Fat Guy

The Bar Room at the Modern seems to have pulled in some of this audience for awhile, although I've heard almost nothing but complaints ever since the place got three stars in the New York Times (and my one disappointing meal ever at the Bar Room was I think on the night it got the three stars). Maybe the shift in expectations has done something, or maybe the place just got overwhelmed. I'm not sure -- but it's probably the closest thing Midtown has to a pocketbook-friendly pseudo-haute experience.

Interesting. As a not-exactly-on-point experiment, I just put 4 ounces of 125-degree water in a glass, added a tablespoon of coarse sea salt, and stirred with a spoon ten times. It all dissolved.

On a couple of other topics we've been discussing the trend (some agree that it's a trend, others think it's nothing new; I think it's legit) in New York City towards inexpensive, casual restaurants -- often with no reservations -- that serve food that has its roots not in the bistro/brasserie tradition but in haute cuisine. Perhaps it's that the generation of foodies now coming of age is demanding this kind of restaurant, or perhaps it's because there are so many young well-trained chefs out there now, or perhaps it has to do with the increased availability of better ingredients . . . or all those factors and more. What I was hoping to do here is assemble a list of the best places serving in this style: haute-type cuisine, inexpensive, casual, walk-in . . .

When I got my plastic Zyliss cheese grater (model 11220 I believe) I never thought it would hold up under the stress of real-world kitchen use. Yet it provided years of good service. Finally, though, it came to an end the other day when the handle cracked off. Now I need to replace it. Any thoughts on the best graters being made today? I want a rotary handle type grater -- I have a box grater and a mandoline-type grater. Perhaps someone makes an all metal version?

Owen, what the heck are you cooking that requires such fine gradations of salt coarseness?

We've had a topic on pepper and salt mills going since 2002, and once in awhile someone pops up and says (not in so many words) salt mills are stupid. I would like to take a few moments to establish this premise once and for all. There are two reasons to use pepper mills: first, if you use pre-ground pepper it just doesn't taste as good because pepper, once ground, rapidly degrades (it also degrades in whole form, so you don't want to be using ten-year-old peppercorns); second, the grind size of pepper is a significant factor in many dishes. Salt, for its part, won't change in flavor even if you leave it, say, buried in the Earth for a million years. It's the one thing you could find in an archaeological dig in someone's ancient kitchen and it wouldn't taste any different today than it did during the Peloponnesian wars. And when cooking, the grind size of salt is usually irrelevant because salt dissolves in most dishes. There are a few places where the grind size of salt does matter. Most are rather esoteric, but there's one big one: when you use salt as a table condiment or garnish, the grind size can make a difference. Me, I'm entirely happy with the range of coarseness choices available off the shelf. Not that I think this is the reason most people use salt mills. In 99% of cases, they're cosmetic. As for the downside of a salt grinder, it's horribly inefficient. Especially when you're cooking, it takes forever to grind enough salt into a pot. And you never really know how much you're using. The hand is a far better tool for salting, because you know what you're getting. There are also, I should add, plenty of cosmetically appealing ways to present salt on the table. We have individual antique salt dishes in cobalt blue glass and sterling silver, with little spoons, as well as individual miniature salt shakers (the range of salt shakers out there is amazing and, for those concerned with symmetry, some even match certain pepper mills). It's not like you have to put a paper can of Morton's on the table.

The March issue of SmartMoney magazine contains a feature on the Zagats, and makes some interesting contributions to the discussion of the Zagat guides. Being a money-oriented magazine, SmartMoney did actual statistical analysis of the Zagat ratings over time and came to the following conclusion: The Zagats respond in a couple of ways. They say they emphasize recommended restaurants, and that restaurants have gotten better. But it's absurd to think those factors justify a shift from 25% of the rated restaurants scoring 20+ to 70% reaching that level. Definitely read to the end of the piece to get to the anecdote about Tim Zagat storming out of an interview. (There's also a quote from me somewhere in there).

To me there is no meal more enjoyable than a leisurely lunch at a fine restaurant. Not only do I prefer to have my largest meal of the day at lunchtime, and not only do I think almost every restaurant with windows is more attractive at lunchtime, but also most restaurants have traditionally offered better value at lunchtime: the same or similar food for half as much money (or less). As a member of the un- . . . I mean self-employed class, this has long worked out well for me. It would seem that this lunch discount has always reflected the reduced demand for tables at lunchtime. However, it seems like it used to be a given that good restaurants in New York City would be open for lunch. In the past decade or so, that seems to have changed. The recent shutdown of Cafe Gray's lunch service in the Time Warner Center felt, to me, like another nail in the coffin of the fine-dining lunch. A few years in, Ducasse pulled its lunch service. Daniel serves no lunch. Jean-Georges Vongerichten recently implied that without his deeply discounted lunch Jean Georges would be empty by day. Weekend lunch hours are even more unusual, though there's always Bouley. In most of the US, the best restaurants just aren't open for lunch. But in New York we've tended to have enough business lunch demand to justify keeping the restaurant open -- even if there was little actual net profit for the restaurant, it was always a way to keep the staff working. Will this tradition die off as more people take shorter lunches, have smaller expense accounts and work (or work out) through lunch? Or will there always be enough demand to keep the best places open at lunchtime?

The Stone Rose bar also seems to be thriving, as well as Bouchon. And if you count it as a restaurant, the dining area at Whole Foods is a zoo. The Dean & DeLuca outpost in Borders also seems to sell a ton of stuff.

I started this topic in 2002, and in the intervening half a decade I never actually managed to buy a new peppermill. Finally, a friend put me out of my misery. He was cooking at my house, became disgusted with my pathetic excuse for a peppermill, and soon after sent me a Unicorn Magnum as a gift. This thing is amazing. I can't even understand how it operates within the laws of physics, because it takes so little twisting effort to produce an avalanche of beautifully ground pepper. And the loading mechanism, it just makes so much sense -- because you load from the side, you don't have to mess up your grind setting every time you load (though you do need a bit of dexterity). One note on the little plastic tray that comes with the Magnum: yes, it's very nice, and it's sort of crazy that every peppermill doesn't come with a dust catcher tray. But the lack of a dust catcher has never been one of my problems. You just have to find an old mustard, jelly or other jar lid with a slightly greater diameter than the base of your peppermill and you have a dust catcher for the life of your peppermill. Also, a trick I've picked up watching several professional cooks: twist the body of the peppermill and the top in opposite directions. Never release your grip on the top part. Rather, twist the body and the top in opposite directions, loosen the hand that's holding the body, turn the top hand back and repeat. Once you establish that rhythm you can grind with great efficiency. I realize that was a confusing description. Maybe someone else can do better.

Graydon Carter owns the Waverly Inn, not Little Owl.

I don't think Bruni was aggressively condemning fine dining in that review. I think he probably thinks he likes fine dining well enough. The problem is that having Bruni as the fine dining critic is like hiring an opera critic who prefers Broadway musicals -- and then letting that person review Broadway musicals and talk about how much better the young people like them than opera. I mean, operas are so long, they require an understanding of a foreign language, they're very complex and usually heavy, and all those fat people in costumes acting badly -- sheesh, of course Broadway shows are better. Such a person, with a little training, could certainly identify better and worse operas and offer some appropriate praise for the better ones. But it would be empty. I don't disagree with Bruni about the trend. I don't even disagree that fine dining is in retreat. I just think he isn't well suited to the job he has, because he doesn't have an appreciation (and hasn't been able to develop one) for the subject area in which he's really supposed to be writing.

I think there are a few categories of places that offer bar dining. First, there are the places where you can get food at the bar but it's a different level of food than is served in the main restaurant. The Nougatine bar is a good example of this, as are the bars at Gramercy Tavern, Tabla and the Modern. It's not that this is undesirable as such -- plenty of people like the second-room food better at a lot of places -- however it's something to be aware of. I'm pretty sure Daniel has a separate bar menu, though I've heard of people getting dining-room food in the bar/salon area. Second, there are the places where you can get the same food at the bar as in the main restaurant, but with some restrictions. Eleven Madison Park and Babbo would fall into this category, because you can get most of the offerings but not the tasting menu at the bar. Of course in both of the above cases, sometimes exceptions are made, especially if you're a regular or the restaurant isn't busy. But you can't bet on it happening. Third, there are the restaurants that give you the full experience at the bar. Union Square Cafe is a good example, as is Picholine. Finally, there are the restaurants where dining at the bar, especially alone, is actually the peak experience that restaurant has to offer. Nearly every place with a sushi bar, from Yasuda to Nobu to your neighborhood joint, falls into that category. Also in that category, Atelier, where those who don't dine at the bar have reported regrets. And I happen to think the bar experience at Gotham Bar & Grill is particularly special -- they really blazed this trail. I would choose the bar over the dining room at Gotham almost every time. One thing to bear in mind, as we've been reminded recently, is that holidays and other peak times are the worst times for solo diners. Real or imagined, restaurant staff get into a certain mindset on Mother's Day, or at 8pm on Friday night -- they see it as the time when they're going to make the serious money. Solo diners pretty much always do better at off-peak times. Also, at peak times the bar is often crowded with people drinking and waiting for tables, so the bar dining experience can be especially unpleasant -- not only because of the population density but also because the bartenders are going to be occupied.

I'm in the very early stages of a kebab obsession, and plan to cook many of them over the course of the next few months. I have only rudimentary knowledge of what to do, however. We can use this topic to discuss anything there is to discuss about kebabs, however I'll mention a few of my specific restrictions: 1 - I don't have a grill, so my kebabs have to be done under the broiler or, I guess, in a grill pan (but I prefer the broiler). 2 - The combination of preferences in my household means the only meats I'll use are beef and chicken in relatively antiseptic forms (boneless, skinless, trimmed of visible fat, etc.). Fish and shellfish are fine too. No bell peppers. 3 - For now, on account of our toddler's palate, nothing particularly spicy (as in hot peppers). 4 - I'm willing to invest in some good skewers, but don't really know what to get. Wisdom, advice? Please don't feel restricted by my needs.

The sentence does not state or imply that Italy has only one mountainous region. It simply means that she drove through the mountains, Italian ones. Whether or not to provide greater specificity is the kind of judgment call writers (and editors) make in just about every sentence. Since this article is not directed at people planning to recreate the trip, the names of the particular mountains are not necessarily relevant. Often, authors include too many details and editors, trying to improve flow and space efficiency, remove the ones that don't need to be there. For all we know the writer included three sentences about the trip through the mountains, naming every individual mountain, and an editor crossed it all out and said "the Italian mountains." Happens all the time, for good reason.

Frozen concentrated orange juice, known as FCOJ on the commodities markets, is something I rarely see in people's homes anymore. And from the perspective of a juice drinker, that's a good thing. But the lack of cans of FCOJ in people's freezers means it's not as available for use as an ingredient. FCOJ is a great ingredient for adding a complex, acidic, interesting sweetness to a wide range of preparations both savory and sweet. It enhances the flavor of meats, especially pork and chicken, and it can improve muffins, quick breads and more. Because it's concentrated to 1/4 of its original state, it's quite thick and sticky. Anybody have any great uses for FCOJ? It's so cheap and currently unappreciated, it seems a shame not to utilize it.

I've only tasted a couple of samples of the Salumi salumi, but if they're representative then I don't think Salumi and Fra'Mani are quite in the same league. The stuff I tried from Salumi was excellent, just as the house-made salumi at several restaurants and butchers here in town (Otto, Faicco, Salumeria Biellese, Calabria, Esposito's) is excellent. And I take your point about exuberance. But I really feel that Fra'Mani is making something that's a cut above. I'm going to navigate my way through Salumi's Byzantine ordering process (you have to submit a request and have it approved before they'll let you call in your credit card information) and see if I can assemble enough samples to do a little tasting.

I disagree with pretty much 100% of your post, but perhaps most with this statement. Perhaps you don't deal with any young, wealthy New Yorkers, but I do all the time, and I can assure you that your personal preferences, no matter how strongly held, don't neatly project on to them as a group. Sure, some wealthy people are too impatient to wait for a table -- some poor people are too impatient too. But plenty of millionaires are are just fine with it. We're not talking about standing on line with a black hood and handcuffs on. If you go to Upstairs you can wait in the market or downstairs. You can have a cocktail while you wait. You can talk to the people you came with, or you can flirt with other waiting customers. You can conduct business on your Treo. You can send one person ahead to get on the waiting list and the rest of the group can show up later on. At a lot of places where they make you wait for tables, they'll even take your cell number and call you, so you can go to a nearby bar and hang out. Not to mention, most places have informal ways for regulars to make fake reservations, in other words they'll put you at the front of the line. And even if you wait 30-45 minutes for a table at one of these places you're still in and out in less time than at a fine-dining restaurant. I assure you, there are plenty of millionaires dining at Upstairs. I know one who ate there two days ago -- and she's in her fifties. Plus, plenty of people wait half an hour for tables at fine-dining restaurants where they have reservations -- it happens all the time. People wait.

Sorry. I didn't bring my A game. Didn't record what I ate or the guy's name.

I take issue with a third point as well, and this is a cheap shot taken by critics all the time when responding to their detractors: "Chodorow yelped like a stuck pig, questioning Bruni's credentials as a food critic (something he never would have done had the review been favorable)" We're talking about restaurateurs, not journalists. It's not incumbent upon them to act against self-interest in the pursuit of truth. That they don't object to favorable reviews is a non-observation.

I wasn't in front of Yasuda, however I've found that the stocky guy who's usually at the far end (farthest from the street) of the sushi bar is a delight to work with. His sushi pieces are crafted very much in Yasuda's free-form style, and he tends to operate at a slightly slower pace (which I prefer) and, if you initiate conversation with him, he's very engaging.

I was at the sushi bar.

I was right in the neighborhood of Yasuda the other day and had a little time so I did something I almost never do: I walked in without a reservation. It was the height of the lunch rush, right around 1pm, but they had space at the sushi bar. I just ordered the $34 "sushi matsu" lunch, which is 12 pieces of sushi and half a roll. What a deal. For less than $3 a piece you get a great range of stuff, and they take just as much care as with an expensive omakase. If I'd spent $100+ I wouldn't have been appreciably happier with the sushi. I might have been given some more exotic variants of tuna and yellowtail, and the meal would have been a bit larger, but really, for $34 you can have a great lunch there. Very true. And this tends to be the case at every top sushi place in town, from Masa all the way on down to the lowliest neighborhood joint. If you're not at the sushi bar, it's sort of like you're at a different restaurant.

Sheesh. What took them so long?

Viking does make a 24" range. You can get one for about $3,000. They're very nice. FiveStar also makes a beautiful 24" range in that price bracket. There's also a brand called Capital that's a little less expensive. More in the $1,000 range you can get the top-of-the-line Avanti, which comes in stainless and is probably better than what you're replacing, or a Premier or Summit in stainless. It seems that, especially if you're going to abandon the unit in less than five years, you might be better off with one of these. Dual fuel (gas range with electric oven) is theoretically the best configuration, however in most New York City apartments you have individually metered electric but the gas is a building expense. Therefore if you cook with electric you get a higher electric bill, whereas if you cook with gas it's a fixed building cost no matter how much you cook. So I've never used a dual fuel configuration, even though I've had the option during two past renovations.