Chicken skin texture in braised dishes, such as coq au Vin

[mikec]

Everytime I make Coq au Vin or similar chicken dishes the recipe calls for browning the chicken (creating a nice crispy skin) and then removing it only to return it to the dish to finish by braising in liquid. Unfortunately, when cooked in liquid, my chicken ends up losing its crispiness and turning grey and soggy.

What am I doing wrong, or what can I do to retain then crispy factor?

Thanks.

Mike

[Wilfrid]

Although coq au vin recipes typically call for the chicken pieces to be lightly sauteed to give them a little color, I am not sure the purpose is to get a crispy skin, and I can't see any way for the crispness of the skin to be maintained through the stewing process. The good news is, I don't think a good coq au vin requires the chicken tohave crispy skin.

Did your recipe actually talk about a crispy skin, or did you assume that was the reason for browning the chicken? As for turning grey, chicken cooked in red wine will look somewhat greyish. Again, I think this is authentic and to be expected. If you get the dish cooked with some blood added to the wine, the chicken will be almost black.

[Suzanne F]

Mike: you can always try this truc. After you brown the chicken, remove the skin and set it aside. Complete the recipe with the now-skinless chicken. Before serving, run the skin under the broiler to re-heat and recrisp it. Then serve a "leaf" of nice crisp skin on top of the portion of chicken.

Or you can just remove the skin after cooking as you've done (serve the chicken skinless), and later crisp it up and make the chicken-skin po' boys that John Thorn writes about. They really are GOOD.

But I agree with Wilfrid: the skin isn't expected to be crisp; the browning is for flavor, not looks.

edited to remove that nasty word, "cheat"

[Brad S]

The browning is to create your "fond" on the bottom of your rondo, when deglazing with the red wine this will lift the fond out of the pores and melt it into the wine and then your reduction.

You will not have crisp skin when this dish is finished braising,nor is it a pre requeset to the dish.

Coq au Vin is a great teacher of classic French technique in searing and braising.

Following the proven techniques of this dish will give you excellent results.

[guru]

If you do want to end up with a crispy skin i suggest you make " Poulet au vinaigre" ; where the chicken is cooked seperately then transfered to a plate while you make the sauce in the cooking pan and return the meat only to reheat and coat it. You end up having a more cripy chicken.

[Jinmyo]

The one thing I can't stand is slimy chicken skin.

It must be browned because to not brown meat is to sin against the wonders of caramelization and the flavour compounds that arise from it. But then I hate losing the crackly wonders of a crisped skin by submerging it into a liquid.

I've always removed the skin after browning and then crisped it in a salamander and served it atop or on the side, as per Suzanne's post.

[Suzanne F]

Great minds think alike.

[Jinmyo]

Great minds think alike.   

Just what I was thinking!

[Wilfrid]

You can always just remove the skin and discard it if you share Jin's somewhat unnecessary prissiness about soft chicken skin. Jin - don't you like Hunanese boiled chicken?

[Jinmyo]

You can always just remove the skin and discard it if you share Jin's somewhat unnecessary prissiness about soft chicken skin.  Jin - don't you like Hunanese boiled chicken?

Unnecessarily, not really. Hunan cuisine is not amongst my favourites, anyway. On the other hand, if I haven't prepared it, in some ways I am much more flexible about how a dish should be, especially if it is traditional.

In my defense, Wilfrid, for more years than I care to recall I was married-Jewish as Mrs. Katz and learned not only to choke down but prepare mother-in-law Fay's bobbly skinned chicken soop.

ediot:

Withdrew some smilies. And wanted to add: The main thing though is just not getting the flavours from browning.

[CathyL]

In my defense, Wilfrid, for more years than I care to recall I was married-Jewish as Mrs. Katz and learned not only to choke down but prepare mother-in-law Fay's bobbly skinned chicken soop.            

You were a better wife than I, Jinmyo. I absolutely refused to make hamburgers "like my grandmother's" when I learned this meant simmering balls of ground chuck in a skillet of grease for hours and hours. The kreplach recipe [sic] was even worse.

Another option is to remove the chicken pieces when they're just shy of done and crisp them briefly under the broiler. Or with a butane torch, which is how a friend deals with the uncrisp skin of a smoked chicken.

[mikec]

If you do want to end up with a crispy skin i suggest you make " Poulet au vinaigre" ; where the chicken is cooked seperately then  transfered to a plate while you make the sauce in the cooking pan and return the meat only to reheat and coat it. You end up having a more cripy chicken.

I think that Coq au Vin wasn't the best example to use. Although what I'm describing happens with CaV I guess that its supposed to be the greyish, slimy result (even though all the pictures that I have seen have suggested otherwise.

A better example would be the Chicken with two vinagers recipe from the NYT a few weeks ago. It sounds great, but the result was soggy chicken that tasted good, but looked terrible. While I'm not opposed to eating something delicious even thought it looks ugly, this dish didn't taste good enough to justify the ugly presentation. Besides, I'm sure there is a way to achieve both results.

As far as Poulet au Vinegar, do you brown the chicken and then cook it to just shy of done before putting it back into the sauce? Because if it heats up and finishes in the sauce for too long, it will end up soggy.

Thanks!

[mikec]

Another option is to remove the chicken pieces when they're just shy of done and crisp them briefly under the broiler.  Or with a butane torch, which is how a friend deals with the uncrisp skin of a smoked chicken.

This was the conclusion that I came to as well. It's the only way that I can think of to achieve the results that I want. Although I think that I'll stick to the broiler and leave the blowtorch back in metalshop. :)

[Suzanne F]

But you get better control with a blowtorch

[col klink]

There's a great French restaurant in Seattle that serves up an amazing roast chicken with some of the best skin I've ever had in my life. I've cooked/smoked a lot of poultry and I'm trying to best their chickens, but so far the skin has elluded me. You can read about the discussion on the Pac NW board:

Click me

I tried the method of putting the bird in a 500 degree F oven for 15 minutes, but because (I think) I put the top on my Le Cruset afterward, in a 250 degree oven, I believe I steamed the bird for the rest of the cooking cycle. Do I need to just leave the top off? or do the browning at the end? By the way, we were talking about whole roasting birds, not pieces.

[Suzanne F]

Yup, your bird got steamed. (You would too, if someone stuck you in a hot oven, right?)

Anyway, if your Le Creuset is a "French oven" (Dutch to the rest of us) or casserole with high sides, you might not even want to use it You want the hot air to circulate around the chicken -- that's what will help crisp it. Makes your oven an ungodly mess to do it in a shallow pan, but what's an hour of scrubbing compared to the prospect of perfect chicken?

[col klink]

I was afraid that I might have you use something else besides my Le Cruset, but it makes it so easy if you want to do potatos/onions/mushrooms for the side course. Just place the bird on top and there's a whole meal.

What about after the steaming, carving the bird and finishing the skin under the broiler?

[Suzanne F]

You bet! Just remember to let it rest a bit before carving (so enervated from the heat!) and of course to pour the juices that run off back into the veg.

There's a truc for every problem.