Smithy

For my first attempt at lamb curry, I used Julie Sahni's recipe for Gosht Masala from Indian Regional Classics. I suspect, after rereading this thread to answer some of the questions that came up while I was cooking, that it's a bit generic, or simple, as curries go. (For instance, it calls for cooking oil instead of ghee.) That's all right for this beginner, however; I still learned plenty. Since my photos aren't anywhere near the caliber of those already posted, I'll just show the before and after. 2 lbs. lamb stew meat, pureed tomato, finely chopped onion, grated ginger, minced garlic, ground cumin, coriander, red pepper, paprika, turmeric. Question: what kind of red pepper is usually used here? I had some ground up dried hot Egyptian chilies on hand and used a bit of those. Is cayenne the norm? Let's see...I learned that I really have to turn down the heat. I was using my Le Creuset 6.75 oval French oven over an electric burner set on about 6 - medium high heat. My onion was running out of moisture and threatening to burn at about 15 minutes. I wonder whether that means too much heat or too large a pot? At any rate, I didn't get the caramelization I was expecting, and the sauce is pretty oniony. I used 2 c. of finely chopped yellow onions for 2 lb. lamb stew meat, 1 c. tomato puree, and assorted spices and cooking water. I also learned, yet again, that time does wonders. The sauce after simmering was bitter (the uncaramelized onions, and perhaps the red pepper I used) at first. I poured the finished product over some leftover pilaf, and the merged beautifully and tasted pretty good. Today I just had another bowlful for lunch - no rice - and the flavors have definitely mellowed, although the onion aftertaste is pretty strong without the rice. Tonight I'm going to reheat the whole thing and cook some small waxy potatoes in it, per Sahni's variation, and garnish with cilantro. The finished product, poured over pilaf, isn't as elegantly plated as most of you manage, but it tasted good enough for a first attempt:

I'm curious about what's going on with the changing flavors I noted in my previous post, and how to describe it. If someone else experienced it with this wine, and can explain it along with better descriptors than mine, I'd appreciate some elucidation. I may try it again after the current Introduction to Evaluating Wine eGCI class is finished, as a measure to see how my perceptions and ability to describe them have changed.

I've been testing and tasting wines for a couple of years with friends, but still don't have good descriptions. I hope the present eGCI class will change that, but in the meantime, please bear with me. This is a pretty generic description. Columbia Crest Grand Estates Columbia Valley Merlot, 2001 On first opening: Deep garnet color, coats the glass, no legs that I can see. Aroma pleasant, fruity, rather light-bodied. The first sip was pretty astringent - due to tannins? I let the glass sit 30 to 40 minutes and tried again. The dry salami I had in the meantime may have influenced my palate, but the wine seemed less astingent. After an hour, the wine was definitely smoother, but also not as fruity. Still some tannins (I think). It wasn't quite a one-note wine; as it sat on the the tongue the flavor changed and improved. This was a drinkable wine, but not as good as other merlots I've had in the same price range. Without having a good term for it, I'd say it struck me as dark, rather musty, and almost sullen. Andrea Immer says some wines improve after a night - or in some cases two - so I let the rest of the bottle sit until tonight. There was a definite improvement. 2nd night: Aroma light, fruity Flavor: pleasant, fruity (see, I told you my wine vocabulary is weak) Tannin bite is gone The flavor is better, brighter. Whatever seemed dark and sullen last night is gone. Tonight, it's a pretty good wine. I don't know that it's worth bothering to buy again, though. I have trouble envisioning myself buying a bottle of wine and opening it the night before I want to drink it. I've found other merlots that are friendly right after opening, for the same price.

Rocks are in short supply around here right now unless I go after them with an ice chisel. I think I have enough in my pet rock collection around the house to satisfy the requirement, but I'm wondering whether I should be selecting particular types. River stones? Aquarium gravel? Lava? Edited for lucidity

I am very fond of The Salt Traders' Danish Viking-Smoked Salt. It has a lovely dark amber color and distinctive smoky flavor that goes especially well with pork dishes and some pasta dishes. It reminds me, actually, of some flavor notes found in certain sausages and hot dogs. I'm glad to see some recommendations of other salt types. So far I've experimented with a Japanese Nazuna(?) sea salt and a Murray River Basin salt, and couldn't tell much difference from the regular Eden sea salt I usually keep around. I've been reluctant to blow money on further experiments, but with this thread's guidance I'll go exploring anew.

OK, I have 3 recipes for curried lamb from which to choose and will be choosing tonight. (The lamb is already thawing in the refrigerator.) Tomorrow I go to purchase the fresh spices, since my turmeric and cardamom (to name only a couple) are at least a year old. Here are my questions: 1. If I purchase whole spices and toast them, how will I know they're done toasting? 2. Are there certain spices in the typical curry recipe that won't need toasting and that I should purchase ground? (That probably depends on the recipe I finally pick, but maybe I can get some general rules here.) 3. For those of you who make your own garam masala, I'd like to know your preferred mixes. I tried making it once - can't remember whose recipe - and didn't like it, either by itself or in the final dish. I don't like cloves, in any form that I can detect, and I think that's what wrecked it for me. Is it total heresy to leave cloves out of garam masala? Nancy

Re the "neutral white wine" for the aroma kit: in general I avoid cheap California chardonnays because so many of them are heavily oaky. Is that not an issue for the aroma kit? Or is Gallo sufficiently oak-free that it won't matter? Would a sauvignon blanc do as well from a "neutral" standpoint?

I think you should ask that question over on the Lamb Curry, eGullet Recipe Cookoff IV thread in question. Folks over there should know. Besides, if you post your question there, I won't have to. edited for punctuation

How many acres are you working, and how many people are working it? Are you really all volunteers, or do you mean you get volunteer help with the most labor-intensive and time-critical operations, like pruning? (I remember being 'volunteered' to help sucker orange trees in my youth. At age 12 or so, volunteerism is a lot less voluntary. )

I don't remember the Monty Python routine, but how about the James Thurber cartoon caption? "It's a naive domestic Burgundy without any breeding, but I think you'll be amused by its presumption."

This is going to be fun! The infusions portion specifies "1 box cherries". I'm a bit confused because I don't normally associate cherries with boxes - except packing boxes, which are much too big. By inference with the box of raspberries and box of blackberries listed above, I'm guessing this is supposed to be about 1 pint of cherries. Is that right, or does it mean 1 box dried tart cherries? Is that the right quantity for the raspberries and blackberries?

Well, I have blisters from last night's Cajun Napalm, and a pot full of my first attempt at Fifi's Gumbo Goddess Chicken and Sausage Gumbo. I had to take a few liberties and make some command decisions due to some unanswered questions. 1. Half the Andouille disappeared at lunch when I wasn't looking. I knew the refrigerator was a safe place to store it, away from the dog and cats. I forgot about the other household member with opposable thumbs. I substituted some frozen old pancetta that had to go anyway, to supplement the remaining andouille. 2. Stung by this comment, followed by yet more discussion in the okra wars, I decided to tempt fate and slice up a few of the slimy buggers and put them in Fifi's precious okra recipe. I note that Fifi didn't scream when Snowangel did it, so maybe she cuts us northerners some slack. It came out pretty good, even though I stopped the roux too early. It had been browning so quickly, I was sure it was about to burn. Since the finished product wasn't as dark as my last attempt, I have to conclude I chickened out. I did notice that it smelled about the same as last time, even though last time I used lard and canola and this time I used peanut oil and canola. (I'm regretting wearing the same jeans today, though.) So, now for the questions. Please forgive me if they're answered above and I missed the answers: 1. If you're going to add okra, at what stage are you supposed to add it? I added it in with the trinity. 2. Is the chicken supposed to be cooked beforehand, or not, or does it matter? Fifi's recipe doesn't seem to use precooked chicken, but a lot of posters in this thread have done so. I didn't. I suspect it makes for a different, not necessarily better, or worse, product. FWIW, the okra was pretty much unnoticeable. I'm reminded of a former acquaintance's comment about his favorite venison recipe. He went on at great length about the marinade, the rum glaze, and so forth, and finished with "It's great! You can't taste the deer meat at all!" The only benefit of the pancetta was that it got it out of my freezer.

They aren't, if you shop eBay with patience. Of course, they're older and not necessarily as fine-mesh or high-tech as the newest ones. So far I've been happy with the one I got that was most like my grandmother's.

What does "3004 aluminum alloy" mean, and might it be less reactive than raw aluminum?

I'm not sure which specific brands are good, but I can tell you what to look for: make sure that the straining disk feels rough to the touch when you run your fingers over the holes on the inside (food holding side). The rough edges of the holes seem to be necessary to grip the food instead of letting it slide around when you crank. I bought a nice-looking stainless steel food mill, brand name forgotten, some inexpensive SS thing made in China. It was big enough to hold a lot of stuff and had 3 interchangeable disks for different straining sizes. It looked great and was easy to clean. Unfortunately, it didn't work worth beans. It just pushed stuff around instead of straining anything through the holes. I hate stuff that looks pretty and doesn't do its job. I went on eBay and picked up a small (1 qt) old Foley food mill. Wonderful. I think it may be tinned steel. It isn't as big as I'd like, and it doesn't have interchangeable disks, but it works. I love stuff that works. Foley is still around. I don't know what their food mills are like now. I do know that you should feel the interior screen before buying. If your fingers run gently over nice smooth holes, with no feeling of resistance (I'm not talking about cutting your fingers, by the way; it's more like very coarse sandpaper), don't buy it. Keep looking. Edited to add: a china hat (chinoise) might work for you, too. You can pick those up on eBay as well.

I should explain that I only know the cooking of the Mediterranean and the French Southwest and their claypot cooking styles. In Morocco, fish is almost always cooked in an unglazed pot called a tagra (see photo below). Not because of fear of flavor transfer but the shape is more 'fish-like' Before I can share what I know about claypot cooking I need to know which pot you were using. So many types of glazes, clays, additions of such minerals as mica, and shapes have a lot to do with the outcome of your braise. ← Well, I can answer some of those questions, but my Egyptian isn't good enough to have all the answers! In Egypt they call this particular pot a tagine, pronounced more or less "DAjin" with a broad 'a' as in 'ahh', and I picked it and the smaller bowls up because I like using them for moussaka. This type of clay cookware is as common as dirt around Luxor, and fortunately as cheap. They're unglazed. I think the clay must come from the stuff mined for the many potteries now - from somewhere near Aswan? can't remember where. Some potters closer to Cairo told me that the present conservation rules forbid using arable land from the Nile Valley for getting clay, so dry material is mined in the desert, brought in sacks of dry powder to the valley factories, and then mixed with water to make pottery clay. The initial cure involves coating the pot interior with molasses ("asl aswad") and cooking it in the oven in low heat for a long time. Temperature and time eluded our language skills. I've managed so far not to break anything. I think really well-seasoned pots may have a heavier coating. Here are a top view of the larger pot that I used as well as one of the individual bowls. That's an orange in front, for size comparison. The side view of the tagine gives a better idea of its shape. And yes, I know this is totally different than a Moroccan tagine. Someday I hope to lay my hands on one of those babies. I've never seen them in Egypt. Edited to correct a trivial detail on the mining and shipping process, and an incorrect pronunciation note.

A friend gave me a copy of this cookbook last year and I've been thoroughly enjoying it. It's huge, it's engagingly written, and it has as many stories as it does recipes. I'm glad to see it recommended, complete with links.

Ducky, as noted in Fat Guy's post to which slkinsey responded in the post right after yours, we all had more satisfactory results in cookware with a higher heat capacity. For ease of figuring you can take that as "more massive" but that isn't the whole story, as slkinsey's explained so well. Beyond that it got down to technique, equipment and to some extent personal taste. I had better results in the oven; a couple of the others did better on stovetop. I think I was the only person who tried a clay pot, and I really liked that too.

I don't know whether you were addressing that request to slkinsey in particular, but if you weren't, I will. I didn't much like my clay pot braising results the first night, but as the nights progressed and I continued recombining the meat and juice and reheating them in their pot, that sample became one of my favorites. I doubt that the clay has either the heat content or heat conductivity of the metals. Therefore I think there must be something else going on to explain the clay pot results, and I'm guessing it's related to the way the pores inside the pot exchange moisture and flavors with the meat and juice. What does the materials expert think? I certainly plan to do more braising in the clay pot vs. the Le Creuset and All-Clad, to see what happens as my technique and control improve. It may be that certain flavor combinations benefit more from the earthy pot flavor than others do. I have a clay pot question right away, for Ms. Wolfert: do they take on the flavors of the foods cooked in them to the point that you reserve some for certain types of food? If so, which do you segregate? Finally, thank you Wolfert for the note above about clarifying the sauce. That's a neat trick, and I have a lot of juice on which to try it.

Heck, who needs adjoining towns? That happens in our household all the time, and we aren't even in Texas!!

The sauce seemed to be different in my test. I plan a more careful series of tests to confirm this, but I thought the sauce from deglazing the stovetop steel (not nonstick) pan was richer, more complex and darker than the other sauces. For that matter, I also thought there were some differences in the meat texture and taste - but they were admittedly minor, not as noticeable as the sauce differences. I'll know more tonight when I reheat the samples. ← It's tonight. I didn't label the samples. One sample is more tender than the others, but I don't know which one it is, except that it is one of the meats that had been browned beforehand. How do I know? By the juices, or sauces, whatever you want to call them. (I haven't bothered reducing them, so they're runny but flavorful.) Three are indistinguishable. The fourth is different in appearance, texture, and to some degree taste. It was like this last night too, and even though I've lost the labels I know that this one dish had the unseared meat. The unbrowned-meat sauce separates readily into two layers, with the top layer a clear, maybe golden, maybe colorless, liquid. (It's difficult to be sure of the color, given the small sample.) It gives the bowl juice a halo effect, of light golden color around the reddish sauce. The browned-meat sauces all are more homogenous, with no halo from having a clear layer floating atop a darker layer. The juices look somehow more coagulated. I can taste the wine, meat juice and spices in all 4 samples, but the unbrowned-meat-braise-juice tastes, erm, lighter somehow. I tried to photograph the differences, but now as I'm previewing the post I don't think they came out. I won't bother casual readers with them, but they're in my Braising Lab 3+ album in case anyone else is interested enough to look. I poured the juices into small glasses to see how they'd separate. The top layer of the unbrowned-meat juice was clearer than the layer below and the top layer of the browned-meat juices was cloudier than the layer below. I haven't a clue of the chemistry behind what I'm seeing, or what it might mean for making a sauce, or what it says about the braising method. Either setup tastes fine, but they're different. Why? Enquiring minds want to know!

Ms. Wolfert, I was wondering today about the tagines. Are there specific cuts of meat that are generally used? You mention shoulder or breast of lamb. Is that because they benefit particularly from this treatment? Are there cuts that do not benefit from tagines?

The sauce seemed to be different in my test. I plan a more careful series of tests to confirm this, but I thought the sauce from deglazing the stovetop steel (not nonstick) pan was richer, more complex and darker than the other sauces. For that matter, I also thought there were some differences in the meat texture and taste - but they were admittedly minor, not as noticeable as the sauce differences. I'll know more tonight when I reheat the samples.

Fiftydollars, are you using gas or an electric stove? If you ever said, I missed it.

Yes, I'd also like to thank Steven and the eGCI team. This has been a very instructive and gratifying class. I've learned a lot of technique this week, raised a lot of questions and answered a few. This has been a great line of scientific inquiry. I've also made some darned good meals this week, applying my new braising knowledge to projects outside the scope of the lab sessions. Thanks for helping me get another cooking method into my repertoire.