Bux

Yes, "loud" was mentioned earlier. The French, at table and elsewhere tend to be much quieter than Americans. I'd note that this is a cultural difference without being judgmental. I'll admit that loud discussions from another table seem disruptive in France, but you're less likely to hear a American conversation over the din in a restaurant in Spain or Italy.

Stereotypes aside. some of see an argument as a discussion, while others see a discussion as an argument. I sometimes have the feeling that Americans take dissent too personally.

Margaret hit it on the nail when she noted she had no faith in the consistency of enforcement or knowledge of the latest rules by local inspectors. You can play it safe, or risk loss of expensive products.

I had hoped Azula10 just experienced a bad day at the restaurant when I decided to return, but © 2005 WorldTable Inc. Reposted with permission.

It's a nice site and one desgned to sell salt even where taste is not involved. It also offers some good advice.

Nah. I wrote "mild bad manners", in fact it's very mild bad manners. It's tolerated and sometimes may be considered a proof of admiration for the cook. See, French manners are a bit tricky because of our ancestral ambiguity. On the one hand, we are very very formal. On the other hand, there's nothing we like more than transgression and breaking the rules. In some cases we make the rules stiff so that it shows more when we break them. I am not going to go into this in-depth because it's already difficult to understand for French people, so I may well make things more confusing for you here. . . . . ← I don't at all claim to understand the French or their customs, but I have always felt comfortably at home in France. I've often felt I've found the French hospitable simple because they offer such good food, but it may actually be their love of transgression that makes me feel at ease. Many Americans need to argue the rules. I am content to defend their importance even while transgressing them.

Because our life style is changing, we're busy and have less time and energy to entertain, we are eating out more often. As a result, we find ourselves in need of more affordable places. I might seriously suggest we might appreciate one great meal far more than three medicore ones, the need, or at least desire, to meet several friends for dinner in one week makes it sometime more important to find good food at reasonable prices, than to find that one great meal.

Actually, that encapsulates what I think of this restaurant right now better than I was able to say it. That's very flattering. Thanks. Excitement comes in all forms. NY is a pretty good restaurant town and there's really no great shortage of good, very good and excellent restaurants, but it's still very exciting when a good one opens in any neighborhood. It's even more exciting when a good restaurant opens to fill a void in a certain price range. It's less exciting when such a restaurant opens in someone else's neighborhood, but NY can always use another good restaurant. Clearly we don't have enough. I'm always amazed at how long in advance I have to book at many restaurants that are no better than good. Michelin stars are relative to how far out of one's way one should go to dine at a restaurant. Two stars merits a detour and three are worth a special trip. In a city as densely populated as NY, and particularly in Manhattan, everyone should have a choice of good restaurants within walking distance. I'd suggest another way one might rate restaurants is how far in advance one should have to make reservations. Ideally, one should be able to choose a place on a couple of day's notice. Laurent Gras is a destination chef. This however is not his destination restaurant and because people have reason to expect a meal resembling what he offered at Peacock Alley, I think it's important for prospective diners to understand not to expect it here. A diner arriving with memories of Peacock Alley dancing in his head is likely to disappointed. A dinner arriving with no advance knowledge of who's in the kitchen, is far more likely to be pleased. My fear is that Gras is not in the kitchen full time and my pasta leads me to worry about quality control and consistency. My sweetbreads however, bode well for successful dining.

I'm with Ptipois on preferring grey salt for cooking, although I'm not sure I can actually taste the difference. I may simply prefer the fact that it's unrefined and hope the impurities add a certain je ne sais quoi to the dish. I do however, prefer fleur de sel for sprinkling on certain foods just as I'm about to eat them. I value the structure and the crunch. I've never spent much time in the UK, but have found Malden salt to be rather popular in Spain and I associate it very much with certain dishes such as those small green Galician peppers that are simply roasted or fried and served with Malden salt. They are mild peppers, except for the occasional one that's very much not mild. The above referenced page is actually rather confusingin that it blurs any distinction between the two salts from Guerande. Both fleur de sel and sel gris are produced there. Both the web page and the citation above are quite unclear as to which salt smells of violets, or if both do. I believe Ptipois is correct in that it's a passing aroma, best experienced not from the salt, but along the marshes. Ptipois' comments about dry salt are intersting too. The grey salt I've purchased in plastic bags is quite moist when it's sold, but it doesn't cake. I suspect it's the structure of the crystal. For what it's worth, my wife prefers to sprinkle fine salt on her food and to use it in cooking as well. I suppose that's because she's used to it and can estimate how much to use out of habit. She doesn't much like either of the salts from Guérande. Her loss.

Is it really bad manners to mop up one's plate with a piece of bread? I always thought it was acceptable in rustic bistros, but less so in those establishments sporting many forks, spoons and macarons in the red guide. On the other hand, I always thought it was socially unacceptable, that is, unacceptable to the other diners, but not at all unappreciated by the chef as a testament to his good cooking. My own inadequate knowledge of French customs has enabled me to romanticize them according to my own fantasies. (Always with my hands above the table rim, however.) My assumptions, whenever I'm in doubt, are that respect goes to the food first, the chef second and one's companions last. If that's not actually pretty much the case in the real France, it serves as a guideline for manners in the world I carry with me. I believe it's good to hold your fork in one hand continuously simply because it makes for more graceful movements and once learned, allows the diner to eat with less fumbling of implements. Left hand for the fork simply as a convention. Wine glasses are held by the stem simply to keep the bowl from acquiring fingerprints. It is just so much more appealing to have a table full of clean looking glasses, but there's no sense of contempt for those who do not agree or even for those who have not thought about it as I have and paying too much attention to how others eat can ultimately do nothing by ruin one's own meal. I'll second what Fat Guy said. "My" rules are all about enjoying the food and meal and hopefully to allow others to derive maximum enjoyment in a rational and esthetic manner. The quote above reminds me of an old thread, one that was not in one of the European forums. I, or rather my point of view, took a beating in the thread. If you took a vote, I think my perspective was defeated by about two dozen opinions to maybe two or three. If I recall correctly, Fat Guy posted one of supporting opinions. There might have been one other. The majority view was that I was a boor and a cad as well. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've been told that it's proper to start eating when one is served in France, especially when the food is warm, and that this is true even if the rest or the table hasn't been served for any reason. The original post on the thread in question was about a restaurant in NYC, in which a large table was served just as one of the diners left the table to make a trip to the "powder room." The original discussion was about whether the restaurant was obligated to remove all the dishes, return them to the kitchen and bring new hot dishes when the lady returned to the table. Certainly we can discuss this from an Anglo-American view and a French one. Just how much responsibility does the diner have to take and is it incumbent on the kitchen to recook eight dishes simply because one person decides to visit the loo at the precise moment the main course is served. That's not the etiquette question I mean to raise. In this case, the restaurant made no effort to remove the plates and seven diners sat there while their food grew cold out of respect for the diner who left the table. I expressed the opinion that it was silly for them to ruin their meal, as it served in no way to improve the meal their companion had and that it's better for seven people to enjoy hot food than for none to have that enjoyment. I further expressed the opinion that I would be distressed to know others were ruining their meal out of respect for me and that I would expect my wife and daughter to feel the same way. (I will also add that I would expect the restaurant to do something about that one plate.)

As Jack said, there's a difference between sealing a product sous vide for storing it a bit longer and for cooking it sous vide. My assumption has always been that few people take the package home and cook the meat in it. I've had shops seal dried sausage and ham as well as hard cured cheeses. I'm not convinced it's really a good idea for the cheese, though. We had an amazing andouille not long ago that arrived sealed sous vide. They are usually eaten sliced cold, but the Breton who arrived with the sausage intended for us to make a hot meal of it. It was taken out of the package and "cooked" in hot water with potatoes. I'm getting off topic, but the sous vide sealing was simply a packing method. Heating the andouille sous vide might have preserved even more of the flavor.

Absolutely, but trust me on this, I've come to admire Tony and have great respect for him. He's talented and engaging. It's just that I think he, himself, would be the first person to tell you that restaurants such as the French Laundry and le Bernardin have great chefs. Les Halles is another kind of restaurant. At any rate, as I said above, Tony's accomplishments as a writer and and as a TV host/guide are probably his greater contributions, even within a culinary context. There is some sort of celebrity thing that drives many to les Halles because it's where Tony cheffed when he became well known, just as it does to the White Horse Tavern because Dylan Thomas drank there. I guess what I'm tryiing to say is that some people seem to believe they might arrive at les Halles and find him in the kitchen.

We ate in the Cafe once and haven't really been tempted to try the restaurant, mostly because of the scene like descriptions I've read or heard about. We are irregular patrons of the tacos in that wedge of room with a counter overlooking the triangular park. They're pretty good, albeit perhaps less authentic than the ones I've found over in the places in the garment district. Authenticity is much over rated however. The tacqueria counter is open for lunch and dinner, as well as odd hours and late into the night.

Missing from this discussion seems to be what I thought was common knowledge--that M. Gras is in search of a place to open his own upscale restaurant. Rumors abound that he's found the spot, but as I don't know where that is or if in fact that's at all true, all I can do is point you to Mme. Gras' web site, okay, maybe that's Mrs. Gras, at SNACK. Specifically, that's a link to hotsnack of September 21, 2005. Laurent's Bistro du Vent menu is here. Laurent is a managing partner at Bistro du Vent and I'm going to suspect much of his time, energy and interest is being devoted to his own future restaurant. As of September 21, "The high-flying haute cuisine will come later at his next restaurant. The quest continues..." Bistro du Vent is hardly where Laurent Gras has ended up in NY. It's just a place he's he's helping find a way, while he has the time. It's hardly unusual for a talented chef to have his fingers in many pots, or to have his pots in several kitchens these days. Although it's reputed to have had a minor face lift since I've been there, don't go expecting a destination restaurant and certainly don't go expecting what he served up at Peacock Alley. At the time, the decor was effectively reminiscent of a local bistro in Paris, but not of a charming one. Service didn't particularly transport me to Paris. The food is the thing of course and I had mixed feelings. With the Batali/Bastianich connection in mind, I had spaghetti and clams for a first course and it was an unexpected disaster. Even had I not just returned from two weeks in Italy, I would have found my pasta done well beyond any point resembling al dente. Although the waitress asked if everything was okay when she put the plates on the table, no one asked if I enjoyed my dish after I left most of the pasta on the plate. My sweetbreads, on the other hand, were exemplary and I wouldn't have expected them to have been better prepared in good Parisian bistro. They were accompanied by a salad of mache and thinly sliced pears. If memory serves, the pears were either pickled or lightly cooked. There was no real flash of creative genius, just what you might expect if a haute cuisine chef were to design a menu attempting to capture the simplicity of bistro cooking in a modern style and create a good neighborhood restaurant. Although I did make a special trip to see what Laurent Gras might be up to, I'd not be inclined to make a special trip next time, but if I had reason to be in the neighborhood, it's not out of the question that I'd be back hoping the pasta was a rare occurance and that the sweetbreads represented the level of cooking that will prevail.

The restaurant is cosy and cheerful under artificial lighting at night, but I really find it more appealing during the day and Victor hit it on the nose about both the view and the drive. In addition I really enjoy having a special long meal during the afternoon and having the opportunity to walk it off before bed time. I'd much prefer to have some drinks and light tapas at night before I go to bed.

In fact, the medium and the other news media are not what they used to be.

There are a number of restarant chair suppliers on the Bowery. Check out the guy on the west side of the street just opposite Spring, a few doors up from Delancy among others. You should really scout the Bowery from Houston south at least until Delancy. I don't know what kind of small wares you're looking to find, but let me suggest Paragon on the west side of the Bowery between Houston and Prince is worth a look into for all sorts of supplies.

It's not just that Tony's made his mark as a literary figure and media journalist rather than in the kitchen, but somehow I don't think he'd pride himself on seeing that water glasses are always full or that the bill arrived on time.

I seem to recall reading that they're doing lunch on Sunday and I believe they won't be doing dinner on Sunday as a result. Having had one lunch and two dinners at elBulli, I can say that I'd probably prefer lunch.

I think that many Americans who think they've taken sufficient care to learn local customs, then mistakenly assume the rudeness they encounter is not perceived rudeness, when in fact it's often no more than that and due to a subtle misapprehension of appropriate local etiquette. In France I have some insight as the result of our daughter's marriage to a Frenchman. That insight doesn't stop me from making gaffes, but it enables me to get a clue after it's too late. Cultural mores and etiquette aren't like math or geometry. They are not even as logical as conjugations and the pronunciations of town names. The rules don't build on each other in a rational way and the French are an unusually formal people, in my opinion. They are unlike other Latin or Mediterranean cultures in that aspect and far more formal than the British in their manners, again in my opinion.

Mussels, oysters, crabs, shrimps? Not anymore. The times they are a changing. More and more the PDG (CEO) or responsable or (horrors) Anglo boss is feminine; and the men listen to her attentively. Nice eh? ← I fondly recall the time Mrs. B picked up her pigeon bones in a pleasant one star restaurant in the Loire Valley. Our, then eleven year old, daughter all but hid under the table out of embarrassment, reappearing in public above the edge of the table only when she saw the waiter arrive with a finger bowl. At that point she surmised this must be an accepted protocol as there seemed to be a well ordered staff response with its own time honored implements. While haute cuisine tends towards an hands off refinement, the French are more than comfortable touching thier food when it's appropriate. On the other hand, I don't expect to see corn served on the cob anytime soon. I find the practice of presenting only one menu with prices to be alive and well, although it's a practice I find offensive in principle. I'd not like to be married to a silly little thing who couldn't be bothered to worry about the household budget, or a wife who wouldn't sometimes take me out for a birthday dinner at a fine restaurant. What is curious, is that I still remember certain restaurants from our early travels in the countryside of France back in the sixties. What was common then, and perhaps less so today, was to see the wife/mother pick up the check and pay the bill from her purse in those pre-credit card days. Not sure if it happens as often today, or if we just eat in different sorts of places.

It's been my experience that fleur de sel is not particularly distinguished by its complex flavor. My impression of fleur de sel as opposed to it's cousin sel gris is that the former is rather pure and the latter far less so resulting in a grey color, not to mention small bits of flotsam and jetsam, especially if procured close to the source, at least in Guérande. Packaging is irrelevant. I prefer to buy it in plastic bags from ladies selling salt from card tables on one of the paths (I'm hesitant to call them roads) in the salt gathering area. I'm not recommending a trip just to buy a kilo or two of salt, but it is an interesting landscape worth a short detour for anyone in the area and there is the reward of actually buying salt as we once did on the side of the salt flats. The kiloo of sel gris is a real bargain, but you'd risk a hernia bringing back inexpensive packages for all your friends. I'm also not aware of any loss of flavor in cooking. Salt simply dissolves in liquid, faster at a higher temperature and the flavor is less pronounced in the same dish when eaten cold, than when eaten warm. Terrines, ballotines, etc. meant to be eaten cold should be slightly over salted. What distinguishes fleur de sel is its crystalline structure. Under an electron microscope it will be seen as having almost barb like ends. Common rock salt and most refined salt, including sea salt, is pretty smooth by comparison. It's these barbs that help it stick better to food. The size of its crytals also provides, what many see--or taste as, just the right crunch and "hit" of salt on the tongue.

I think that's what JohnL said above. Call it a service or call it pandering if you will. Anyone who bends over and drops pants, may be accused of rendering a service. The issue raised by Lesley is not whether the Times should have run such an article however, it is whether it should have been assigned to Bruni as Sneakeater and Lesley already noted. After I posted my initial message, I had some after thoughts about the relationship of this sort of article in relation to Diner's Journal. My conclusion was that it was an entirely different kind of article. It was not about first impression of a new restaurant. It was speculation about a yet to open restaurant and a profile piece that's entirely out of character with what reviewers write in their capacity as reviewers. I don't claim that it's a conflict of interest for Bruni to write the article, but it's clear that readers may see it as that. Even readers who don't see it as that will have trouble wondering if his reviews won't be tainted by having written this sort of article. Others will be disturbed to read that perhaps his critical opinion when written isn't as supportive as it appears in this article. What I said in my earlier post was that I found it to be an unexpected assignment for the restaurant reviewer. That wasn't necessarily meant to be judgmental. My assumption is that Bruni was assigned this article to write, if it was his decision to suggest he write the article or to propose the article in the first place, it may well signal his lack of dedication to being a reviewer. It, on the other hand, it was an editorial decision, than it signals a decision to blur the difference between reviews and articles. I don't know that the best reviews are always written with a reviewer's mentality, but there's a danger when the critical nature of the paper's reviews lose the distinction that separates them from the articles and profiles. Lost so far in this thread, is that over the years, many interim reviews have been written by staff members whose primary job has been to write this sort of article. Then again, my sense of reviews by Marrian Burros and Amanda Hesser is that they have not been my favorite reviews. Perhaps there are better examples of a journalist who's written better reviews alternately with other restaurant news.

They themselves translate in the English version of the menu: "Piglet with almonds and gentian". ← I'm losing something here. Surely "Cordero lechal" is lamb and not translated as "piglet." "Piglet" would be good for "suckling pig," although I'm usually not content to rely on a restaurant's translation of its own menu. I've seen some really gross mistranslations on menus, even at world class restaurants with multilingual staff.

I think Lesley makes a very good point. It's not the kind of assignment I would have expected the NY Times to give to its regular restaurant reviewer. It could preface Bruni's moving on to culinary journalist and it doesn't necessarily imply he'll be unfair when reviewing Del Posto, but it seems untimely in the first case and unnecessarily questionable in the second. As I read the article, I found the parts devoted to refinement to be curious. "They're after refinement over raw energy." Refinement is later defined as including reservations even for the lounge, "live piano music and, believe it or not, valet parking." It sounds more like Mulberry Street than Daniel or ADNY. "Marble, brass and bronze, all meant to evoke a centuries-old palazzo" doesn't do anything but reinforce that for me.