SobaAddict70

Mac-n-cheese is definitely one of those comfort foods that I get a hankering for around this time of year. In the past I've delved into Kraft's mysterious halls of wonder, but these days I prefer to make my own. I prefer Cheddar, with bread crumbs and no tomatoes, although sometimes I'll slip in Emmantaler or Gruyere in the mix. Once I get over this cold, I know what's for dinner soon.... Share some of your cheese and macaroni stories. Soba

Cold appetizers are on many menus at Chinese restaurants in Manhattan. You have to wonder if these are inherent money losers because, although I don't know about you, I don't see many run-of-the-mill Americans (who aren't Asian -- or even some who ARE Asian) ordering things like jellyfish and duck's tongue for starters. Soba

Very nice photos, Stone. Does public transportation run to Larkspur from SF? (remember, I don't drive.) As for the nay-sayers, well that's because there isn't any butter or bacon. Soba

Before you know it, there'll be risotto from what's-her-name, the person who I can't remember her name who's the newest food media sensation. You know, 30 minute gourmet meals or some such. Oh, Adam -- I suppose it can't hurt to bear repeating: Risotto is best, imho, when it's simple and used with the best quality ingredients you can find. That's not to say that other types of risotto aren't as good (i.e., braised short rib risotto with barbecued fava beans and roasted apple slices ), it's just that the adage "less is more" is no truer than in this context. And when you're feeling adventurous enough, do give dessert risotto a try. It's like rice pudding -- only a hundred times better. Soba

Isn't it customary to serve two pieces per order of sushi? I seem to recall reading that some place, and it had to do with the etymology of the word "sushi" (something to do with one piece meaning "to kill myself" and three pieces meaning something else.) Also, imo, ideal sushi should not be consumable in one bite, with respect to the size issue. Jinmyo? Kristin? help? Soba

In addition to homemade stock which is probably the sole indispensible ingredient in just about any kitchen, you should try using a better grade of wine. I think someone said someplace that the wine you use to make stock, sauces and things like risotto should be at least as good an item as something that you would be glad to serve at a dinner party. Ok, I know I mangled that sentence. But you know what I mean. Soba

I'm just waiting for the day when McDonald's parent merges with Starbucks' parent. Then we'll be truly frightened out of our gullets. Soba

I think a better matchup would be if CT went mano-a-mano vs. The Iron Chef. Talk about "excellence". Soba

There should be an unwritten rulebook for these situations. Soba

Yeah, they do. It's a mountain of fries -- I couldn't finish it once. The Joe isn't very tomato-ey. I suppose if you're looking for a Manwich equivalent, you're not going to get one. But it IS fair, I'll give it that. Soba

Yeah, I think he was trying to post in iambic pentameter. hehe Soba

It's the rice that gets to you every time. Otherwise I concur with JJ, 15 pieces isn't a problem...usually. Soba

I like to believe individuals have values, not cultures. It avoids stereotyping. I believe the issue was about needing to find intrinsic value. And he explained it in his own way. Perhaps a poor choice of words, but that's the way I read it. He was referring to the perception that many people have of a deeply held belief, value, whatever -- mistaken or stereotyped as it may be -- of people belonging to a certain segment of society who identify themselves as "Jewish", not the religion as was interpreted by another person elsewhere in the thread. I suppose that this is another line of debate that we can go mano-a-mano another time. Soba

Veselka's in the East Village (9th and 2nd Avenue). It's a nightly special (on Tuesdays, I think). They come with sweet potato fries. Soba

Interesting to note that the commentary regarding service and decor was minimal this time around. I'd say the food's the showpiece it's meant to be. Or maybe Grimes is becoming more like his predecessor. Soba

I know, but its more of a philosophical inquiry if you will. Not directed at you Holly, but pls feel free to answer it if you want. I have a feeling based on the following cues picked up in Grimes' review that BOH is probably up to it. FOH might be a different story entirely. Who knows, time will tell. Soba

I think hiyayakko is about where perfection resides. Or close to it. Everything else pales in comparison. Ok, well most everything. Ma po dofu is a close second. Soba

Oh, I just shot down everything I ate after the first taste. Looking back on it, I remember feeling lucky I didn't vomit all over the table because of a certain queasy feeling that was creeping up on me. Good thing that didn't happen, eh? Soba

A question then: is it more preferable to aspire to the welcoming arms of safer pastures than to culinary heights of greatness? Because I thought it's usually the other way around, but what the hell do I know. Soba

Sam, can't say I ever have. Lactase supplements and I = Bad News. I tried some a while back and had severe cramping for a couple of days. Not again. I'm not as intolerant as someone like Jason for example; more like mild intolerance (i.e., no milk -- but cheese is acceptable.) But it's worth looking into. I raised the point because there are categories of people (of which I am one but not the only one I'm sure) who cannot hope to experience the nuances of fine dining at its best for reasons they cannot control. In my case, it's inability to drink wine. I'm not sure if in the past when I've dined out, if my ordering mineral water sent any sort of signal, but it's something I prefer to verbally express to the waitstaff by way of explanation. This "art" of signalling that Bux referred to earlier is something I'm not aware of...until now. Soba

I read the context and got it. My point is that I need to be trained to enjoy wine. Simple. I don't make it a habit of drinking wine because of my aforementioned problem, and I need to be trained to appreciate the complexities that wine can bring to a good meal. I am well aware that I'm missing that part of the equation, but a little at a loss as to how to proceed. I am cognizant that there are greater experiences to be had with regards to reds, roses, port, and other types of wines other than the normal fruity whites I find so appealing. That's all. No hidden agenda here. There are people who, like me, are unable to appreciate wine (but perhaps for different reasons). That in and of itself shouldn't bar us from being able to appreciate fine dining. Getting back on topic, Adrober is by his description an aspiring gourmand. And this is his first but perhaps not his last CT experience. If he is an aspiring gourmand by any stretch of the imagination, he'll probably want to go to some place like Chez Panisse, Fat Duck or El Bulli sometime soon. He'll train his palate and his awareness to appreciate elements which are present at a place like CT but may not necessarily be present at a place like Babbo. We don't know for instance, that he's ever had an experience at JG or ADNY, but I'm sure he will...eventually. I think the important thing is that the pseudo-review, post or whatever was a forthright assessment by someone who's taking first steps into the world of fine dining and shouldn't be overly critiqued. Offer some help, give some advice, but don't shoot the messenger for delivering the goods. And if everyone will have taken something away worthwhile from this thread, why so much the better. Side note (not addressed to GC): As to the reference that "religion" was introduced into the thread, I read it more as a reference to a "cultural value" (as in Jewish the culture, not Judaism the belief system). Soba

Hear, hear re #1. (Apologies for the late quotes on page 9 of this fascinating thread as I am a late comer. I clearly need to get out more. ) Obviously there's a difference between the waitstaff at Gramercy Tavern (no temple of haute cuisine, but impressive for the service factor) and CT. But, I suppose, there are different levels of service vis-a-vis a restaurant such as GT and a restaurant such as CT, so what passes for impressive service at GT may not at CT precisely because the two restaurants are not in the same league as each other. (Full discloure: I have never been to CT but it remains on one of my "go to" list of places in my lifetime. I am 32, not terribly experienced in terms of haute cuisine but well-versed enough in the realm of good food and dining out that I can recognize when an experience is merely mediocre as opposed to stunningly great.) So your impression of the waiter being "a robot" and "completely out of tune with his audience" is not off the mark -- at least with respect to someone who is perhaps more inclined towards the GT level of service as opposed to the all-encompassing level that restaurants such as JG, ADNY and CT seek to provide. edit: There is also the issue of expectation and experience. Others have mentioned it on this thread so far so I will not repeat their statements. You came to CT with a set of expectations drawn on past experience, but that did not approach those that a patron of CT might be reasonably expected to have. This is not a put-down or a criticism. It is an inference I am making based on my reading of your post -- please feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. As you gain more experience in your pursuit of fine dining, your criteria and your expectations will evolve, so that if in the future, you are presented with the opportunity to experience a restaurant such as CT or one of like caliber, you will be able to appreciate it on different terms than before. Soba

Actually, yes I would. In fact, I offer myself as Exhibit A in your gallery of evidence. I can't drink wine, not because I don't like it, but because I have a genetic inability to properly metabolize alcohol. That doesn't mean I can't appreciate a good wine when I have one -- and I've sampled really really small samples in the past, sometimes within the presence of a few eGulleteers. When I have enjoyed it, I prefer whites over reds and fruity/sweet over dry. But that's just me. Now, does this mean I can't appreciate fine dining? Pish, of course not. It means I can't possibly experience the fullest nuance that would be available if I were able to drink wine. But by no means does it mean that I am a country rube in a cosmopolitan palace, at least with regards to the sort of experience we're talking about. Now, I don't know about the silent art of sending signals, so I suppose I'm learning as I go along. I've always found it helpful to verbally express to the waitstaff either my interest in whatever it is that's in the offing, my relative inexperience, and my inability to drink. Soba

Biltmore Room (William Grimes) (from today's DIGEST. You may have to scroll down for the appropriate link.) With the introduction of Biltmore Room (290 Eighth Avenue near 25th Street), Chef Gary Robins, formerly of Mi, Aja and Match, returns -- this time to Chelsea Heights, with pan-Asian fusion that borders on dazzling. Has anyone visited or had any experiences here? On another tangent, are new three-star restaurants in short supply in New York these days? Discuss, Soba

NYTimes Weekly Update Wednesday, 12 November 2003 Effective today, Wednesday, November 12, NY Times coverage will be split between articles that focus on dining in/dining out, and articles of a more general, albeit food-focused nature. The essential nature of this DIGEST has not changed however. --Soba A. Dining In/Dining Out Section The Essence of Champagne (Eric Asimov) Matching Food With Wine (R.W. Apple, Jr.) At Autumn's Table (Nigella Lawson) Bits and Pieces (Florence Fabriacant) Digestifs (Amanda Hesser) Sidebar: A Selection of Digestifs Biltmore Room (William Grimes) Subatomic Cheese (Melissa Clark) Temple (Eric Asimov) The Minimalist Delves Into The Soul Of Pie (Mark Bittman) Wine Talk (Frank J. Prial) Hard Cider's Comeback (Lise Funderburg) Recipe: DEVILED EGGS WITH CAPERS AND ANCHOVIES Pairings (Amanda Hesser) Corrections Recipes in today's section: 1. Mellow Lamb Steaks 2. Autumnal Spiced Plums 3. Caramelized Apples 4. Caramelized Onion and Quark Dip 5. Quark Mousse with Mixed Berries If you go to the NYTimes web site, you'll find an interactive panel discussion between Eric Asimov, Amanda Hesser, Tim Kopec (the sommelier at Veritas) and Karen King (the sommelier at Gramercy Tavern). Click on the yellow box marked "Small Champagne Producers" to begin the presentation. B. Elsewhere in today's Times: When Your Garden Becomes Your Pharmacy (Anne Raver) Continuing Coverage of The Collingswood Four (David Kocieniewski) Defects In Kosher Baby Food (Richard Bernstein)