SethG

I've recently been involved in an informal little group in the cooking forum devoted to trying out the same recipes at our own locations and reporting to each other on our progress. Through this group, I've had occasion to bake my first loaf of bread and make my first puff pastry. Neither of these efforts was a complete success, but my halting first steps into the world of baking have made me realize that I love the feel of dough, the smell of yeast, and the sound of the mixer. I want to make a lot of bread and pastry. Anyone else want to do it with me? I have several books that are relevant to such a project. I own Torres' Dessert Circus, and Payard's Simply Sensational Desserts. I also own Child's Mastering the Art (vol. 1) and Child/Pepin's Julia and Jacques Cooking at Home, both of which contain dessert recipes, and Kamman's New Making of A Chef, which contains a bunch of souffles and probably other dessert stuff besides. But the book I just acquired that has really motivated me to get started is Baking With Julia. I've read very good things about the book, and when it arrived yesterday, I flipped through it and found myself drooling over the prospect of making the delights contained within: country bread, challah, croissants, savory tarts (in which I have a little more experience), sweet desserts and cakes, and what seems like a thousand other delights. Furthermore (I'll drone on just a little longer), I've ordered Jackal10's sourdough starter and I plan to make his sourdough recipe as my first project. And I want to work in somewhere an attempt at Jeffrey Steingarten's recipe for Pane Genzanese, which he describes as the best bread he's ever baked (It Must Have Been Something I Ate, page 311). I'd like to make something every two weeks or so. It doesn't have to be that often, though. And people could drift in and out of the group. It can be completely informal. But we could report to each other in real time; ask each other questions as we're baking; learn a lot from each other and from more experienced members of this board, if they're interested in throwing in their two cents. (It seems like we've got a lot of professional bakers around these parts.) You may say I'm a dreamer. But (I hope) I'm not the only one. What do you think? I'm open to other plans, other books.

Monday night: Salmon fillets, sauteed on their skins; creamed corn; and green beans.

Jenny, thanks for blogging! You should really try some eel. I love it. It's always cooked. (Or nearly always? Someone else will know the answer.) It has a nice meaty taste-- not very fishy at all. In sushi restaurants (in the U.S.A., anyway) you'll often see it paired with avocado. Yum.

So, anyone make anything? My pithiviers was decent but not spectacular. I'd say mine rose about half as much as Torres' pictured one did. It was very tasty, but the puff pastry part was denser and harder than I believe it should have been. I might email Torres about my experience-- I read in some review of his book that he'll actually answer you if you send him a question by email (!). I don't know which of the many things I was worried about actually went wrong, so I don't know how to improve without guidance. I made a second one, which is now sitting in my freezer, so if anyone wants to come over for mediocre pithiviers, I'm good to go. And I made potato case salmon, which didn't go as well as it did the other time I made it. I used wild king salmon which I bought at Whole Paycheck. This fish was previously frozen, and when I started to work with it I could see what freezing had done to it. It was mushy, and hard to keep from falling apart in the pan. And I didn't think the taste was markedly better than (fresh) farmed salmon. I don't know what to do about salmon, except to have it less often until the pressure on retailers makes them demonstrate the good practices of their sources. My Pissaladiere was good, but I used these red onions that were a very deep purple color. Last time I made this tart, the finished product had a nice purple hue to it, but this time it was almost black, the onions were so dark! Tasted fine, though.

Depending on your recipe, you use a cup or more, and have almost all of it left over. "The potatoes give the oil a delicious flavor, so reserve the rest for future use." --- Penelope Casas Future use=salad dressing?

Today I made my second Spanish tortilla of the month. I love tortilla, but I always end up wasting the olive oil used to cook the potatoes and onions. Penelope Casas advises the cook to save the oil for later use, and I often do this, only to find it going to waste, unused, after a while. What is potato-infused oil good for? The next tortilla? Anything else?

Friday night: Maddhur Jaffrey's chicken in onion sauce, fried egplant triangles with Indian spices, and basmati. I love this thread too, Susan in FL. It's my favorite. I get to post what I'm learning about and see so many more experienced people's ideas.

This remains to be seen. I have to fold it again later, then let it rest once more before I cut out a portion and use it. I keep fearing I'm handling it too much, that I put in too much water, and that I'm having to press too hard and too many times with the rolling pin to get it to the appropriate size for folding. I'm worried that the dough is too hard, and that my gluten will never relax enough. I'm worried that I'm mushing the layers together so that they'll never separate again, and I'm not sure I understand how ANYONE can roll it out gently enough so that the layers will still separate and puff up in the oven. Other than that, it's going fine! There's no way to tell, really. Is there? I've never made it before, and my dough looks just like Torres' pictures, so I'll just assume it's okay.

Erin, are you making this Pithiviers? I'm 2/3 done making the puff pastry. I'm a little insecure about how it's going, but I think I'm doing it right. And do you still need a recipe for Pissaladiere, or are you going with Julia?

I got my moka pot set up last night, and started seasoning it right away. I rubbed all the parts with bacon, then put them in a 350F oven for about two hours. Then I made some coffee, and it was the best pork-flavored caffiene I've ever had. Just kidding. I did make a starter pot, threw it away, then made a keeper pot. And I thought it wasn't bad at all! I've certainly been served worse in restaurants, and from those toy steam espresso machines. I'm looking forward to it getting better and better. I made another pot this morning, and it seems I see everything with just a bit more clarity than usual. This moka thing is going to be big.

I am sorry I won't be able to make it. I was really looking forward to meeting all of you! Some other time.

Tonight (Thursday) was a Thai curry with chicken and vegetables from David Thompson's book, doctored quite a bit because I didn't find it very interesting once it was made, then doctored a little more at my wife's urging, but ultimately not really bad at all. And jasmine rice. And a bamboo shoot salad was supposed to be a part of all this, but it was aborted during all the doctoring.

A question about the Pithiviers. If Torres calls for one third of his puff pastry recipe, should I make the full recipe and then cut out a piece that's one third the size of the whole thing? I don't think I should make just a third of the puff pastry recipe, because there's a lot of folding involved and I want the right number of layers to come about without the thing breaking apart or something. What do you think? Should I post this question in Pastry & Baking?

This thread has been a revelation to me. I work just a couple blocks from Chambers Street. So I went to Ceci Cela the other day, and got a very good croissant, pain au chocolat, and a pretty darn good cup of coffee. I can't really articulate the quivering excitement I feel at the prospect of having these products available daily! But Financier beckoned. I went there on Wednesday, braving frigid temperatures and a howling lower Manhattan wind. I decided to do an informal sort of comparison, so I bought another croissant and a pain au chocolat, but I couldn't help but notice a much wider array of tortes and cakes than are available at Ceci Cela. After much hemming and hawing, I bought a slice of Sacher Torte, my least favorite dessert in Vienna but something to be treasured if found here in New York. I brought this stash to my office, again courageously walking the frozen city streets, bag in hand. Once I finally reached my office, I bit into the croissant. It was substandard, I'm sorry to say. It was heavy, neither creamy with buttery goodness nor crunchy with flakiness. I was crestfallen. But then I tasted the pain au chocolat. It was transporting. A revelation. Light, flaky, the perfect thin layer of dark delicious chocolate. I saved the Sacher Torte for lunchtime, and shared it with my officemate. It went in a blur. All I remember is that it was moist. It was gone in seconds, so obviously it must have been much smaller than it seemed at the time of purchase. This morning I decided it was well past time for a rematch, so I went back to Ceci Cela for a croissant and pain au chocolat. Both were very good, but I didn't feel the same kind of euphoria that enveloped me when I had the Financier pain au chocolat. But was this feeling the result of the Financier pain au chocolate alone, or were other factors at work? Did the long walk in the cold have something to do with it? Were my expectations lowered by the subpar croissant? Clearly a side-by-side comparison is in order.

And I got myself the 6 cup stainless steel Guido Bergna. It just arrived today, along with a can of Lavazza espresso grounds. I can't wait to try it out.

I cut a bunch of Land-O-Lakes into little squares and put it in the freezer this morning, but given the Pithiviers advice here, I guess I'll pick up some Plugra (or even better butter if I can find it) and start over. Now that I've taken a look at Villas' recipe (and Julie Powell's rendition of Julia's), I think Peterson's Pissaladiere is unconventional in a different way than I realized. I don't have Peterson's (very heavy) book with me at the moment, but if i recall correctly his crust is actually made from a very sticky active yeast dough that is left to rise for a while, then punched down and stretched out to cover a baking sheet. Once cooked, it makes a crust that bears some resemblance to focaccia.

Heather, I've never noticed Julia's pissaladiere in Mastering the Art! I'll have to check it out. Peterson's is a little non-traditional. His is rectangular, and he calls for red onions. There's also a (traditional) pissaladiere in Villas' French Country Kitchen, an out-of-print book I've had out of the library recently. I can PM anybody who wants Peterson's recipe. Regarding potatoes, I was trying to say, with my usual lack of clarity, that we could do a potato side if we do the salmon on its skin, not the potato case salmon. As for pithiviers, I sure hope it tastes as good as it looks! I've been drooling over the picture for a while now!

Craig, please, as I said above, you did not offend.

I'm down with salmon, Heather! I might opt for the potato case salmon on the facing page, however. Have you tried that one? I was thinking about serving pissaladiere and a green salad as a first course. I like this pissaladiere I've made before from Peterson's Glorious French Food. But I'm having trouble pairing something with the salmon. Rice? Spinach? Braised red cabbage? I feel bored just thinking of these selections, all of which are contained in Jules et Jim. What do you think? If I go with your salmon selection I could serve a potato side, or some other starchy puree, maybe something from New Way. While I'm going overboard, I was also thinking of making Pithivier, from Dessert Circus. I've been wanting to make this for months. I've never made puff pastry before, so it would be exciting for me to try. I might make this dessert over the next couple days and freeze it for baking over the weekend.

Thanks, Katie. I'm in New York, where I think I can receive wine by mail. But I should also be able to find plenty of the recommended bottles locally, too. And Carema, thanks for your kind words but I was kidding (mostly). Craig's opinion was not at all offensive-- I just meant I should probably stop writing about this one bottle of wine before I embarrass myself further.

Is that from the new book?

I will agree with the full-bodied, but not more sophisticated. Craig, have you tried the wine I was talking about? I meant to cast no aspersions on Muscadet or Riesling-- I love them both. Maybe it was the blend that made me feel it had a bit more complexity. Or maybe I should shut up.

Give Dave a chance-- he's been in NYC with his whole family! I expect him to come bounding into this thread again at any moment. I don't think we need to begin a new thread-- will Matthew mind if we carry on in his name? But if people want to let it die, that's okay. I don't want to be the Paul McCartney of this group, soldiering on after everyone else has lost interest. But if you are interested..... I'm having company on Sunday, and would love to plan a menu from either book with y'all. It needs to involve fish again, since one of the guests is a non-red meat eater.

Today I bought a very reasonably priced 2002 French Roussanne/Viognier blend from a Rhone (Lirac) outfit called Lafond. They didn't have any straight Viognier (other than Condrieu) at the shop, so I thought I'd give it a try. I drank it with some shrimp risotto and a salad. I thought it was very nice, although I wouldn't describe it as a true Viognier fruit explosion or anything. Again, I know nothing, so please ignore what I say. But lately I find myself buying crisp whites like Muscadet and Alsatian Reisling a lot, and for a similar $10-12 expenditure this was a much more full-bodied and sophisticated drink. I think I'll buy more. Later I found a piece on MSNBC about the wine. So the secret's out.

The dark meat at the bone in a chicken is often pinker than the meat closer to the skin-- this gives the illusion that it may not be cooked, when it actually is. Go by temp, as others have said, although I wouldn't endorse a number as low as 150 in the dark meat. My own preference is for close to 170-180 in the dark meat, but no more than 160 in the breast. You may have slowed down your chicken by opening your oven door over and over again to baste. I usually plop my bird in a cast-iron skillet, let it sit for an hour and ten at 400, and it's done. The skillet helps the dark meat reach the temperature I want quickly, and it gets nicely browned on top. Nice work with the herbs-- I've never cut slits. I frequently shove herbs or a stuffing under the skin, however. And the lemon inside is crucial!