pbear
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Posts posted by pbear
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On 5/5/2016 at 1:49 AM, pulledpork said:
I've thought of trying agar agar to make a spaghetti out of a veg juice. Not technically a junk food I know.
If this sort of thing interests you, I'd recommend you download Texture by eG member Martin Lersch. Free pdf and very well done.
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On 4/27/2016 at 1:42 PM, paulraphael said:
I've been trying to find a simple way to use the circulator to proof bread dough and starters..
I've not done exactly this, but I've done similar stuff and have a few pointers/suggestions. For starters, I like to work in canning jars, either 12 oz jelly or 24 oz wide mouth, both of which are relatively tall for volume (helps with water level issues) and have straight sides (easy to scrape out). Both are stock Ball jars, but may require a little hunting to track down; the latter are called pints-and-a-half. The 12 oz jars also are great for working with custards in a water bath and the 24 oz end up being useful for all sorts of things, so these aren't one purpose acquisitions. As for dough, the first rise is relatively easy. Again, you want something tall for volume. I like steam table inserts; soup inserts also could be used, if you'd prefer round. No good way to do the second rise comes to mind, especially if you're using a proofing basket. Maybe float in an insert and rely mostly on latent heat?
BTW, if you have one of the old Auber/FMS controllers hanging around, that plus a countertop roaster makes a wizard proofing box. That's what I do for starters, actually, dry rather than wet. For dough, I use a fairly conventional heat-source-in-a-box strategy, currently a coffee mug warmer on a lamp dimmer.
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No, that's not the issue. When, as here, the heat is coming from below, the limiting factor is the water. Once that comes to a boil, it undergoes a phase change on the inside bottom surface, rising as steam. Once above the water but below the lid (a steamer is always covered) there's no source of heat to make it hotter than 212º. A pressure cooker solves this problem by raising the phase transition point. A combi oven (or CSO) solves it by supplying heat to the whole system, not just a contact surface. A simple steamer, though, is limited to 212º.
Bear in mind, by the way, this limitation is why a double boiler works.
ETA: I took "it" to mean the steam. If you meant the pot, we're saying pretty much the same thing.
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Yes, steam can get above 212ºF, but not when you're creating it by heating a pot of water.
ETA: Meaning a set-up as described above. A pressure cooker, of course, gets to 240/250º depending on pressure.
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14 hours ago, IndyRob said:
I've had the misfortune to burn myself both with boiling water and with steam and I must say that steam seems far worse. I'm trying to think of some sort of mitigating factor like the barbeque stall, but that doesn't seem to apply.
Looking in McGee, 2d edition at p.785, the cause of this phenomenon is condensation, i.e., your relatively cool arm extracting heat of fusion from the steam. The same thing will be true initially for eggs. Once the exterior gets hot, though, ISTM heat transfer will be via conduction, for which as I recall (sorry, don't have the reference) steam is only about 80% as efficient as water. This came up, for example, in the sous vide thread apropos of combi ovens vs. circulator baths.
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22 hours ago, Chris Hennes said:
It is used industrially for just that purpose, actually, though I'm not sure it's correct to state that it is doing it "without weakening the gluten." L-Cysteine is what's called a "reducing agent," which breaks some of the disulfide bonds in the gluten (and between the gluten molecules). Excruciating detail available here.
Here's another article, also technical but a little less intimidating, targeted apparently to professional bakers, Dough and Bread Conditioners by Klaus Tengergen. Worth reading the whole thing, but the particularly relevant paragraph explains:
Reducing agents have exactly the opposite effect of oxidizers. They disrupt the disulfide bonds between and within protein molecules, weakening the protein structures. Since the intramolecular disulfide bonds are rapidly "disconnected," the proteins unfold quickly with less mixing. This can also soften the gluten where desired, as in biscuit dough, or can be used in conjunction with a slow-acting oxidizer [e.g., ascorbic acid] to reduce mixing time. The oxidizer rebuilds the disulfide bonds between the now-unfolded proteins; otherwise the dough would become too soft and sticky. The most commonly used reducing agent, L-cysteine, works very quickly. Other reducers include sulfites, which can cause allergic reactions, and reduced glutathione in the form of deactivated yeast.
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Do ya'll realize that, per the CDC's annual botulism surveillance reports, there has only been one case linked to garlic-in-oil in the past fifteen years? And that one is presumed but not confirmed, as no product remained to be tested.
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Okay. But, you can move the bowl/cooker (with stirring paddle, if convenient) to the scale and back more easily than you can decant the contents and check by volume. And of course you'd still use time to decide when to start weighing. Anyhoo, just a thought.
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... unfortunately I do not presently have a good method of monitoring the reduction other than by cooking time.
I've only been dropping into the thread occasionally, so apologies if this has been discussed. My usual way of solving that problem is by using a scale. Note weight of empty vessel; add liquid being reduced; calculate target weight (including the vessel); weigh as needed while reducing. If overreduced, it's usually okay to add back a little water.
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Kenneth, do yourself a favor. Take the time (and it will be considerable) to learn the food science behind this. Good starting points would be the FDA Bad Bug Book and the 1999 CDC study on foodborne illness. The statistics will be almost entirely about the U.S., of course, but the science applies everywhere. Also handy, by the way, is this concise chart by food scientist Peter Snyder summarizing salient characteristics of the most common bugs.
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Of which speaking, here's an article on the question raised by Fat Guy back in 2006: The day they took the Cheese out of Cheez Whiz.
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To be clear, I'm not hatin' on Calphalon. In fact, I have four pieces of tri-ply, which work fine for what they are. It's just that I happened to notice this new product line yesterday at BB&B and thought, "Oh dear, they've run out of good ideas."
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We've had various discussions about layers in stainless steel pans, but I don't think I've ever noticed such a brazen abuse of the concept as the recently released Calphalon Signature line. For example, look at the write-up for the 5 qt dutch oven. Five layers! Only, turns out it's stainless inside-and-out, then three aluminum layers each on top of the other. I defy any materials engineer with a reputation to lose to explain how that's any better than tri-ply. Pure marketing hokem, I say.
Needless to say, I am NOT endorsing this product line.
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My main reaction is that this looks like a good machine if you're going to leave it on the counter full time, but not so good if you're going to want to put it away between uses. Also, a conventional circulator can be used with a wide variety of containers, where here you're limited to the one built in.
Can't address the zip-top bag question. That's how I worked for years, but with a noncirculating Sous Vide Supreme.
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Here's the press release (from Dec. 2014)..
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FYI, Secret, ThermoWorks uses a thermistor for its probe-on-wire Dot. I assume the reason is that response time doesn't matter much when the probe stays in the thing being measured. The Thermapen is a different critter, a probe inserted to measure and then removed.
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FWIW, I almost never see those fresh here either, but can find them frozen at several stores in the Mission district. Much better than the paste, which in fact I've never liked. Frankly, if he can't find them frozen, I think he'll do better rehydrating dried.
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Barry, that's the same concept but a different execution. (And a different manufacturer.) The Vita is a self-contained unit, rather than fussing with tubes and ports. It also supports that technology, but the main box is larger and easier to use. Also, much more expensive.
Personally, I find it much easier just to freeze bread. But obviously there are folks who prefer the vaccum strategy.
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An ad for this showed up on the NYT's website this morning, so the product appears indeed to have made it to market. To be clear, I am NOT in any way recommending or endorsing the machine. In fact, I can't imagine wanting one. But I figured it might be of interest to some folks in a general "what's new" sense. Here's the website, main product page with specs here. Basically, it's a rigid box which automatically pulls a partial vacuum (strength not disclosed) when the lid is closed. Base unit goes for $200, a little more ($229) to add accessory containers and bags. Internal capacity, 2 gal / 8 litres (linear internal dimensions not given). Outside dimensions, 18.5x11.8x8.2 inch / 47x30x20.8 cm. Direct sales only; up to a three month lag until shipment. Twelve month warranty. Only shipping at this time to Netherlands (where the company is based), U.S. and U.K.
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I tried making veal stock from shank bones a couple times and was disappointed for precisely the reason you mention, not much flavor. Now I make it with breast (the equivalent of spareribs on a pig), which has both meat and bone. You probably could get to the same place by adding veal shoulder (chuck) to shank bones, say 50/50 by weight.
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Monti, I'm not able to duplicate your conditions exactly, but got pretty close. Cutting to the chase, I think your unit is okay.
So, an Anova One, not the PC. Ten litres water, but in a stockpot (with cutout cover) not a Cambro. Starting temp of the water was 65ºF (18.3ºC), as was ambient air temp. Plugged the Anova into a watt meter, which read 875 to 900 watts throughout, but take that with a grain of salt as I've never figured out a reliable way to check its accuracy. Took four minutes to cover the first ten degrees, i.e., to your start temp of 75ºF (23.9ºC). From there, it was 34:40 minutes to 140ºF (60ºC), 1.875 degrees per minute. Notably, consistent with haresfur's comment, it took two minutes to cover the last degree; if we take that out, the heating rate was 1.94 degrees per minute. Incidentally, the time from 80ºF (26.7ºC) to 140ºF, i.e., that tested by Serious Eats, was 32:20. And I did confirm final temp with a Thermapen.
Hope that helps.
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FWIW, gulfporter posted a thread about something similar (sauteing duck breasts) a few months ago: An Alternative Use For Baking Parchment.
Apparently the reason it works is that the paper is coated/impregnated with silicone.
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but I can't find any info about temps between 80 and 100.
I did some digging last year to find something definitive on this. The best thing I found was a 1985 article in the Journal of Food Science. Only the abstract is available without subscription, but I'll quote that in full:
Methodology was developed that allowed sensitive measurement of phytohemagglutinin (PHA), the lectin of kidney beans. Trypsinated porcine red blood cells were treated with saline extracts of kidney beans, incubated, and the nonagglutinated cells were quantitated using a Coulter Counter. This hemagglutination activity (HA) assay was then used to monitor the PHA in cooked kidney beans. The thermal treatment (minutes @°C) required to reduce HA by 1 log cvcle was: 12 @ 100°C: 62 @ 93°C: 136 @ 88°C: 160 @ 82°C. Beans were prepared in commercially available low-temperature cookers and evaluated for tenderness and residual hemagglutinating activity.
In plain words, for future reference, any slow cooker which hits 88C/190F at least two hours before the beans are finished should be fine. And the time required goes down as the temp goes up.
Incidentally, I found several articles to similar effect. That one just seemed to me the clearest and most authoritative.
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Hard to believe since this was just 1300 g of a much larger batch and there doesn't seem to be any indication that the larger batch was spoiled
Recall that Johannes cooked the rest of the meat (the main part, actually) in a pressure cooker. It never had a chance to spoil.
When it's happened me I've always suspected the stuff I put in the bag, not the meat..
Conversely, I almost never add anything to my pouches except salt. This may be why I've had only one failure (so far).
Baking Bread in a Bread Machine
in Pastry & Baking
Posted
Now that I understand the question, I'm intrigued by the possibility this might actually work. MIGHT. Meaning, developing commercial yeast as a stable culture, similar to sourdough but mild. What captures my imagination isn't saving ten cents per batch in yeast but rather whether it will function like a levain, building in flavor as well as a rise. It'll take me a week to do the test. I started tonight. I'm gonna put the culture through six generations of pare-and-rebulld. Will report back on how it bakes out in a tried-and-true recipe.
FYI, Norman, if nothing else, understand you absolutely must incorporate a chill phase into the process. If you don't, as several others have mentioned, you will end up with a sourdough starter.