Bux

Or a savory custard. A savory custard in a pastry crust is a quiche. Unless of course, apple sauce is just apple pie without the crust.

I thought the Mario/Michael show was interesting, but frustrating. Of all the foods prepared so far on ICA, these dishes were the ones I though I had to taste. That is I couldn't quite imagine how they tasted and thus it was too difficult to have much of an opinion on taste, the most important element. I was surprised that Mario got the nod on creativity and by that margin. Once again the comments seem too edited to offer much insight into the voting.

Smoke, mirrors and computer animation, hell freezing over is kid's play on TV.

I think I'm going to die from what I eat. As Pan says, "Vegetables aren't free of risk, either." I trust you're all familiar with ecoli related deaths from scallions. Nothing is dealier than raw vegetation in my book. Everytime I sit down to dinner I ask myself if maybe I'd live longer if I'd just stop eating. Worse yet, everytime I pick up the newspaper, I worry about scaring myself to death before I starve. Even the medicines my doctor prescribes to prolong my life, seems to be killing other people.

My own feeling on what to do when one can't or don't feel like making a proper crust is to just make a Spanish tortilla. It's also not unreasonable to bake a savory custard without a crust. It can be unmolded or just eaten out of the mold in which it's cooked most of the time.

Oddly enough, this is so different from French policy, and law, regarding restaurants which must post a copy of their menu outside on the street for all to see before they enter the premises. Even odder is the fact that most (all?) clothing shops post prices in the window for all clothing displayed in the window. Both of these things came up recently here in a discussion about about one of NYC's most expensive restaurants which is in what's basically an urban mall. Although Per Se is rather formal, pricey and booked months in advance, clueless tourists wander in wearing jeans and looking to eat lunch. It wouldn't happen if the $175 menu price were posted outside, but in NY, that's considered tacky.

That "the location is unasuming" is quite an understatment, though it is easily accessible even by public transportation, there is a bus stop just a couple of blocks away and it's within walkable distance of the Calatrava designed museum complex that's on every tourist's must see list. It's an unshaded walk however and could be brutal under the summer sun. I supsect most people want to choose the tasting menu, if it's a first visit especially. I'd also agree that Sento runs that ship of his very tightly. Hardly a server passed by him without him making some comment to her. He seems stern, yet able to turn on the charm. Getting on his good side seems important. We seem to have managed that. As much as the tasting menu seems an obvious choice, there was a surfeit of choices on the a la carte menu that seemed to say "you can't leave Valencia without eating me." Sento sensed our interest in the food and our frustration with having to choose and came to our rescue making suggestions and in no time with translations for my approval, he and Esilda, with Esilda making translations for my approval, put together an excellent menu. Of course he went into the kitchen to consult with his son and came back with the report that our menu was not as well balanced as it should be. I thought the chef might have a suggestion for a change, but no, he wanted to add some dish. Perhaps it pushed the limits of how much we could eat, but we left later than afternoon feeling we had one of the most satisfying meals we'd ever had in Spain.

Boucherie Chevaline was a much more common sign in Paris back in the 60s. Horsemeat seems to have gone out of fashion. It's still around, but not to the extend that I recall seeing in forty years ago. I've been told that it's about the French wanting to be seen as modern and in step with other countries.

Druckenbrodt, it appears that you experienced authentic Breton weather. We've made galettes using half buckwheat and half wheat flour. They were quite good, but I'm told that in Brittany they often use a mix that favors the white flour, rather half and half. I had a bottle of buckwheat beer in Brittany. I only remember that it was quite dark and earthy. An experience and perhaps an acquired taste. It is not particularly a traditional product, but a relatively new one. With the exception of the area around Nantes, Brittany make no wine. They are best known for their hard cider which I think competes successfully with that of Normandy, but the brewing of beer seems to have picked in more recent times and there are a number of local labels. The Breton language is a Celtic tongue. It far more widely spoken that it is now, but there are programs to teach it to the young these days and there's an active interest in pan-Celtic culture. Bagpipes are one of the local traditional musical instruments. Our Breton son-in-law chose to have his bride come down the aisle to the tune of a piper. It scared the hell out of the flower girl. One of the guests from the UK wondered why anyone was surprised at that. He noted that the damn things were developed to scare the enemy before battle. Brittany is home to Celtic festivals that bring musicians from Ireland to Galicia to participate.

As that place is a pretty big place, do you remember if it was north, east, south or west of the place?

No one's mentioned products you prepare yourself and then defrost, heat and serve. Do those count? When we did more cooking then we do now, we'd almost always make more than enough of certain foods, mostly stews, soups and pasta sauces. Maybe we'd make enough for three meals and freeze enough for one or two meals. I have a great dislike for eating commercially prepared food and it's not based on health, or necessarily even on taste. Perhaps it's just rebellion against a mass culture. However, there are always a few staples in the freezer. These days, one of them is bound to be frozen Chinese dumplings from one or two local sources in NY's Chinatown. Another might be some locally produced spinach and cheese ravioli from a local source. Because fresh pasta is perishable, the local shop usually has their ravioli in the freezer case. We usually have some rolls or bread in the freezer. A brioche loaf can be easily sliced even when frozen and can go into the toaster for a few seconds. We tend not to keep a lot of frozen vegetables on hand mostly because I enjoy experiencing the seasons. Again, I see it as a personal choice rather than a moral one. Peas freeze incredibly well and it's hard to get peas even in season that are any better. The vitues of flash freezing have already been spelled out in this thread. Eggs are my favorite fast food. No one wants to eat stale eggs, but they really keep well enough that one doesn't have to shop too often to always have fresh eggs on hand. From the refriderator to the table, is a pretty quick and it doesn't matter much if they're fried, scrambled or an omelet. Now that we're willing to spend the premium price for eggs from the greenmarket or even organic eggs from the supermarket, I enjoy them a lot more as well. Eggs really vary in taste. Bread, as I mentioned, freezes well. I thought the Boboli crusts would be great, but when I tried it, I just didn't like the taste. I can't remember much else about it. Although I've been accused of being a purist for good reason, I've found brands of chestnuts either in jars, or vacuum packed are incredible. I've not been able to discern a flavor loss and the time saved it wonderful. They are not exactly a heat and eat product, expecially if I want them accompany a braised goose.

Mushrooms, leeks, and of course the classic Lorraine with gruyere and bacon. It's been a while since I've had quiche in the states. It seems dated here, but it's still a staple in France and an afternoon snack for us there might be an individual quiche purchased at a patisserie. There's also a one dish restaurant in Bayonne. All they serve are tartes, both savory and sweet. Actually they have salad as well. As fine a quick meal as one might want, a slice of savory quiche, a green salad and a slice of a fruit tarte.

We've stayed in a few paradors, but haven't eaten in enough of them to offer a personal opinion. I recall reading about a plan to have paradors offer examples of regional cooking, but I have no idea if it was a proposal or a plan now in affect. I seem to recall a few comments in the forum that were not particularly positive about parador food in general and it seems to be a hit and miss sort of thing. It would be interesting to learn which paradors had good food.

lxt, you've touched a nerve here with your assessments that many of the diners at some of the most famous restaurants are there only because they can afford to be and are no more interested in the food than the diners, if they may be called diners, at some chain restaurant in a mall. I recall an the time I first got into a conversation with a French chef in his NY restaurant. A few pleasantries were exchanged as he passed the table, but I guess he became convinced of our passion, if not necessarily of our knowledge. Over the years, a small friendship emerged, but at that moment the ice was broken just enough to broach certain subjects and I asked about his clientele. He was direct. He said that tomorrow, many of the people in the dining room would be eating far inferior food, paying as much, if not more, and quite as happy to do it. I honestly don't know if the ratio of connoisseurs is higher in Paris than in NY. I've suspected so, but I'm not always convinced. A chef and his kitchen need to be appreciated or the quality will deteriorate, but the best of them will cook for the best level of clientele. They will cook at their best all the time, but a good restaurant will usually have a staff that's attentive to the signs of an educated diner as well as a passionate one and will be responsive to that interest or should I say those interests. Catering to an audience with an interest in food, but a less developed appreciation may lead to to excesses of showmanship rather than solid cuisine.

We're already discussing Iron Chef America In the Media Forum. This may be much more about Chefs on TV or how chefs are presented to America by the media than it is about cooking and as the "competition" between Michael and Mario wasn't restricted to pastry, Food Media and News is the appropriate place to discuss what transpired on TV. We've moved all post broadcast discussion of the show and in my opinion "show" is a more operative word that contest, to the Iron Chef America thread in Food Media and News. The discussion of the Batali/Laiskonis event begins with post #255. Please join that discussion to post on the show.

Art that reinvents art, or at least revolutionizes it is Art. The rest is just culture. Adria may, or may not please your palate, but he is making chefs think about food in ways they haven't before and he's doing the same thing for diners. Hopefully, the eGullet forums can do the same thing in our own way.

This might be more fun than discussing the issues germane to the topic at hand. It's certainly about both, although I suspect there's more than a bit of self deception and denial involved. Closer to the mission of this forum, if no this discussion, I'll only note that Guy Savoy is slated to open a restaurant in Las Vegas. I have heard rumors that Daniel Boulud has rejected some offers to open a restaurant in Las Vegas, but I've also heard that it's always been a possibility for the future. Smart money will probably not bet against either Boulud or Ducasse opening in L.V. John Whiting's post concurs with my memory that it was proposed to be more than just a restaurant at the Louvre by a progressive director. It was intended as a cultural project as much as a place to eat.

If you go from Brittany to the Brittish Isles or Ireland, or from Provence or the Côte d'Azur to Italy, you will see far less change than if you go from Brittany to Provence, with the exception of the fact that almost everyone between Brittany and Provence will speak the same language. The four corners of France very much resemble their neighbor across the borders in each corner. At the north and southeast, those borders were still changing in the 20th century. In that century Alsace has been German and Savoy, Italian. The Basques often express a kinship with the Basque nation that crosses the border. The foridable border of the Pyrenees is not much of a cultural border at either end. There's a Catalan culture that exists on both sides of the border and you will see both the Catalan flag flying proudly on both sides. You will also see cultural institutions operated by the same Catalan cultural organization. For all that however, there's a Frenchness that doesn't celebrate diversity quite the same way Americans do. There are no hypenated French. The don't have Algerian-French or Celtic-French, the way we have Italian-Americans, Irish-Americans, Jewish-Americans, Chinese-Americans, etc. France may, or may not be more of a melting pot, but it prentends to be one in which all the cultures merge. Lately it's had some awakenings. Things are not always as they seem.

If you remember, can you describe this a little more? ← As I recall it was a caramel colored macaron, with caramel colored filling. I believe the caramel flavor was in both the "cookie" and the butter cream. I suspect the butter cream filling was more intensely flavored. There were no salt crystals in evidence. The salt is in the batter or the buttercream. It was not a salty macaron, but it had the tang of those Breton caramels made with salted butter.

I've met 75 year old men from Maine that give the same impression.

As was clear to Jonathan, I was referring to Robert Parker. It's hard to blame him for "parkerization" of wines as I heard one winemaker call the trend towards making wines that please Parker. That same winemaker noted that a "92" from Parker made his banker very happy. In other times, it might have been said that a good wine would have made one's bankers happy. Last night I had a vin de pays from the area designated as something like the "hills of the Rhone." The largest word on the label was the name of the grape, then came the negotiant's name. The region of production was indicated in much smaller type. In the south of France in certain areas, particularly in the Languedoc, but obviously not exclussively, wine labels read much the same as then do in the new world where the prominent feature is the name of the grape without reference to expected terroir.

I had a caramel au buerre salé macaron rather some time ago and it was a paragon.

The playing field is changing. It may be changing very slowly, but it's changing. One sign that it's changing is that there are people who are just becoming aware of an agricultural heritage and a food heritage that's been lost. There are artisanal cheeses, wines, beers, etc. that are being produced by people whose fathers were not in those industries. They're willing to look outside France because they understand that a generation of Frenchmen have neglected the heritage they thought should be theirs by right and isn't. Another sign of change is that the majority of French winemakers now appear to cater to the taste of one man, and he's an American. Yet another tell tale sign of change is that a French chef who's worked in the US, is no longer considered to have fallen off the face of the earth. French culinary students will willingly stage in American restaurants, although I understand that's less and less the case with the implementation of new work laws in France. Young French chefs no longer seem willing to work the house that Americans and Spaniards are willing to endure, at least according to what I've heard.

The project seemed quite serious and not particularly aimed at tourism when it was first announced.

I thought it was supposed to open Monday (7 Feb.). I've already ready reviews of the dumplings, or so I thought. I went over there for lunch today, but all I got was the chance to read a sign that said they'd be opening next week. I hope that was a new sign and not one that's been there, or one that will be there for a while.