Le Bernardin

[Msk]

Ill echo what Bourdain and tana said. I will add to increase the amount of black you wear, inverse proportionally to how dressed up you go. The more casual, the more black. This is typically a safe bet for NYC across the board.

Msk

[Chris Cognac]

Think black.

He's right.

And enjoy the specialness of being "forced" to dress up. I have been in California for over half my life, and I think the casual aspect is far overrated. Won't it be fun to get glammed up and be part of that whole scene in New York?

Happy anniversary, Alicia!

I dont know, I pretty much like the casual aspect of California dining. Being able to enjoy a great steak with a view of the sun setting over the ocean and having only to put on a good aloha shirt and nice shorts.....But on the other hand, I will being doing Vegas on new years eve and plan on wearing my ivory dinner jacket and black tie!..Now I just have to figure out where to wear it!

[Fat Guy]

You will find plenty of men at Le Bernardin wearing jackets but not ties, for example a black silk turtleneck under an earth-toned designer jacket. This has been fairly standard at top New York restaurants for the past decade. Even Lespinasse abandoned the necktie requirement in its last year of business, reverting to jacket-required/tie-optional. However, at Lespinasse a man would have been in a tiny minority without a necktie, whereas at Le Bernardin he would be in a minority but wouldn't be alone.

For women, dress in New York is quite flexible yet the mores can be difficult to navigate. For example, black pants and a lightweight black sweater with low-key black leather boots would be considered quite casual by the standards of many areas. However, it is probably the most likely outfit you'll see in winter among women in fancy restaurants in New York, as well as everywhere else. At the same time, what would be considered quite formal and totally appropriate for fine dining in Dallas -- like the latest Yigal-Azrouel printed halter dress from Neiman-Marcus in a floral print -- will scream "tourist!" in a New York restaurant. Ditto for jewelry, makeup, and fragrances: New York has its own brand of understatement in that regard.

[alicia]

(Everytime I post something here, I am certain that I'm going to be mocked into never posting again, but I consistently get friendly, helpful responses.)

Thanks for all the quick responses. I will now use this occasion as an excuse to go out and buy a sexy (but professional) black outfit, so that I can play dress up and pretend to be a sophisticated New Yorker for one night, anyway (at least until my unabashed oohing and aahing over the some of the best food in the city gives me away). Look out New York!

[Fat Guy]

I'm not an authority on women's fashion, so take what I say with a grain of salt, but . . . my suggestion would be to get out of the mindset that acknowledges such a thing as an "outfit." The "outfit" is a very non-New-York-ish concept. New Yorkers might actually use the term condescendingly when watching tourists parade around in restaurants, as in, "Oh, look at her little outfit." What you want to treat yourself to, in my opinion, is a really nice pair of black pants, and a really nice black top that is not related to the pants. Not a business suit. Pants and a top. This is the official uniform in New York, as far as I can tell.

[Marlene]

Do you have a nice blazer that would go over the sleeveless dress? I do this all the time. No only because at this stage of my life, I tend to overheat quite easily and I can always remove the jacket and have a lovely dress underneath

[KatieLoeb]

A nice pair of black wool garbardine trousers that you'll get tons of wear out of later with either a silk blouse or silk sweater in a solid color (either more black or a splash of color of your choice), a black blazer atop for warmth and/or style is optional. You'll be properly attired for just about anything in NYC.

[lamb]

I only own one "nice" dress, and it's sleeveless, so it isn't going to do me much good in NYC in January.

If that sleeveless dress is black; add a shawl!

You will look quite chic.

I haven't been to LB in about a year, and it is certainly a nice restaurant to celebrate your anniversary in.

Are you dining anywhere else while in NYC?

[alicia]

I tend to use the word "outfit" pretty loosely to refer to whatever it is I am wearing, whether it be jeans and tshirt, or a business suit. As far as I'm concerned, simple is better. I'm certainly no Vogue-mode-type, so blending in is what I'd like to do. Although I'm most comfortable in casual clothes, it isn't a big problem for me to dress up either, and understated is certainly easier for me than what would pass as appropriate dress attire in, say Dallas or Amarillo.

Thanks again, and I hope to provide a full report of the meal when I return - in early January...

[bloviatrix]

I'm not an authority on women's fashion, so take what I say with a grain of salt, but . . .

Don't sell yourself short, FG. Even Blovie, who I've trained in the finer points of Blahnik and Louboutin doesn't know about Yigal Azrouel.

My suggestions are:

1) go with something tailored. Even the most casual fabric will look dressier if it's well cut.

2) wear high heels. Again, it dresses everything up.

3) and while you can never go wrong with black.... camel, grey or navy work well too.

[alicia]

Alicia, are you walking or taking cabs?

Don't yet know. We're coming from Williamsburg, so depending on the weather, might subway/walk it, or if we're feeling particularly lazy, take a cab. Do they have valet parking? We could drive there in my mother-in-law's beat up 1980-something taurus station wagon (which she uses to haul paint, drop cloths, brushes, gardening implements, etc.). It is a lovely vehicle - only one of the doors works, one of the the back seats is stuck permanently in the down position, the upholstry is pretty much gone, at least two windows are cracked, and everything is covered with a nice layer of dust, dirt and paint.

Just kidding.

Edited December 19, 2003 by alicia (log)

[alicia]

Allright! You've given me my excuse to splurge- sixth wedding anniversarry, but tenth year together (and we rarely get to NYC more than once a year) - we take a car service, AND go to lunch the next day!

[jogoode]

Yesterday, I got to take off from work for a few hours at the last minute and had lunch at Le Bernardin with Bond Girl. I was happy to see the room almost full when we sat down, at 12:30. I was the only one there in a five-dollar blazer with big, gold buttons. Ripert was shaking hands in the dining room, and when I left he was sitting and chatting at a table.

Lunch started, as it had the two other times I'd been to LB, with toasted bread and salmon rillettes, which I could have eaten all day.

Before only one of my three lunches, the second one, did they serve an amuse -- a great one of thumbnail-sized pieces of fried squid, mentioned earlier in the thread. No amuse this time.

Bond Girl:

HAMACHI TARTARE Topped with Wasabi Tobiko; Ginger-Coriander Emulsion

I would never have ordered this dish, but I'm glad she did. Like most tartares, this was a cylindric pile of chopped fish. The wasabi tobiko, which I usually dismiss as kitschy when I see it on a menu, delivered texture in sweet, bracing pops. The ginger-coriander emulsion came, I think, by way of a light mayonnaise beneath the fish. Excellent yellowtail.

Me:

BAY SCALLOP-SEA URCHIN Marinated with Lime and Extra Virgin Olive Oil: "Ceviche Style"

In my experience, the raw apps at LB come in much smaller portions than the "lightly-cooked" apps. I could have finished my dish in two bites, but I took it slowly, constructing perfect little bites of scallop, thick cut to retain its texture, lobes of urchin, microscopic diced tomato, and a few slivers of red onion. The lime and olive oil was combined to silky effect, and the lime didn't overwhelm, as it does in so many ceviches around town. If I could have had a meal composed only of those tiny portions, I'd would have happily stayed through the dinner service, constantly nibbling.

I had been dreaming for a year about the dish of urchin pasta with warm urchin and caviar that they serve, but I couldn't bring myself to pay the $50 supplement.

Extra Course: Ravioli of Argentinean Shrimp and Wild Mushrooms Foie Gras-Truffle Sauce

I've eaten this dish every time I've been to LB: the first time I ordered it, the second someone at my table ordered it, and here it was again. I get a little star struck when I eat dishes like this -- truffles do that to me. I can say that the dish was well-executed each time: the pasta had been cooked perfectly, the sauce was rich but did not overwhelm the flavors of the shrimp, the shrimp themselves cooked just through, never chewy. Bond Girl said the dish was good but a little flat. I see her point. I think a little more salt on the ravioli -- to be sure, it was not bland -- would have cut the richness of the sauce, added another dimension of flavor, and encouraged the cilantro and mushroom in the ravioli, which were welcome during my first taste of the dish, about nine months ago, but were not as clear this time. Sorry to ramble, but this was the first time I had gotten to try the same dish more than once in a four-star.

Bond Girl:

SKATE Poached Skate Wing with Lemon Brown Butter; Tangy Carrot-Lemon Broth and Butternut Squash

I wasn't so sure about this dish as I ate it and when I thought about it after the meal I decided it was truly disappointing. My dad had skate on my second visit and it was great, in brown butter with capers alongside "braised lettuces." Yesterday, it was encircled by funny balls of butternut squash and had poured around it a not-very-tangy carrot sauce, possibly with coconut in it. The skate was cooked well, but the dish did not excite.

Me:

WILD ALASKAN SALMON

Barely Cooked Salmon on a Bed of Red Wine Braised Leeks; Black Truffle-Butter "Vinaigrette"

Ask me what is my least favorite fish. Go on, ask: salmon. I can never decide what I want at these damn restaurants. Everything sounds great. But sometimes, impulsively, I order the thing I think I'm least likely to love. I do, though, love raw salmon, so I thought that barely cooked, this salmon had potential. It was one of the best dishes I've ever eaten. This was the first dish I've had at LB that was aggressively salted. The salmon was warm, cooked enough to shed its resistant texture but not nearly enough to flake: the two pieces were still a vivid orange-pink. The truffle vinaigrette was nicely acidic, the leeks tender and sweet.

Desserts (we were given a sampling because Bond Girl knew someone in the kitchen. Ditto for the extra course):

CHOCOLATE

Warm Chocolate Tart with Melting Whipped Cream and Dark Chocolate Sauce

ALMOND-PEAR

Warm Baked Almond Cake; Marinated Pear Salad and Pear William Sorbet

YUZU

Yuzu Lemon Tart and Ginger Parfait topped with a Thin Caramel Tuile

The yuzu and the chocolate I had had before. Both are very basic, and very good. The almond-pear, which I thought at first was almond-green apple, was awesome.

On my first visit, I thought the service unfriendly, or at least a little cold. Nothing specific gave me that impression, it was a general feeling, but my subsequent visits have corrected it. The service is unintrusive; it included nothing gratuitous.

This meal was special because it was the first meal after which I got a tour of the kitchen! I had never seen the kitchen of a restaurant, and I was surprised at how small it was and how many people were stuffed inside. I also saw the relatively new kitchen (2 years old) that serves the private rooms upstairs. I met a few sous chefs and Ripert. What a day! And all this in my horrible, horrible blazer...

[winemike]

I have been to Le Bernardin on saturday evening for the late serving (10 pm).

Well, all in all, I was far from being impressed, be it the food, the service

or the setting.

The first shock was how packed the place is. You could not squeeze any

additional table. Our table (we were 3 people) was surrounded by 3 other

tables that were so close, we had the impression of dining with the other

guests at our table. Most annoying.

Of course, the place being packed, it was also incredibly LOUD. I could barely

hear the waiter... !! And there were so many waiters RUNNING around.

Constantly hitting my wife's chair. It gave us a feeling of "train station

restaurant". I thought that was a real joke.

Anyway, I was given the wine list (well before the menus) and then I was

asked by the waiter to choose the wine ... without having seen the menu !!!!

When I told him I'd decide what to drink once I know what I'd be eating,

he told me that "we serve fish here, you could choose any white wine".

I could not believe what I had heard

At that point, I should have just left the place. Immediately.

Though, I wanted to eat there for a while and was in NY just for 2 days

so we decided to stay and get the food that I remembered to be fantastic.

The waiter was simply horrible. When given the menu, I did not even have

time to read it that he was already waiting to take the order.

Stop pressuring me !!! I'm here to relax, have good food and good wine.

And take my time to eat. Or I would have gone to McDonalds !

Alright, then came the food.

I first had "Geoduck, thinly sliced marinated in lime-wasabi".

This was good, well balanced flavors, just a touch of coriander. A very refreshing

dish. It was good but I was not blown away. I tought it was good without

being brilliant. Of course, the problem being that everything around us

causing stress, we were not in the best mood for appreciating the food.

Then I had "Bouillabaisse". Well, not something I will remember.

It was .. just a bouillabaisse. Shrimps were overcooked, the aioli crab cake

was just alright and the lobster saffron broth was just .. well... good.

I had better bouillabaisse in quite a number of cheap eateries in south of France.

very disappointing.

Then we had "Steamed Maine Lobster with Corn and Chanterelle Stuffed Cabbage, Bacon Butter Sauce"

This was brilliant. Really good. Lobster cooked to absolute perfection, the sauce

was divine. And the Corn and chanterelle stuffed cabbage just nicely complemented

the dish. We all really enjoyed this dish. I tought "at last !!!" I understand why

it is expensive to dine here.

The desserts were fabulous.

"Warm Chocolate Tart with Melting Whipped Cream and Dark Chocolate Sauce"

was exactly as I remembered it when I first ate it about 3 years ago. Grand !!

Perfect temperature so the chocolate was just melting, the taste was incredible.

Just the perfect sweetness, the crust was great and .. well .. it was just great.

The sommelier offered us "Yuzu Lemon Tart and Ginger Parfait topped with a Thin Caramel Tuile".

That was truly nice from him and this dessert was amazing.

The lemon tart was of perfect consistency, the lemon flavour not too

acidic, the thin caramel tuile was great. Beautifully presented. A masterpiece.

In between, people had started leaving the place so it was much quieter

and much more enjoyable. The sommelier spent quite some time talking

about .... wine of course with us and I really enjoyed the quick chats.

Eventually, we almost left with a positive feeling but the whole experience

was spoiled from what happened in the first part of our dinner.

The impression of "hurry up, we need to serve more people to make more

money", "choose a white wine, we serve fish here" ... completely unacceptable

in a place like that.

I do not intend to return there at my next stop in NY because I've left

far too much money for what I got. There is surely other places were diners are

treated better (food, service and setting). Alain Ducasse, for instance ?!

Of course, it might just have been a night off. But at that price, there is no excuse...

[Bux]

Strange, as I recall, le Bernardin had a pretty extensive list of red wines--for a fish place. I'd be very disappointed to get overcooked shrimp at le Bernardin. However, I'd also not expect to get a bouillabaisse in New York, or in a haute cuisine restaurant in any city that resembled the original dish in Marseille or anywhere along the Mediterannean coast of France.

[Fat Guy]

Haute cuisine dishes are almost universally more refined, and therefore less rustic, than their non-haute counterparts. The bouillabaisse served at Le Bernardin is, in my opinion, an excellent dish in its own right that is probably best described as "inspired by bouillabaisse."

What I take away from winemike's post is that I won't be booking a late table at Le Bernardin. Not that I often book late at any restaurant -- it's very often a problematic sitting. Kitchens and managers tend to put a lot of pressure on waitstaff to get the last sitting's orders in right away. Then they can bang out the food, ascertain that things are on autopilot, and go home, leaving the waiters and pastry assistants to stand around all night waiting to close.

[winemike]

Of course, I did not expect bouillabaisse at Le Bernardin to be a real bouillabaisse.

I did not express myself very well, here...

Don't get me wrong, all in all it was good. But I was not that impressed with it. That's all.

There was also the frustration of having had two dishes at that stage and not one

of them was mind blowing. With only one left before dessert, I really thought that

this place is not worth it anymore ...

Clearly my mood interacted here. If everything had been perfect before, I might have

found the dish better ?? But the shrimp was still overcooked

Bux, the wine list has a great selection of red wines. But it's the waiter ... taking me for

an idiot by saying that they "serve fish here" and implying that "white wine" going with

fish, I could just pick any white I like. The more I think about, the more I think I should have left.

It was just insulting.

I hope it's all related to the late serving. Waiters are tired, cooks too and it all transpires....

But if they can't make it, they should just have two servings. I will not go back there for

any serving now. Early, "normal" or late ...

[Fat Guy]

If a tree falls and nobody hears it . . .

The complaint about the waiter should be taken to the restaurant's owner, in writing. Hopefully the waiter's name, the table number, and the time of the meal are on the receipt -- they usually are.

If everything happened exactly as stated here and there's no issue of miscommunication, misinterpretation, or anything of that nature, then the waiter needs to be taken aside by management and given a stern warning. But the waiter also needs to be allowed to explain himself. Worse, he could have been operating at the direction of middle management -- there is a tendency for this sort of thing to come from above.

[winemike]

I intended to do that and definitely will.

There was no miscommunication and no misunderstanding. My wife and our friend were as shocked as I was.

[Fat Guy]

There could have been a misunderstanding on the waiter's part, however. Sometimes we ask one question and a waiter hears another question, and the answer to the wrong question sounds incredibly obnoxious to the person who asked the right one. Or it's possible that your waiter was an asshole. Either way, I hope he is confronted.

[winemike]

I had not asked him any question, he just came and coldly said that.

Maybe he answered a question asked at another table. They were so close, it

would not surprise me

[marcus]

I had better bouillabaisse in quite a number of cheap eateries in south of France.

At a recent disappointing dinner at Le Bernardin, I had their bouillabaisse as part of the tasting menu. One must acknowledge that the broth was described on the menu as being based on lobster, which was how it tasted, so it should not be directly compared to the deeper flavored and far more interesting fish based varieties in the Mediterannean areas. My complaint was that it tasted sweetened, which to me is a major turn-off.

Without an specific horror story, I found the service which, I would once have described as the best in NY, to have declined significantly across the board, and we had a 7:30 reservation. The diners also struck me as much more of a bridge and tunnel crowd than I used to see there.

[JMayer]

What I take away from winemike's post is that I won't be booking a late table at Le Bernardin. Not that I often book late at any restaurant -- it's very often a problematic sitting. Kitchens and managers tend to put a lot of pressure on waitstaff to get the last sitting's orders in right away. Then they can bang out the food, ascertain that things are on autopilot, and go home, leaving the waiters and pastry assistants to stand around all night waiting to close.

There is no excuse for bad service.

There could have been a misunderstanding on the waiter's part, however. Sometimes we ask one question and a waiter hears another question, and the answer to the wrong question sounds incredibly obnoxious to the person who asked the right one.

In my experience miscomunications do not occur as often as people claim. And in a highly profesional enviornment such as LB, I would expect that the waiter would have enough sense to interpret possible miscomunications and ask the diner to explain himself or herself better.

Worse, he could have been operating at the direction of middle management -- there is a tendency for this sort of thing to come from above.

When one person lets down the team, the whole team fails not just the indivdual (sorry for the preachy tone). In my opinion it is not important who told who what, the fact is somewhere the service failed to meet the expectations of the diner. Therefore, the entire restaurant failed, not just the waiter who may or may not have been following someone elses orders.

I am not trying to pick on you fatguy, just wanted to express some of my opinions.

More to follow!

-Justin

Edited March 1, 2004 by JMayer (log)

[Fat Guy]

There is no excuse for bad service.

Do you also believe the customer is always right?

It's easy to lay down axioms of this nature, but the reality is that there are lots of excuses for bad service: servers are human beings not machines; service is a highly variable interpersonal phenomenon subject to many interpretations; and, most importantly, SHIT HAPPENS.

I've experienced poor service incidents in some of the top-rated restaurants in the world: Taillevent, Daniel, and French Laundry, just to name a few. The eGullet boards are chock full of bad-service stories about Michelin three-star restaurants all over Europe. Life throws you curveballs like that sometimes. I wish it never happened, but it does. So you have to go to Plan B and ask what you're going to do about it.

There is some positive news, though: direct intervention can turn bad beginnings into good endings. It's a given that every restaurant in the world, no matter how good, will fuck up once in awhile. What distinguishes the men from the boys is how those fuck-ups get handled once brought to the attention of management. That's the true test of a restaurant's mettle. What I've found is that, in the best restaurants, if you speak up about a service or food problem, they often handle it so well that you not only forgive the error but also develop newfound respect for the establishment.

Of course confrontation on-the-spot is difficult, even for bastards like me. So sometimes letter-writing after the meal is the only option -- but it's always a second-best option.

I should point out that, in the case of Le Bernardin, my mother-in-law wrote them a letter of complaint a couple of years ago and got a full-page hand-written response from Ripert. Unfortunately, I didn't find the response particularly helpful -- it was to my mind a bit condescending -- but at least it was something. Nonetheless, I can't help but think that had she brought her complaint to the attention of management on the spot, she would have had better results.

[JMayer]

Fatguy here is a post I was working on before I read your latest, I think it addresses many of the issues you raise. Thank you for a very insightful post, I very much enjoyed reading it. In terms of the customer always being right, I do not think this is always the case, however, sometimes I think restaurants forget that they are in the SERVICE business. I will elaborate on this further in a future post, but for know this is what I wrote down earlier today on MS Word…..

This may sound a little like a rant, but reading winemike’s experience inspired me. Sometimes no matter how hard a restaurant tries they cannot please some customers, however, upon reviewing winemike’s post I highly doubt this is the case. To me it seems like LB is trying to maximize its profits by booking to many seating and simply failed in the service aspect.

Some people may argue that the waiter was having a bad day or he or she is a bad egg and you should not let this spoil the whole basket. However, if I am going to spend, $500 on a basket of eggs there had better not be any spoiled eggs in it, and if there were, I would have the right to be extremely disappointed. Regarding the waiter having a bad day, I do not care if you are having a bad day; do not take it out on me. We all have bad days, does this give us the right to treat people lesser. If your having such a bad day don’t come into work, however, if you do come into work your there to serve at my pleasure (as if I were to serve you I would serve at your pleasure). Is it acceptable for a pilot, who is having a bad day, to land a plane in a haphazardly manner? Moreover, waiters please leave your pretense at the door. I do not care how much knowledge of food you have or how great the executive chef is, there is no reason for you to treat a person as if they are smaller then you.

I am not unrealistic and think that restaurants such as LB can succeed with every customer. Sometimes a restaurant will fail; no individual or team can be perfect all the time. Some failures are greater then others, however, at the end of the day it is still a failure. One failure does not justify a bad restaurant (even several failures) it is the overall opinion of people and repeated visits by people that formulate the quality of a restaurant. If someone goes to a restaurant several times and is consistently disappointed then there is cause for alarm!

Cheers,

Justin