Bux

Well I also agree that it's exactly the way a restaurant should respond, most of the time. It's in their best interests to see that a diner leaves pleased. It's better for them to take a loss on the dish than to hold to their right not to offer a second dish without charge, but lets understand that the diner doesn't have the right to demand such service and it is a mark of graciousness on the part of the house. Sammy has already corrected your misunderstanding of wine service, ritual and etiquette, but I don't think it can be emphasized enough how mistaken it is to say one can try a wine to see if one likes it before buying it. I trust no one comes away from reading any post on eGullet with that impression. You do have the right to refuse a bottle that is flawed and the reason you are offered a taste is to determine if the wine is "corked" or has other off tastes. If you order Sauternes with your scallops and then decide the wine is too sweet for your taste, you have no right not to pay for the wine. It is the responsibility of the diner to know what he's ordering and how it should taste. If you ask for a dry wine and the sommelier recommends a Sauternes, then you have a case for refusal, but if you just don't like a wine you ordered, it shouldn't go back. That's not how it works. I'm genuinely surprised to see anyone say that on a web site of this caliber and surprised that it didn't meet up with a greater reaction.

This is one way in which an exceptional restaurant that has been well priced has become more accessible lately. It seemed to me that at one time, there was little I could find in the way of selections under $40 and that now there's a good selection closer to $30 and it's a more interesting selection than I find at lesser restaurants offering wines at that price. It's a small list, but it's very serviceable and the steward knows her wines, as do some of the other staff.

When assessing any reviewer, it helps to have some familiarity with the restaurants he's awarding stars. It's one thing to read that a dish in a top luxury restaurant is inferior to what he's had in a meager trattoria, it's another thing to believe it when you're had the dish.

I will check out Nova. My experience with AE, which have generally been good, (although I need to put that in perspective to what I expect when I rent a car) is that when they quote in dollars, they often use a rate of exchange that's better than the one currently in effect, so it's deceptively low by a bit. Europecar is often the one we get thorough AE and I've been happy enough with them.

I'd like to hear more about EasyCar. I've used EasyAnything for Internet access in Paris and several other places. Car rental companies can be such sleezebags that I've been reluctant to switch from the companies with which I've had tolerable relations in the past. I understand EasyCar's contracts differ from the standard contracts offered in the industry. That's not necessarily bad, but one needs to read the terms clearly and understand the potential for surcharges and unexpected charges. I see that they hold a deposit for 30 days after you return the car. That makes you their banker for a month. That's not weird, it's unreasonable. I'm reading their web site and see all sorts of flags. There's a cleaning fee if the car is returned dirty. The policy paper defining "clean car" requires the reader to link to another page and there one has to choose the rental location. I assume policies vary from location to locations and are always subject to interpretation. At the Montparnasse Paris location, the late fee is 120 euros. That's pretty hefty even before you note that the return is not effected until they finish the paper work. They endeavor to complete the check in process within one hour during peak times, although it may take longer if the car is not clean. As Pan suggests, I'd pay very close attention to the contract.

And the bias being from the point of view of a connoisseur of good food, or just the good life. I trust that price included room and board? Not cheap, but a bargain by Parisian terms. I also trust this is a second visit to France this year, or have you been at your house since July?

Is this it? gastronomie: produits exotiques Izrael 30 RUE FRANCOIS MIRON 75004 PARIS 01 42 72 66 23 01 42 72 86 32 fax Les Pages Jaunes--The French Yellow Pages online is a source you should know, although as with most search engines, correct spelling is essential.

I've never been a fan of Grimes, but I think he's right on the money in this case. "The Brooklyn Cyclones could win all 76 of their games, but they would still be a minor league team. A great one, but still minor league." If there's one guide with a scale of ratings, those ratings must be relative to each other for them to have any value to a stranger to the restaurants involved. The one thing Michelin has done well is to emphasize that their stars are relative to the time and trouble it's worth to get to the restaurant. When I go to one of the best restaurants in France on the basis of three Michelin stars, I'm not guaranteed I will personally like the food, but I am guaranteed that it will be a world class restaurant. I would feel cheated if I picked up a Zagat guide overseas, made my reservations based on their ratings, got into a cab in NY and wound up at a great neighborhood restaurant when I was expecting major league food. You want to award top marks for a burger? Fine, but put it in a burger guide, or divide your general guide into meaningful sections. That the Zagat's are so fond of this place just make's me think they're pushing their weight around a bit as well. I've come back from Paris with fond memories of meals at stratospheric prices and equally fond memories of chitlin' sausages in a chain brasserie, but I never confuse the two. Zagat is blurring the lines and failing to communicate with these kind of ratings. It's what they've always done and one reason why they've always been unreliable for serious diners.

How's the harvest in La Mancha? Grapes were still on the vine in La Rioja, at least in some places. Our restaurant selections were pretty well made before Robert's article appeared here. It's interesting that they were affected by earlier threads in which Berasategui got very favorable reviews. Diners who read personal reports when making their travel plans are all too often apt to place too much importance in a single report by someone they don't know over the professionally produced guide books. Over the years, I've had enough dissatisfaction with Michelin--in reality one of the most successful and dependable dining guides--to want to throw the guides out, but it's dangerous to depend on even a few opinions by diners with only a single meal at a restaurant under their belt. I know that if I visit even a three star restaurant on different nights, I may have a drastically different opinion of my meal. More often than not, it's dependent on my mood, what I ordered, how I ordered and things only I have any control over and less on differences in what the restaurant delivers, although knowing a restaurant's specialties is more important that knowing what one likes, in my opinion. There's nothing wrong in having links or influences to French food or having them obvious. I think we agree that for at least the first three quarters of the 20th century, France far outpaced Spain in culinary matters in many ways, not the least of these was the quality and depth of haute cuisine. Spain is running with the ball right now, to use a sports metaphor, but they didn't invent the game of restaurant cooking nor develop the techniques, discipline or style of haute cuisine. I think the issue is not unlike having a restaurant in Normandy showing a link to Burgundy a couple of generations ago or maybe less great. Regional food at the very top level of haute cuisine is far less dominant today than it was a few generations ago.

The bar at the NE corner of the Plza. de la Constitution must be Astelena, previously mentioned by Pedro and on Akelarre's list as well. With a triple recommendation that only thing that could stop me from a visit was finding it closed for vacation. I suppose it was a blessing in that there were too many to cover anyway, but in addition to the ones I've already mentioned that were closed, Txepetxa, a very highly recommended place for both its anchovies and its friendliness was also closed. Directions to bobsdf's third recommendation weren't the easiest to follow, but I found the bar he mentioned. It turned out to be La Cuchara de San Telmo also mentioned by girlcook, but without an address and I'll pass the recommendation on as excellent. I would have liked to work my way through most of that blackboard list, but had only a tapa of rissotto with idiazabal cheese. I'll follow this up with a compendium of recommendations from others with my comments. It may take a few days unless someone is on their way to Donostia and needs a list in a hurry. If anyone has additional recommendations or a recent list of qualified recommendations, I'd appreciated getting them by private mail so I can include them in the list. The first time we were in Donostia, we found the bars intimidating. I don't know why. Maybe we were just uptight about being served quickly. This time, I found all of the bars reasonable accommodating and many of them were downright friendly and solicitous. It does take a bit of determination to work your way to the bar in the most crowed places, but naturally, they're the ones you most want to experience. Spanish patrons seemed to have the same problems we had and their determination and patience varied. Some found an opening quickly and others stood around waiting for an opporutnity. It also made little difference if the man or the woman did the ordering, or if our Spanish was fluent or obtuse. I often had to repeat my order or correct them if I was misunderstood. The response from the other side of the bar ranged from overtly solicitous to politely efficient. It generally seemed to depend on how busy they were. In the barrio de Gros across the bridge from the more touristy part of town, there was less of a scene and conversation, if you spoke Castillano or Euskara, was easy to strike up. It may well be that if one is interested in the best tapas rather than the scene, this may be where some of the best tapas are found. It was hard to tell as two out of our three destinations were closed.

I've responded to the news about Las Rejas in the thread I had started on Las Rejas, but I think it's worth noting, just to stay on topic, that Martin also has three sols and three Michelin stars.

From Martin Berasategui - 2003 thread I'm really pleased to hear that. I think it's human nature to want to have one's taste reinforced with the backing of some establishment judgment. I think I described my meal there as holding its own with any two star restaurant in France, and I've have some meals in two star restaurants that I thought should have had three stars. I suspect this is the English language scoop on this news, so I thank you. I have not read anything on Las Rejas in the English language press. In fact, I believe your earlier mention of the restaurant here is the only thing I've read in English about de la Osa or the restaurant before we went there. As I recall it was two "sols" in Campsa this year and the woman we spoke to in Madrid--a woman who described her husband as obsessed with food--said her husband thought it was underrated. This has very much become a benchmark restaurant for us. Most of our meals in Spain since, have been compared to Las Rejas. Some of them have been considered to have been "finer," although none have been considered better. The concept of finesse is far more subjective here than even quality and should not really be taken as a necessarily positive. In fact, Manolo's lamb's foot was a more impressive final savory dish in some ways than the ubiquitous pigeons we had last week. Then again the fact that I love pigeon more than lamb's foot and that the latter was unique to my experience worked in its favor. The one difference between Las Rejas and the restaurants in the Pais Basque and even Echaurren that shouldn't be over looked when discussion Michelin stars is the decor, ambience and environment of the restaurant. While I was most comfortable and noticed not a single service fault, with the possible exception of too great an efficiency in presenting the next course, and while I don't think Michelin is as focused on luxury settings as some French chefs seem to think, I would suggest the current environment of Las Rejas will work against Michelin recognizing it as a three star restaurant. While Akelarre and Berasategui might bring diners just for the view, and maybe I'd add Mugaritz to that category, Las Rejas may have the drabbest setting and most unimposing exterior appearance of any restaurant in Spain. The interior is nice enough, but in a provincial way, and lacks the smart chicness or the restored historical situation I'm coming to expect in a top Spanish restaurant. I'd also add that the price tag is a bargain that belies the quality. It's 160 kilometers from Madrid and well worth a detour on any drive south or east of Madrid. It would also make for a reasonable overnight trip from Madrid combining sightseeing in Aranjuez and Cuenca with a possible overnight in one of a couple of Paradors.

I think this is part of a problem I've found that is not uncommon in France. There's a willingness to say one is broadminded, but in reality too many French chefs are unable to overcome their defensive attitudes about France's place in the history of cuisine. I've had too many discussions with young chefs who equate McDonald's with American taste while at the same time, failing to admit that although Americans created McDo, the French consumer is eating the concept with gusto. Recently I was in Arpege where I heard more English spoken than French. Loiseau, years ago, admitted that foreign tourism was what was keeping haute cuisine alive in France. Attention to good food is on the rise in the US and other English speaking countries. It has been in decline for decades in France, although I sense a revival there. The point I'd make is that chauvinism is out of date in today's culinary world. Vserna has eloquently stated the influnece French chefs have on not only Arzak, but most of the other great chefs of his, and the next, generation of Spanish chefs here on eGullet, but it's just as obvious that today, young and established chefs in France and America are talking about the restaurants in Spain more and more. That American chefs and Spanish chefs have been able to learn from the French and that the French can only create "shitty fusion food in Paris" would be proof of the culinary vitality in France, but it's really not very true. L'Astrance is a very good example of why it's not true. I think edm correctly described his post as a rant. It was emotional and undocumented and probably defensive about the wrong things. I have long been a champion of French food, French cooking and above all French culinary training and discipline. It was not long ago that I would said that all the really great restaurants in the US had French chefs and that all the good ones were run by chefs that had training in France. Even Alice Waters based her restaurants on what she'd observed in France. I'd still advise a young cook in the states to travel, eat and, if possible, train in France and Spain, but times are changing and we're developing our own standards. There are many reasons why Spanish cuisine is so interesting right now and so influential and none of them have anything to do with the establishment of an academic institution. It has to do with the dynamic atmospere that now exists in Spain. I will also point out that whle Arpege gets 300 euros for its tasting menu and the cheapest wines on the list run about 80 euros, the top restaurants in and around San Sebastian have gastronomic menus that run aroung 100 euros and sommeliers have no problem recommending wines at 30 euros. Haut cuisine is inaccessible to most people in France and this is helping the disconnect between French citizens and gastronomy. I think the rest of the world has paid due respect to French cuisine over the ages and continue to do so by evolving. It's the French who are least interested in paying hommage to the tradition and substance of French cuisine, while defending the form. Don't get me wrong. France is not a disaster area in terms of food and eating, but it will continue to decline wherever it establishes a defensive attitude.

Take this discussion to the France board where you're likely to get better suggestions for this part of your trip.

Akelarre, Martin, Arzak and Mugaritz. All fine meals. Of course we have our favorites and our complaints, but still all were worth our time and money and all were both enjoyable and interesting. This is it for this trip to Donostia. We also visited Echaurren in Escaray which we enjoyed very much. Outside of tapas and snacks, we I think we only had two unplanned lunches. One was cheap and dreadful--a mistake, but for the sake of domestic relations, I won't dwell on that choice. The other one was quite interesting with roast baby pig and an unusual first course of morcilla and pear lasagne with a roquefort cheese sauce. The one comment I might make at this point is that perhaps the main meat and fish courses on the tasting menus were often not quite up to the appetizers and seafood dishes, but even that's relative to many things and especially to one's expectations and interests. Sometimes one has to reconsider a meal afterwards to understand one's own subjectivity. Neither foam nor caramel was absent from the table, but neither was so very much in evidence. There are trends and there are certain ingredients and techniques that appear in more than one restaurant, but what I sense is a lot of individuality, that's just not well reported in the American press covering Spanish food. Subijana proved to be the most accessible chef to us this trip and this was part of what we discussed as the conversation drifted to food in other parts of Spain. His eyes lit up when we mentioned De La Osa from Las Rejas. I'm not sure if he really liked his food or if he was just pleased to see Americans so familiar with Spanish food outside the Catalunya-Pais Vasco axis.

Just to be clear, it was a Spaniard who made that statement in response to an American who asked what morcilla was. There are days when I suspect an eGulleteer may offer a better introduction to Spanish food than a Spaniard, but then again eGulleteers, like Spaniards are not all equal. In the end, real appreciation cuts across all borders. The percentages may still favor the locals most of the time, but I'm always reminded of the comment made by one of the guests at a wedding in France. He said his parents used to eat that stuff. In this case, that stuff was, I believe, pigs feet in aspic. Lots of pigeon this week. I think every tasting menu has featured it. It would be a problem if I didn´t love pigeon. I believe Akelarre's menu said pichon de sangre. It was crisped on the skin side and raw on the other. All of the pigeons I've had have been quite nicely rare. Generally speaking at least as rare as served in France. Presentation, garnish and the appeal of each dish aside, I think the pigeon at Mugaritz was the most flavorful and the most "gamey," but I´d realy not like to rate then in order. Not a bad meal in the lot so far and we leave in the morning, so I'd say all our meals can be described as destination meals. The down side is that Esilda has little appetite for tapas until noon the next day. It's not the worst problem, but my list of recommended bars grows faster than tha then number of bars I can get to visit.

The bar on Bermingham is called Begarra, and unfortunately it's closed for a couple of weeks for vacation. No big loss, there's a bar in the other direction on Bermingham, Aloña Berri, that was recommended by Gambero Rosso (thanks Francesco) and it had some prize winning tapas. Actually it won a prize a few years back for it's brandada, but it was the langoustino in bric with parsley sauce and the sea urchin that were the winners for me. Sea urchin is a delicacy in Asturias, but not as commonly found or eaten here. Then again, there was the Spanish woman showing some Americans around when I ordered the morcilla last night. One of the Americans asked her what I was having and she said it had stuff in it she didn't know and that she wouldn't touch it. Full report when I get back, but I'm afraid Mrs. B is quiting too early in the evening for me to cover the ground I'd like to cover. At this rate, I'm not going to make them all.

Muchas gracias. We're still trying to cover the short list we had, but a few more names won't hurt. Actually, many of the places we pass look good enough to try, but it's good to work from a reliable list. Also, after a really fine lunch it's hard to work up much of an appetite even for a tapa. It's a tough job, but someone's got to do it. I've printed out your post.

As I've just posted in another thread devoted to Berasategui, we had lunch at MB a little earlier in the day and it was an even better experience than our first lunch in May of 2000. Food and service were all I'd expect from a three star restaurant and overall, the best we've had since we arrive in Spain. I can´t really say much about the sommelier. We ordered a white wine we knew. The sommelier recommended a nice olorosso from Jerez with the smoked eel, foie gras green apple classic and we enjoyed the combination. I asked for a glass of red wine with our duck and did not enjoy the wine or the way it didn't work with the duck as much as I may have liked. Do most three star restaurants have good choices by the glass? I don't know. I will say that this glass cost less than a third the price of the wine I got by the glass at Arpege and wasn't much worse. I'm really disappointed to read that others had a less favorable experience than we did. On the whole I think everyone should be more influenced by good reports and ignore the negative ones unless you're willing to forgo a potentially great meal. The really interesting thing about our lunch was the Mrs. B had to be talked into the tasting menu. She was ready for another day off from serious eating, but once that food started coming to the table her mood changed completely.

I have to note that we just left Martin Berasategui a few hours ago after a spectacular lunch that pleased us no end. I also have to note that much of the tasting menu was in line with the one described at the beginning of this thread. We loved every dish, although our appetites flagged towards the end. I won't say every dish was better than every other dish we've had since arriving in Donostia, but overall, this was the best meal. I suppose I'll have to get around to posting more about it, but I realy felt I needed to say this. Martin is a real three star chef in his prime. Of that, there is no question in my mind. It was engaging food and served by an engaging staff who were most attentive and responsive to our questions. There's no accounting for individual taste, but I just don't understand why anyone wouldn't recognize the talent in this restaurant. I suppose that's what makes horse races.

Most of the major chateaux in Brodeaux are not open to visitors. For the most part, one shouldn't think of California style wine touring when in France. Most lesser wineries are open mostly for tasting in the hope the visitor planning on buying a case or so. Of course there are exceptions and there are wineries open to tourists. Nonetheless, Bordeaux, although the name of a famous wine is not the most interesting city in France. If I had a to split a month between Paris and Bordeaux, Í think four days in Bordeaux would be too much. I have spent two or three days in the area, but only with a car to make side trips.

We're just back in Donostia and finally had a chance to wander the streets of the old part of town this evening. I forgot how good the tapas can be there. Generally speaking, and we did have a list of recommended places from eGullet and other sources, the quality is just so much better than what we've had elsewhere in the region which includes the Pais Vasco and La Rioja. We were in Logrono on a Sunday night and I was impressed with the crowds that packed a certain part of town. It was wall to wall people eating and drinking in the streets as the bars overflowed. Donostia was tamer, perhaps Sunday night is special. Maybe Wednesday is an off night. The last time we were in Donostia, I recall not being able to get to the bar to place an order. A couple of more nights like this and I may have a good report to post.

This isn't the appropriate board, but there must be better places in France than Bordeaux that are accessible by train and of more gastronomic interest. I like Bordeaux, but the best meal Í've had in the area is from a chef who lost one of his stars and consequently his restaurant. Try Lyon perhaps--better local food and greater access to better restaurants.

Bordeaux may be the weak spot in your itinerary. Traditionally, it hasn't been that hot a spot for food.

Coming to Donostia from Paris, I can't say the inflation is anywhere near as great as in France. Nevertheless, it's not fair to hate Adria for the fault of others. Also, I am hardly an expert on Spanish food--new or old--but I see a lot of creativity that is original, and I see just as many foams in France as in Spain.