roosterchef21

Anyone who reads the books by Adria, Blumenthal, and Achatz would know the amount of work they put into developing a dish before it gets put onto their menus. Even if a dish does make it onto a menu, they still work at refining it. The problem with Tender Trap is that there doesn't seem to be much thought put into their dishes. In the few times I've had food that would fall under the molecular gastronomy umbrella, I've thoroughly enjoyed the experience. It just opens up the eyes (and all the other senses) to the possibilities of food. It's not the type of thing that I could eat on even a monthly basis, but as something to have once a year, it's great. As for the restaurant trade, it's the ideas from the cutting edge that eventually filter down to everyone else. For example, Adria's foams used to seem exotic, but now they're everywhere. Anyway, another Melbourne restaurant that delves into the world of molecular gastronomy is Vue de Monde (www.vuedemonde.com.au). ← Exactly.... its all well and good to push boundaries but if a dish doesn't work it doesn't work. I often wonder how many chef's have actually eaten at the place they work or if they taste any of the food before it goes out...

I'm more interested in the rising stars category....

Grandvewe is lovely. We regularly have their cheese on the menu at work. They also make a lovely Honey & Vanilla Yoghurt. It's a nice place to visit on your days off for a relaxing afternoon.

Ah, you'll cringe if you read the Age review of Tender Trap in my post above. In Keller's "Under Pressure" one of his chefs writes about how young chefs still need to know the basics of cooking before they can really use the new techniques. After all, without the basics, how can they know that the new techniques will deliver the results they need? In Australia, Alla Wolf-Tasker from the Lake House restaurant (Victoria, Australia) said the same thing. She's concerned that there will be a generation of chefs who can use all the latest equipment and ingredients, but won't know how to make a good stock from scratch. The thing is that Adria, Blementhal, Keller, Achatz, and co. were all well grounded in traditional techniques before they moved onto the cutting edge of cooking. ← Read it.... My point exactly. Don't get me wrong there is definetely a place for molecular gastronomy and molecular restaurants but it has to be done properly. In fact I'm making a trip to Paris soon and want to eat at Gagnaire (can't reserve till the month before. poop) so I'm still intrigued by it.

Hey! Heading to Italy at the end of March and just had some quick questions. Rome: Have booking at La Rosetta. Want to go to either Il Chianti or Matricianella. When should I book these? Which is better in the price/quality stakes? I know they are completely different but which would you choose. Any good bakeries around? Florence: Same questions as with Rome. This time Antellisi or Camillo. Bakeries? Definetely going to Nerbone! Venice: Is Caffe Quaddri worth it? Have a booking... Which of Alle Testiere or Trattoria Alla Madonna has more traditional Venetian food & better price/quality. Thanks!

So we have booked our flights and accomodation. Decided on Mar-Apr. Just want to thank everyone for their input. Even if you didn't reply directly to my thread you still helped in some way. Only had a couple of questions for the France forum left (I hope!) In Lyon, Le Bistrot de Saint Paul, Le Garet or L'Est. Looking for best price/quality ratio and more importantly local cuisine. Any boulangerie's I should visit? Nice - Nothing. Have a booking at Chateau de la Chevre d'or for lunch. Want to go to La Merenda - desperately! In Bordeaux, is Le Saint James worth it? Where is the best place to purchase wine? Have a booking at La Tupina. Very excited! In Paris - Chocolate Shops - La Maison du Chocolat, Michel Chaudun & Michel Cluizel Boulangeries - Poilane, Maison Kayser, Pain D'Epis Patisseries - Laduree & Pierre Herme Ice Cream - Berthillon Deli- Fauchon High End Restaurants - Ledoyen, Le Meurice, L'Arpege & Pierre Gagnaire Cafe: Cafe Constant Any glaring omissions from the above? Would like to visit any/either of Chez Georges, Chez L'Ami Jean, Chez Denise & La Rotonde so have that sorted... As a side note. Going to 3 *** stars in Paris. Ledoyen, L'Arpege & Gagnaire are my top 3 but I can't book the last two till March. Have Le Meurice booked as a backup. So no need to comment on that part....

I am so over this whole molecular thing. Why can't a chef source outstanding products and do as little as possible to it. Why do "molecular" chef's need to make a foam or gelee or "risotto" and show no respect to an ingredient. I don't mean chef's at the high end places (Alinea, WD50, Mugaritz, Gagnaire, El Bulli, Fat Duck etc) but the average chef. Look, I'm 25 and I know most of my colleagues around my age and younger love it. And when they cook something it has to be molecular. And it just doesn't work. It seems these places are shaping their future. I think they need to learn the basics before trying the new. So, FWIW and in no particular order my top 8: Influential: I guess this is subjective... Everyone has their own influences... El Bulli Fat Duck French Laundry Savoy Robuchon Ducasse - Louis XV & ADPA Gordon Ramsay Alinea Molecular: Gagnaire El Bulli Fat Duck Mugaritz Alinea WD50 Veyrat Per Se Modern: (I'm not going Molecular here... At least not out and out molecular restaurants. I don't mind if they have the occasional touch of molecular) L'Arpege French Laundry Louis XV Bras Roellinger L'Astrance L'Arnsbourg Ledoyen

Go to college and learn while your still young and your mind is set on learning (in high school mode). Then go to cooking college. Some days you will just want to leave the industry or will be out of a job and at least then you will have dual qualifications and more options when looking for work... I'm not saying your a quitter or will get the sack btw! These days the more options you have the better.

Not really sure.... something to do I suppose! LOL!

Was just wondering which celebrities/famous people you've seen when you've been out for a meal in France. Where was it at?

I think what will happen is that restaurants will need to focus more on lesser (not quality wise but simpler)/non luxury ingredients. Not everyone will be able to have the top of the line menu and to keep people coming in, as the bread & butter of the restaurant, I think chef's will start looking at using simpler ingredients more effectively. It will be interesting to see who shines at this and who is going to struggle. I think a place such as L'Astrance, with no set menu, is in a prime position to steal customers from restaurants that use luxury items often... I also think food will become more market/season driven in that set menu's will become less common and what is best at the market will be seen on a daily menu. At least at the lesser/poorer (money wise) restaurants. I also wonder if the cooking/food/meals will become a lot simpler. For the average joe (not so much us, the general public I mean), eating out I think will become a big deal financially and they will want less pizzazz(?) and more consistency. With us, most of us don't mind (I know its a generalization) spending a little more at a restaurant that's pushing boundaries. Because we are really in to food!

I don't know - although Julot speculated a while back that this is one reason for the lighter food served in some places. FWIW - to me - lighter doesn't necessarily mean just the kind of foods you mention - but smaller quantities (of just about anything). My husband and I had room service for dinner in Paris a couple of times - where it's easy to order one main - maybe one starter - and split everything. Without guilt (we wouldn't do that at a restaurant). Robyn ← I should have mentioned less in my original statement! Sorry! LOL!

It's so disappointing. I'm 25 and I have noticed a lot of my chef friends around my age or younger only want to eat at *** Michelin star restaurants. They seem to think that these restaurants are the be all and end all of food... ← Thank you for confirming my very informal unscientific observations. Like others - I don't know where the money is coming from. Not that young people shouldn't have really fine meals once in a while. We started eating at very high end places in our late 20's. But - even when we were in France - they were special occasions. And the prices were a lot different then (dinner for 2 with modest wine at a 3 star place in France outside Paris might cost $150 or so - the recessionary years of the 70's and early 80's were good for something). But money has never been a major consideration when we travel - the most limiting factor then and now has been our inability to eat large rich meals on a regular basis. Kind of like trying to eat Thanksgiving dinner 5 days in a row - but worse. Robyn ← Do you think this is why some (not all) restaurants are serving "lighter" food? By that I mean more use of vegetables, raw fish & meat, vinaigrette/oil based sauces etc. To get repeat customers in the one week... Or do you think it's just the thing to do atm?

What did you think overall of the dinner? Is it worth the trip? How much for the menu?

That fig looks nice....

I think it depends what nationality you are.... In that, I mean if your from a country that is not visited by the michelin inspectors e.g. Australia, South Africa, Uzbekistan, Mongolia, when you go for a trip to Europe/US/Japan etc you will want to eat at two and three star places at least once. When it is such a huge outlay for flights over meaning you can only go on very rare occasions I can understand eating at some high end establishments. What I don't understand is eating at all high end/starred restaurants. Just as an example, I'm heading for France/Italy next March for four weeks. I'm hoping to go to three *** places and maybe one or two ** for lunch. And that will do. The rest of my meals will be going to markets, bakeries, delicatessens or really simple restaurants that people recommend on here. Half the fun of travelling is discovering that beautiful trattoria, bistro or bouchon. You know the ones, run by ma & pa and the grandkids, in the middle of nowhere serving the most amazing food that only the locals seem to know about. Heaven!

How do I get a job as a Chef? It obviously pays far more than my chosen career. ← LOL I aint seeing any of it! Don't ask me how they do it!

It's so disappointing. I'm 25 and I have noticed a lot of my chef friends around my age or younger only want to eat at *** Michelin star restaurants. They seem to think that these restaurants are the be all and end all of food. Look, sometimes it's nice to take the Ferrari for a drive but there is always room for the Volvo. I LOVE restaurants that are true to themselves and serve beautiful simple food. They don't aim to be a starred restaurants and don't claim to be. It's just good honest food in a friendly atmosphere. And more than anything else I love up and coming places. I think the problem with the Michelin Guide is that there is no competition. By that I mean that the average tourist/average joe/beginner foodie haven't heard of the Gambero Rosso or Gault Millau etc etc. Take a look in shops. There is about 10 copies of the Michelin Guide to 1 of each of the above. That means that the "average tourist/average joe/beginner foodie" goes "ok, this guide must be the best because there is so many of them, I will buy it and then I will base my decision on that". Another problem is the fact it has been around for so long. It's had the time to build a customer base. Which is not a bad thing but guides are quite expensive - a loyal customer to Michelin isn't going to swap to another guide anytime soon quite simply because it is an untried guide. The Michelin guide IS a good guide. It just has some little issues it needs to work on. It needs to learn to take away stars quickly rather than giving them quickly. It makes the guide inaccurate if a place has 1, 2 or 3 stars when it quite clearly is not a 1, 2 or 3 star place. Especially since a star (or two or three) means that they can charge you extra, its not exactly a mistake that the average punter can afford to take. I can understand that some chef's (Bocuse, Blanc etc) have been so influential for chef's in the past that they want to reward them. But if it's not up to scratch it's not up to scratch. Maybe they should give yellow (or purple, pink, blue, black whatever) stars to reward these chef's. You know, three yellow stars to bocuse, blanc etc as an honorary three star place. In that way, the guide can move on from the past without forgetting the past... The average joe can then look at the guide and say "Hey, (insert restaurant name here) is a three star place for what it's done in the past but it's not a three star place for what it is doing now. Just a thought.

Rather than starting a new thread and just as an aside, which chefs do you think are at the top of their game and who do you think is only just hanging on? Anyone else have an opinion?

I was very unimpressed with the service at Robuchon. They tried to usher me out of the restaurant as quickly as possible. It was my shortest michelin starred meal I have ever had. If I had a choice of other memorable meals on the Rivera close to Monaco I would suggest Chevre d'Or in Eze for lunch (where you can appreciate the wonderful view as well as the great food) or mirazur in Menton. ← What did you think of Chevre? I've got a lunch booking in April.

I was looking through my michelin guide and noticed le petit nice in marseille as a three star. Has anyone been? What did you think and who/how does it compare to other three stars? It hasn't really had much publicity in Australia and has kind of flown under the radar with us! Sneaky sneaky

What a shame. Out of all the restaurants I wanted to go to in the world his was it. All the best...

Gracious. They let you book THAT far in advance? ← I like to think it's because of my good looks and charming personality I think since it's part of a major hotel chain they have the resources to do it.... Maybe. Or its the reason above

I have my booking for the 17th April next year! Very excited! Just waiting for the 1st November to book Olivier Roellinger's and the start of next year for L'Ambroisie or possibly Gagnaire...

There isn't much that beats margherita pizza wise!