Simon Majumdar

Count the History lesson as my Christmas gift to you. Unless of course I get to be your secret Santa at the Xmas bash in which case your wish to own a brand new shiny pair of nipple clamps may well come true. Cookery is such a fluid thing I am not sure asking such formal questions is valid. The dish could have originated in many ways. A Sahib could have asked his cook to produce a soup and the cook used the ingredients and knowledge he had and came up with this OR an Ex Pat army cook could have tried to recreate a soup from blighty and used ingredients at hand. Some dishes can be traced back to particular events. I know there are some dishes that originated at the Tolly Club and were created for the visit of a dignitary ( in the same way that Peach Melba was created ) The soup itself is not Indian ( you are not arguing it is, of course ) but that does not mean that it is not very good when well made. It also does not mean that it has not become part of many menus throughout India. Cuisine is like a sponge stuff flows out and gets absorbed. India has taken in many things from it colonial past ( Chilli and vinegar from the Portugese for example and, tomatoes from, I believe, China ) and it has contributed much not just in the proliferation of restaurants but in the understanding of the effect a subtle use of spicing can have on cooking I am one of those who feel that most dishes whatever their provenance can benefit from the use of chilli, not for heat but to create a depth of flavour and ignite the existing tastes. S

As with all spices, I think people underestimate their use in sweet dishes ( ever the Bengali, sweet dishes are at the very front of my mind ) I recently made a superb Ice Cream with Corriander and Papaya. The combination was one I had not seen and thought it worth trying I made a rich egg custard and folded in some finely chopped leaves and some pulped papaya and some chunks of papaya. I did not have an ice cream maker so I had to keep returning to the freezer to mix the ice to stop the crystals. The end result was smooth and rich with a satisfying flavour. S

While I think that this is a wonderful dish when prepared properly, I do think that its roots ( from the date of the recipe ) are found in the East India company and The Raj rather than any particular India Cuisine of the time. Like all Ex-pats there is a tendency to take the cuisine from home and blend with the available ingredients abroad. The British were mnasters of this as they, at the point in time of the recipe, governed over 1/4 of the Globe ( I still recall having a map when I very first started school that had all the "British" areas in pink ) This recipe seems to have all the hallmarks of that, echoing the Georgian and Victorian passion for soups. I suspect it was made for the Sahib by one of his cooks using the available ingredients. Also, don't forget that in 1829 India was still a collection of vastly disparate states with very diofferent cusines, so there is even more danger referring to an "Indian" dish than there is now S

after the grief I got from my review of this place way back when it is interesting to see that the same issues I raised keep cropping up Lighting too low Service hit & miss ( in my case efficient but charmless ) tables too close together Food fine but hardly revelatory There are so many places in NY, I find it hard to see why this place gets such coverage apart from the fact that MA seemed like a very nice guy and probably deserves all the success he can get. S

Steve is it really the case that more restaurants are closing here than in mainland Europe. I would love to see the figures that back it up That being said, the reason may be thaqt restaurants in the Uk and particularly London are predicated on different values. They are much more aimed at being more of a profitable business than a delivery system for fine food. even the best ones ( RHR ) are still businesses first and restaurants second. They are far more open to the slings and arrows of outrageous media and the fikle public. Few restaurants in Paris/Rome/Amsterdam will become as achingly fashionable, but by the same token few will fall from grace as quickly ( The Atlantic bar & Grill Anyone?) this gives them the luxury of developing their menu and service and pricing away from the glare of media frenzy. London is far more like NY in that respect than it is Europe S

I think I love you too

This is interesting. Steve makes a few points 1) I am not sure if cooking what the press "cares" to write about is relevant. I don't think the press, even the reviewers give a tinkers cuss about the food. They just want copy. To that extent LML is right. PK just is not fashionable and probably is not capable ( in the unlikely event that he would want to be ) of being so 2) What is very true is that when this thread firsts started many people ( excluding LML who seems to have more recent experience than most of LTC ) rushed to book. a) Because we mourned the passing of an institution b) Because there was some guilt that we had never been or not been recently I have not been since it was in the new place ( in fact I posted a thread recently asking about it as a suitable business venue ) The reason? None really apart from it is not cheap and when the notion came up to go there, there was always somewhere else I wanted to go. The comparison with music or books is a valid one. We do not like to see our heroes get old or lose relevance. It makes us aware of our own increasing age and it makes us question our own judgements. How tragic that Morrisey could not find a record company. The voice of one generation is irrelevant to another generation. How tracic to read the latest William Boyd, a legend, agreat and a God and one of the nicest men on God's earth, but his latest novel shows all the signs of a burnt out engine. You can have a comeback in publishing. How much hoopla would there have been for a new Salinger novel? how great was the publicity when Heller wrote a sequel to catch 22? But tellingly, how rubbish was the book and how soon did he slip back into irrelavancy? Shame but truthful, Steve S

Would that that were so Tony, but I am not sure it is or ever will be again the case that a restaurant will succeed just because it is any good, particularly not if it is in the centre of London. Look at the much lamented High Holborn. Superb food, exemplary service and not impossibly priced AND lasted about a year. I can't see PK being happy moving out to the burbs and, while I can see a lot of interest from "foodies" or people on egullet, that is not going to support a place for very long. He would need to get onto the map for visitors and those who, like a good chum of mine "like to eat out, but know bugger all about food, so just look for what's hip" to do that, he needs to court publicity and create a buzz. I am not sure he is either inclined or indeed capable of doing that and certainly not towards the end of his career. From the two or three times I have seen him interviewed, I am not sure he is very media friendly. Whether you love or loathe the place, the perfect example of how to open a new place, create a buzz and have it booked out until doomsday has to be Locanda Locatelli. I can't see PK going through the same grind to achieve that at this stage in his life and quite frankly why should he? S

Absolutely right LML. He is going to need some sctick if he wants to be taken seriously by the media. Being a superlative chef who gives a fuck is no longer enough Are all the below taken 1) Riding a vespa 2) playing one game for Rangers reserves and then claiming " I could have been a professional" 3) Growing ludicrously long hair and insisting that people refer to you as "The Don" If all of those are taken, I supsect he may have to claim to have had a vison of our lady in his new restaurant and, as a result, be able to heal the sick. Mind you, that would scupper the next series of Jamie's Kitchen. S

I think the issue of the provinces is a valid one. Outside of the major cities and to some extent even outside just London, it is difficult to get huge backing to open a restaurant. In places like London, Manchester, Birmingham etc, VC's and chains are more willing to invest in openings. The places there are not run as "Mom & Pop" places but as hard nosed businesses. The owner/chef/manager may have to work like a dog, but they can at least afford to take some time off from the Kitchen. If you are going to open a restaurant of any quality in a smaller town or village, then the chances are that it is run by one person or a couple who cover all aspects of the business from purchasing to serving, from cooking to cleaning. I can imagine as in any small business that can wear you down. I thought I worked hard in my small business, but listening to Basildog modestly describe his working hours/week/year, I realise that I am living on easy st. I can imagine that there is by necessity a short shelf life for such an occupation as you get older, get different priorities and get worn out by the daily grind. S

John You have not met Basildog. It obviously helps if you are not in your right mind S

No sugar needed. The onions release a lot of sweetness as they cook It is very very simple Sweat two finely sliced red onions with one chopped green chilli and the zest of two ( in this case) oranges in a little oil and butter Do this over a low heat for at least an hour ( more if needed ) The end consistency is jam like and has a wonderful sour sweet quality that works with all fish I have found ( oily fish is especcially good, try it with grilled sardines ) it also works as a side with roast duck S

If you sweat the grated peel of citrus fruit with onions until it forms a jam, it makes an incredible dish to go with any fish S

The humble caulie is a wonder. It holds flavours in many dishes I like to deep fry in chick pea flour and then dip in a fiery chutney I love it with aubergine and chickpeas sauted in oil and turmeric I love it raosted with a sprinkle of brown sugar and roasted cumin seeds I guess, I just love it S

Ah, but unlike so many herein, I can take an objective view of that most tawdry of cities and, when it does come up trumps, can admit it S

Not at all Why would you think that was a joke? S

Nice posts Paul The lettuce is much underrated. I had a superb dish on my last visit to paris where they had taken a simple dish of petit pois and bacon and folded in finely sliced lettuce. The sap ( ? ) from the lettuce added an extraordinary velvety texture to the dish. I would imagine that in the soup, with a good stock as base, this would make a similar impact S

I have never noticed a smokey smell or taste. It depends on how they have been processed or indeed kept. Oh, and the make a wonderful reviving hangover tea when ground and mixed with assam leaves S

As with Monica, I love green ones in desserts such as rabri and also in a spicy lassi. I use the black ones in meatier dishes or some of the dhals I make. I also like to use them in tarkas ( my absolute favourite is to fry bulb chillies, nigella seed, black pods and fennel seeds in ghee) and pour that over dhals or even mix it into a raita of mint and cucumber. At the weekend we had a meal of lobster and crab and afterwards my mother made the most spectacular indian soup using the shells. She fried off some spices ( a cinnamon stick, chilli powder, turmeric and cumin ) with a lot of black pods and added the lobster and crab shells with a load of chopped ripe tomatoes. She then added two pints of water and cooked on a low heat for 7 hrs. After straining, she added potatoes and chunks of oily fish. The complexity of taste was amazing and the black pods made such a difference S

Then we could get one of half a brain to represent an australian academic. is there such a thing? Don't you get a degree in Oz for knowing how to open a can of XXXX without cutting yourself? thank god for those emoticons, eh? S

Maybe we could just have one with shackles to indicate an Australian S

You ate your pasta out of Bowls? Christ that is so un-hip, its a wonder that your legs didn't fall off. Almost as un-hip as a quote from Hitch Hikers S

LML I think this is truly an interesting point. Is there any room anymore for a person to be a chef at his level purely for the enjoyment of cooking? So much money is being spent on the opening of a new restaurant these days that the owners have to cover every angle and make sure that all aspects of marketing are covered. That includes the chef who has to have a well polished media friendly personality and be willing to talk about themselves at the drop of a hat. They will not and probably cannot afford the luxury of letting the food speak for itself, however good it may be. There are still some places that exist by word of mouth. Chavot is not one for courting publicity ( as far as I am aware ) and The Capital seems to exist by good word of mouth. But for everyone of him there is a Conrad Gallagher or an Angela Harnett who is given a restaurant kitchen to run in a massive media glare. I suspect that PK will always be a victim of this even when he moves to his new place. The real problem is that his food is never fashionable. It may be bloody good, by all arguments I have heard amongst the best in London, but he never ( maybe Never wanted to is a better way of putting it ) got on the list of must visit places in London particularly for visitors. With Bourdin ( sp?) at the Connaught and now PK going, is there any room for the superb classically trained chef plying their trade for the enjoyment of their customers or are we now doomed to a procession of chefs who all have "branded" persona's? S

Try also the Grand Duce Alba and the Jaime I Both are excellent S

It has been over a year since I was there and that time we had the tasting menu with the wine flight ( cost c $300 per person ) My recollection was that the fish and seafood dishes were far superior to the meat dishes. In fact the meat dishes were over salted. All that being said, it was one of the better tasting menus I have had and one dish, a rabbit and lobster dish in a gerwurtz reduction was exceptional. Perhaps one of the best dishes I have ever eaten i had been considering a return for my next visit, but perhaps not. S