slkinsey
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Posts posted by slkinsey
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I believe it was Dorothy Parker who said that eternity was 2 people and a ham.
As far as I know, this was written by Irma S. Rombauer, author of the original The Joy of Cooking.
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I have had very good feedback on these lemon ricotta pancakes. I forget where I got the recipe:
1 cup high quality ricotta (or drained overnight if Polly-O is the best you can do)
1 cup sour cream
3 eggs, separated
0.5 teaspoon baking soda
1 cup AP flour
1 tablespoon sugar
2 tablespoons lemon juice
2 teaspoons grated lemon zest
Pinch salt
Butter
Beat together ricotta, sour cream and egg yolks. Beat egg whites medium-stiff. Stir dry ingredients into cheese mixture well (do not beat). Stir in lemon juice and zest, then fold in beaten egg whites very gently. 3-5 minutes per side in butter. Makes a very light, moist and tender pancake.
I serve with a warm fruit compote.
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Whole untrimmed tenderloin will have a certain amount of waste, whereas beef sold as "fillet mignon" will already be trimmed. That contributes to the higher price for fillet mignon. there is also the issue of the grade of the beef. I might expect to pay $20 for prime fillet mignon, and $5.99 a pound doesn't seem out of line for untrimmed choice tenderloin.
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Here, in the extreme north- western part Tuscany, I simply didn’t know that, as you say, cipollini is the diminutivo of cipolla. For the diminutivo, we always say cipollina in the singular and cipolline in the plural, because cipolla is feminine, not masculine.
That would be why I said "not uncommon misspelling." My use of I instead of E at the end was a typo. But, here's the thing: Okay, so the restaurant used a misspelled name. So what? Spellings do not make something more or less "Italian." They were using a commonly-understood-to-Americans word to describe an ingredient from the Italian kitchen. If a restaurant decides calls a pressed sandwich a "panini" instead of a "panino," that makes it an inappropriate use of the language, but the spelling doesn't make the sandwich Italian or not-Italian.
Here, cipollina is also the name for what you say is “the small, flat onions which are popular in Italy.” We see lots of flat onions here, cipolline, but none of them are small; however, we’re in a small town in Tuscany so we miss a lot of what is popular in the rest of Italy.Lo Zingarelli says: "cippolina [1830] s. f. 1 Dim. di cipolla. 2 Varietà di cipolla con bulbo piccolo, che si mangia fresca, sott'aceto o gener. cotto." Again, I don't quite get your making such a big point out of incorrect namings or spellings on the menu.
Having been to Taggia a lot, I believe the people there would be horrified that those olives would be used for “guinea fowl” with smoky fennel and lemons.Are you taking the position that the olive cultivar known (but not exclusively called) the taggiasca olive is only grown and properly consumed in Taggia, and that the people of Taggia are the only ones whose practices and opinions as to the culinary use of these olives carries any weight? That is quite a restrictive view of Italian cooking! Considering that one can find cured olives around Italy for sale at retail and employed in restaurants that come from a wide variety of cultivars and regions, I'm wondering why we should care whether the people of Taggia would be horrified to see these olives used for guinea fowl (or faraona, if you prefer) with smoky fennel and lemon?
That's not the point. The point is whether Italians eating such a dish in Italy would say "this is Italian" or "this is not Italian." My experience is that they might say "this is not a traditional dish of this particular region" but would still feel that it's within the range of what they considered "Italian food." But, hey... don't take my word for it. A short google search revealed that the restaurant Ròmilo in Rome had on its menu at one time a remarkably similar dish described as terrina di faraona, finocchio e olive taggiasche, su vellutata di peperoni gialli e sedano glacè. I guess that, in your view, this is "not Italian" and the Taggiesi would be horrified?
Hey, but times are changing and the good folks coming to New York because the dollar is so cheap, and eating at Insieme, might, after eating that dish, think that serving them that way is a good idea. Once again, cultural transformation of food from one area to another... right?Look... I'm not here to defend the cooking or the menu of Insieme. That's not the question posed in this thread -- which is not about how Italian food is implemented in New York City.
In taking another look at Insieme, some of the dishes from the “traditional” side of the menu would be found in Italy; most are merely the latest version in a long line of Italo-Amercan food, perhaps very good, but having very little to do with what is cooked in Italy today.Let's examine that. There is on the traditional side of the dinner menu:
- A salad with lettuce, vegetables, shaved Parmigiano-Reggiano and balsamic. This is a salad I've had in Italy.
- Spiedini di gamberi. Very Italian. I've had dozens of iterations of this in Italy.
- Vitellone crudo alla Piemontese. Not sure what makes this Piemontese. And it's a tartare-type dish, which I've never had in Italy. However, a short google search for "vitellone crudo" turns up quite a few Italian-language pages with a recipe for this dish.
- Fritto misto alla Lucchese (consisting of deep-fried offal of various kinds). Again, I'm not sure what the connection is to Lucca. However, a short google search reveals that this is quite similar to the traditional fritto misto alla Piemontese. Perfectly Italian, notwithstanding the naming convention I don't understand.
- Chestnut fettucine with venison ragù. Again, chestnut pasta sauced with game ragù (and named after Castagne, as Insieme does) is quite traditional in Italy. The pomegranate garnish isn't particularly traditional, but not enough to make this dish entirely "not Italian."
- A traditional lasagne al forno with béchamel and ragu is perfectly Italian. The use of "green" spinach lasagne is not unprecedented for this dish in Italy.
- Linguine con vongole. Totally traditional.
- Cacciucco alla Viareggina. Totally traditional.
- Arista di maiale arrosto. Totally traditional.
- Lesso misto. Totally traditional.
- Bistecca fiorentina. Other than the use of Piemontese beef, totally traditional (although, as I mention above, I don't believe that Toscana-sourced beef is necessary for this naming, even in Firenze).
- Fagioli all'uccelletto. Totally traditional.
- Roasted potatoes with herbs. Is there a single European culinary tradition where this is not traditional?
- Cavolfiore in umido (cauliflower stewed with sofrito and tomato) is not something with which I am familiar, although nothing in the preparation strikes me as not-Italian. A google search turns up several Italian-language references.
- Polenta. Totally traditional.
So, in what way, exactly, are these dishes "very little to do with what is cooked in Italy today" and merely the "latest version in a long line of Italo-Amercan food"?
I've traveled and worked around in Italy quite a bit, from the big cities like Milano, Roma and Napoli to the medium cities like Firenze, smaller ones like Pesaro and Orvieto, and small towns like Montespertoli and Urbania. Some cities and areas are more hidebound by culinary tradition than others, but have been plenty of restaurants in locales of all sizes and in all regions that made forward-looking food more or less within the general range of that Insieme is doing, and that were well-received by the locals. More to the point, I don't have any doubts that, were I to bring an Italian visitor to Insieme, the food would be recognized as sufficiently within the Italian culinary aesthetic to qualify as "Italian" (whereas, say, Carmine's would not). I have, in fact, done exactly that with Babbo as the restaurant. Few of the Italians I know would be shocked at guinea fowl with smoky fennel, olives and lemon. It almost seems as though, as a part-time American transplant to Italy, you're taking an even more conservative view than most Italians on this question (which I suppose isn't too unusual or surprising -- Catholic converts are often observed to be "more Catholic than the Pope").
So, getting back to the point of this thread, you have to go further from tradition than Insieme does before the contemporary food starts to become only nebulously and notionally "Italian." There is a point where this happens, in my opinion, but as I and others have stated, this is really true of any national cuisine.
As for Italian microregionalism, I have to believe that it's slowly but inexorably (and sadly) on the way out. 40 years ago, the vast majority of Italians spoke dialect in the home as their primary language, now the vast majority of Italians speak Italian in the home as their primary language and the local and regional dialects are disappearing. Similarly, mass media and the much more extensive distribution of ingredients that were formerly only in certain local areas means that Italians are consuming a much wider variety of foods than ever before. Why, I hear that the Milanesi sometimes eat spaghetti with olive oil, and pizza with mozzarella di bufala is sometimes consumed outside of Napoli. Shocking, I know.
Anyway... if you want to talk about traditional versus contemporary Italian cooking in a way that does more than challenge the spelling and naming conventions of a New York City restaurant menu, I'd be happy to do so. But I don't think there's much more useful to say in the current fork of the discussion, so I'll opt out of continuing that any further.
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I don't take any particular position on the three dishes you ask about, except to observe that they don't strike me as all that Italian -- or all that anything, really.
That was exactly my point.
I guess it's not clear to me what this "point" adds to the discussion. I believe I wrote some time ago in this thread that most culinary traditions when "elevated" to a certain level of haute abstraction don't seem particularly rooted to an actual national cooking. The only reason we call today's haute cuisine "French" is because the French were the first and strongest to go in this direction.
What is “cippolini onion”? And what exactly makes “branzino saltimbocca” Italian?You’re kidding me… smoked fennel and Tagiasca olives is “plenty Italian?” From which part of Italy?
This seems pretty simple to understand, and I can't believe you actually don't understand it, but I will humor you nevertheless:
- "cippolini onion" is simply an unfortunate and not uncommon spelling of cipollini, which, as I imagine you know, is the diminutive of cipolla (onion), therefore meaning "small onion." In the United States, this designation is generally applied to the small, flat onions which are popular in Italy.
- What's not "Italian" about branzino saltimbocca? I've had plenty of "saltimbocca" dishes in Italy that were not made with veal (usually with turkey or chicken). What's "not Italian" about branzino (presumably) folded around prosciutto with onion, cabbage and sage? This seems clearly evocative of the "saltimbocca" meme.
- Again, what's "not Italian" about smoked fennel? You mean to tell me that fennel-loving Italians never thought to put fennel on the grill and cook them off with a smoky flavor? I think you must be kidding me.
- The taggiasca olive is an Italian cultivar from Liguria, I believe. So, what exactly is "not Italian" about these olives? Or are you saying that they would never be combined with guinea fowl and smoky fennel in Italy? Really?!
BISTECCA FIORENTINA (for two) 78.26 oz. grass-fed Piedmontese t-bone steak. Anything wrong here? Didn’t realize that Bistecca Fiorentina was from Piedmontese steak? Also didn’t realize that steak from Piemonte came to the US, but perhaps it does. Does it?
The provenance of the steak is not of crucial importance in "allowing" them to call the steak "bistecca fiorentina." Do you suppose that 100% of the places selling bistecca alla fiorentina in Firenze itself are using Chianina beef from Toscana? Perhaps there is some kind of Italian government regulation to this effect? Regardless, their preparation seems faithful enough to the original that it's certainly not un-Italian. Would it please you more if their menu said "bistecca 'alla fiorentina' style"? Would that make it any more or less "Italian food"?
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Suggestions from above:
First question (well..two questions): I'm thinking of cooking ox heart sous vide, since it works so well for tough muscles that are typically braised. What would my cooking time and temperature be for something like this? Also should I pre-slice it into the serving sizes or wait until it's done to cut it up?Heart muscles is TOUGH because it is constantly in use. I would try 180F/82C for 8 hours. This ought to be enough, but you may need to take it longer. This will create a texture similar to a traditional braise, which is probably what you are familiar with.
I would cut it into serving portion and bag each separately.
You could cook it down to 140F/60C but then it would require days and that may not be what you are looking for.
Some experimentation will be necessary to get the results you want.
Just wanted to report that the ox heart cooked sous vide (per NathanM's 180F/82C for 8 hours suggestion) came out fabulous. The heart was sliced into about 1/2" thick slices. I kept it real simple, just s/p and some frozen cubes of stock. I cooked it the day before, then chilled and reheated just before serving with an orange-cognac gastrique and a mizuna salad with mandarins and crispy pig's ear (see below for more info on that).
Beautiful rose-pink color, fork tender. Although one of my dinner guests who is a big heart lover said it was maybe too tender--that he missed the chewiness. However another guest said you could have served it to anyone without telling them it was heart and they would have had no idea!
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There's a scant 1/4 ounce of 1:1 simple in there as well, I think.
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I think the point e-monster was making is that, with <1.5-inch steaks, once you finish browning the steak, the difference is not tremendously different from regular pan cooking. Personally, I'm not sure I agree with that. It depends on how you brown the steak, for one (blowtorch being recomomended if you want good external browning with minimum penetration). I'd also say that 1.5 inches as a reference point is a bit too thick. I've seen a marked difference using this technique for strip steaks as thin as one inch. Below maybe 0.75 inches you're really starting to get so thin that by the time you brown the steak (unless using a blowtorch) you have undone a lot of the careful temperature work you did with the sous vide process.
This is all assuming you would like to brown the exterior of the steak in a hot pan. If you're using a blowtorch or if you do not want to brown the exterior of the steak at all, you could get good results at most any thickness.
Where sous vide is really handy is when you have an extra-thick steak. Then you can get an even medium rare with a nice crust but otherwise very little penetration of "doneness" beyond medium rare that would be extremely-challenging-to-impossible using any other method.
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Some threads that may be of interest:
If you like this, you'll probably like this. . . Cocktail suggestions
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I have done this with a 6 inch thick porterhouse steak and some other steaks of lesser size. Sous vide it up to temperature, then blast in a hot pan to finish. You can see some pictures of the dinosaur steak here.
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(I've heard rumors of one opening on my street in Brooklyn -- but having investigated, I think my informant was confused.)
Don't know what street you are on in Brooklyn, but there is a cocktailian bar set to open in Brooklyn by a leading light in the NYC cocktail scene. I can't say (and largely don't know) more than that, but don't be too quick to discount this rumor.
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What's so "very Italian" about Marco Canora and Paul Grieco? One's from upstate NY and the other is Canadian.
Regardless, the three dishes you ask about, which come from a tasting menu at Insieme restaurant in NYC, are all listed as "contemporary" dishes in contrast to such traditional (or anyway less outreaching) dishes such as fritto misto and sardines "in saor".
I don't think that Insieme gets a pass and everything being declared "Italian," by the way. In particular, I have my doubts as to whether the "crudo" trend (started by Pasternack at Esca, by the way) has any real traditional grounding -- rather, Batali's places have tended to view their cuisine as being "in the Italian tradition, as though NYC culture and ingredients were another region of Italy." Not quite the same thing as being "Italian" though.
I don't take any particular position on the three dishes you ask about, except to observe that they don't strike me as all that Italian -- or all that anything, really. On the other hand, there are plenty of things on the "contemporary" side of that menu which strike me as plenty Italian, such as short rib ravioli with fiore di sardo, kohlrabi and thyme; branzino "saltimbocca" with cippolini onion, savoy cabbage, prosciutto and sage; guinea hen "finochietti" consisting of an organic breast, liver, thigh and wing of guinea hen with smoked fennel, tagiasca olives and lemon; and others.
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I think the whole reaction saying "oh my god! what are those idiots at Father's Office going to do when someone orders a Ramos Fizz?!" is a bit misplaced. Like many articles on cocktail developments, and especially those by the LA Times, this one simply asks the wrong person. I don't know if there are any serious cocktailian bars in LA along the lines of what exists in NYC and a few cities around the country, but regardless... Father's Office in LA does not seem to be one. From what I can tell (web site here) it's a medium-upscale pub well known for burgers that is focused mostly on beer, of which there are 30 on tap (cocktails aren't even mentioned on the web site). One is not surprised to learn that "Trivial Pursuit" is a popular passtime there.
What this means is that the guy from Father's Office was happy to get the press mention, but the fact is that they are not a serious cocktail spot and they don't seem to be set up to make any cocktails that one would be unhappy to have stirred. I imagine they do 99% of their (presumably relatively meager) cocktail business in highballs, rocks drinks and the occasional Martini or Manhattan -- none of which requires a shaker -- and I'm quite sure there isn't an egg white to be found behind the bar.
ETA: Considering that Father's Office doesn't seem to be much of a serious cocktailian bar, or even cocktail-focused establishment, it's interesting to me that this is the second LA Times article on the subject of cocktails that quotes Sang Yoon of Father's Office to appear within a month (the other being this article on cocktail "rules"). I'm wondering if Mr. Yoon has some in with the LAT staff.
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I suppose it's possible that that an entirely different Argentine place offering a very similar menu opened in the old Pampa space. It does make sense that a new Argentine restaurant might want to take advantage of whatever cuisine-specific equipment was already in place. But the similarities of the menu and presentation, combined with what looks like the reappearance of Pampa's grill man, makes it look like an awfully big coincidence.
I believe Caminito is cheffed (and possibly also owned) by Fabian Manca, who was the original chef from Pampa's early "glory days." It looks like Cafe Frida, Cafe Rhonda and La Rural are owned by a management group headed up by Cristina Castañeda and Raul Bonetto. Considering that the WHOIS information for pamparestaurant.com lists Raul Bonetto as the administrative contact, I think it's safe to assume that La Rural's management is the same group that ran Pampa, if not the original chef.
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Thanks for the write-up, D!
Interesting that this place seems to be, more or less, an updating and renaming of Pampa. Do you have any idea whether it is under the same management?
I look forward to checking it out. Over the life of Pampa, I felt like the overall quality there suffered a decline -- slow in the beginning and rather precipitous towards the end. In the early days, Pampa featured actual Argentinian beed, but various factors put a stop fo that. Then the selection began to narrow, especially with respect to offal selections (the original menu featured not only sweetbreads but also grilled kidneys, intestines and tripe). Soon thereafter the prices began creeping and then bounding upwards from what had originally been quite a bargain to something that seemed on the expensive side for a cramped, loud restaurant on Amsterdam Avenue above 96th Street. I stopped going a year or two before it closed, and wasn't surprised when they shut their doors.
. . . All of which is to say that I miss the original Pampa, and am very pleased to see that another similar restaurant has opened in its place offering, if not quite the same pricing of Pampa's early days, at least what seems like a much better-executed version of what Pampa was trying to be in the final years of its decline, together with a more varied and more interesting menu.
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Libbey makes a 24 oz. (glass) Ice Tea glass. It's the Chivalry line, which isn't the most beautiful, but. . . They also have a 24 oz. jumbo tumbler (panel).
Interesting. Do you know who sells the 24oz Chivalry glass? I wasn't able to turn it up with Google.
I don't know about the Chivalry glass, but if you google something like "buy libbey glass" you'll find plenty of places selling it. In general, since many of these glasses are intended for business, you'll have to buy a case. The size of a case will vary depending on the glass (12 to a case seems the usual for large tumblers -- cases of small cocktail glasses are much larger).
Here is a case of twelve 24 ounce Libbey glasses for 40 bucks.
Here is a case of 23 ounce Chivalry beer glasses for 28 bucks.
Here is a case of 24 ounce paneled jumbo coolers for 36 bucks.
In general, this seems like a pretty good site for Libbey glasses. Poke around in the various categories of glass down towards the bottom of the page.
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I thought I remember reading on eGullet that they served something called the "Sea Fizz" at Pegu Club or some other New York venue, but never got the details of the drink.
This is a drink (usually, and it would seem, incorrectly called a "Sea Fizz") that a number of NYC bartenders are known to make from time to time. I'm not aware of it being on any menus.
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What makes absinthe turn cloudy? Is it temperature, dilution?
Absinthe is a high-proof solution containing a lot of alcohol-soluble dissolved substances. When water is added and the proof is lowered, certain alcohol-soluble substances that do not have good solubility in water come out of solution and, being now opaque, create the characteristic milky white "louche."
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Dude, you have clearly never had a job in Italy. That is efficient, if you're an Italian!
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From what I have been able to glean, it actually is an infusion of the cookies -- believe it or not.
According to the Lazzaroni web site:
The Authentic Italian Amaretto since 1851, made and bottled in Saronno Italy, according to an old and unique formula: the infusion of famous cookies "Amaretti di Saronno." -
Nathan, that might be true in terms of savory dishes and cocktails. But, in general I think America has a sweet palate compared to other cultures. And those 100+ year old cocktails might seem sweet to you and me, but not so much to the people drinking "Apple Pie Martinis" in the Dubuque TGI Friday's.
Taken as a percentage of the average diet, it's hard to say off the cuff whether sugar consumption has radically increased -- because, of course, the average daily calorie count in general has radically increased over the last 150 years. Even if the percentage has remained the same (and I think it's likely it has increased simply as a function of the fact that people eat far more processed foods today) it could still be a lot more sugar.
However, one chance I've noticed over the last 3.5 decades is the huge increase in soda, juice and other high-calorie drinks among American children. When I was a kid, we had Coca-Cola around the house maybe 3-4 times a year, total. Nowadays, it's not uncommon for a family to consume more than 2 liters of full sugar soda per person per week. When I was a "tween" there was maybe one overweight kid in my entire elementary school class. Now the average is probably at least 35% (if not 50% or more). The one fundamental difference in diet I can see between 4th graders now and 4th graders in the 1970s is the extra calories from beverages. As adults, there is (sometimes) less drinking of full-sugar cold drinks, but this is compensated with increased consumption of things like a "grande gingerbread pumpkin latte" at Starbuck's.
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Last I checked, Crisco was not banned. And, for what it's worth, I think it's pretty silly to ban trans-fats in all applications. There's no reason pie crusts shouldn't be made with Crisco. On the other hand, I'd prefer that the pie crusts be made with butter and lard, which is not only natural but more healthful than using Crisco.
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Other things such as respecting the power of the stove and the capacity of the pan and not over-crowding the pan also help to reduce sticking.
slkinsey, what do you mean by "respecting the power of the stove"? Do you simply mean not overheating the pan?
What I meant is that, if you have a Crapmaster 9000 NYC apartment stove like I have, you are not putting out nearly as many BTUs as you are if you have a Wolf stove. As a result, you have to adjust your technique. In a commercial stove, you can put more food in the pan without losing temperature, because the burner is cranking out tons of thermal energy and the pan can recover quickly. On the Crapmaster 9000, you have to rely more upon the thermal energy stored in the pan, since the stove isn't strong enough for a fast recovery. I find that overcrowding the pan, which has consequences beyond simply lowering the temperature, is one of the most common mistakes made by home cooks.
I've always wondered why All-Clad's instructions for pans say not to use more than a medium-high flame.This way they're covered liability- and warranty-wise if you crank up the heat and something bad happens.
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Hmmm. I feel the need for some side-by-side expermientation after the turn of the New Year.
The Aviation
in Spirits & Cocktails
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I think the level of the blueness depends on which violette is used.