A Patric

They sell those here too: http://grizzly.com/products/h6252 I also just bought one, but haven't received it yet. I'm hopeful.

That's a beautiful thing.

Large cubes of avocado, large cubes of home-grown tomato, lime juice, liberal amount of crisp bacon pieces, chopped cilantro (optional), minced garlic, minced green chiles, sprinkle of sea salt. Mix very lightly. Makes an excellent salad for barbeque, picnics, etc.

Me too.

Interesting. I have never heard of this. ← Actually, that is basically what the food management food-safety test in my city says. The water must be 70 F or less, and it must constantly flow strongly enough to wash away any food particulate. The illustration shows a chicken in a big pot with water flowing in from a faucet and then overflowing out the top. It doesn't say anything about a time limit.

Just wanted to update this thread. Yep I use two racks, and that seems to hold all the meat most of the time (5 lbs.) if it is sliced at between 1/4 and 1/8 inches thick. For the really small pieces that won't stay on the rack without falling, I use a wire cooling rack placed on the oven rack since it has cross wires and smaller (1/4 inch I think) openings. Also, I don't know what type of marinade or rub you'll use, but if it is pretty wet, I'd blot the meat first to speed up the drying process (I use a spice, soy sauce, terriyaki, worcestershire mix marinated overnight). I started with about 165 F to get the oven up to heat, and then when the meat was hot to the touch (but I doubt all the way up to 160 F) turned it down to about 140 F (which is the lowest temp that my oven will go to). It usually takes about 8 hours to dry at this point depending upon the thickness of the meat. I just remove pieces as they are ready and make sure that any minor meat overlap is rectified as the meat begins to dry and contract. When it is done I bag it and store it in the fridge. I'm sure it would be fine at room temp, but since I don't use nitrites or nitrates, I figure that the fridge is safest, even though it is loaded with salt. I've made over 20 batches like this and have never had any problems with getting sick. Either I'm lucky or doing something right. Couldn't tell you which though.

I make jerky all the time (in fact, I'll be marinating some tonight to be dried tomorrow). Never have I used nitrates. I always use an oven or a smoker. I've never tried ground beef. I know that it is possible to press and form ground beef and make jerky out of it because I've seen little gizmos to do such a thing; however, I wouldn't want to try it because of bacterial issues. Another thing they say is that it is best to quickly get the meat's surface temp up to 165 F for 15 seconds before turning the heat way down to dry it. I've never done this, but I'm sure it is safer that way.

You can dry them and/or pickle them. You can make a few types of salsa with them and can a couple of batches of it. That should take care of your crop. The dried ones can be used for salsa picante, by themselves, or along with some dried chiles that have a little less heat. Rick Bayless has a good recipe for salsa picante in his "Authentic Mexican."

sauce bourguignonne When I was living in Beaujolais, that was served with every meat fondue or pirade. It was always store-bought, but it was pretty good anyway. It probably would be even better home-made.

Well, I've found out a bit more. There are a number of models made by different manufacturers that run from down around 35,000 BTU per oven cavity all the way up to 90,000 BTU or maybe more that I haven't found yet. I've also found a major difference in timer controls. Most have 60 minute timers, but some of the ovens with cook and hold features have up to 15 hour digital timers. Some of these ovens also have digital temperature controls. Also, some of these ovens have convection cycling options. They still all say two speed fans, but I wonder if the convection cycling would allow for more control?? I've e-mailed one of the companies to see if I can find out a bit more. If anyone else has anything to add, I'd still be very happy to hear about it. Thanks

Tan319, Alanamoana, Thanks for the feedback. Maybe I'm out of luck trying to find something better than the standard conventionals, but at a lower pricepoint than the Rationals. At any rate, I'll keep looking, and if I find anything of interest, I'll post it here.

Thanks for the info. Do you happen to know if there is anything that falls between the quality of a Rational combi, and the normal convection ovens that I've been seeing? I probably should have specified that I am looking for the most accurate and controllable oven without steam cooking options. It just didn't cross my mind. I can imagine an oven with fully adjustable time, temp, and fan controls, and a larger internal mass for more even heating, but I just don't know what brands I should be looking at, and what the particular specs should be. Thanks again.

Hello, I'm looking at different commercial convection ovens and trying to figure out which ones are the most accurate. I've seen gas and electric, and different brands such as Blodgett and Southbend. Some have larger ranges of temperature from 140-200 F instead of 200-500 F, and some have weaker blower motors than others (1/2 hp as opposed to 3/4). Regarding the gas models, some are rated 72,000 BTU per oven cavity while others are at 50,000 BTU. The ones that I've seen all have two speed blowers. I don't necessarily know what difference all of this makes for what I'm looking for. What I want is to find out which ovens are the most accurate in two senses: 1) When I set the controls at a temperature, they reach that temperature and remain as stable as possible, fluctuating only a couple of degrees higher or lower (is that possible?). 2) The temperature in the bottom, middle, and top of the oven is the same, or very, very close to the same. I am also looking for controllability. As I have mentioned, I keep seeing two-speed fans, but I would like full control over the fan, the temperature, and the timer. All the ovens I've seen have 60 minute timers. I'd like some timers that allow for greater than 3 hour bake/roast times. I also prefer the great temperature ranges such as 140 F- 500F Does anyone have any idea what types/brands of ovens I should be looking at that would fulfill my criteria, and whether I should be looking at electric or gas? The time it takes to bring the oven up to temp is less important to me than all the above criteria. Thanks in advance for any help.

Well, it's done. It took about 3 hours at between 200 F and 225 F (never got up to 250). I pulled it right at 160 F, wrapped it in foil, and waited 45 minutes to carve it. It is super juicy and really flavorful. Perfect! Thanks again.

Dear All, Thanks for the tips. I'll smoke it to 160 F and pull it then. I'll run the temperature at around 250 F. It's just getting going right now. I didn't brine because when I read up on it on line it said not to brine if you have a self-basting turkey (packed in a sodium solution). Mine says that it is a self-basting breast with 3% sodium solution, so I didn't brine. I just pulled it this morning, patted dry, rubbed with a carolina rub, and threw it in. I didn't have time to buy the apple wood, but next time I'll use that instead. Thanks for all the tips.

Well, all I have is hickory, so I was going to use that. I've been wanting to experiment with apple for pork, but haven't gotten around to buying any yet. Thanks for the tip. Alan

Hello all, I have a new smoker and so I've been smoking everything I can find. So far I've done a pork butt for pulled pork, pork and beef ribs, jerky, etc. Now I want to do a huge turkey breast tomorrow. As I've been looking around on line I've noticed that people seem to be smoking their turkey at different temperatures than pork butt or ribs. What I was going to do was shoot for a temperature between 200-225 F and smoke the breast for three hours and then wrap it. My smoker is a water smoker, so the breast shouldn't dry out in the first three hours. Then I was going to smoke it until the internal hit about 195 F. Am I going to run into some unforseen trouble here? I'm seeing temps for turkey running at 260 F and instructions to pull the bird once it hits 165F. It doesn't seem to me that this would make it very tender... Isn't low and slow to a higher temperature better? Is there something I'm missing? Thanks for tips. Alan

Thank you to everyone who has added input. It is a quite interesting subject. It's too bad that someone hasn't written more about it formally. Maybe that will change someday soon.

Okay, I believe that I understand. Here is a new related question though: With convection ovens often one is told to decrease the temperature slightly. This makes sense to me given your explanation as it seems if the recipe was written with a normal non-convection oven in mind, then the outside of the bread/meat/etc. could become very overdone before the inside is finished in a convection oven. So, there are two ways of doing it so far: relatively stationary air and higher temperature convection (moving) air and lower temperature Am I to understand that we could come up with many more possibilities by increasing the airflow and further decreasing temperature? If so, given the two extremes of 1) maximal airflow and minimal temperature and 2) maximal temp and minimal airflow, if they are both within my capability to attain, then why would I choose one over the other? If I understand correctly, the option with maximal airflow and minimal temperature would probably take less time to cook (is this correct?), is there anything else that should cause me to choose one over the other? Thanks again.

Hello all, I'm wondering if there are any cookbooks, food books, or other books or publications out there that do the topic of temperature and airflow justice. By this I mean that I would like to see a very clear explanation of what happens within an oven, for example, when one increases the airflow while keeping the temperature the same in terms of length of cooking time and any other interrelated changes. I understand that often cooking times decrease given the same temp but increased airflow, but I would like to know what is happening that causes the cooking time to decrease, etc. I wasn't sure which place would be the best to ask this question, but I figured with all the bakers here, it would be relevant in this section. Also, if you don't know of a book, but you are very knowledgeable about the subject, then I would greatly appreciate all the information that you have the time to share. Many thanks in advance.

Hi Trishiad, Well, I wouldn't want to narrow down the questions because I find that every one of them deals with an issue relevant to molding and cooling; at the least, these topics are all covered in industry books, and so I'm trying to get a feeling for how and whether they have been taken into consideration my most people molding small numbers of bars without cooling tunnels, and if so, in what ways. However, I don't expect that everyone will want to answer every question, or that every person will feel that each question is relevant to her/his situation, and that is perfectly fine with me. Some input is better than none. So, thank you for yours. Alan

Dear Kerry, Thank you very much for the time you've taken to type out your experience. I appreciate it greatly. Regards, Alan P.S. Anyone else?

Anyone? Thanks in advance for any personal experience relating to the above questions.

Hello all, I'm trying to figure out the best way (in terms of a nice balance of time and money) to mold chocolate bars on a relatively small scale. I've been doing quite a bit of reading, research, and asking questions, and I've seen quite a bit of conflicting information. So, what I'm looking for now is real world experience. I'd be interested to know what people are doing who don't use a cooling tunnel, but who end up turning out chocolate with a nice snap and gloss without any obvious swirling (noting that many bars have a light swirling on the back if held at a certain angel to the light) or other finish issues. I have a number of questions that I would like anyone who fits the above description to answer (pretty please): 1) What is the thickness of your molds, and what is the material? 2) Do you warm up your molds to the temperature of the tempered chocolate prior to depositing? 3) What is the room temperature in your molding room? 4) What do you do with the molds immediately after depositing the chocolate? (i.e., do you do a number of molds and then put them all in a cooling area, or do you put them in one at a time?) 5) Your cooling area/room/chamber...what is the temperature? 6) Do you alter the temperature in the cooling area, or transport the molds to a different area with a different temperature while they are cooling? Please explain in as much detail as possible. 7) How do you handle airflow--what machines do you use (ceiling fans, large industrial standing fans, other?), and how are they mounted (how far away from the chocolate), and at what speed do you run them? 8) How much time do you give your bars before unmolding? 9) Finally, please explain any methods that you did use previously which led to bad results. Thank you in advance to everyone who participates. Since I'm designing a couple of rooms based on moulding and cooling, in part, I'm hoping to rule out really problematic designs ahead of time by learning as much as possible. I've read about all the theory that I can find including Minifie's, Beckett's and Chatt's books among others and am hoping that all of your experience will fill in the missing puzzle pieces.

He previously called it "leaf lard" but noted that after having talked to the owner of the company about it, he realized that he (the owner) was familiar with the term "caul fat" and had used it in sausage making to wrap certain types of sausages. I wasn't sure if by saying this that he was: a) admitting that his terminology was incorrect, or that b) he was admitting that he was thinking of another pork-fat product from the general belly area and didn't realize that the caul was useful for anything other than rendering down to lard, therefore meaning that he wouldn't have cared about its name. At any rate, he knows now, and I even told him the scientific name "omentum." He seemed interested to know. Alan