Carrot Top

Well, it seems that the heat wave affected me to the point that I dreamt that we lost a month of summer when I was writing the last post. "Steppin' Out" is actually happening on August 5th and 6th. Not September 5th.

Great idea. . .both for a small-business owner and for the neighborhoods it would be part of. I remember. . about twenty years ago in Brooklyn Heights there was a little old Italian guy who came through the neighborhood with his cart full of vegetables actually pulled by a small horse! Now that horse really sold those veggies. At a pretty penny, too.

I found the topic that had some more information. . .the focus is on feeding kids, but the idea is the same. Lots of food for not too much money. And the suggestions are good. Unfortunately, I've never linked to an internal eGullet topic, and my patience on how to figure it out is too short at the moment so must just give you the name of the topic (maybe an administrator will come along and nicely clicky-clicky to make a real link for you. . . ) "Feeding a Bottomless Pit; Dear God What Do I Do?" is the topic title, and it is in the General Foods forum. . .

Beautiful. And although I really wanted to stay out of this today, I feel a terrible urge to give the American Heritage Dictionary's definition of "elitism" as the word keeps cropping up. Just to add to the fun, you know. elitism: 1. The belief that certain persons or members of certain classes or groups deserve favored treatment by virtue of their perceived superiority, as in intellect, social status, or financial resources. 2a. The sense of entitlement enjoyed by such a class. b. Contol, rule or domination by such a class.

Soba, you sound like one of my kids. They each eat like this. And apparently, this is normal for kids their age! (No, they are not overweight at all!) Ouch. There was a thread that could also have some ideas on this subject on trying to contain food costs that was focused on "feeding the growing kids with the neverending hunger" sort of tack. . .I wonder if anyone knows that link. . .

Well, really. . .I do have to laugh at the way my last post sounds, for it truly sounds as if I think all the ills of the world can be cured with a bushel of fresh red peppers or something. Oh, well. I guess it is as good an idea as any. Though definitely rather loopy sounding.

I brought this up with a friend of mine who loves to cook and eat and also happens to be on disabilty for a mental illness. She showed me another perspective on this whole thing. When she has her druthers, and the money, and especially the energy and stamina, she is very glad to get ingredients that are exellent quality and to fix wonderful food with them. But she also stressed that many times she can barely make her self eat anything and it takes more energy and time than she can invest in even the simplest thing. Hence the junk food, the boxed/frozen foods, etc. She also pointed out to me, that I may not know if a person in line in front of me who has a basket full of this stuff is in such a situation, say on disability or has some medical or mental problem that precludes them from doing even a bit of cooking. I started looking at it differently after this. ← I think it is possible that we see this in quite a similar fashion. When writing the original post, I deleted some words that spoke of my "worry" about these people, for it sounded pretensious. For who am I to have the right to "worry" about anyone else for whatever reason? There is, however, something that speaks to me of health and life in fresh foods as opposed to the boxed up type. That is a separate issue from the price/shopping venue issue that we've been discussing. So when I see people whose carts seem to say to me, "Empty of the life that fresh real foods can offer", I wonder why it is that way, and why it has to be that way. And I worry about the people. I wonder how things could be changed to make it "better" for them. But that "better" is of course, only my opinion, my sense of what food is and how it can create a good and happy life in its own small way for people. Finally, I push it to the side of my mind as "something just to mull over" for surely I am not positive that I am right in projecting what are my own ideas of what food is and what it can do, onto other people. I think it was andiesenji who wrote in a thread a ways back of how the cooking of good things, fresh things, had brought health at times not only to her but also to other people she had known. I guess in some part of my mind, I think that if that health and good-feeling can be brought by fresh vital foods cooked and eaten by people who are physically ill, then perhaps the same idea might be used to heal the hurts of people who are also either mentally or. . .may I say culturally ill? If poverty could be considered a cultural illness. . .I don't know.

Yeah, it is a good topic, isn't it? I'm hooked. Here today it smells like Bolognese Sauce, Origins Tangerine Body Balm, and freshly ground black pepper. With an overlay of air-conditioning which does not sound as good as the other stuff, but for which I am extremely grateful. Here, jamie. . .your ponderings on your fiancee's ways of cooking reminded me of a quote so I looked it up: "Zee always went naked in the house, except for the brassiere she wore when it was her turn to get dinner. Once, cooking French-fried potatoes in a kettle of boiling fat, she had come within an inch of crisping her most striking features." G.S. Albee Or in other words, be sure she exercises caution.

Then I'll have to stop in there too, for the food, Holly. And I'll give the nice waitresses a shout out from ya.

russ, I wonder about the shopping carts that are filled with processed foods, too, most specifically even more when I see it within this income group. Yes. When I remember carts like this, I don't remember seeing it with recent immigrants, though. . .I see it more with the sort of "entrenched" poor here. I have a recurring rather surrealistic vision that they are buying these foods as a substitute for something more real that they think they can not attain. The foods become a metaphor for the American Dream in my mind. . .and it seems that they are going home to simply eat their dreams, whatever they may be. . . to swallow them whole in a huge bag of potato chips. It is difficult sorting out these cultural/class/money things without someone's toes getting stepped on verbally, I guess.

Busboy, your good deed of starting this thread has yielded results already! This weekend I'll be in the area Big Wyoming mentioned, and as he says. . .by God! I hope to try this place he has been kind enough to write in about!

How I wish I could agree with you on this. But when I look at the prices for either meats or veggies at the Farmer's Markets I've been to, either in large cities or smaller. . .I can see the difference between these prices and the ones at the places that the "economically disadvantaged" tend to shop. Many of the people that I have known that have not had too much money in their wallets have been immigrants, with large families, children (which are always expensive no matter what one's income level is! ), debt from starting a new life, and very little money left over after the bills are paid. Many do not even have health insurance. Alternately, they come from low-income rural areas where life can still be quite hand-to-mouth for many. It might be that they could and would like to take the effort to pick up the ingredients for a good dinner at the Farmer's Market, but that one dinner would at its price take the same money that would have fed them four dinners put together from food bought on sale at Wal-Mart. And they simply can not afford to do it. I so wish I could be persuaded otherwise. I do agree that "elitist" is a strong word that has an aura of sanctimoniousness. There might be a better word that could be used.

Three questions, please. . . Will it be mostly for adults? Are children encouraged or discouraged to attend with their parents? And what is the cut-off date for "signing up" or is it possible to show up last minute or close-to-it? Thanks. . . Karen

Kroger here, has much better meat than the other chains (Food Lion and. . .omg. . .Wal-Mart!? Yes, that is the extent of it, here). But they do not carry some cuts of meat that are still considered to be perhaps for a different market. And they did not show any inclination to order these different things when I've enquired before, but that could be an independent management decision specific to this store, perhaps. Veal breast, many sorts of offal, some cuts of pork. . .Food Lion is the place to find these. And Wal-Mart actually has become the place to find good oxtails, tripe, and beef cheeks which they stock for their Hispanic shoppers. So everyone, has some things to offer.

Hey, stringcheese! Probably good you are not here in Blacksburg today. . .it is verrrrry hot! The places you mentioned would have been in my "second" list, if there had been one, definitely. Plus Boudreaux's (Cajun) and Sharkey's if it re-opens well (it is undergoing transformation to a BBQ ribs place). The two top places are both new, and both have taken "places to eat" here to a higher level than before, both in terms of a sophistication of sorts and in terms of the technical level demanded of the kitchens. They have made it so that I don't blush when someone asks me what Blacksburg has "good to eat". (Yes, I am demanding in ways, used to be a chef and such-like myself in a previous life experience ). Though if one is in the mood for some good pita and tzaziki, the Souvlaki place is a marvel. Pita shipped in from Chicago, each bite worth every mile it travelled! Which reminds me, "Steppin' Out" the town's annual street festival, is coming up on September 5 if anyone is wandering through. . .

Beurre noir perhaps? Charcoal biscuits. . .they always remind me of some hypochondriac Sargeant in a Brit mystery novel. Wasn't it Adam Dalgliesh's second-in-command who was always munching on these?

The Lunch Club site reminded me of a place in Little Italy (NYC). Was it Puglias? On the corner of Mott and something-or-other? Long tables filled the rowdy garlic-and-tomato scented place. It didn't matter whether you went to eat alone or with others, everyone just gathered round the tables, pulled up a chair and ate and laughed and had a great time. I bet Pan knows of the place, if it is still there.

Busboy's recent thread on trying to find a good place to eat while driving through Lexington, VA brought the thought that maybe someone might find themselves in a similar situation in my neck of the woods. Blacksburg (which is home to Virginia Tech) has a lot of places to eat. It can be confusing to a visitor with the jumble of pizza places and bars that exist to keep the student population going strong. I thought that to start I might just list the places that I can whole-heartedly recommend for one reason or another. If there is a restaurant that someone travelling through does not see listed that they are curious about, please feel free to PM me and I'll tell you whatever I can about it. . . My personal criteria for a whole-hearted recommendation includes the following: 1. Taste of foods offered must have a sort of vitality and life. 2. Consistency, i.e. the food should not suffer if the cook is making it rather than the chef that particular day. 3. Sanitation (a big one for me). In a college town with lots of staff turnover in the kitchens, this can be a problem. I try to be hooked-into the goings on enough in the places to be able to know staff who can give me the scoop on what "really" is going on back-of-house. 4. Atmosphere and service should be pleasant. 5. Style. . .a sense of style definitely adds to the experience. 6. Food made in-house not ordered from Sysco ready-made then reheated and served. Places for lunch or dinner: (I'll attach a link to a website where one exists.) Nerv http://thenerv.com/dinner_menu.php Cabo Fish Taco http://www.cabofishtaco.com/menu.html (A new addition, located right on Main Street in downtown Blacksburg.) (Note: It might be closed on Mondays. . .at the moment it is, but when the students return to town that could change. . ) Five Guys Burgers and Fries http://www.fiveguys.com/images/Menu.html (On University Boulevard, across from University Mall.) PK's Pizza (On Main Street.) Places for Coffee: Mill Mountain Coffee http://www.millmountaincoffee.com/ Bollo's http://athena.english.vt.edu/~nquesinb/Nq/...tra/gbhome.html Starbuck's is here too. The difference between Mill Mountain and Bollo's seems to me to be that everyone's hair at Bollo's, whether they be male or female, is about six inches longer than everyone's hair at Mill Mountain. Bollo's also does not accept credit or debit cards, and Mill Mountain does. Places for Dessert: Ben and Jerry's Ice Cream, Kent Square on Main Street Hope this little list might be of use to someone that might be "driving through"! Karen

Kroger did a "switch-out" in certain parts of the South with Harris Teeter several years ago. For some reason, they just switched locations with each other, trading store for store, from what I heard from the manager of the Kroger here. Of those stores listed, Kroger is the most likely to be "upscale". They also will be more expensive. Another point I've heard about Kroger is that they pay their employees much better than the other chains, which is one reason for the higher prices.

Well, really. . .it will never matter to me at all anymore what my house smells like, for what could top this! Incredible. What a distillation of the essence of intelligent, seductive femininity is held in those five words. And now, I have to say, "Pork Roast"? It makes me feel so plebian, you know. . .rather clunky and worn, dressed in potato sack cloth or the like. Heh heh. Great lines, maggie. I don't even care if you made it up or not. Great, either way. P.S. Sigh. Not that I think you made it up. . .it is just that the words so seem to define a reality that would follow them, rather than the other way around. And now I had better stop jabbering, myself.

Do I recognize the voice of MFK Fisher in your quote, Melissa? A beautiful quote, even if not. . .

If you go to epicurious.com then go to "browse recipes by preparation" then clicky clicky on chill/freeze you'll find a good selection. Tried to copy the link but msn always gives me problems trying to do this. Aargh. Karen

Yes, you are right. . .the City That Never Sleeps does not have much soil left uncovered for folks to dig into and grow things in. The one year that I grew a small garden on my "balcony" (heh heh fancy word for a fire escape with a french door opening to it!) in Brooklyn Heights, it got destroyed when trampled by the cat-burglar crack addict that flew up the back of the building and into the apartment to grab my purse which was sitting on the nearby table then fly back out with it. Maybe he needed money for organic veggies. But the city grows many other wonderful things. . .ideas, architecture, businesses, and art in all its forms. So who can fault it for lack of open soil. Not me. . .though Whole Foods and Food Emporium do tend to make me somewhat cranky.

Some great stories there, Jaymes. It seems as if finally, the only true love that lasted was between the man and the punchbowl!

It sounds as if there are several major points of contention going on with "what the article states". Which is good in one way, for it has certainly sparked debate which brings forth ideas that may have been sitting in the back of people's heads that other people can learn from. . .but difficult in that the whole thing is not a debate about one clear-cut thing. If I were Julie, I might feel good about the debate. . .and also good (as someone has mentioned) that my piece was published in such a noticeable place. I might also feel that ultimately, (based on the reader's reactions) that the piece might have been written with either a better eye to the researching of stated facts or with more clarity of intended meaning. I feel sort of badly for her, for it seems she has put out there, in the written word in public, something that is quite easily attacked in a variety of ways. But then again, she is a professional and professionals have to take their lumps and learn from it in a very direct way. Could it have been that this piece was edited to fit the space and time constraints therefore losing parts that would have made it read for better acceptance? I wonder. My own small contribution to the discussion is that here, where I live there are no Whole Foods stores or Food Emporiums within an hour's drive. And one does need to have a car to get to them. And where I live, is one of the most populated areas around in many directions. Small town rural America reigns here, and where they shop is Wal-Mart if they are lucky (yes, they do for the most part consider themselves lucky when a Wal-Mart comes in) enough to have one close enough. . .or in small older town grocery stores where the lighting is usually dingy and the floors battered, as is the produce. The economies of such places do not allow most people to even consider whether their budget would include "organic" produce from the grocery store, no matter how hard they pushed the numbers around. If they want it, they grow it. There's a large population to whom this discussion of Whole Foods is simply moot. (Not sure how this fits into the overall subject, but just wanted to again bring up this point. . .)