peterpumkino

So sorry you were misled but that's French and NOT Italian food. One of the problems is that once a restaurant (in Italy) ceases to be 'local' and becomes 'international' and is mentioned a lot on this site by the likes of you and me the food actually changes and adapts for the new, wealthier, clients. It's a very sad and very true fact. Let's put it this way, I wouldn't go to Aimo e Nadia now.

Whew!!!!! Back to basics again. IT'S ALL JUST A MATTER OF PERSONAL OPINION! (and add a dash of personal experience in).

That's Michelin, NOT a local restaurant, so it wouldn't work would it?

Actually there IS a story behind the name. It started when I lived in Jamaica (and it wasn't Pumkins I was accused of eating - geddit!!). Cheers and tks for your email, Peter

Well I would have done that except that it doesn't taste like cola and it does taste like toothpaste and mouthwash. Sorry Steve, you may have just discovered that it's fun to eat where the locals eat but you still need to learn a lot more before you can spout your head of. Zinfandel is a great varietal as Jason Perlow himself said. I have no idea what you were drinking. n.b. actually that was a good descripton as to your experiences in Lyon.

Took a very long time for you to "realise that it's not a bad thing to eat with locals"! Wow, I've been doing that (and loving it) for years. Maybe we just might make a true gourmet of you yet. In the meantime I couldn't agree with you more on prononciation problems with cab drivers but I rather think that many times it's the drivers themselves that don't want to understand! A wealthy friend of mine, an American, hailed a taxi outside the Georges V and asked for the Eiffel Tower. The driver didn't understand, he said it again, no understand, and again, no understand. It was only when he said "Torre Effiel" that the driver finally understood! And as I say this was directly outside the hotel! Mind you this is the same friend who, in a Parisien bar with a Swede, a Luxembourger and myself proceeded to ask, in a loud voice, why the French have an Arc De Triomphe "as they have nothing to be triumpant about - every time the Germans come along they lie down and surrender!" - we had to leave that bar quickly and quietly after that one!

Maybe it's me but what language is this - with all the x's it must be Basque! My guess is a New York Italian dialect??? Portugese?? It's "old Italian." Nothing to do with New York or Portuguese. It is simply an adage in dialect from Veneto which roughly translates as "if whoever invented wine is not in paradise, he's close to it". Nothing to do with old Italian (a most difficult thing to define, BTW). Do you pronounce it with a high pitched accent alla Veneto dialect? In the movie Lorenzo's Gold Nick Nolte got panned for his "bad Italian accent" - actually his accent was not bad at all, trouble was it was a Veneto accent and not what many consider an Italian accent which, they say, should be Gel-ah-toe, Spa-ghe-tti - slightly up in the middle and definitely descending down at the end, which is actually how Southern Italians speak and as the vast majority of immigrants were from the South this accent was accepted as Real Italian (ha! little joke there for Thom). "Old Italian"? What is that? Nearest I can think (apart from Latin) is Italiano Vulgari di Dante (vulgar Italian from Dante - i.e Dante's Inferno) which was actually Latin's Tuscan dialect and is now considered to be perfect Italian (actually not, Italians say that perfect Italian is "Lingua Toscana in Boca Romana" meaning the Tuscan tongue - words - in a Roman mouth - accent). Peace, love and pasta.

Yes, I drink Zinfandel, the coca cola of wine. Zinfandel doesnt deserve that moniker, its a serious varietal. Not according to lots of people. Matter of opinion, right? I like drinking Zinfandel sometimes myself - but sophisticated it ain't. Hmmmmh. I definately disagree (surprise, surprise). Points: Zinfandel IS a serious wine. For me an aging Foppiano is stunning but there's a lot of cheap wines that have the name Zinfandel which are nothing to do whatsover with the Great Zinfandels. Maybe that's what you've been drinking? Or are you talking about White Zinfandel which is a pop wine!

Maybe it's me but what language is this - with all the x's it must be Basque! My guess is a New York Italian dialect??? Portugese??

Thom, you dissapoint me. As any good poseur knows Northern Italian Cuisine (whatever that is!) is supposed to be light and the heavily sauced pasta comes from the South (Milano and Rimini are in the North) but, as everywhere, there is crossover everywhere. The copyright should go way, way back as it was impossible to get anything remotely like Real Italian in the good ol' days - in fact you can actually get something vaguely similar in London now if you're very, very lucky. What about Real Chinese (or Real Dim-Sum), or Real Japanese or Real Egyptian or Real American ad nauseam? Best ask a native (asked any Real Italians lately? Don't take my word for it ask them - Italians born in England need not apply).

Would you believe that all the times I have been at Metro Pizza I've never actually had their pizza!!! (their Antipasti and Pasta with lobster etc so mind blowing that I just cannot order anything else!). However UK Pizzarias do tend to have a heavier crust compared to Italy. Just to prove I am not an 'Italian snob' I do think that the Neopolitano with an egg in the middle at.....er........Pizza Express is very good! Anyone heard the rumour that the chain is going out of business (if it's true then it proves something, I'm not sure what). Bloated, did you notice that in many Pizzarias in Napoli serve only beer, no wine?!!!

Why should I? It's true! Besides I have a great sense of fun! Re. Dim Sum, yes it's Cantonese (not easy to get in Bejing) and it's actually a late breakfast. It's fun going Dim Summing at a real Chinese place as all the Chinese start leaving at midday when the white people are all arriving! (also the selections change to suit 'us' so you must go early to get the Real dim sum - sort of like having to go to Italy to get Real Italian food, right Thom?).

In fact, based on what I would do in the States, I find the opposite is true in France and Spain. I always try the tasting menu as I find myself eating dishes I would never order myself and loving every minute of it! (anyone for oysters cooked in custard? Marvellous!). Actually I'm off to Bilbao/San Sebastian on the 6th Feb. Anyone have any further suggestions for me (or warnings...eg I know that Akelare is closed unfortunately)?

Gary, I think you meant 'all real italian fans should miss locatelli on telly tonight'

Thom, sorry but it IS a flippant analogy considering that heavily sauced pasta is NOT Real Italian and Locatelli and River Cafe are both a million miles away from Real Italian (that does not mean they are not both good, of course). You are spot on about Chinese food. Having travellede and eaten extensively through China I can confirm that your friends are right. The food in China is GENERALLY not great(please no one email me with examples of memorable meals in China, I've had them too. Memories of sitting in the street in a small town on the Yangtse River that is no longer there - flooded a while back - eating an incredible Szechwan Hot Pot comes to mind, although I did pay for it the next day!). Chinese food in China should be much better than it is although, to my mind, it gets better the more you head South.

Sorry Marcus, I think you are confusing France (and Belgium) with Europe (a common mistake on this site - when will these people realise that there are many diverse countries in Europe not just France). It's certainly NOT true of Germany (where, half the time they don't even take credit cards) and it's not true of Italy and it's not true of Greece and it's not true of...........you get the idea. What you are referring to is the credit card machines that French waiters carry on their hip which automatically prints out the total thus leaving the client no opportuniy to leave a tip contrary to many pllaces in Europe that add the tip and then leave the tip box clear hoping you'll be stupid enought to add another tip. It won't catch on in the States!!!

Nice to see you are in good company for once Simon. AA Gill says exactly the same things about food in London versus Oop North. But what does he know?

There you go again Mr Plotnicki. I love Cadbury's fruit and nut and much prefer it to 'elitist' Belgian chocolate (or chocolatier as you put it).

This is partly true. Witness the fact that the largest McDonalds in Western Europe is in the heart of.......Rome! Now I DO know that the Italians young, old and inbetween love good food so I can only surmise that, for Italy at least, it's a trendy thing. The young all use McDonalds as a meeting place. My 16 year old American daughter has been travelling and eating with me ever since and she really knows and loves her food yet she still goes to McDonalds.

I think you know me a lot better than this (at least you should by now). BTW how was the Peasant and Cream - a bit meaty maybe?

Gary, how on earth do you support that statement ? Yes, I would be interested to know as well, Garry. You must watch a lot of TV 'real life' soaps. Eating is a lifestyle thing and many families eat TV dinners and that's it but nowhere near all. Even if we are having a Chinese or Indian take-away I insist that we eat at a table with proper cutlery. My significant other (can you imagine living with me?!) thinks it's wonderful because, even if the food is fast food, at least you sit down, concentrate on the food and the conversation and thus while the time time away at leisure and enjoy the experience. I may be wrong but I do believe quite a few people do the same.

As you are coming from NY you must go to Pizza Metro and have Italian food for the first time in your life! Also Indian is a good idea but it's usually too spicy for NY tastes (in the UK).

It certainly works for me!!!!! One other thing is - the climate. Let's face it the Nordic countries do not have such an emphasis on food than even we do let alone France, Spain et all. The first time I went to Iceland (and it wasn't THAT long ago) there was a total of 2 restaurants in Reykavik - now there are many. They say that the reason the Italians put up with everything going wrong, 143 governments in thirty years, the trains running late, the post office running out of stamps - you name it, is simply because they have the 'mentalita del cortile' - courtyard mentality. Meaning that after a terrible day with everything going wrong they get home, go outside in their courtyard on a balmy night, open a bottle of lovely red, get some great fresh pasta, eat some formaggio, watch the stars and not give a s*** about anything else. Nice life?

Gulp. Where do you get that idea? What an astonishing conclusion. the statement is also true of Australian and I suspect the USA as well. I would say definately the United States. The vast majority know absolutely nada (and don't want to know) about food. They eat at their fast food joints and Olive Gardens stuffing their mouths full of disgusting food that I wouldn't even feed Plotnicki. However, before you all start to flame me, there is a small percentage of Americans (and don't forget a 'small percentage' in the U.S. is still a helluva lot of people) who really know their stuff and many are on this site (with the exception of one!). Certainly in my experience people (and in my job I do meet a lot of people) in the UK are very interested in food and a select few are gourmets. Is this being elitist? This is, of course, not true of the Fish and Chip brigade (but I DO love good fish and chips!).

I agree and that's why food is so good in Italy, simply put quality and freshnes does not come into it because it's ALL quality and fresh - nothing less would do. Yes, I've been accused of being an elitist - on this site would you believe - because I love Italian food as cooked in Italy which is very difficult to get in the UK. Elitist? No, just someone who knows what they like, is all.