds later. Those had the same multi-textural thing going on, and were excellent. So I'm thinking that this could be done in a pan, at home, one would just need to work fast, or maybe have more than one pan going, but make the whole thing, not just the crêpe part, maybe even holding the filled item in a warm oven for a short time as you get a few together. I'm not sure if I'll have time to try this myself soon, but if so, I'll report back...

I'll agree with some of the above posts, if it's a nice day, wandering around Rittenhouse Square, and maybe getting something to eat in the park is a nice idea. You can certainly get provisions and assemble something yourself from DiBruno's (or they'll make you a nice sandwich) and DiBruno's is a good foodie stop no matter what. But also keep in mind that a few blocks west on Chestnut is Primo Hoagies, for a very Philly kind of sandwich. (Yo Mummer, what's the address? Oddly their website doesn't list that one!!)

I have to say that I'm with the V on this one, re where and when to walk: Philly is a very walkable city, and you certainly should do that within reason, but it is a big city, and especially as a visitor, you should err on the side of caution... Like Sandy, I've been walking all over the city, after dark, for years, in my case over 20 years. And although I only ended up in the hospital that one time, that was enough.... and there have been plenty of times that I've avoided trouble by knowing what routes to take and what ones to avoid, which is not always easy for visitors in an unfamiliar town. The biggest problems in the routes you describe aren't with "bad" neighborhoods, but with empty ones. The odds are small, but running into someone with bad intentions is MUCH worse when there's nobody else around...And additionally, although central Philly is very walkable, there are some stretches that are just long enough, and not especially interesting, that you'd be well-served to just hop on the subway, or in a cab. This is just my opinion, but I'd suggest this: for the sake of scale and safety, you should have no reluctance to walk anywhere in the real center of center city, between front street and 24th in the east-west dimension, and between South Street and Vine in the north-south dimension. Of course there are plenty of areas outside of that which are just fine, you don't have to stop at those borders, but just keep your heads-up once you cross them. In fact keep your head up all the time. It's pretty safe in center city, but it's still a big city... As mentioned above, through South Philly, on 9th or 10th, or on Passyunk, you're in pretty good shape. You could probably feel pretty good walking all the way up or down Broad street, the question is whether you want to bother, when you can whip down to the stadium on the subway, unless there's something in particular you wanted to see along the way. It's not an impossible walk by any means, but it's long.... Up around the Art Museum, and Fairmount in the 20s, you're pretty good. In Northern Liberties, around the Standard Tap, that immediate vicinity is pretty mellow, but walking up there is just a bit tedious, if not overtly hazardous. There's just a whole lot of nothing between Spring Garden and Race, that makes the hike a little boring, and maybe hazardous late at night. Again, it's not as if society stops functioning outside of the areas mentioned, you won't be attacked by bands of raiding Vikings if you step over the borders I mentioned. I'm quite sure you could walk safely through the vast majority of the city, especially if staying on major streets. You don't want to avoid particular neighborhoods, but you do want to avoid sparsely-populated stretches between them, especially after dark. And it may be hard to predict where those are, as visitors. And more to the point, hopping on public transit is just going to make sense occasionally, as opposed to wearing yourself out with especially long hikes.

The best meal I've had in Rochester in a long time was sadly undocumented with photos (what was I thinking?!?) and was a bit unexpected. I'd generally given up looking for restaurants in Rochester offering creative contemporary cuisine, they never seemed to quite get it, and were always disappointing compared to what I could find in larger cities. But I was pleasantly surprised by Sienna. 151 St Paul Street (at Andrews) 585-546-4070 www.siennagrillandbar.com They not only offer a fairly creative menu, but from my one dinner there, it seems that they generally pull it off. I always find it a good sign when I have a hard time deciding between several menu items, and it also bodes well when I have to arm-wrestle my brother over which of us gets to order something... The menu posted on the website is not exactly what was offered the night we were at the restaurant, and we were told they were about to change the menu again, to focus on some more summery offerings, so the specific dishes we enjoyed may not be available much longer. But I think it's safe to extrapolate that it's worth taking a risk one whatever the kitchen's making. They were a bit too crazed to offer it the night we were there (a few large parties were clearly torturing them...) but our waiter told us that they usually offer a tasting menu on fridays and saturdays. I look forward to checking that out next time I'm in town. There was a nice selection of breads, 3 or 4 types, the rye-ish one with a salty crust was especially good. We started with: Chestnut Soufflée with Frisée and Pancetta, dressed with Buerre Noisette Vinaigrette This featured an airy, sweet, earthy disc of chestnut souflée, surrounded by fresh, slightly bitter greens, and nicely crisped cubes of salty pancetta. I liked it a lot. Grapefruit, Shaved Fennel, Watercress, with Pistachio-Crusted Goat Cheese, Caramelized Honey-Ancho Chile Vinaigrette This suffered a bit from the ingredients being presented in discrete piles, but the interplay of the peppery watercress, the bright fennel root, and the rich cheese was very nice, once forced to mingle. Sienna Salad with Mixed Field Greens, Toasted Pinenuts, Sun-Dried Tomatoes, Crumbled Bleu Cheese tossed in Balsamic Vinaigrette A pretty straightforward salad, but well-executed. Entrées: Sienna Trio of Pork: Braised Pork Belly, Pork Tenderloin, House-made Pork Sausage with Sweet and Sour Escarole, Roasted Fingerling Potatoes, topped with Warm Smoked Sweet Onion Vinaigrette This was WAY better than I ever could have expected, I was pretty shocked to see a braised pork belly on the menu in Rochester... But that belly was beautifully done, the fat nicely rendered out, with just a touch remaining under the crisp skin, to provide that requisite decadent mouthfeel. The tenderloin was miraculously juicy, assertively smoky, and fork-tender. And the sausage, served as a small tower of un-cased meat, had a bold flavor that contrasted nicely with the other two elements. But what put this dish over the top was the excellent escarole, which played the part of an elegant saurkraut. Potatoes were well-cooked as well, and were complimented by the vinaigrette. An excellent dish, sadly i suspect it'll be off the menu until the fall or winter... Pan-Roasted Duck Breast, with Duck Confit Strudel, Baby Carrots, Pomegranate Glaze The breast was a pretty conventional presentation, but quite tasty, especially with the tart pomegranate sauce. But the exciting part was the strudel. I'd assumed this would be a "streudel," you know, something bearing some vague structural relation to the inspiration. But no, this was a pretty straight-ahead streudel, sweet and flaky, pretty good as a dessert, but with shreds of duck leg in it. And it worked. Prime Rack of Lamb in Macadamia and Mint Pesto Crust, served atop Sauteed Swiss Chard and Toasted Almond Mashed Potatoes Again, no big innovations here, just good lamb, perfectly cooked. And the Swiss Chard was great, an excellent foil for the meat. The potatoes were simply sprinkled with some toasted almonds, which tasted better than it sounds... Portions were very generous, so it was all we could do to share one dessert, a super-dense chocolate cake, topped with Guinness Ice Cream. Again, no big surprises, just really tasty. Sienna has a full bar, with decent wines by the glass, ranging from acceptable house offerings, to some outrageously expensive "premium" selections. Selections by the bottle were nicely varied, and I really appreciated the availability of a few half-bottles as well. Service was very professional, informed and friendly (with only a bit of mangling of the French language...) although the overall pacing of our meal was pretty bad. We had an 8:30 reservation, but weren't seated until well after 9, and didn't get our salads until just about 10. Entrees were a little slow, but not as bad as the rest of the night. Normally, I'd be pretty pissed about this, but we could see that there were 3 large groups that were bogging them down, and the host and waiter were quite apologetic about the pacing. They probably could have been a bit more gracious, we really did wait a pretty outrageously long time to get started, I think some drinks could have been sent our way... but we could see what was happening, it was largely out of their control, short of turning a hose on one of the tables, so we had some sympathy. The prices a re a bit steep for Rochester, but seemed quite worth it for what we got. Two cocktails ($6-7ish) a half bottle of Pinot Noir ($20ish) three apps, three entrees, one dessert, came to about $200 after tax and tip. This was one of the most interesting and satisfying meals I've had in Rochester. This kitchen could hold its own in a much bigger city, showing some real creativity along with good basic execution, and insistence on good ingredients. I look forward to returning when I'm back up that way, hopefully for a tasting menu.

I'll agree that she makes great pasta. And for those not following the thread from the top, she's the pasta chef at Penne. Penne Restaurant 3600 Sansom St. Philadelphia, PA 19104 215-823-6222 www.pennerestaurant.com/

King and I 1455 E Henrietta Rd Rochester, NY 14623-3117 (716) 427-8090 I can't visit Rochester without a few visits to The King and I. It's solid Thai food, a bit smoothed-out for broad appeal, but occasionally exceptional. They've gotten very popular and a couple of years ago expanded to a larger location, and as one might expect, that expansion had led to a bit of assembly-line, crowd-pleasing, formulaic food and service, but there are still worthwhile things to eat. And even if the entrees sometimes all start looking alike, the same piles of ingredients with a different sauce, those ingredients are generally pretty good, and the sauces distinctive and flavorful. It's probably not going to please the Thai purist, but there's some good food here nonetheless. I have a sentimental attachment to the place, as we accidentally stumbled in there a few hours after they opened on their first day in business. And it's also really close to my mother's house, so it's really nice to have this as the default, easiest place to to grab a bite. Satay is pretty standard, but well-executed, with good peanut sauce and cucumber salad. Springrolls have good crispy wrappers (they're available un-fried as well) but the fillings are a bit stringy and hard to bite-through. The can be had in veggie or shrimp-filled versions. Decent. Tom Yum is redder than most renditions of this I see, from some extra tomato in the broth, but it's quite delicious. Tom Kar Kai is excellent with lots of chicken, mushrooms, tomato, and an assertive kick from lemongrass and galangal. I like it spicier than they serve it, but there's good chili oil on the table that does the trick. Sesame Beef is probably my favorite thing they serve, and one of the best things I've ever eaten anywhere. It's unbreaded beef, marinated in what seems like soy, sesame, sugar, I'm sure a few more things, then charcoal-grilled. It has a general flavor profile somewhat like Korean Bulgogi, sweet and earthy and very charred around the edges. It's served with a sweet cabbage slaw that compliments it well. I can rarely resist getting this, even if I had intended to get a curry dish... Chicken Cashew has got a subtle spice, and a good crunch from the nuts. Pork Curry is made without coconut milk, and has a slightly salty, intense flavor. Sweet and Sour Vegetables was neither cloyingly sweet, nor florescent red. The versions with chicken, or whatever, feature stir-fried meat, not breaded-deepfried nuggets. Chicken Chu Chee was smooth and creamy and nutty, always a bit hit at the table. Pad Thai is pretty standard, but not bad at all. They offer a pretty amazingly wide array of curries, all helpfully described inside the front cover of the menu. Pretty much everything is available in a vegetarian version if desired. They have a variety of beer and wine, and a killer semi-frozen lemonade that really hits the spot if you've ordered something especially spicy (there are a few things... ) Service can be a bit brusque, occasionally maddeningly hurried. At lunch, if you haven't ordered soup before you've fully settled in your seat, they seem a little put-out. Even at dinner, certain servers can be hovering, pushing for an order, and dropping the entrees when you're a few bites into your appetizers. Still, it's generally good food, and a good value, so I'll put up with it, or intentionally pace my ordering to space-out my meal. And of course the real reason to go is for the special Michelob Noodles...

Well, I'm going to swim against the tide and agree with DT Barton, to say that the gnocchi I've had at Ralph's, including pretty recently, have always been pretty strong. Not as elegant as others, but good. As for the restaurant Gnocchi, I like the place, and have enjoyed other things I ordered, but ironically, the gnocchi did gnot gnock my socks off. Not terrible, but the texture just didn't seem right. But you could do worse...

I've really liked the gnocchi at Felicia's, but it's been a couple years since I've gone. The vibe should be right, not too fancy, but still nice. The only problem could be that the main dining room is up a couple of steps, if that creates a mobility issue. 1148 S. 11th Street

And after that spicy lamb, I needed some palate-cooling. Thankfully a few hundred yards away was a branch of Abbotts Frozen Custard. Chocolate Almond Vanilla with Chocolate chips. As you can probably see, this is no the typical soft-serve, machine-pumped frozen custard. It's hand-dipped, and just outrageously dense and creamy, not as airy as the mass-market stuff. Also, fillings like the almonds or chocolate chips are added-in at the last minute, to order, so the nuts don't get soggy, or the chips frozen. The flavor selection can be limited, they make the stuff fresh every day, and if they run out, then they're out.. But it's worth some compromise, it's great frozen custard. There are a bunch of locations around Rochester, a few further out in upstate NY, and oddly, two in Vero Beach, Florida. www.abbottscustard.com/

Bumping this topic, because I actually had a stretch of really good meals in Rochester recently. Really. As referenced in the post immediately above, Thali of India is a very good Indian restaurant, and there have been some developments recently. First, the original location has expanded and updated its decor. Second, the owners have opened a second restaurant, called Tandoor of India, also in Henrietta, across from Southtown Plaza. Tandoor of India JEFFERSON PLAZA 376 JEFFERSON ROAD ROCHESTER, NY 14623 585-427-7080 FAX: 585-427-8720 www.tandoorofindia.com/ I decided to check out Tandoor, and liked it a lot. It has a wide range of regional styles, including Indo-Chinese "Manchurian" dishes, Bombay and Southern specialties, such as dosas and chaat, British-style Balti, a Goat curry, and surprisingly, most of the meat dishes can be made with either lamb or beef. There's a lunch buffet every day but Monday, and a dinner buffet on Tuesdays. We started with one of my favorite appetizers, which I don't see on menus enough: Papri Chaat This cool, refreshing dish has chickpeas, crunchy fried noodles, yoghurt, tamarind sauce and ground chile. It was a good version, tangy, crunchy, creamy, a bit spicy. Hara Bhara Kebab Potatoes, Spinach, lentils, spices. This was not a particularly appetizing color, but it tasted great. Bread Pakoras I had never seen bread pakoras before, so I had to satisfy the curiosity. Well, they taste like you might imagine, like deep-fried, batter-dipped bread. Not bad, but I think I'll stick with veggies or paneer for my pakora filling in the future! For entrees: Aloo Palak I wasn't paying enough attention to what my dining partners were ordering, so we also ended up with the too-similar, but also quite tasty Chicken Palak More of a contrast was the Kerala Peppercorn Lamb This featured meltingly tender lamb, in an assertively peppery sauce, and a serious level of chile heat as well, as requested. An Onion Kulcha was fresh and airy and slightly sweet, really good. Tandoor has a good selection of beer and wine, including Indian beers, and some good upstate NY white wines that actually go fairly well with Indian food. Interestingly, there's a huge window between the dining room and the kitchen, so if you want to watch them make your samosas, you can... I'm not sure whether I like the food at Tandoor any better than at Thali, but the selection is wider, and it's a larger place, so one should be able to avoid the Thali lines. Overall, solid food, and an interesting variety.

I did, rocking good meal, which makes me wonder how unique this topic's phenomenon is to Philly. Susur Lee might be very supportive and nurturing to his sous chefs and line cooks, he seemed like a cool guy to me, but it's not like he's likely to pass-on the restaurant "Susur" to someone else, nor his place next door, "Lee." I guess he could, but like with Lacroix, the place is so tied to a particular chef/persona that it just would seem odd... But who knows, of course there are plenty of precedents, maybe Susur will open a SLNY, or Jean-marie will get bored and arrange a JMLNY, or JMLLV. But I'm curious, is this dissolution of the classic mentoring/succession model especially bad in Philly kitchens, or is it getting like that everywhere?

Well, his name is "Georges."www.georgesperriergroup.com/

Actually, Susur is all tasting-menu now (June 2006), there does not seem to be a printed a la carte menu at all any more. That said, they're very accommodating. I asked about that just out of curiosity, and they said they'd be happy to configure a smaller menu from the selections available that night, so if you want to do three courses, or whatever, they'd adjust. Might be worth mentioning at the time of reservation if you think that most people would want to go off the map and customize, but the restaurant seems pretty flexible about it...

OK, I must say, it's really entertaining, and enlightening, to be able to eavesdrop on this very inside conversation. It would usually take buying a lot of drinks for a bunch of half-dead, sauce-stained guys at a dingy, smoky after-hours joint to get good dirt like this! But I have to ask, is "shoemaker" a widely-understood slang in the biz? I like it... And I presume "beekeeper's son" is a specific reference, but I'm thinking of adding it to my lexicon anyway. Carry on!

Upthread, I referenced my habit of getting lunch at Le Papillon whenever in Toronto: I think I have an unbroken record of always eating there once whenever I'm in town, through their three locations, literally about 30 years, and I suspect not a single change to the menu. While there are obviously plenty of more interesting dining options in Toronto, I'm always happy to have gone there, and the friends I drag along generally profess an affection for the place by the end of the meal, so I don't feel too bad about it... Here's why I go: I've had Soupe a L'Oignon Gratinée and Crêpes in Paris, and Montreal, and NYC, and countless other places, and these remain my faves... although I'll admit that the preference could just be due to an early imprinting of these as the ideals. Anyway, I'm going to keep going until the place closes!

I don't think there's a set wine pairing. They'll configure something for you from glasses, bottles, half-bottles, etc, based on your party's size, preferences, budget, etc. I think people would appreciate a pre-arranged pairing, just to not have to think about it, but I saw no indication that one existed.

It was labeled as a "Pecan Butter Tart" but I suspected it wouldn't quite meet the criteria for the traditional definition!

there is already a topic in the NY board: Moore Bros NY >>

This lunch at the St Lawrence Market felt very Canadian to me, just because I can't get this in the states. The woman at the counter seemed amazed that we didn't have peameal sandwiches in Philadelphia... It was delicious: a new tradition for me, I don't think I can leave town without one...

So I guess this wasn't a proper butter tart, because of the pecans? No matter, it was rocking good.... (from the guy at the bottom of the stairs in the SLM)

Do tell! the Eigensinn Farm topic

I agree that it's an excellent value for the quality of the food and experience overall.My companions were not big wine-drinkers, so we were pretty conservative on the grape consumption, sharing a bottle of Cave Springs Gewurtz for most courses. I expressed an interest in something red for the earlier (heavier) courses, and Kelly graciously arranged short pours of some very nice Rhone for two of us, effectively splitting a glass. Again, more testimony to the professionalism of Kelly Kwan: I didn't know what food was coming, which made it a little hard to anticipate what wine matches might be appropriate, he could have easily sold me a bottle of something, but he accurately gaged that we didn't need lots of heavy reds for this menu. But we did need a little... And he steered us to a Gewurtz that was complex enough to be a good companion for the food, yet approachable enough for my friends to enjoy (they were out of my first choice). All-in, three of us spent about $500 CDN ($160-ish per person), it was just over $400 before tip. But remember, one of us had the less-expensive vegetarian menu, and we didn't drink much wine, and what we did drink was very reasonably-priced.