ajay

thanks for the excellent recipes, Suvir. Your dedication to this site, even on your vacation is commendable. we've almost never added mango to our mint, cilantro or mint/cilantro chutneys in the past; I'm going to have to overcome the traditionalists in the family and insist that we try it. Does anyone have any leads on where to get good, fresh locquats in NYC? Thanks in advance.

THis dish sounds very reminiscent to one that I had at L'Arpege this winter: Pulpe d'avocat a la creme de sevruga d'Iran "nouvelle peche". I wonder what direction the inspiratoin for this dish flows...

My expereince with champagne is that it doesn't pair so well with the foods I like, especially pork products, and lamb. Thus, I take champagne only infrequently.

Fair 'nough, Wilfrid. I too pay minimal attention to the issue. I don't think anyone who makes the effort and has the means to go to Ducasse would attempt to go in ripped jeans and open toed sandals, and it would fall outside my stipulation that dress should be irrelevant within a 'broad standard of appropriateness and resaonability.' Moreover, for the record, I would note that the wearing of jackets is by no means the norm in Michelin 3 stars. THis is especially true of the countryside. However, even in Paris, there were invariably some gentlemen not wearing jackets, and I didn't notice any hostility toward them on the part of the House. That said, I also note that almost everyone every native I encountered in France was smartly dressed--jacket or no. As to being judged by one's clothing/appearance, I believe that it is a regrettable, if unconcscious, fact of life, but this is an issue that could easily spawn a swarm of digressions and rebuttals.

Thanks for the clarification Wilfrid! I still feel that members who are concerend with the attire of others in a restaurant (within a broad spectrum of appropriateness/reasonability) are being obssessive and a bit crochety! Perhaps my views are due to my (relatively) young age. I'm firmly of the opinion that one should be free to dress in as disheveled a fashion as one prefers. Now, I freely admit that others, including restaurants, draw inferences from a sloppy appearance. But the balancing between the consequences of sloppiness, and the comfort/desirability of so dressing should be left to the individual.

Can someone describe an ortolan? The word was not in Webster's and I don't as yet have a gastronmic dictionary. what is an Ortolan? How is it customarily prepared? Where is it found? Has anyone made a name for themselves with this ingredient?

I've found that I only enjoy Vueve Cliquot le grande dame. The non vintage stuff I've tried has invariably been thin, and generally disappointing. But, to my underdeveloped palate, the grande dame has been consistently excellent. What do members think of rose champaign? I've always thought it's a little gimicky, and have never tried it. Another option might be the Tatinger blanc de blancs--I've read excellent reviews, but never tried them. My problem with champaigne consumption is that I rarely have the opportunity or desire to consume an entire bottle. At a restaurant, champagne is only a good match for the first couple of courses--if that. At home, nothing that I prepare would work with champagne, and it feels unacceptably decadent and wasteful to open a top-notch champagne just for celebration, or even as an apertif. I'd like to hear how other members believe top quality champagne should be consumed--both at home and in the restaurant.

Sorry for the digression, but I'm curious...why would a bottle require two hours time to decant? Is it intrinsic to this particular producer? Or was this a complete red herring?

Mamster, I'm wondering if we were in the same France. Even the ethnic restaurants where I had "menus," usually the cheapest way to go left me quite full. DOn't get me wrong, I don't mind this feeling at all. Moreover, I have a pretty large appetite for a small (5'10", 160lbs) guy, and yet, I couldn't finish all of the food offered as part of the "menu l'astrance" at the amazing L'Astrance Restaurant. Markstevens, I think you'll find that claims of minimalism at the level of Le Bernardin still force the kitchen to work quite hard and the pots and pans will be a baggin'. I've only had one prixe fixe lunch there. But, I can tell you the cooking was intricate, and the flavors complex. Le Bernardin is not a place that simply steams the freshest fish; they work their food over, but their influence is subtle. Since I hate food wastage, I wish there were a good solution to the portion problem: I funtion on the goldfish principle--as long as food is put before me, I continue to eat it. But, I see now that, it's not just women who prefer smaller portions. I usually emphasize my hunger to the waitstaff, but I don't think this practice yields a different sized portion. I've often been tempted to ask for seconds--they've bee offered and gratefully accepted at a few places, but usually abstain so as to not disrupt the pacing/tempo of the meal. I often request extra petite fours and I eat a lot of bread if I feel the portions are small. These are, I admit, imperfect solutions, but I'm not sure what else to do.

Well said, Tommy. I agree that coats and ties are for the office funerals and other occasions that I prefer to skip, but can't. I find both coats and ties restrictive, and a large portion of my meal is dedicated to avoiding spillage on those articles of clothing. Hence, I often prefer trousers or khakis and a polo shirt, especially when the weather is warm. I usually draw the line at shorts, but, I don't question the attire of others, and would appreciate others not questioning my attire. I don't see how what I wear can affect the quality of someone else's experience. I believe that people should have the option of dressing as they like (within some very general constraints-- I'd prefer not to see very baggy jeans with boxer shorts hanging out paired with a sports jersey, but if I saw someone wearing such an outfit, I'd probably think of them as a rube or a bumpkin and continue my meal. THe attire of others doesn't influence the enjoyment of my meal. Food, service, wine and company of fellow diners are all that influence my meal. Wilfrid, you are a turncoat . But, no harm done, I will simply ignore your stares of incredulity when we meet at Bid--if we meet at Bid. (Alas, I will be away for the Ninth ave gourging.) PS i will also avert my eyes from all of the (gentle?)men who choose to wear silk shirts with "only the collar buttoned."

Simple. Put me behind the stove.

I've often experienced unripened and half ripened mangos as pickles or garnishes, but never in the preparation of a vegetable dish. Chats with mangos I can imagine but have never attempted. I think a mint and mango chutney would be fabulous, and will try that in the future. But, again, I look forward to a discussion and recipes involving the use of fruit, especially mangos, in curries. In Gujrat, we make a sweet and hot pickle known as gord kerrie from mangos. I was also told that a dish can be prepared from the 'whiter' parts (I can't describe it any better) of a watermelon. However, all of the members of my family who have sampled said dish agree that it is not much to get excited about. Suvir, The lavendar parfait sounds excellent. I don't why but I am always particularly excited when flowers are included in my dessert. There's something incredibly exciting, almost sensual about it. I've often heard of Flowers (here I'm thinking primarily of rose and hibiscus) used in flavoring Indian desserts. I've always felt a particularly good cook could push this envelope. Alas, I am not such a cook, and my mother and grandmother scoff at the notion. So I am left with only theories ps I couldn't find the loquat chutney recipe on the LA Times website. Clickety anyone?

Do members know whether the bar area of artisnal is akin to the front (tavern) room at GT in that one can go at any time after the lunch service and have a grilled cheese, or is it a more traditional lunch break dinner style of service?

Steve, I wonder, though, would a critic who stumbled upon the information you've describe write about it? Would Mr. Bauer?

So the restaurant is comporable in price to Sushi Yasuda? Is it comporable in quality and diversity of selection--exetrnalities sucha s wasabie and sake nonwithstanding??

Fat Guy, Despite the fact that most reviews in the NYC are do not contain much content that furthers my knowledge of food, I agree that at education is a proper and desirable goal to strive for in a review. I am not, however, covinced that a close relationship with a chef is necessary to provide this education--just as I am not convinced by your analogy to a sportswriter not setting foot in the locker room. moreover, I think the link on Mr. Bauer's practices in San Francisco highlight quite well the dangers of compromised critics without any kind of disclosure. An anonymous critic is still present in a restaurant, so it's not as though he is merely watching on TV. The reason a sports writer would be handicapped by watching on TV is that his field of vision is restricted by the camera in a way it would not be if he was on the field and his eyes had the freedom to roam over the length and breadth of the field. Thus, watching on TV, a writer may miss an athelete's footwork or the block that actually opens the hole. I believe an anonymous reviewer possess the freedom, while at the restaurant, to take in the details pertinent to reporting on a dining experience. He would have a chance to see the food, read the menu and ask pertinent questions of the waitstaff, and perhaps the kitchen in his anonymous capacity--I do it all of the time. I do not see how presence in the locker room, or kitchen will yield information that will make education any easier. All, or certainley most of the information seems obtainable by phone interviews. I'd be interested in specific that you believe are only obtainable in person. By being in the locker room, perhaps you meant that a sports writer or food critic should have actually participated in the endeavor they cover prior to their reporting on it? But, to the best of my knowledge, most critics are not cultivated from the restaurant industry--other more knowledgable people can and will no doubt correct me on this point if I am incorrect in this assumption. As to the ethics of critics dining anonymously, I believe that their consumer protection function is essentially covered by the lack of availability exception; the objective information on how a diner is treated is probably only obtained through attempting to recreate the situation. Thus, if I was Randy Cohem, I would give clear you and all other critics on that theory.

In the "If you could drink wine from only one producer" thread, Steve (Plotnicki) said that he found most bordeaux wines to be either "powerful or p*ss." I stumbled upon the opportunity to acquire up to a half dozen or so of these bottles for about 150 euros. I am a little hesitant, however, to go forward with the transaction. This is for two reasons, first, this is a rather large investment, but when others were buying, I have enjoyed Latour 1993, and found it to be a treat. But, even though I was not old enough to drink wine, I know that, in general, 1987 was not a good year, so I'm not sure how good the Latour '87 is. The advice of various sommeliers in New York has been contradictory. The bottle was on the list at ADNY and the sommelier said the wine was 'pretty good' but not as good as the '86 or '88. Jean Luc at Daniel didn't think the bottle was particularly worthwhile. Any opinions out there?

Thanks Rail Paul. I was pretty sure Congress had delegated the power, but was unsure where and when. I should have thought of the Constitutional Amendment repealing prohibition. This source of the delegation raises a troubling question: Since the authority for state liquor regulation including the bizarre direct shipinng laws is grounded in a constiutional amendment, can Congress preempt these laws with its commerce power? My inclination is to say no, but first someone would have to convince Congress to muster the political will to impose common sense regulation on direct shipping laws. Who knows, maybe the SUpreme Court is full of closet wine drinkers who are eqaully frustrated by their inability to acquire good Oregon Pinot Noir and California gewztraminer, and they'll construe the amendment in a favorable way

I've always wondered what the difference between a fruit ice and a sorbet is. Any insights would be much appreciated. from my recollection of the tapioca dessert, they were equivalent...

Beachfan, At the risk of being indiscreet, did your substitutions to the changing menu result in supplemental charges? I would think that would be likely given that it's unlikely they could have reduced the lobster portion. Also, I seem to recall a cheese course as also commanding a supplemental charge...If one can indeed customize a tasting menu for 90 bucks, I will make my reservations immediatley

Beachfan, Glad to hear you had such an excellent experience. I would be much obliged if you could answer a few questions. Did you take the tasting menu as printed, or did you make substiutions? If so, were there any supplemental charges for your substiutions? I've always enjoyed the coconut tapioca dessert, but have had much difficulty in getting it incorporated into the tasting menu. Ditto for a cheese course and the lobster. Has the restaurant changed its policies regarding tasting menu substitutions?

Suvir, I always considered myself as one who understands, or at least has broad experience in Indian cuisine. However, with the exception of Mango Chutney, I don't believe that I've ever encountered any of the dishes you have mentioned. [i'd be interested to hear about some others that didn't pop into your head on the spur of the moment!] Some recipes would be much appreciated. But I would prefer even more advice on where I can sample (preferably in New York, but I'll settle for anywhere) such dishes. This thread coupeled with our earlier discussion of Indian desserts (where I also believed fruit was an absent element) have conclusively demonstrated that I have much to learn about Indian cuisine, and I look forward to the lessons,hopefully with some tastes along the way

Bux, welcome back! I'm dying for a report of your experiences, espcially at Bras....Don't make me beg!

I'd appreciate links to articles that describe courts striking down prohibitions against out of state shipping. It was my impression that Congress had granted the states the authority to enact such legislation as a part of the federal government's commerce power. [This would seem to make the VA Supreme Court's opinion curious to say the least!] I would be thrilled, though, if the SUpreme Court were to end these odd laws, as I could finally get the wines I want at more reasonable prices.

Steve, A surprise menu was out of the question at L'arpege. Just as we were seated, (directly across from the entrance), the table next to us, towards whom, as I have previously mentioned, the captain was quite obsequious, began to smoke. All of the members of my dining party have allergies to smoke, and so we were not prepared to deal with a full 7-8 course degustation. Moreover, though we had all agreed to spend lavishly in France, we all felt that 300 Euros for the printed tasting menu was excessive. (Gagnaire's menu was 143 Euros and the Troisgros menu was 180). There being three of us, we decided to order al la carte. My point is that if a review is excessivley slanted toward the strange, extraordinary and maginficent, as is likely to occurr where a critic is recognized, they will be no help to diners situated as we were. I dare say that the majority of diners in a particular establishment on a given night will be be looking for advice on how to maximize their ordering strategy without having to specially instruct the waitstaff and the kitchen. It is intereting to note that L'Arpege turned out to be our most expensive dining experience in France, despite the fact that we did not ask for surprise menus [this was even though we spent less on wine at L'Arpege than at any other restaurant]. In New York, however, I am less inclined to request special menus. This is for two reasons: one, I can't afford them and two, I sense that it isn't simply enought to request them when one arrives, but rather one must be a friend of the restaurant, or have a VIP make the reservation for you. Now, your suggestion of reducing the number of fine dining experiences I have is a viable option. But, I'm afraid, that it would leave me eating pastrami a bit too often for my taste ! Therefore, I am willing to go to a place, and not demand cutting edge treatment. Naturally, the egulleteer inside of me would prefer such treatment, but all to often, in New York, despite asking for such treatment, I am dissappointed anyway. Thus, when I read the New York Times, or other publication, I would like some advice on how to maximize the experience I am likely to encounter. Perhaps this is eccentric and idiosyncratic, but it is nevertheless what I expect. I will say that this exchange has helped me to better understand what Steve desires from a restaurant critic, and I agree that such information can certainley be useful. I just think that such information is not demanded by the majority of any critic's readership, and said critic should take this into account in approaching and writing his/her review. Cabrales, We felt like sending a dish back at Gagnaire, but decided against it. I think our standards for sending a dish back are as rigorous as those you seem to have adopted. However, on my return to France (when I will hopefully have a better command of at least restaurant Fench), I hope to be a bit more assertive. We felt that the turbot they served us at Gagnaire was oversalted in the extreme, but as were already having communication problems with the waitstaff, we decided to let it slide. PS Steve, I would be greatful if you could post your tasting notes [including the world famous Plotnicki point system] on the '58 Marquis de Riscal Rioja Gran Reserva. I doubt that I will get my hands on the stuff anytime soon, but I am intruiged. And who knows, if I can find it anywhere near $45, I would probably bite!