A Balic

Padma is very easy on the eyes indeed. Thank you guys, I will buy a round of Montrachet if I ever meet up with you. Oh, except for Steve Plotnicki, for him I will select a glass of Macon-Chardonnay chardonnay as punishment for inspiring me to read a book on Kant. ;) Andy, you sat near to Rushdie? Just be thankful you didn't sit next to him.

No, Grouse season is well and truely over. As for sneaking one in? Its a bit of a risk, you are not even allowed to display legally shot and frozen down grouse, after the season (although my butcher does). Fat Guy here is a article that lists all the British game seasons, which I crossed checked for you: http://www.foodiesite.com/articles/1999-09/game.jsp I'm not happy with it being grouse, mostly because I think Wilfrid would know that bird, but also because it is either illegal or has been frozen down. I am still rooting for wood pigeon, the species in the UK has meat that is very dark and remains dark after cooking and while grouse flesh is almost black when raw, it does go quite pale when cooked (although a marinade may change this, but why would you marinate grouse?). Fat Guy as you explain it the up-grade does seem pretty minor, but if you were expecting pheasant and got Grouse/Wood pigeon some people may find that flavour to be to "gamy"and a little strange, especially if you weren't told about the change.

Interesting. Most likely is Wood pigeon then. Organic game? How cheeky. I have just stocked my freezer up with grey leg partridges and two woodcock, maybe I should export it?

How big were the breasts? Wood pigeon is a very dark, strong tasting meat and would be much smaller then pheasant. Why would they try to pass it off as pheasant? Do they have Wood pigeon in the US, it would seem to be to much expense/bother to import them from abroad. At the moment you can buy 10 breasts for four quid from my local butcher. It could be woodcock or grey partridge (maybe not dark enough) but these are more expensive than pheasant (like grouse) so why would they palm it off as pheasant. I am mystified by reponse taken by the restaurant, they have lied on at least one account, but why bother to lie at all? How strange, I would out them, bribes or no.

You have better luck then I do! Funny how one wine can change your opinion like that. The first Bordeaux red that I really like was a 1982 Ch. Figeac, I wonder if there is still any of this kicking around?

In no real order: Anything by Elizabeth Laurd French Provincial Cooking, Elizabeth David The Cooking of Northern Italy, Anna del Conte Catalan Cuisine (or is it cooking?), Colman Andrews SW France, Paula Wolfert The Accomplisht Cook, Robert May Anything to do with pigs or fish written by Jane Grigson Middle Eastern Food, Claudia Roden Many, many others.

Oh, that was just a joke to myself. There was a thread on "The Man Who Ate Everything" in the media section of egullet (November I think), he seems to induce strong emotions in some people. The boar did have a lot of surface fat, but that wasn't a bad thing as is cooked off and keep the meat tender.

Moris Farms is produces a really great Morellino di Scansano, what did you think of it?

Thank you all for the rib information. I have now read about them in"The Man Who Ate Everything", but as we all hate that barstard I wasn't sure if they were worth the bother ;) . Jim - Scottish BBQ's are very, very sad. People should BBQ in the sunshine #### it. The supermarkets here sell BBQs in the "seasonal" section. I miss the this aspect of the Great Australian Dream very much. As I am of a partly non-Anglo-Saxon background, my family would always roast a whole pig or sheep (not lamb) on a spit for special ocasions. After six hours of slow cooking those animals really taste fantastic. I will give the ribs a go in my oven, although that may be a little sad.

Just rub the magic lamp! First of all, who let the bears out? Let's make this clear: I am not claiming that works of art (or other objects of critical judgment) do not exist unless perceived by humans. I am claiming that they have no critical value in and of themselves except as judged by humans (or Vulcans, or whatever). Now, if anyone wants to disagree with that, I think they have to come up with an account of two things: 1. How these objects (make it works of art, cuisines, whatever) come to be good, bad or indifferent, without reference to human opinions. 2. What criteria we have for telling that a judgment is right or wrong (since it originates somewhere - the answer to 1. will tell us where - outside of the sphere of human judgment). I have taken in all view points expressed on this thread and I think I can answer these questions with some precision. 1) Because they are magical. 2) See above. This topic must really have been ridden into the ground if the two Steves bring out the old "distract them with salted meat" gambit. This has been such a fun thread, I can't thank you all enough for it.

#### it, where's Wilfrid when you need him?

You have lost your objectivity or am I wrong ;) . The fact that we think their wine was lousy isn't the point is it (they used resin and turpentine as a preservative as well)? The level of their wine appreciation is the interesting thing, they liked there wine. The wouldn't have like Montrachet because they would have diluted it with water and that would taste pretty bad.

Boy, now the tag team comes out. I am a scientist and an academic both and I mostly fine that my precision with words is not precise enough to be precise :) . I buy the Montrachet V St. Veran example, but if you do think that the greatness Sauternes (as an example only) exists in seperation to preferences and trends, then you really are talking about Platonic ideals. Interesting, I will have to give this some thought. I have been doing some reading on the consuming passions of the classical Greeks (see the connection?), those chaps drank wine and appreciated it, I would argue just as much as us, but the had a very different take on what was a great wine and how it should be drunk. The would have hated Montrachet and St. Veran both. So if Montrachet's greatness exists outside of external influences, its pretty lucky that it is made in the here/now rather then 2500 years ago.

After, staying in Burgundy for a few weeks in 2000, I would never tell those guys how to do anything, they can get a little touchy about that sort of thing. I think that if you went to Bordeaux and asked the wine makers there about the relative merits of two Burgundies they would say Burgundy having any merit was definately a cultural construct. All jokes and teasing of philosophers aside, you must admit that there is a very subjective component to wine appreciation. Look at the drop in the popularity of Sauternes in the last twenty odd years. For christmas 2001 I opened a bottle of 1976 Ch. Climens, it was almost a perfect wine (for me at least). Does that mean only I can recognise its "betterness" or that I am a wine idiot? Edinburgh is a wine tasting wasteland, so I will have to do something about that. I have organised wine tastings at work, this is fun, but that is not the same as being in a group of people who really appreciate wine.

Nah, that still doesn't prove the REALITY of bears dumping (what a cute word) in the woods, it just provides a conceptual frame work on which to draw conclusions from if a set of propositions is understood to be true. Ponsot Clos de la Roche being a "better" wine than Savigny-les-Beaune is a Cultural construct. Still, if we consider the "STEVE PLOTNICKI" Alpha-Omega as a self contained, internally referencing object, then you can say that Clos de la Roche is "better", if you like. Anyway, as the only true perfect state is the state of nothingness then the perfect wine is Gallo Ruby Cabernet. The BALIC DYNAMIC OBJECT considers that the PLOTNICKI ENTE drinks better wine than he does. Subjectively, this makes the BALIC sad.

I am a scientist, so to keep up with you chaps I had to go out and buy a whole load of "Boy's own Guide to Philosophy" books. I agree with Wilfrid, so far. I don't think that bears do #### in the woods until I see them. But I do like Fat Guys IDEA that Montrachet is closer to the Platonic ideal of CHARDONNAY than St. Veran is. You could use that as a selling point, "Taste the EMPIRICAL CONCEPT in every glass - as recomended by Kant". See me book learn good.

Thanks for the information guys. This is starting to look the replys to my question "so what is Kosher?".

Not ribs, but I have had roast loin and chops cooked in that that Anjou sauce(prune/wine/cream) manner. Always a very mild flavour. I have also had wild "wild boar" prosuitto/salami with pecorino (with truffle) and rocket , from this little hole in the wall place near the Duomo in Florence (A filled roll and a glass of wine for about Ū, you stand in the street and put your empty wine glass back on a little shelf). I have a confession to make, I have never had "ribs". What cut are they and are they nice?

Wild boar are the same species as the domestic pig, but there are obvious differences, due to the intensive selective breeding of the latter. You can also get feral domestic pigs, which have reverted back to a wild boar like phenotype, but are not technically the same animal. Just like different breeds of cattle taste different all these porcines taste different depending on their genetics and what they have eaten. Here is a link for you to explain it better: http://www.britishwildboar.org.uk/profile.html Um, With the leftovers I made wild boar and braised fennel sandwiches and then my wife made the rest into a ragu and we had that with papadelle.

(Moderator's Note: Topics from 2001 concerning wine tasting have been merged into this topic.) Here a few more unusual non-Parker reviewed wines that I have tasted in the last twelve months.<p>Pfaffenheim Pinot Blanc 2000: Never liked this varietal, until this wine. Rich, lemony great with pheasant galantine. <p>Malaga Oro Viejo Hijos Suarez Villalba NV: Great fortified wine, much better then the majority of Malaga avalible.<p>Montilla NV: Sherry like (Fino, PX and Amontillado styles) from around Cordoba, natural alcohol (no fortification). Excellent if you like Fino.<p>Morellino di Scansano '97: Lovely Sourthern Tuscan red (Sangiovese), good value, wild cherry flavours.<p>Others to follow.

Gloaming? As in: "At e'en in the gloaming, nae swankies are roaming 'Bout stacks wi' the lasses at bogle to play; But ilk ane sits drearie, lamenting her dearie, - The Flowers of the Forest are a' wede away." So clear now............

Scapetta, thank you for the sauce it was a great success. I used candied cedro peel and a little preserved ginger instead of the orange peel. The boar was very good, nice and tender. My guests remarked how it wasn't what they were expecting as its flavour was milder then swine pork, more like very young lamb. I have had this farmed wild boar several times and have always found this to be the case. Strange, don't you think.

No, that #### thread already scares me enough thank you. Back to the topic, Wilfrid do you think that you could define what you mean by "better"? As in "........French haute cuisine is better than Syrian.......".

I think this post would be best placed on my bio thread - with all the others......(I can't believe said "intelligent people use egullet").

#### it I know that you are right, the Scottish light example was the clincher. I spent an hour last summer explaining to someone how the twighlight in Scotland was wonderful as it bought out all these blue/purple colours that you don't normally get to see - blank looks in return only.